Newcastle Diamonds V Plymouth Devils 6th July 2014 Pl 6.30pm

[Mauger_Magic]

My first time back at Brough tonight after four years away. I only went to meet two Exeter Falcons fans, Mary and Patrick, (and their alsatian Skye), who although they do not have a team to support still frequent loads of Speedway tracks. They had been to Peterborough on Monday, Redcar on Thursday, Berwick on Saturday and Newcastle last night and drove straight back down to Devon after the meeting! I thought the track was okay although I have always dreaded riders going in to bend 2, which for some reason over the years has seen a load of crashes. My brother always said it was because Brough's track was an egg shape and they forgot it was more tight on bends 1 & 2than bends 3 & 4.and he said Ivan Mauger was not the best at handling it but his hero Peter Kelly!!! It was sad to see that the crowd has dwindled a lot since four years ago..I would have said about 400 to 500 last night...course I was brought up with the 8,000 plus crowds of the 1960's!!

As said previously I cannot remember a team finishing with as few riders as that...the final few races were three riders....in fact to be fair I was amazed at how the Track Commentator and crowd could be as enthusuiastic, when it was a non event.

However that is Speedway....and after smelling the bike fumes again..no matter what the track is like etc., I am going back!

Edited July 7, 2014 by Mauger_Magic

[Arson fire]

A lot of crashes at Newcastle seem to be bend 2 and to a lesser extent bend 3.... I think it's the track shape rather than the surface myself, we often see visiting rides come in to bend 1 to fast then have to almost lock up to avoid drifting to the fence, all tracks are different though and some of these riders have been around Newcastle lots and lots of times.... Simon stead used to always look ill at ease, but this year he attacked the track and used his loaf and was very impressive, it's mainly visitors that get caught out, yet when guesting for us seem to do ok, which is strange.

 

Riders have to learn and remember you simply will not get around bend 2 if you don't loosen the throttle a little or use your head...I don't think the track can be changed, so the riders will have too.

We always have a load of dirt down so maybe riders arnt used to it with a lot of slick tracks around??

[ruffdiamond]

There are plenty of so called technical tracks in the UK and they don't have this level of accidents. I think even the NL riders in the EL cope with the notorious holes at Poole without this level.

 

So rather than getting all defensive about it and quoting riders from 50 years ago, maybe some rational discussion about the causes of all the problems and what can be done about them would be a start.

'throttle control'

I drive to work and go round the corner, in normal condition's at 30mph and things are fine, I do the same in the wet and things are fine,,, if somehow there is snow there, I put it 4wd and things are fine,,, if not, I take easy,,, it's not rocket science :-(

A lot of crashes at Newcastle seem to be bend 2 and to a lesser extent bend 3.... I think it's the track shape rather than the surface myself, we often see visiting rides come in to bend 1 to fast then have to almost lock up to avoid drifting to the fence, all tracks are different though and some of these riders have been around Newcastle lots and lots of times.... Simon stead used to always look ill at ease, but this year he attacked the track and used his loaf and was very impressive, it's mainly visitors that get caught out, yet when guesting for us seem to do ok, which is strange.

 

Riders have to learn and remember you simply will not get around bend 2 if you don't loosen the throttle a little or use your head...I don't think the track can be changed, so the riders will have too.

We always have a load of dirt down so maybe riders arnt used to it with a lot of slick tracks around??

that's probly the bit folk can't comprehend !!!

[bringbackHalifax]

I will try and give a balanced view on the track yesterday ( and probably the last few weeks as well ).

The drainage on bends is not great ( there is none at all on one of the bends ) and whenever there is rain it just sits on the track. When JS turns up early on a Sunday morning his first few hours is spent pumping water off the track. However as these parts of the track have sat under water it means the base is different to the outside, where there has been no standing water.

When you get new riders ( first visit ) or certain established riders ( Barker for Ipswich last yr, Auty every visit bar 1, Ollie Allen every time he drives through the pit gate in his van, if he comes, to name a few ) they tend to leave their brains in the toolbox and make a hash of at least one race. Not one of those mentioned hits a corner as fast as Cookie the other week, or indeed Lindgren last night, but they get the line all wrong on entry, which usually means a big off.

