Scunthorpe V Cradley (national League) 13th April 2014

[Halifaxtiger]

Strange, but that is what most National League promoters will be saying when Cradley visit their tracks this season!

 

If you are going to cherry pick the best riders available enticed by over the odds points money then you run the risk of unbalancing the League which is what you have done. That is detrimental to the National League. There is not a level playing field and it is a dreadful shame when money buys the best team.

 

Is it ?

 

When I chose my meetings this season, one of the first to be pencilled in was Mildenhall v Cradley at West Row. To suggest that fans will not attend home meetings when the best team in the league turns up is bizarre.

 

I have no problem with what Scunny are doing, but one thing is certain : other NL promotions will (I have been told that Buster Chapman was less than impressed last week). The drop in attendances that the weakness of the side provokes is exactly the reason why the Stags run as double headers with the Scorpions.

 

That is exactly how the EL & PL work - witness the complaints made by fans about Workington, for example. Why should the NL be any different, and why shouldn't a club that is successful off track use the financial muscle gained by that success to give it the best opportunity for success on track ?

[Ommer Mon]

Strange, but that is what most National League promoters will be saying when Cradley visit their tracks this season!

 

If you are going to cherry pick the best riders available enticed by over the odds points money then you run the risk of unbalancing the League which is what you have done. That is detrimental to the National League. There is not a level playing field and it is a dreadful shame when money buys the best team.

 

Have to say that my experience of following Dudley / Cradley to away tracks is that we are welcomed with open arms due to the number of fans we take with us.

[Halifaxtiger]

If teams don't like what Scunny are doing they could always move up a League, instead of buying this League.

 

Nonsense.

 

Are you suggesting the Young Stars move up (the simple truth is it will be anything but just Cradley who will be unhappy), because apparently Buster Chapman wasn't impressed last week ?

 

This view utterly overlooks the reason why Scunthorpe run Stags meetings as double headers with Scorpions ones : they do so because if they ran them as stand alones few would pay to attend and in running them as double headers you effectively pay for the NL meeting whether you want to or not if you want to see the PL match. In other words, they will take no financial risk on the effect that the Stags team will have on their overall viability while imposing that risk on every other club in the league.

 

Until such time as Scunthorpe run Stags meetings as stand alones every other club in the league is perfectly justified in complaining about the effect the weakness of the Stags side has on their gates.

 

As a final point, if Scunthorpe don't like other teams complaints (and, lets face it, the others will be very much in the majority) they could always move down a league.

Edited April 13, 2014 by Halifaxtiger

[EC Rides Again]

The scoreline wasnt important, what was, was the debut of a young man Sam Chapman, he scored 12 points including beating Tom Perry, Max Clegg, and Matt Williamson for a very good debut.

 

As others have said on this subject on other threads, there has to be middle ground found in a league where teams have different agendas. Scunny are too weak and Cradley too strong, a balance is needed for the good of everyone.

 

Anyway today is all about Sam Chapman so well done to him. No doubt the Heathens have their eye on him for next year.....

Quite agree that the best thing about this match is the emergence of Sam Chapman. I wasn't there today (boo hoo) so could someone fill me in on his background story ?

 

Looks like by rather more luck than judgement ( I presume he was in the team due to the injury crisis) the Stags might have a new prospect to get excited about.

[bruno]

This isnt cradleys fault or scunnys fault but the way the nl is run.difficult to find an answer but neither promotions fault.I was looking forward to visiting Scunthorpe but it made no sense financially or competitively.not even sure il be at monmore wood for the return.answer? No idea

[SCB]

If Sam Chapman turns out to be anyway decent and capable of PL speedway then Scunthorpe will be able to say all the thrashing, all the moaning etc has been worth it, they have found a rider. More power to them!

[Ommer Mon]

 

Nonsense.

 

Are you suggesting the Young Stars move up (the simple truth is it will be anything but just Cradley who will be unhappy), because apparently Buster Chapman wasn't impressed last week ?

