Top Rider Shortage

[Baldy]

Nice reply Jayne I get fed up with people saying why don't you........... when they have no answers and just stand on the sidelines anonomously criticising and making futile suggestions about riders you have probably already tried or some who have not even returned your call.

 

If they had any idea how long it can take to sign one rider let alone a team full.

 

It is difficult this season but I believe that there is some merit in the EL Draft although personally I would have liked the Premier League to have been involved as well. Maybe in both Leagues each team to have one rider from the NL pool. More warning might have been helpful and then maybe we could have had a picking session as well.

 

Good Luck with your team I know how hard it is

 

Malcolm

I have all the time in the world for you Malcolm; in fact when you came to Stoke it kept me going for a while, so I will respect what you say to my comments. I no longer go to speedway due to the set-up we have in all leagues not just the NL because There is very large a gap in the riding ability of the num one riders and the lads that ride at reserve berth. I have too long watched riders finish 1/2 to 3/4 of a lap at times in front of others due to the spread in ability. I have often said I would be willing to watch lads of Ben Wilson's standard race against each other as I would also be willing to pay to see Rob the new seven at Stoke (sorry his surname has gone from my head) race against his standard but not Ben against Rob as no racing tends to be involved and I end up not entertained. Two to three good races a night is not enough. Why cannot sides be with riders of equal ability racing against each other?. I hear that for lads to get better they need to ride against better riders and to a degree that is correct if the ability is close; if not then a lad can be demoralised by the experience. This is not a complaint against you, just interested in your views.

[teddy2706]

To get bums on seats, promoters must provide a spectacle. However, last season, almost every Buxton home meeting was a spectacle, yet unless visiting supporters arrived in force, the crowd was low. This is a very sad state of affairs, yet the crowd for Deano's airfence meeting was very good.

Steeplejack's point about half lap leads is by no means confined to NL racing, we have all seen this happen at every level and will no doubt see it again.`

Regarding payment for riders, minimum pay and minimum travel allowances are insufficient for riders to break even if they are travelling any distances.

Sponsorship, not only from large concerns, but from the grass roots supporters will undoubtedly assist riders to invest in top quality machinery.

Whilst bracing myself for an onslaught from fans who believe paying to get in is more than sufficient, riders at NL level struggle with costs and in my experience, help, no matter how small, is usually gratefully received.

If it isn't, don't help that particular rider again!

Joe Hughes International will mail a tyre to any supporter anywhere, as I am sure all of the other speedway specialists will too.

Make an NL rider smile, give him a tyre!

It costs about the same as admission to three meetings (ish).

This will not alleviate a rider shortage, but it will assist in making sure those available can continue to ride.

[montie]

The draft is a double edged sword. How are these lads supposed to earn when they are too good for NL and now it seems too good for the EL.

 

Being to goOD for the NL is how it works.,,,,and there is nothing wrong with that..and im not sure who is to good for the EL??!

[TMW]

 

Being to goOD for the NL is how it works.,,,,and there is nothing wrong with that..and im not sure who is to good for the EL??!

Don't have places? Too good to be on the reserve draft? Did I say there was anything wrong with being too good for the NL? No I don't believe I did. I was alluding to their earning potential in PL only. Which at the mo is all thty have unless they have European commitments.

 

Oh we are going to have such fun this season

Edited January 21, 2014 by TMW

[Swift Saint]

I have all the time in the world for you Malcolm; in fact when you came to Stoke it kept me going for a while, so I will respect what you say to my comments. I no longer go to speedway due to the set-up we have in all leagues not just the NL because There is very large a gap in the riding ability of the num one riders and the lads that ride at reserve berth. I have too long watched riders finish 1/2 to 3/4 of a lap at times in front of others due to the spread in ability. I have often said I would be willing to watch lads of Ben Wilson's standard race against each other as I would also be willing to pay to see Rob the new seven at Stoke (sorry his surname has gone from my head) race against his standard but not Ben against Rob as no racing tends to be involved and I end up not entertained. Two to three good races a night is not enough. Why cannot sides be with riders of equal ability racing against each other?. I hear that for lads to get better they need to ride against better riders and to a degree that is correct if the ability is close; if not then a lad can be demoralised by the experience. This is not a complaint against you, just interested in your views.

You make some interesting points and I am not sure how best to find ideas that will rectify what you have said. Indeed, the actions taken by the Elite League during the close season, which I actually support to a degree make the situation you describe even worse for them. Ok two reserve races there may be but how are the National League reserves going to fare against regular Elite League team members?

