Birmingham V Lakeside April 2 El (a)

[SteveLyric2]

I see Barker is already blaming the lack of track prep 'to suit the home riders' - too slick apparently?!

 

I thought most riders these days know that most tracks will be prepared 'slick' as that suits the current bikes!!? Fans need to recognise that too - or perhaps that's why attendances might dwindle even more?

 

Changes need to be made sport-wide to make bikes/silencers and riders etc more suited to grippier tracks imo.

[Vincent Vega]

Great win from the Hammers. Agree with Hougaard Racing that Sundstrom would be a good signing. Rather than moan about the track being too slick BB should work on his gating.

[Tommy Sweetman]

A losing team will only drive the fanbase away even further though, I do have to say though that i have often asked the question about Speedway in Brum on numerous occasions, but its just not the speedway in Birmingham that is affected by dwindling crowds, Birmingham City and Aston Villa have both suffered losses in fan base, Warwickshire Cricket Club another , i would just like to say one thing about Birmingham in general and its not having a dig at anyone in particular but Birmingham is very multicultural and when you walk through our city centre it is now very hard to even hear an english conversation, its either Polish, Hindi, Romanian and god knows what other languages are spoken in our wonderful city, i just dont think that sport is high on the agenda of this city anymore, least we not forget also that when Birmingham closed in the 80s and re-opened in 2007 there was a lost generation in speedway support, maybe without internet, social media the younger generations would have seen speedway as a cheaper version than the ridiculous high priced football, i cant honestly say that Birmingham will see the season through or not, hopefully NOT the latter, but i do fear beyond this season, but when a team crumbles as badly as tonight at home, it wont help the situation

Absolutely spot on with that assessment,Birmingham as a city seems no longer interested in any kind of sport.

Crowds at Edgbaston for the cricket ,have nose dived in recent times,and can only see speedway at Perry Barr following the same trend.

Dont think fans in the city are fickle,just that they prefer to spend their money on things other than sport.

[Bagpuss]

I see Barker is already blaming the lack of track prep 'to suit the home riders' - too slick apparently?!

 

I thought most riders these days know that most tracks will be prepared 'slick' as that suits the current bikes!!? Fans need to recognise that too - or perhaps that's why attendances might dwindle even more?

 

Changes need to be made sport-wide to make bikes/silencers and riders etc more suited to grippier tracks imo.

You are right but Brum has always had a grippy outside line and as a home rider there is nothing worse than turning up to a home track which is completely different to what you expect or are used to. A slick track played right into Lakeside's hands although I'm sure they would have won anyway.

[MFE]

Not certain your assessment of the fans in the city is correct, the reason for decreasing crowds is lack of any

success for any of our sports teams in the region, fans are totally cheesed off, by second rate performances.

The problem at Birmingham Speedway is exactly the same, virtually everyone could see it was a team built on a

tight budget, and as a result have no recognised heat leaders,5 inconsistent second strings and two reserves, it was blooming obvious to all fans that this season was going to be a massive struggle. Alan Phillips said today, all the team needs is a couple of good results, not at all sure where these will come from. The other problem of course is the ageing supporter base, which is not being replenished, never have I been to a track where there are so

many anoraks from the clubs byegone age, and the crowds will naturally decrease.

[Bryn]

You are right but Brum has always had a grippy outside line and as a home rider there is nothing worse than turning up to a home track which is completely different to what you expect or are used to. A slick track played right into Lakeside's hands although I'm sure they would have won anyway.

 

Apologies for going slightly off-topic but would be interested to know what your definition of a 'slick' track is "Bagpuss?" Alas I was unable to get to Brum last night but managed to get a lift to King's Lynn instead. On arrival at 6.40pm looking at the track from the press box the track "looked" to be deep in shale and obviously very well watered as it looked very wet indeed. Initial thoughts of all (including the meeting officials) up where I was that it "looked" as if it may well prove to be too grippy especially for the several really inexperienced riders taking part. The track was watered again prior to the 7.30pm start, the truck might have gone round twice in fact but there was a lot of chat 'up in the box.'

I should have known better of course for the well watered seemingly too deep Saddlebow Road circuit proved excellent throughout the night and NONE of the several falls during the match and abandoned MDL match in the second half were attributable to it - all were as a result of 'pilot error!'

So "Bagpuss" how would you and others define a 'slick' track - genuine question.

