Little Thumper Posted January 8, 2017 Report Share Posted January 8, 2017 British Speedway fuelled by ....... Incompetence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted January 8, 2017 Report Share Posted January 8, 2017 We'll run this year I've no doubt of that it's just the long planned for legacy is gone. We are just tenants now not owners. MCC can decide if the back straight opens just at easily as when the GRA decided to knocked down the Chieftain stand. If Monsters trucks are a better option on a BH then they will run instead of us. Down the line 5, 10 or 20 years it might suit MCC to see the dog track levelled and be replaced by council tax paying homes. Belle Vue dogs and stock cars would be attractive financially as fellow tenants in the NSS (if that's still its name) so we get sidelined still further. The thing is now it's out of our hands. As has happened many times over the last few decades this knee jerk reaction to have a pop at Belle Vue has long term repercussions for us and the sport in the U.K. Considering it took so long to achieve it's a crying shame to see it lost over petty jealousy and envy. British Speedway fuelled by ....... ............ and that's my worry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falcon Hammer Posted January 9, 2017 Report Share Posted January 9, 2017 Even the most ridiculous track conditions have been considered recoverable and when you watch the YouTube clips of the practice laps on the night, even now, with the benefit of hindsight it seems incredible that the meeting didn't go ahead, doesn't it? I was also surprised it didn't go ahead; expected the rollers to come out after every 4 heats, possibly every 2 - would've been a bit of inconvenience, but I'm sure most people would've been understanding Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halifaxtiger Posted January 13, 2017 Report Share Posted January 13, 2017 (edited) The Belle Vue promoters were putting money into a business that's 100% reliant on leased facilities. If those leased facilities needed to be constructed to a particular specification, I'd absolutely make it a condition of my lease to be able to inspect that the facilities met the necessary specification - at every stage of construction. I have some sympathy for the promoters who pursued a vision, eventually made it happen, but who appear to have been let down by other parties. Unfortunately though, that's the nature of doing business and the incompetence of others can cost you dearly if you neglect the supervisory process. I don't know the ins-and-outs of the arrangements with Quirky Lane, but the new stadium was built to a tight schedule and construction overruns and deficiencies are not unusual. I'm not sure why a provisional agreement couldn't have been made to use the old stadium, or to delay the start of the season if there were any delays in delivery. The bottom line is that ultimately it doesn't matter where the blame lies. Two promoters have lost their shirts as a result, the council has lost a lot of revenue, and the reputation of the new stadium has been damaged. The Council should certainly be up to supervising the construction of stands and toilets, but I doubt they have any experience at all with constructing a speedway track and I absolutely wouldn't be reliant on them signing off something that important to my business. I'd say its pretty clear that Belle Vue didn't have inspection rights. There's no way the council would have settled a counter claim if they had. I'd also say that you are right when you state you would very much want to have such rights if your business was greatly affected by the quality of the construction. I conclude, then, that the council refused to allow Belle Vue any part in construction other than the design. What to do in those circumstances ? Fold the team ? Unthinkable. Stay at Kirky Lane permanently ? Unthinkable, given that David Gordon had said many times that there was no future there. Temporary residency at Kirky Lane, to me, is simply not an option. For a start, Belle Vue were constantly assured by the council that the stadium would be ready on time and fit for purpose and until a few weeks before that, had no reason to disbelieve them (lets not forget that the practice session was a huge success). Notice to quit Kirky Lane must have been given months before hand and as the GRA are often no friends of speedway I can just imagine how much a week to week contract would have cost. I can also imagine how it would have looked if Gordon and Morton had agreed to a cover arrangement that would have cost a huge amount totally unnecessarily especially given that the club was cash strapped before they moved. Its easy to be wise with hindsight, but in their shoes I would have done exactly what Gordon and Morton did in moving to NSS. Its why I think any suggestion that laying any responsibility for the shoddy construction at the feet of Gordon & Morton is entirely unreasonable. What they are at least partly responsible for, however, is the existence of a world class stadium with a world class track like none other in Britain. You can say that it doesn't matter where the blame lies, and in the end you are right. But there is a great deal of interest in the story of what happened. I'd be surprised if there is any speedway fan who couldn't care less about the near loss of not just speedway's fantastic new stadium but also of the most famous name in world speedway, Belle Vue Aces. Edited January 13, 2017 by Halifaxtiger 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
New Science Posted January 14, 2017 Report Share Posted January 14, 2017 I'd say its pretty clear that Belle Vue didn't have inspection rights. There's no way the council would have settled a counter claim if they had. I'd also say that you are right when you state you would very much want to have such rights if your business was greatly affected by the quality of the construction. I conclude, then, that the council refused to allow Belle Vue any part in construction other than the design. What to do in those circumstances ? Fold the team ? Unthinkable. Stay at Kirky Lane permanently ? Unthinkable, given that David Gordon had said many times that there was no future there. Temporary residency at Kirky Lane, to me, is simply not an option. For a start, Belle Vue were constantly assured by the council that the stadium would be ready on time and fit for purpose and until a few weeks before that, had no reason to disbelieve them (lets not forget that the practice session was a huge success). Notice to quit Kirky Lane must have been given months before hand and as the GRA are often no friends of speedway I can just imagine how much a week to week contract would have cost. I can also imagine how it would have looked if Gordon and Morton had agreed to a cover arrangement that would have cost a huge amount totally unnecessarily especially given that the club was cash strapped before they moved. Its easy to be wise with hindsight, but in their shoes I would have done exactly what Gordon and Morton did in moving to NSS. Its why I think any suggestion that laying any responsibility for the shoddy construction at the feet of Gordon & Morton is entirely unreasonable. What they are at least partly responsible for, however, is the existence of a world class stadium with a world class track like none other in Britain. You can say that it doesn't matter where the blame lies, and in the end you are right. But there is a great deal of interest in the story of what happened. I'd be surprised if there is any speedway fan who couldn't care less about the near loss of not just speedway's fantastic new