It is frustrating for the home riders that the track is patchy and inconsistent but they understand that the speedway club has no access to the track after Wednesday night due to the dogs and therefore are in the laps of the gods with the weather. It also is difficult to find a set up that works week in week out.

Agree with the comment though that the riders who attack the track will prosper. Stead, Cookie, Josh G, Kyle N, and Pepe last night after his first ride

 

Hope this helps people understand.

I am not trying to justify it, I would love it to be better, but its not the worse track, I have seen this season. Kings Lynn, Lakeside, Poole, Scunthorpe, Swindon, Coventry, Belle Vue, Eastbourne have all had some bad track meetings.

[Tsunami]

I will try and give a balanced view on the track yesterday ( and probably the last few weeks as well ).

The drainage on bends is not great ( there is none at all on one of the bends ) and whenever there is rain it just sits on the track. When JS turns up early on a Sunday morning his first few hours is spent pumping water off the track. However as these parts of the track have sat under water it means the base is different to the outside, where there has been no standing water.

When you get new riders ( first visit ) or certain established riders ( Barker for Ipswich last yr, Auty every visit bar 1, Ollie Allen every time he drives through the pit gate in his van, if he comes, to name a few ) they tend to leave their brains in the toolbox and make a hash of at least one race. Not one of those mentioned hits a corner as fast as Cookie the other week, or indeed Lindgren last night, but they get the line all wrong on entry, which usually means a big off.

It is frustrating for the home riders that the track is patchy and inconsistent but they understand that the speedway club has no access to the track after Wednesday night due to the dogs and therefore are in the laps of the gods with the weather. It also is difficult to find a set up that works week in week out.

Agree with the comment though that the riders who attack the track will prosper. Stead, Cookie, Josh G, Kyle N, and Pepe last night after his first ride

 

Hope this helps people understand.

I am not trying to justify it, I would love it to be better, but its not the worse track, I have seen this season. Kings Lynn, Lakeside, Poole, Scunthorpe, Swindon, Coventry, Belle Vue, Eastbourne have all had some bad track meetings.

Quite agree. After the heavy rains on Thursday morning and all day Friday, I knew there would be a lot of water lying on the track softening it up. In view of the fact that lightish rain was forecast from 10 till 6.00pm yesterday I cancelled the training school as i knew Jonny would need a lot of access to the track, and we were unlikely to get on the track. Although the rain didn't come yesterday, Jonny told me he had taken 7 and a half bowsers full of water off the track, and there was no chance that the training school could have been held. He showed me the pics he usually takes in such cases, and they showed that the back straight was all under water, the second and most of the first bend were under water, and the inside line of the third and forth were also flooded.

Despite the difficulties that we are faced with at Brough, we regularly get good marks from all the refs for track preparation, so they don't see there is a problem. Given the problems i have explained above, I would agree that last nights track was not great and a light blade was used early last night quite early on, and that is not usual. As others have stated, Brough needs to be ridden and attacked using more brain than speed, and i'm afraid that riders like Howarth, Auty, Roynon, Hall, Morris, will always have problems with their style of riding. Simon Nielsen( my rider of the night last night) showed them all up by his steady fast and professional way he rode the track all night. A lad who is not having a great season, been a guest twice now with good success, he certainly showed the others how to ride it safely. I would sign him in a flash should he become available, and if Scramm does not come back soon.

 

As to the injuries, three riders withdrawn from a meeting sounds like carnage to some but. In heat one, a rider who had not ridden Brough before, clips the back of his teammate Barker, twists his knee and, unknown at the time, Barker after two epic battles with King and Robson, decides to retire from the meeting citing rib problems. So that's two out from a simple fall from a rider error. In heat 10, 4 riders get tangled up coming out of the second bend, all at the same time and they go down. All 4 back, but Kyle unfortunately injures a shoulder, but also gets a knock from his goggles that gives him blurred vision in one eye. Could have happened at any track, at anytime. So that's three out of the meeting unfortunately. Unfortunately that meant more rides for the 2 Devil reserves who weren't watching Nielsen, and either had no idea or desire to ride Brough correctly. This was something that was cited against some Devil riders at Berwick the previous night, so I think the Devils management could soon be required o change their team to rectify their present problems. Bringing in rides from abroad to ride like that, is to good for British speedway. As someone said to me last night "surely they could find some one British who could ride better than that for a fraction of the cost".