[Bagpuss]

Bryn, using the word 'slicker' probably would have been better in my post, the point being that the track didn't have as much grip as Barker & co are used to. I would say a slick track is one with not to much dirt or moisture and where the base of the track can be seen on the racing line pretty early on. Nothing wrong with a track being reasonably slick as long as there is something there for the riders to work with, but extremes of conditions ie excessively slick or grippy aren't the best conditions for good racing IMO.

[stevebrum]

Not being disrespectful to Smolinski, but i do believe he will be seriously outclassed in the GP series, if he makes anywhere near the top 8 then i,m afraid Speedway is going downhill, because there is no way he is up to that class

 

Dont think you will find many disagreeing with you, however just a word of caution - look how many were saying Woffy would be outclassed this time last year.

[Tommy Sweetman]

Not certain your assessment of the fans in the city is correct, the reason for decreasing crowds is lack of any

success for any of our sports teams in the region, fans are totally cheesed off, by second rate performances.

The problem at Birmingham Speedway is exactly the same, virtually everyone could see it was a team built on a

tight budget, and as a result have no recognised heat leaders,5 inconsistent second strings and two reserves, it was blooming obvious to all fans that this season was going to be a massive struggle. Alan Phillips said today, all the team needs is a couple of good results, not at all sure where these will come from. The other problem of course is the ageing supporter base, which is not being replenished, never have I been to a track where there are so

many anoraks from the clubs byegone age, and the crowds will naturally decrease.

The exepetion being B,ham City ladies,who have reached the semi-final of the Champion League after beating the all conquering Gooners

[Bryn]

Thanks for your response Bagpuss and I accept what you say. I would mention though that many track curators I've talked to over the years have said to me that they don't put much loose shale on circuits in the early stages of a season as tracks are prone to staying far too damp after watering and prone to 'cut up.' They gradually add more shale as the season evolves and outside evening temperatures generally rise.

One thing I know is that there's no way I'd want to be a track curator because whatever you do, someone will moan!

[Haza]

 

Apologies for going slightly off-topic but would be interested to know what your definition of a 'slick' track is "Bagpuss?" Alas I was unable to get to Brum last night but managed to get a lift to King's Lynn instead. On arrival at 6.40pm looking at the track from the press box the track "looked" to be deep in shale and obviously very well watered as it looked very wet indeed. Initial thoughts of all (including the meeting officials) up where I was that it "looked" as if it may well prove to be too grippy especially for the several really inexperienced riders taking part. The track was watered again prior to the 7.30pm start, the truck might have gone round twice in fact but there was a lot of chat 'up in the box.'

I should have known better of course for the well watered seemingly too deep Saddlebow Road circuit proved excellent throughout the night and NONE of the several falls during the match and abandoned MDL match in the second half were attributable to it - all were as a result of 'pilot error!'

So "Bagpuss" how would you and others define a 'slick' track - genuine question.

easy one to answer Bryn slick track =Lakeside EL Rye House PL

[semion]

Easy Answer Bryn. Slick is the word for those 2 tries England ran in at Twickenham in The 6 nations against some team playing in Red.

[E I Addio]

You are right but Brum has always had a grippy outside line and as a home rider there is nothing worse than turning up to a home track which is completely different to what you expect or are used to. A slick track played right into Lakeside's hands although I'm sure they would have won anyway.

 

 

Can't really see how a slick track played into Lakesides hands. Barker, Kennett and King have all had big scores at Arena in the past and Kennett in particular probably rides Arena as well if not better than he rides any other EL track. I agree it is a disadvantage when a team finds its home track not as they usually expect it but that alone doesn't account for a defeat of this size. I see the Brummies t/m has put it down to poor gating by his team and that might well have more to do with it than track conditions. When riders are not totally focussed gating is often where it shows.

 

If you ever watch Phil Morris at work in the pits he is on to the riders encouraging them all the time and trying to get the best from them, arguably the best t/m in the country. He worked wonders with the Brum team last year and maybe that's whats needed now although the riders themselves have to respond of course.

[OGT]

Just a point about Aston Villa's "dwindling" attendances. They currently have the 9th highest average home gate at 36,230, which considering how bad their home performances and results have been (for quite a while now) is pretty good.

 

I can't really explain why Blues' attendances are so low though.