 

In the example that you give at Stoke Ben Wilson and Rob Shuttleworth will not normally race together. Only in the event of an injury would that likely to be the case. You have to give opportunities to newcomers and it is difficult to select them at the start of the season. We feel that given his fantastic enthusiasm his rapid improvement last season and his family pedigree and support Rob has a chance to be that magic discovery. But let's not pressure the lad. He has promised his utmost what more can one ask for? James McBain our other reserve has more experience and I feel sure that he will be an exceptional capture but looking at what happened at Stoke last season when everyone said at the start of the season that we had a good team and yet at times we could not have beaten a drum.

 

But I believe that National League speedway because of the effort of the riders and the unpredictability is far and away the best to watch and I believe I have seen more third tier speedway in this country than anyone else. I smile now that all the snobs who made the assertion that they were not going to watch what they called "wobblers" now will be saying how great that level is which in turn will help us. But the mixing between the two levels in the same race may be a problem. I feel that the Premier League should have had one NL reserve and the EL one also and that would have been an improvement. But I do not know that for certain.

 

I hope Mr Steeplejack that you will return to Stoke and that we will excite and entertain you. We have a burning desire to do well but who knows? One bad injury could wipe you out if you need a top replacement. Its that difficult.

 

I don't think that really answers your question but it is my thoughts on this difficult subject.

 

Malcolm Vasey

[roguetrader]

I'd say it's not just about the money at Cradley it's also about the staggering support home and away. who wouldn't want to win away in front if a big away crowd and the potential for sponsorship is there to. Who wouldn't want to ride under those terms? At the end of the day the promotion meeting supporters needs and a bit more points money is a bonus and let's face it banter or not all promoters look forward to Cradley rolling into town. I've never been to Mildenhall v Dudley meeting but I imagine the roof is raised by some feet at those fixtures :-)

The really sad state of affairs is that you actually believe your post is true. The truth is that Dudley/Cradley will be the death of the National League. There are set points money for the National League which Dudley/Cradley openly abuse. It could have been much worse as your out of touch Management Team wanted to sign an Australian ringer as reserve who would have made a mockery of the National League.

Thankfully Scunthorpe yet again will restore the true ethos of the values that the National League represent and something Buxton has always seeked to achieve.

[TMW]

The really sad state of affairs is that you actually believe your post is true. The truth is that Dudley/Cradley will be the death of the National League. There are set points money for the National League which Dudley/Cradley openly abuse. It could have been much worse as your out of touch Management Team wanted to sign an Australian ringer as reserve who would have made a mockery of the National League.

Thankfully Scunthorpe yet again will restore the true ethos of the values that the National League represent and something Buxton has always seeked to achieve.

I'm not a Cradley supporter. Just giving a view of why a rider may have their head turned. I'm sure the money is good and for what it's worth I think Williamson has been ill advised. If Cradley supporters are happy for the constant thrashings at home then should they be deprived? the rest of the league can aim for 2nd place and have a lot more fun doing it.

[roguetrader]

I'm not a Cradley supporter. Just giving a view of why a rider may have their head turned. I'm sure the money is good and for what it's worth I think Williamson has been ill advised. If Cradley supporters are happy for the constant thrashings at home then should they be deprived? the rest of the league can aim for 2nd place and have a lot more fun doing it.

Fair point and good post.

[Hunty]

I'm not a Cradley supporter. Just giving a view of why a rider may have their head turned. I'm sure the money is good and for what it's worth I think Williamson has been ill advised. If Cradley supporters are happy for the constant thrashings at home then should they be deprived? the rest of the league can aim for 2nd place and have a lot more fun doing it.

I don't see it being that easy for Cradley. The home meetings can be a bit of a whitewash sometimes but individual heats can be absolutely fantastic to watch. Last year I saw the best racing all year at Monmore Wood on a Tuesday night. I go to EL fixtures all over the country and went to the Play Offs at Wolves and Birmingham and well Poole v Birmingham at Perry Barr was bland to the say the very least.

 

The NL final second leg at Kings Lynn was only won by one point to the Heathens, ok that's an away meeting but come the end of the season we had some great tussles with IOW Kent Kings and the young Stars.

 

I expect us to do well but it won't be the same outcome as 2013 let me tell you that!

[June]

Seeing as I'm a big believer in our British youngsters getting into our sport, I read all these posts and yes I do join in. Ive been insulted took it on the chin. Don't expect it any other way or I wouldn't make posts. Whatever is said or done in N/L the basic facts are;

[Hunty]

Seeing as I'm a big believer in our British youngsters getting into our sport, I read all these posts and yes I do join in. Ive been insulted took it on the chin. Don't expect it any other way or I wouldn't make posts. Whatever is said or done in N/L the basic facts are;

Drumroll Please?

 

The end of Eastenders Music

 

Leaving us on a cliff hanger?

[June]

Cont'd ...Sorry my comptr went on the blink had to re-boot.

