iris123 Posted April 6, 2014 Report Share Posted April 6, 2014 So, best to have a rule in place for the younger ones then!!!! Yup.That is what i have also stated.Just imo because of the small numbers i think it could be a flexible rule based on ability rather than one that states wednesday you can't ride,but thursday because you have a birthday you can...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BWitcher Posted April 6, 2014 Report Share Posted April 6, 2014 Yup.That is what i have also stated.Just imo because of the small numbers i think it could be a flexible rule based on ability rather than one that states wednesday you can't ride,but thursday because you have a birthday you can...... That's life. Deal with it. Most others do. Next Lamberts family will be bleating the speed limits are different in the UK to Germany. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Posted April 6, 2014 Report Share Posted April 6, 2014 It isn't easy,but i do think in the case of speedway where we are dealing with such small numbers there could be a deal of flexibility.These things are all different in the speedway world as well as in real world.SCB states that even at the age of 19 you can't ride a 500cc on the road,but could be speedway world champion.But i do understand that you make an exception and where do you draw the line.My personal opinion is if a rider can do 4 laps of a track on a 500cc in a NL standard time on any given track then he should be ready.If someone can't then they ain't There will be quite a few kids who can do NL times on their own but lack the physical strength to cope when things go wrong in a group of riders. You have to think of the risk to the people they are competing against as well as their own well being. Go to an amateur meeting and you will sometimes see riders who are fairly quick but just can't cope with a crowded track. Speedway isn't a career that is all over in 5 years so I can see no reason to risk having 14 year old riders competing against adults. At the moment there is one rider unhappy with the situation but who has the opportunity to progress in exactly the same way but 12 months later. There would be (has been at times with 15 year old riders in the NL) plenty of complaints about older riders if they put a 14 year old through the fence and hurt him by hard riding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iris123 Posted April 6, 2014 Report Share Posted April 6, 2014 There will be quite a few kids who can do NL times on their own but lack the physical strength to cope when things go wrong in a group of riders. You have to think of the risk to the people they are competing against as well as their own well being. Go to an amateur meeting and you will sometimes see riders who are fairly quick but just can't cope with a crowded track. Speedway isn't a career that is all over in 5 years so I can see no reason to risk having 14 year old riders competing against adults. At the moment there is one rider unhappy with the situation but who has the opportunity to progress in exactly the same way but 12 months later. There would be (has been at times with 15 year old riders in the NL) plenty of complaints about older riders if they put a 14 year old through the fence and hurt him by hard riding. Yes,but we have also had similar cases with women put in the fence.And are girls of 15 as strong as boys?Is there a different rule for girls + boys?I do remember a few young girls riding as well,although a couple of sisters have just last season moved up to 500cc and only wanted to do demo/training rides.But from talking to them it did seem as if that was their own choice.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi Posted April 6, 2014 Report Share Posted April 6, 2014 gonna have a great world cup/pairs, the Germans I mean. Smolinski, Lambert. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Smith Posted April 6, 2014 Report Share Posted April 6, 2014 Questions for iris123 How is it possible to judge if a 14yr old is strong enough to face top class speedway? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted April 6, 2014 Report Share Posted April 6, 2014 Can you imagine the uproar is a 14 year old is taken out by a much older rider, you'd have people claiming they should take it easy against him as he's only a kid. What if an older, more experience rider wiped him out? Imagine the uproar. For once I think the BSPA have this right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post E I Addio Posted April 6, 2014 Popular Post Report Share Posted April 6, 2014 Yes,but we have also had similar cases with women put in the fence.And are girls of 15 as strong as boys?Is there a different rule for girls + boys?I do remember a few young girls riding as well,although a couple of sisters have just last season moved up to 500cc and only wanted to do demo/training rides.But from talking to them it did seem as if that was their own choice.. Presumably the "we " you are referring to means Germany . I will spell it out as succinctly as I can :- Speedway Star has pointed out that Germany is the exception in allowing 14 year olds to compete on 500cc machines. The fact that it is an exception means most other countries don't allow riders to compete on %00cc machines that young. Are you with me so far ? Therefore we can see that in not allowing 14 year olds to compete with seniors the BSPA are in line with most other countries . Agreed ? Now, if you bother to read the article in SS, (which you clearly haven't) you will see that even Lambert himself does not say in terms that the rule is wrong