stadium but also of the most famous name in world speedway, Belle Vue Aces. If Gordon and Morton are the good guys here , how come their good friends at the BSPA have revoked their promoting license and their partners at Manchester council have locked them out of their own stadium ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halifaxtiger Posted January 15, 2017 Report Share Posted January 15, 2017 (edited) If Gordon and Morton are the good guys here , how come their good friends at the BSPA have revoked their promoting license and their partners at Manchester council have locked them out of their own stadium ? Its not my intention to paint them as 'good guys', just as blameless for the shoddy construction. Having said that, in my view David Gordon & Chris Morton soldiered on for years as Kirky Lane believing that NSS would be built and in the hope that a move to a new stadium would attract increased attendances and wipe out running debts. You only have to read the pages of this forum to know that many were sceptical, contemptuous and dismissive and it is my understanding that a few within the BSPA were too. The stadium was built, and that is at least partly down to them. It would be speculation indeed to suggest that if the stadium had been completed as planned (no issues with track, proper terracing and toilets) Belle Vue would have survived unscathed but the way I see it the Peter Craven meeting and the fact that the track was not fit for purpose for several weeks was the straw that broke Morton & Gordon's back. Edited January 15, 2017 by Halifaxtiger 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OveFundinFan Posted January 15, 2017 Report Share Posted January 15, 2017 If Gordon and Morton are the good guys here , how come their good friends at the BSPA have revoked their promoting license and their partners at Manchester council have locked them out of their own stadium ? Before the 2016 season ie NSS opeing, does anyone know what the relationship between Dave Gordon and Chris Morton ws in reality??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post PHILIPRISING Posted January 15, 2017 Author Popular Post Report Share Posted January 15, 2017 Before the 2016 season ie NSS opeing, does anyone know what the relationship between Dave Gordon and Chris Morton ws in reality??? EXCELLENT ... you don't spend nine years on a project like this, going through so many setbacks along the way, without a decent relationship. Incidentally, barring any last minute legalities, SS will be publishing a comprehensive investigation in what went wrong at the NSS this week. 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OveFundinFan Posted January 15, 2017 Report Share Posted January 15, 2017 My apololgies, the question I asked is not pointed in the right direction, so I will re-phrase Before the 2016 season ie NSS opening, does anyone know what the relationship between Dave Gordon/Chris Morton and BSPA was in reality?? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halifaxtiger Posted January 15, 2017 Report Share Posted January 15, 2017 (edited) EXCELLENT ... you don't spend nine years on a project like this, going through so many setbacks along the way, without a decent relationship. Incidentally, barring any last minute legalities, SS will be publishing a comprehensive investigation in what went wrong at the NSS this week. That sounds like a good news announcement about the speedway is imminent. Edited January 15, 2017 by Halifaxtiger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Shovlar Posted January 15, 2017 Report Share Posted January 15, 2017 Having witnessed speedway live at the NSS on three occassionsin 2016, I really hope the club comes to tapes in 2017. It's a long way from Poole but well worth the effort of a nine hour round trip. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILIPRISING Posted January 17, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 DUE to some legal arguments, which we hope to resolve later this week, Speedway Star has had to put on hold our feature on what went wrong at the NSS this year. The legal department at Manchester City Council have raised a number of objections but we are confident that everything are ready to publish is both factual and verifiable by documentation that we have in our possession. All being well we will go ahead next week. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Smith Posted January 17, 2017 Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 DUE to some legal arguments, which we hope to resolve later this week, Speedway Star has had to put on hold our feature on what went wrong at the NSS this year. The legal department at Manchester City Council have raised a number of objections but we are confident that everything are ready to publish is both factual and verifiable by documentation that we have in our possession. All being well we will go ahead next week. So, I assume that this Speedway Star exclusive is in the defence of Morton & Gordon if MCC have raised some objections? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner85 Posted January 17, 2017 Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 When the facts are known ,then I think you will find that neither MCC nor the Belle Vue promotion will be shown to be blameless. It will be good to see facts rather than rumour / exaggeration of rumours. At the end of the day the most important aspect is that Belle Vue race in 2017 and beyond. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OveFundinFan Posted January 17, 2017 Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 So, I assume that this Speedway Star exclusive is in the defence of Morton & Gordon if MCC have raised some objections? So, I assume that this Speedway Star exclusive is in the defence of Morton & Gordon if MCC have raised some objections? You can assume all you like, this forum is full of assumptions - many of them wrong. What are you expecting as a response..... If the SS news is put back a week....its put back a week. At least we all know its put back a week.........we will have to wait a bit longer. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ouch Posted January 17, 2017 Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 Not surprised at all about that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsunami Posted January 17, 2017 Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 So, I assume that this Speedway Star exclusive is in the defence of Morton & Gordon if MCC have raised some objections? Oh Dear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILIPRISING Posted January 17, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 (edited) So, I assume that this Speedway Star exclusive is in the defence of Morton & Gordon if MCC have raised some objections? IT'S a chance for Gordon to have his say and by no means asserts he or CM are blameless but does lay bare what went wrong and who is to blame regarding the track and the opening night fiasco and the consequences of that. Edited January 17, 2017 by PHILIPRISING Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Smith Posted January 17, 2017 Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 Oh Dear. Why "Oh dear"? perfectly reasonable question to ask and Phil answered it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsunami Posted January 17, 2017 Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 Why "Oh dear"? perfectly reasonable question to ask and Phil answered it But quick enough to jump to conclusions that probably were not true. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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