 

Anyway, this whole discussion has accidentally brought so many speedway fans together once again, in pursuit of their obsessions. Step forward, montie, Drac, TaylorJ, Bandits(4 life and 4 Ever), and now Mr Blobby. So predictable, whatever would we do without you.

Edited July 7, 2014 by Tsunami

[montie]

 

 

. Step forward, montie, Drac, TaylorJ, Bandits(4 life and 4 Ever), and now Mr Blobby. So predictable, whatever would we do without you.

 

You have missed around 000`s of names from that list,including Promotions,team managers,riders,Owners and former World Champions!

 

Yes the weather seems to have played a part yesterday,but it seems every week these days,you only have to read various social media site to see

 

Interesting that you pick out Simon Nielsen,seen him a few times this year and last and to be honest hes been slow as a donkey and utter crap,maybe thats why he stays on BP!!

 

We continue to hear how you have to come off the throttle at BP,yet next,we hear that if you come off the throttle with a modern speedway bike[and silencer] they bike reacts in a strange way

 

i dont ride a bike so aint got a clue which is right

[Chewbacca]

The best riders at Brough are sideways before they enter the bend. If you point your front wheel at the centre green and give it plenty you will get around fine. If you almost two wheel into the bends at a shallow angle expecting a longtrack shape and have the front wheel pointing at the fence and then put the throttle on hard, carnage ensues.

 

This is why young riders (like Kyle Newman who was unfortunately carted off by someone else last night) come to Newcastle to learn to become better all round riders. It's a track you have to think about. Some riders (and a lot of them fall off every season at Brough) never seem to learn.

 

It IS a technical track.

 

Is it the best track around? - no.

Is it the most exciting to spectate at? - no

Is it dangerous? - no

 

Has it been made more difficult to ride by laydown bikes and useless silencers? - yes, and more so than tracks where the throttle is pinned open all the way round.

[Taylorj]

Quite agree. After the heavy rains on Thursday morning and all day Friday, I knew there would be a lot of water lying on the track softening it up. In view of the fact that lightish rain was forecast from 10 till 6.00pm yesterday I cancelled the training school as i knew Jonny would need a lot of access to the track, and we were unlikely to get on the track. Although the rain didn't come yesterday, Jonny told me he had taken 7 and a half bowsers full of water off the track, and there was no chance that the training school could have been held. He showed me the pics he usually takes in such cases, and they showed that the back straight was all under water, the second and most of the first bend were under water, and the inside line of the third and forth were also flooded.

Despite the difficulties that we are faced with at Brough, we regularly get good marks from all the refs for track preparation, so they don't see there is a problem. Given the problems i have explained above, I would agree that last nights track was not great and a light blade was used early last night quite early on, and that is not usual. As others have stated, Brough needs to be ridden and attacked using more brain than speed, and i'm afraid that riders like Howarth, Auty, Roynon, Hall, Morris, will always have problems with their style of riding. Simon Nielsen( my rider of the night last night) showed them all up by his steady fast and professional way he rode the track all night. A lad who is not having a great season, been a guest twice now with good success, he certainly showed the others how to ride it safely. I would sign him in a flash should he become available, and if Scramm does not come back soon.

 

As to the injuries, three riders withdrawn from a meeting sounds like carnage to some but. In heat one, a rider who had not ridden Brough before, clips the back of his teammate Barker, twists his knee and, unknown at the time, Barker after two epic battles with King and Robson, decides to retire from the meeting citing rib problems. So that's two out from a simple fall from a rider error. In heat 10, 4 riders get tangled up coming out of the second bend, all at the same time and they go down. All 4 back, but Kyle unfortunately injures a shoulder, but also gets a knock from his goggles that gives him blurred vision in one eye. Could have happened at any track, at anytime. So that's three out of the meeting unfortunately. Unfortunately that meant more rides for the 2 Devil reserves who weren't watching Nielsen, and either had no idea or desire to ride Brough correctly. This was something that was cited against some Devil riders at Berwick the previous night, so I think the Devils management could soon be required o change their team to rectify their present problems. Bringing in rides from abroad to ride like that, is to good for British speedway. As someone said to me last night "surely they could find some one British who could ride better than that for a fraction of the cost".