per se. He doesn't even say there should be some sort of competency test as you claim . What he actually says is:-"The reason I'm racing in Germany is because they wouldn't let me race over here at a young age. I was ready to take the step up and they wouldn't let me race". Note the highlighted part. . He wants the rule waived especially for him. Even up to this point one can see his point of view. If he thinks riding in Germany helps his career, fair enough, but the then the tantrum comes. Because the BSPA won't break the rule that applies to most other riders in most other speedway countries they must be punished by Master Lambert, who says he will not ride for Team GB. ""I wouldn't do it. " he asserts " There is such a sour taste in my mouth I wouldn't put myself out to do it" ( not that he has even been asked to ride for team GB at the moment ) If any rider declines to ride for Team GB because they lose money and don't get paid on time , (as some have ) most fans could at least have sympathy with that position. Riders have to consider their financial situation, but when this schoolboy stamps his feet and says he won't ride for his national team because the BSPA won't waive a rule that is pretty standard practice in most countries then that is in the opinion of many, both childish and churlish. That is the point. Can you imagine the uproar is a 14 year old is taken out by a much older rider, you'd have people claiming they should take it easy against him as he's only a kid. What if an older, more experience rider wiped him out? Imagine the uproar. For once I think the BSPA have this right. Exactly. The other night we saw one of the best riders in the world, Darcy ward, wiped out and rendered unconscious, in a racing accident. Sadly we have seen Ricky Ashworth a competent rider very seriously hurt in a racing accident. Last year we saw Peter Karlsson badly hurt at Lamberts home track. We don't like to admit it but the plain fact is that MOTOR RACING IS DAGEROUS in all its forms, and if we were to swap Darcy, Ricky or PK for Lambert there would be all kind of complaints against the BSPA. The difference is that those three are deemed to be old enough to join the army, get married, have driving licence, and generally make their own decisions in life, which with the best will in the world 14 year old schoolchildren need to be protected from. Of course kids should have access to sport and some do get hurt but you have to have controls. I agree , the BSPA have got this one right. I think all of us except Iris agree on that. 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stratton Posted April 6, 2014 Report Share Posted April 6, 2014 That's life. Deal with it. Most others do. Next Lamberts family will be bleating the speed limits are different in the UK to Germany. You might be right in what you say,but give the Lambert's a bit of slack eh!.You do seem to be on there case he is BRITISH you know!! a bit of SUPPORT wouldn't go amiss. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fromafar Posted April 6, 2014 Report Share Posted April 6, 2014 You might be right in what you say,but give the Lambert's a bit of slack eh!.You do seem to be on there case he is BRITISH you know!! a bit of SUPPORT wouldn't go amiss.the Lamberts should engage brain before putting mouth into gear and this thread would never have started.They have themselves to blame IMO 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BWitcher Posted April 7, 2014 Report Share Posted April 7, 2014 You might be right in what you say,but give the Lambert's a bit of slack eh!.You do seem to be on there case he is BRITISH you know!! a bit of SUPPORT wouldn't go amiss. The Lamberts can have all the slack they want, they've done very well in getting their son additional track time and experience, nobody is knocking them for that at all. Good luck to the lad. However, little point 'supporting' a rider because he is 'british' if he doesn't want to race for his country. Not that I believe that will be the case for one moment down the line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waiheke1 Posted April 7, 2014 Report Share Posted April 7, 2014 is Lambert's only issue with the BSPA the rule on age limits, or is there anything else which has caused this attitude? If the former, then I agree that he's acting like a petulant child, whcih i guess he is. however, i certainly don't think the smart thing ould be for the bspa to react by penalising him in anyway. give it a couple of years and it should all sort itself out, hopefully he will be fulfilling his potential, and representing the uk in wtc and GPs. the most talented sports people often have egos or other issues to match (i'm thinking your lees, wards, tiger woods, ronaldo in NZ kayaker Ben Fouhy, hadlee, crowe etc) - and it can just be a case of living with that, so long as their performances are good enough. obviously it is very early days in lamberts career and he could end up being the next PC/Tai Woffinden, or he could be the next Edward Kennett. I know i'd rather see him in the GB team in three years time than the latter, so fingers crossed he lives up to his promise, in which case I'm sure we can all put up with the odd tantrum in the intervening years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 7, 2014 Report Share Posted April 7, 2014 The Lamberts can have all the slack they want, they've done very well in getting their son additional track time and experience, nobody is knocking them for that at all. Good luck to the lad. However, little point 'supporting' a rider because he is 'british' if he doesn't want to race for his country. Not that I believe that will be the case for one moment down the line. The late great England and Belle Vue star Jack Parker once said to me - it must have been in1953 - "the trouble with so many up-and-coming young riders is their parents!" I wonder if that applies in the case regarding the Lamberts which is now under discussion? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racers and royals Posted April 7, 2014 Report Share Posted April 7, 2014 Some people might think they are the same-however this has nothing to do with the BSPA -it is the Speedway control bureau who administer the rules and have on their board, members from other motorcycle disciplines plus the auto cycle union(ACU). 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iris123 Posted April 7, 2014 Report Share Posted April 7, 2014 Questions for iris123 How is it possible to judge if a 14yr old is strong enough to face top class speedway? Maybe you are asking the wrong person this question as i wasn't the one who brought strength up.I just suggested a competence test,something which it seems they have in the Netherlands we have been told.For me like i said if they can ride a number of heats at a given speed and what i think should also be compulsory is to be able to lay the bike down at a given signal.There is nothing to suggest someone suddenly gets stronger on their 15 birthday The late great England and Belle Vue star Jack Parker once said to me - it must have been in1953 - "the trouble with so many up-and-coming young riders is their parents!" I wonder if that applies in the case regarding the Lamberts which is now under discussion? This is also the great Jack Parker who told his brother whilst the young Ronnie Moore was sitting next to them to "tell your boy if he doesn't back off then i am going to kill him"!!!! And that is where i do tend to agree with the very good point Vince bought up.It is a lot about the attitude of the other riders.How do they cope with a "young upstart" who comes on the scene and beats them.Jack Parker and a few of the other stars of the day didn't take too kind to the teenager Ronnie Moore showing them the way home.It seemed some riders in modern times didn't take too kindly to the female from Denmark Sabrina Bogh beating them.I was told there was little or no problem from local riders,who were used to women racing,but when she moved onto the international scene then rider from eastern Europe didn't like getting beaten by a woman and went out to get her.Maybe the more relaxed atmosphere in germany is better suited to a 14 year old staring out. I'd guess i am one of very few on this thread,on this forum that has witnessed 14 years olds racing speedway.I am one of a few that witnessed Robert Lambert as a 14 year old riding against guys 4,5 or 6 years older than him and he made minced meat of them.But i guess you just have to wonder about the incident last night and if a rider had have kicked Lambert when he was on the track that could well have caused a major incident.You can't compare speedway with driving on the roads,because if that incident last night had happened on a street then someone might....should have ended up in prison.In speedway or in many other sports the law of the land doesn't apply.But imo the people who should not be on the track are those who "fence" or attack a fellow rider and not someone with a special talent Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E I Addio Posted April 7, 2014 Report Share Posted April 7, 2014 In speedway or in many other sports the law of the land doesn't apply. Don't know which land is being referred to, whether it be Germany, Irisworld or somewhere else, but the law of the land applies to all sport in the UK. Whether victims of assault on the sports field choose to press charges is a different matter but the law applies. Yet another attempt to get out of the hole results in it getting deeper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triple.H. Posted April 7, 2014 Report Share Posted April 7, 2014 If RL refuses to ride in the GB U21 as he states in the interview even though it would no doubt antagonise him even more. Would he get a ban ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iris123 Posted April 7, 2014 Report Share Posted April 7, 2014 Don't know which land is being referred to, whether it be Germany, Irisworld or somewhere else, but the law of the land applies to all sport in the UK. Whether victims of assault on the sports field choose to press charges is a different matter but the law applies. Yet another attempt to get out of the hole results in it getting deeper. Obviously it doesn't as YOU pointed out that normally you have to be 21 to ride a 500cc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E I Addio Posted April 7, 2014 Report Share Posted April 7, 2014 Obviously it doesn't as YOU pointed out that normally you have to be 21 to ride a 500cc Really ? Can you point out where I said that ? If you can't show us all where I said that (and I know you can't because I never said it ) then once again we can all see that dear old Iris, when short of facts resorts to making them up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arson fire Posted April 7, 2014 Report Share Posted April 7, 2014 If RL refuses to ride in the GB U21 as he states in the interview even though it would no doubt antagonise him even more. Would he get a ban ?why should he get a ban?? Surely in a free country he can make that choice. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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