 

This view utterly overlooks the reason why Scunthorpe run Stags meetings as double headers with Scorpions ones : they do so because if they ran them as stand alones few would pay to attend and in running them as double headers you effectively pay for the NL meeting whether you want to or not if you want to see the PL match. In other words, they will take no financial risk on the effect that the Stags team will have on their overall viability while imposing that risk on every other club in the league.

 

Until such time as Scunthorpe run Stags meetings as stand alones every other club in the league is perfectly justified in complaining about the effect the weakness of the Stags side has on their gates.

 

As a final point, if Scunthorpe don't like other teams complaints (and, lets face it, the others will be very much in the majority) they could always move down a league.

 

Far more eloquently put than I could have done Halifaxtiger.

 

I think you have hit the nail on the head.

[THE DEAN MACHINE]

If teams don't like what Scunny are doing they could always move up a League, instead of buying this League.

if they move up who are scunny going to ride against

[greyhoundp]

 

 

 

Quite agree that the best thing about this match is the emergence of Sam Chapman. I wasn't there today (boo hoo) so could someone fill me in on his background story ?

 

Looks like by rather more luck than judgement ( I presume he was in the team due to the injury crisis) the Stags might have a new prospect to get excited about.

 

 

Iv read somewhere only today, Sam has been riding for Milton Keynes, so Im only guessing, he could be another Teams assett.

[montie]

if they move up who are scunny going to ride against

The rest of them maybe??

[bullet]

Iv read somewhere only today, Sam has been riding for Milton Keynes, so Im only guessing, he could be another Teams assett.

Not sure he is anyone elses asset at moment (who knows who is these days the rules seem to change about apperances age league etc)

I know he was up here for a training day yesterday at scunny so may have been helping as a guest while up here and on that performance would love to see him fill in the gap our "Full team" has. However like a few other riders I don't think it is likely as believe he is from cornwall so would be a very long distance to travel so may not be able to commit.

 

Although people moan I bet several 3pt riders we have looked at appear in other NL teams during this season and probably quite soon!!

[SCB]

Are you suggesting the Young Stars move up (the simple truth is it will be anything but just Cradley who will be unhappy), because apparently Buster Chapman wasn't impressed last week ?

L:et be honest, the "Young Stars" are a joke. They have an average age only 11 months younger than the "stars" FFS! They have such up an coming rider as Mallett, Hughes and Cockle - who have all failed in the PL, years ago, and are now professional NL riders.

[Daniel Smith]

L:et be honest, the "Young Stars" are a joke. They have an average age only 11 months younger than the "stars" FFS! They have such up an coming rider as Mallett, Hughes and Cockle - who have all failed in the PL, years ago, and are now professional NL riders.

I think joke is a bit harsh but I have no intention of watching them at all this year, just nothing to look forward to in terms of development. With the Young Stars being our 'reserve' team it should be about finding riders for the future just like what Scunny are doing with the help from Matt Ford / Poole. I'm concerned that we've allowed Ford to move one step ahead yet again.

 

I should imagine that Scunny have set up the way that have down to Ford's investment as he'll be looking for future rider. Stags - Scorps - Pirates. Always one step ahead of the game and this is what King's Lynn / Buster should be doing.

 

National League = look to the future - not the past

[Halifaxtiger]

L:et be honest, the "Young Stars" are a joke. They have an average age only 11 months younger than the "stars" FFS! They have such up an coming rider as Mallett, Hughes and Cockle - who have all failed in the PL, years ago, and are now professional NL riders.

 

That's harsh.

 

Lewis Kerr scored a maximum in the PL yesterday and 10 points in the EL on Friday. He's a product of the Young Stars. Lewis Rose scored 7 yesterday, beating the likes of Roynon, Compton & Lanham in his first season at that level. So is he.

 

If Scunthorpe can claim credit for the likes of Josh Auty, I see no reason why King's Lynn Young Stars can't claim Robert Lambert. He's riding in the EL, too.