[Steve0]

Is anyone really surprised with the scoreline? Birmingham have put together a team on a budget and unfortunately they look like a PL team - they are lacking in both the heatleader and reserve positions. I think this team actually looks worse than the Swindon team of 2011 - when we were cast adrift at the bottom of the EL with no chance of strengthening. The net result is that there was less and less of a crowd each week and it was painful to watch.

 

A long season for Brummies fans and they will need to have some resolve to go and watch that team every week!

[woofers]

OK, so it's not helpful if the track isn't prepared as usual or expected.......but these guys are professional speedway riders with years of experience and aspirations of performing at World Cup level. I would expect them to be able to adapt, change their set ups and ride accordingly. The problems must be bigger than the track being too slick.

 

With regard to replacements, surely the introduction of around 20 NL riders has free'd up a number of riders who were EL last year and now without a ride, some of whom would be eager for another chance.

[Bagpuss]

 

 

Can't really see how a slick track played into Lakesides hands. Barker, Kennett and King have all had big scores at Arena in the past and Kennett in particular probably rides Arena as well if not better than he rides any other EL track. I agree it is a disadvantage when a team finds its home track not as they usually expect it but that alone doesn't account for a defeat of this size. I see the Brummies t/m has put it down to poor gating by his team and that might well have more to do with it than track conditions. When riders are not totally focussed gating is often where it shows.

 

If you ever watch Phil Morris at work in the pits he is on to the riders encouraging them all the time and trying to get the best from them, arguably the best t/m in the country. He worked wonders with the Brum team last year and maybe that's whats needed now although the riders themselves have to respond of course.

Don't get me wrong, there is far more to Brum's performances so far than track conditions but I have no doubt it was a major factor last night. That said Lakeside look a very decent team this year, better than I probably have them credit for. The heat leaders may well be found wanting occasionally on the road but the second strings and Ellis look like they will more than make up for it. Should be a good and very tough meeting at the Norfolk Arena on Wednesday. Edited April 3, 2014 by Bagpuss

[mudflaps]

Karol Baron ^

 

Oh Boy I remember the Baron nights around the EOES!

[greyhoundp]

I really fear for The Brummies this season, the supporters of Birmingham have shown in the past, they wont support a poor Team, and this is a poor Team, it would struggle to hold its own in the PL never mind the EL. King as we all know isnt a No1, Kennett is on a downward spiral, Barker is at best a 3rd heat leader, Nermark has seen his best days, Skorniki again another on a downward spiral. The 2 draft riders, Starke will get some points when he gates, Lambert still a NL rider after how many years ?.

 

I can barely see The Brummies winning a meeting with this Team, in fact i will predict, They wont win more than 2 home meetings and none away. The big unknown is will they complete the season ?. Im afraid i have my doubts. . three riders on a downward spiral with their careers, the other two are inconsistant at best. I just hope there is another investor lined up.

I really fear for The Brummies this season, the supporters of Birmingham have shown in the past, they wont support a poor Team, and this is a poor Team, it would struggle to hold its own in the PL never mind the EL. King as we all know isnt a No1, Kennett is on a downward spiral, Barker is at best a 3rd heat leader, Nermark has seen his best days, Skorniki again another on a downward spiral. The 2 draft riders, Starke will get some points when he gates, Lambert still a NL rider after how many years ?.

 

I can barely see The Brummies winning a meeting with this Team, in fact i will predict, They wont win more than 2 home meetings and none away. The big unknown is will they complete the season ?. Im afraid i have my doubts. . three riders on a downward spiral with their careers, the other two are inconsistant at best. I just hope there is another investor lined up.

[stevebrum]

I really fear for The Brummies this season, the supporters of Birmingham have shown in the past, they wont support a poor Team, and this is a poor Team, it would struggle to hold its own in the PL never mind the EL. King as we all know isnt a No1, Kennett is on a downward spiral, Barker is at best a 3rd heat leader, Nermark has seen his best days, Skorniki again another on a downward spiral. The 2 draft riders, Starke will get some points when he gates, Lambert still a NL rider after how many years ?.

 

I can barely see The Brummies winning a meeting with this Team, in fact i will predict, They wont win more than 2 home meetings and none away. The big unknown is will they complete the season ?. Im afraid i have my doubts. . three riders on a downward spiral with their careers, the other two are inconsistant at best. I just hope there is another investor lined up.

 

 

If i was a Brummies fan the answer is simple. Do i want Speedway at Perry Barr or not? If you don't support don't whinge if the doors close for good again.

The club is struggling financially. Now IS the time to be supporting!