 

Anyway, this whole discussion has accidentally brought so many speedway fans together once again, in pursuit of their obsessions. Step forward, montie, Drac, TaylorJ, Bandits(4 life and 4 Ever), and now Mr Blobby. So predictable, whatever would we do without you.

Hey no need to drag me into it, I haven't posted on this thread until now . I just sit back and read all the others comments about Rough Park with the odd like here and there . Haven't had much to comment on really after all lest we not forget that the Comets beat the Diamonds in the PL fixture

[NJC71]

Interesting posts above on the track, the difficulties in preparing it well given the access problems and also how it has become diffcult to ride over the years with the increased speed of the bikes.

 

Taking all of that into consideration then, is it not possible to make major changes to alter the shape of the track? As I said on an earlier post why would it not be possible to bring the whole thing in from the centre to make the straights and bends wider? Yes it would be a big job and would obviously cost money but in theory at least it sounds feasible. I wondered if there was drainage or something on the inside which would make it impossible but it doesn't sound like it if there is standing water after rain. If it was wider there would be more racing lines and there would be less chance of riders colliding because there basically isn't enough room as we saw a couple of times last night.

 

Just a thought although I would assume it's been considered before. I'm sure those that constantly moan about it wold be at the front of the queue for donations to raise the necessary finance

[KEITH M]

To all the moaning fans on here who love to knock the Newcastle track.. I bet all Birmingham, Newport, Exeter and Oxford fans to name a few would love a track like Brough Park

Edited July 7, 2014 by KEITH M

[The White Knight]

Quite agree. After the heavy rains on Thursday morning and all day Friday, I knew there would be a lot of water lying on the track softening it up. In view of the fact that lightish rain was forecast from 10 till 6.00pm yesterday I cancelled the training school as i knew Jonny would need a lot of access to the track, and we were unlikely to get on the track. Although the rain didn't come yesterday, Jonny told me he had taken 7 and a half bowsers full of water off the track, and there was no chance that the training school could have been held. He showed me the pics he usually takes in such cases, and they showed that the back straight was all under water, the second and most of the first bend were under water, and the inside line of the third and forth were also flooded.

Despite the difficulties that we are faced with at Brough, we regularly get good marks from all the refs for track preparation, so they don't see there is a problem. Given the problems i have explained above, I would agree that last nights track was not great and a light blade was used early last night quite early on, and that is not usual. As others have stated, Brough needs to be ridden and attacked using more brain than speed, and i'm afraid that riders like Howarth, Auty, Roynon, Hall, Morris, will always have problems with their style of riding. Simon Nielsen( my rider of the night last night) showed them all up by his steady fast and professional way he rode the track all night. A lad who is not having a great season, been a guest twice now with good success, he certainly showed the others how to ride it safely. I would sign him in a flash should he become available, and if Scramm does not come back soon.

 

As to the injuries, three riders withdrawn from a meeting sounds like carnage to some but. In heat one, a rider who had not ridden Brough before, clips the back of his teammate Barker, twists his knee and, unknown at the time, Barker after two epic battles with King and Robson, decides to retire from the meeting citing rib problems. So that's two out from a simple fall from a rider error. In heat 10, 4 riders get tangled up coming out of the second bend, all at the same time and they go down. All 4 back, but Kyle unfortunately injures a shoulder, but also gets a knock from his goggles that gives him blurred vision in one eye. Could have happened at any track, at anytime. So that's three out of the meeting unfortunately. Unfortunately that meant more rides for the 2 Devil reserves who weren't watching Nielsen, and either had no idea or desire to ride Brough correctly. This was something that was cited against some Devil riders at Berwick the previous night, so I think the Devils management could soon be required o change their team to rectify their present problems. Bringing in rides from abroad to ride like that, is to good for British speedway. As someone said to me last night "surely they could find some one British who could ride better than that for a fraction of the cost".

 

Anyway, this whole discussion has accidentally brought so many speedway fans together once again, in pursuit of their obsessions. Step forward, montie, Drac, TaylorJ, Bandits(4 life and 4 Ever), and now Mr Blobby. So predictable, whatever would we do without you.

Excellent Post Dave. Apart from your final paragraph.