 

I was very impressed with Josh Bailey the other day, another youngster blooded by Dale's team.

 

The difference between King's Lynn and Scunthorpe is that the Stars don't have the luxury of being able to run double header meetings. They can't just throw an MDL team in the NL, because no-one would go and watch it.

[semion]

The difference to my mind is, the likes of Godfrey, Chapman, have the greater good of British Speedway at heart. Winning things at that level is not the main priorty. Other teams at this level have a different agenda. Ok, Lynn aint gonna produce 3 riders like Rose, Kerr and Lambert every season, the same goes for Scunny, But at least you can see what they are trying to acheive as a bigger picture. I am not sure the same could be said for certain other clubs at this level.

Edited April 14, 2014 by semion

[norwichkev]

The difference to my mind is, the likes of Godfrey, Chapman, have the greater good of British Speedway at heart. Winning things at that level is not the main priorty. Other teams at this level have a different agenda. Ok, Lynn aint gonna produce 3 riders like Rose, Kerr and Lambert every season, the same goes for Scunny, But at least you can see what they are trying to acheive as a bigger picture. I am not sure the same could be said for certain other clubs at this level.

Shouldn't be on this thread but name & shame the clubs

[Bagpuss]

I think this is going to be a fallow year for the Young Stars after finishing last season with five youngsters in the side.....there are really just three this year with four experienced NL lads who almost certainly won't go any further. Like screamer I probably won't be paying to watch them too often but next year will probably be different again with one or two younger prospects unearthed. I'd like to see Darren Mallett along with six lads who are on the up, with two rookie reserves every year but that isn't always possible. Would be nice to think that out could happen in the future though.

[THE DEAN MACHINE]

The rest of them maybe??

so stoke mildenhall ,cradley all move up because they all believe its about winning ,where does that leave the national league? 5 teams left =no national league. You can knock cradley all you like but the national league will be a much poorer place without them. I just dont get this fixation with young riders . I want to see good speedway at all levels and quite frankly i dont care if a rider is 15 or 50 as long as its entertaining cause thats what im paying admission for

[adz_mft]

The difference to my mind is, the likes of Godfrey, Chapman, have the greater good of British Speedway at heart. Winning things at that level is not the main priorty. Other teams at this level have a different agenda. Ok, Lynn aint gonna produce 3 riders like Rose, Kerr and Lambert every season, the same goes for Scunny, But at least you can see what they are trying to acheive as a bigger picture. I am not sure the same could be said for certain other clubs at this level.

The trouble you have is the likes of Scunny can do what they are doing with no problem.They can bring in 6 new riders to the sport in 1 go.They have the luxury of a main PL team to fall back on for finances.If Mildenhall for example didn't build a team that could win on track at home and the odd meeting away,we would close as the crowds would drift.The hardcore base would stay I've no doubt about that,but you'd lose the people who only come every so often.

I think Mildenhall have got the balance right this year.Competitive team and a chance to bring on some youngsters.Our oldest rider I believe is Halsey and he's only 25/26.4 riders under 20 aswell.I couldn't be happier with the 7 we have.

[EC Rides Again]

The trouble you have is the likes of Scunny can do what they are doing with no problem.They can bring in 6 new riders to the sport in 1 go.They have the luxury of a main PL team to fall back on for finances.If Mildenhall for example didn't build a team that could win on track at home and the odd meeting away,we would close as the crowds would drift.The hardcore base would stay I've no doubt about that,but you'd lose the people who only come every so often.

The entire conundrum very well summed up !

 

The two sides in this argument are at loggerheads but they should be able to see that they are mutually dependent. The stand alones have to have opposition to fill out a season and the second teams need to test themselves against a mixture of opposition.

 

When Scunthorpe made their late bid to enter the NL this year I would presume that their intentions on team building would have been discussed with the other clubs at the NL AGM. If it was going to be a problem then the other clubs should not have accepted their entry.