 

I totally agree with you about Nielsen too. :approve:

[Bandits4life]

Quite agree. After the heavy rains on Thursday morning and all day Friday, I knew there would be a lot of water lying on the track softening it up. In view of the fact that lightish rain was forecast from 10 till 6.00pm yesterday I cancelled the training school as i knew Jonny would need a lot of access to the track, and we were unlikely to get on the track. Although the rain didn't come yesterday, Jonny told me he had taken 7 and a half bowsers full of water off the track, and there was no chance that the training school could have been held. He showed me the pics he usually takes in such cases, and they showed that the back straight was all under water, the second and most of the first bend were under water, and the inside line of the third and forth were also flooded.

Despite the difficulties that we are faced with at Brough, we regularly get good marks from all the refs for track preparation, so they don't see there is a problem. Given the problems i have explained above, I would agree that last nights track was not great and a light blade was used early last night quite early on, and that is not usual. As others have stated, Brough needs to be ridden and attacked using more brain than speed, and i'm afraid that riders like Howarth, Auty, Roynon, Hall, Morris, will always have problems with their style of riding. Simon Nielsen( my rider of the night last night) showed them all up by his steady fast and professional way he rode the track all night. A lad who is not having a great season, been a guest twice now with good success, he certainly showed the others how to ride it safely. I would sign him in a flash should he become available, and if Scramm does not come back soon.

 

As to the injuries, three riders withdrawn from a meeting sounds like carnage to some but. In heat one, a rider who had not ridden Brough before, clips the back of his teammate Barker, twists his knee and, unknown at the time, Barker after two epic battles with King and Robson, decides to retire from the meeting citing rib problems. So that's two out from a simple fall from a rider error. In heat 10, 4 riders get tangled up coming out of the second bend, all at the same time and they go down. All 4 back, but Kyle unfortunately injures a shoulder, but also gets a knock from his goggles that gives him blurred vision in one eye. Could have happened at any track, at anytime. So that's three out of the meeting unfortunately. Unfortunately that meant more rides for the 2 Devil reserves who weren't watching Nielsen, and either had no idea or desire to ride Brough correctly. This was something that was cited against some Devil riders at Berwick the previous night, so I think the Devils management could soon be required o change their team to rectify their present problems. Bringing in rides from abroad to ride like that, is to good for British speedway. As someone said to me last night "surely they could find some one British who could ride better than that for a fraction of the cost".

 

Anyway, this whole discussion has accidentally brought so many speedway fans together once again, in pursuit of their obsessions. Step forward, montie, Drac, TaylorJ, Bandits(4 life and 4 Ever), and now Mr Blobby. So predictable, whatever would we do without you.

Aye, it's the weathers fault again, so lets say no more . I suppose the downpour we've just had an hour ago on Tyneside will be the excuse in case the track isn't good in a fortnight then?

[Arson fire]

 

The crash in heat 1 from Jensen and Barker, was caused by the track, as was heat 2 when Simota came off, as was heat 10 when Mills lifted and took Newman and King down with him as well. All crashes were caused on exactly the same part of the track tonight. So come on then what's the excuses then? .

After being at some of the berwick meetings you updated on over the years.... your view will be taken with a pinch of salt

[bringbackHalifax]

Was hoping to keep this above the your track my track debate.

Doesn't need to be wider as there were a few times in the last few weeks where 3 abreast round turn 1 and 2 and down the back straight happens at Brough. Can't manage that round Berwick first bend, although you can off the second.

The issue is when a rider hits a patch of the softer stuff and then picks up unplanned grip and then wipes out his rivals / teammates. Again some riders, whether you like it or not can regain control and others can't.

I would put a drainage system in to get the standing water off the track asap and leave the shape alone tbh.

[Tsunami]

Interesting posts above on the track, the difficulties in preparing it well given the access problems and also how it has become diffcult to ride over the years with the increased speed of the bikes.

 

Taking all of that into consideration then, is it not possible to make major changes to alter the shape of the track? As I said on an earlier post why would it not be possible to bring the whole thing in from the centre to make the straights and bends wider? Yes it would be a big job and would obviously cost money but in theory at least it sounds feasible. I wondered if there was drainage or something on the inside which would make it impossible but it doesn't sound like it if there is standing water after rain. If it was wider there would be more racing lines and there would be less chance of riders colliding because there basically isn't enough room as we saw a couple of times last night.

 

Just a thought although I would assume it's been considered before. I'm sure those that constantly moan about it wold be at the front of the queue for donations to raise the necessary finance

Cost of course is the biggest stumbling block, and probably the reluctance of the stadium owners to lose more centre green.

Talking about widening the straights, unfortunately that then makes the bends even tighter, hence the reason why we only went for the minimum width allowed, which is 8 metres, when rebuilding the track for our first season in 1997. Interesting that Northside Training track in Worky, used to have massive corners with little centre green. Unfortunately, kids who rode the inside line were then faced with the problem of hitting the fence, which was then straight in front of them. They then took the inside line out narrowing the bends, and created more natural and traditional curves which has made the circuit for some great safe racing.

Incidently, we did take 2 metres off the centre green apex of the 1st/2nd conner in the late 90's to give more width to the track, but several local riders though we have spoilt the track. The first and 2nd bends are still 2 metres narrower than the 3rd/4th, but then most riders don't use the full width of the 3rd/4th, except for those who have got themselves into big trouble.

After being at some of the berwick meetings you updated on over the years.... your view will be taken with a pinch of salt

Yes, I would remind B 4 Life of his actions after the Bandits last visit. Stood with the Pieman and Seedef, never said a wrong word to them during the meeting, but gave it large on here when other Berwick fans decided to attribute their thrashing on the track.

[Bandits4life]

After being at some of the berwick meetings you updated on over the years.... your view will be taken with a pinch of salt

 

Nothing wrong with them, never biased and generally very fair with my comments.

 

 

Yes, I would remind B 4 Life of his actions after the Bandits last visit. Stood with the Pieman and Seedef, never said a wrong word to them during the meeting, but gave it large on here when other Berwick fans decided to attribute their thrashing on the track.

 

Think you will find that I never made a comment after the Bandits last visit, we were beaten fair and square and no complaints about the track that night. However I think you will find that comments were made after the Somerset meeting, not Berwick.

[Chewbacca]

but then most riders don't use the full width of the 3rd/4th, except for those who have got themselves into big trouble.

 

 

or they're called James Grieves

[Bandits4eva]

Anyway, this whole discussion has accidentally brought so many speedway fans together once again, in pursuit of their obsessions. Step forward, montie, Drac, TaylorJ, Bandits(4 life and 4 Ever), and now Mr Blobby. So predictable, whatever would we do without you.

You seriously need to get over yourself.. There are a lot of fans out there that have criticised Brough as a circuit... My main concern has been bend 2 (which if you take the blinkers off.. a couple of diamonds fans have also reported on) and the amount of problems arising there.. Which was what I pointed out in my post from the Berwick match!

And you say we're all predictable... Just as predictable as you I'm afraid!

Edited July 7, 2014 by Bandits4eva

[Tsunami]

 

You have missed around 000`s of names from that list,including Promotions,team managers,riders,Owners and former World Champions!

 

Yes the weather seems to have played a part yesterday,but it seems every week these days,you only have to read various social media site to see

 

Interesting that you pick out Simon Nielsen,seen him a few times this year and last and to be honest hes been slow as a donkey and utter crap,maybe thats why he stays on BP!!

 

We continue to hear how you have to come off the throttle at BP,yet next,we hear that if you come off the throttle with a modern speedway bike[and silencer] they bike reacts in a strange way

 

i dont ride a bike so aint got a clue which is right

For the millionth time, stop exaggerating. Only WC that didn't like Brough was Havvy jr so that does't count.

 

Ha Ha, great insight and judgement. Nielsen 1+1, 3, 2+1, 0, 2+1,2+1 = 10 +4 =14 must be a lot of slower donkeys about.

 

Auty doesn't not come off the throttle, and his bike usually reacts in a strange way as well.

 

No comment

Edited July 8, 2014 by Tsunami

[Arson fire]

 

Nothing wrong with them, never biased and generally very fair with my comments.

Didn't say they were biased or unfair??....

You seriously need to get over yourself.. There are a lot of fans out there that have criticised Brough as a circuit... My main concern has been bend 2 (which if you take the blinkers off.. a couple of diamonds fans have also reported on) and the amount of problems arising there.. Which was what I pointed out in my post from the Berwick match!

And you say we're all predictable... Just as predictable as you I'm afraid!

your quick to put the boot in though, at least admit that??