N/L is the bottom tier of the 3 leagues. Its the first step on to the ladder for the youngsters and also a first time of being part of a competative team. Its a huge step from having fun, beating better riders in practice and AM meetings. Therefore the sooner foundations are put in place for all teams to develope further to what Scunny and others are doing with these kids before they enter this league the better and faster we will see progression. My point being; I think the team Avereage should be lower, hence more rookies per team. Clubs that want more from the league should apply for PL. OK I expect to get shot down now lol.

[Hunty]

Cont'd ...Sorry my comptr went on the blink had to re-boot.

N/L is the bottom tier of the 3 leagues. Its the first step on to the ladder for the youngsters and also a first time of being part of a competative team. Its a huge step from having fun, beating better riders in practice and AM meetings. Therefore the sooner foundations are put in place for all teams to develope further to what Scunny and others are doing with these kids before they enter this league the better and faster we will see progression. My point being; I think the team Avereage should be lower, hence more rookies per team. Clubs that want more from the league should apply for PL. OK I expect to get shot down now lol.

 

Has the league got more to offer? The fact is the gap between PL is getting bigger in terms of some teams and smaller in the cases of others, so I 100% agree with what you have said. The league should be and is aimed at development, it needs to have more links to the grass roots of the sport such as the MDL. I've said it a few times that if the EL draft works then I would hope there would be a influx of PL teams and EL teams having development squads. We are already seeing a trend towards that happening with the KL young stars, the Stags and Scunny running a second team. It needs to be competitive, it needs to have clubs who can bring in supporters to make it have that edge to it that the meetings really do matter instead of just having 7 riders just trying to improve lap times and technique.

 

Lowering the average would suit one side of the coin in terms of having more rookies but them on the other where will there riders with the bigger averages ride is there a PL spot for them after there first year in the EL draft? Nobody knows until 2015 how it will pan out.

 

It terms of the Heathens, we're in a bit of a situation where as soon as we get our own track it would be PL here we go, but until then we are doing a great job of bringing on talent but are in the situation of big fish in a small pond.

 

Something's got to hive to balance it up. Fingers crossed that we get our own track and Mildenhall can make a push up too and that we get more second teams from the higher leagues.

[TMW]

It has always been the case between the stand alones and 2nd teams. The 2nd teams are running a competitive 1st team. I have seen the support at Scunny for NL I have also seen the support that leave before the 2nd meeting during double headers. The only way round it would be to stop stand alone clubs entering the NL.

[therefused]

im surprised the points limit wasnt lowered to something around 34-36 for the coming season at the agm due to the fact that so few riders are available for the nl this coming season. If i was in charge i would make it mandatory to have two 3 pointers at reserve, as well as changing the rules to any british rider under the age of 21 to be able to compete in the nl regardless of average. would allow ellis who has just missed out in only his second season of racing to be allowed for at least another year.

[Damo b]

Basically there isn't enough of any riders let alone, heat leaders. Just look at the moto cross track near west row, hundreds of lads turn up in £50k plus campers, if only that many where riding speedway, then every club would have a huge choice. The reason I mention the campers is that usually you get the old reason that speedway is expensive which i understand, but moto cross with all the gear and a camper can,t be that cheap.

I wonder if Mildenhall had the track open on the same weekend as the moto cross was on, and had a couple of bikes available, would any of the moto cross lads come across for a spin, as this would give them a chance to have a go at no outlay? Specially if someone got in touch with the moto cross club/ members before hand so they were aware of the invitation. Just an idea.

[roguetrader]

Has the league got more to offer? The fact is the gap between PL is getting bigger in terms of some teams and smaller in the cases of others, so I 100% agree with what you have said. The league should be and is aimed at development, it needs to have more links to the grass roots of the sport such as the MDL. I've said it a few times that if the EL draft works then I would hope there would be a influx of PL teams and EL teams having development squads. We are already seeing a trend towards that happening with the KL young stars, the Stags and Scunny running a second team. It needs to be competitive, it needs to have clubs who can bring in supporters to make it have that edge to it that the meetings really do matter instead of just having 7 riders just trying to improve lap times and technique.

 

Lowering the average would suit one side of the coin in terms of having more rookies but them on the other where will there riders with the bigger averages ride is there a PL spot for them after there first year in the EL draft? Nobody knows until 2015 how it will pan out.

 

It terms of the Heathens, we're in a bit of a situation where as soon as we get our own track it would be PL here we go, but until then we are doing a great job of bringing on talent but are in the situation of big fish in a small pond.

 

Something's got to hive to balance it up. Fingers crossed that we get our own track and Mildenhall can make a push up too and that we get more second teams from the higher leagues.

 

 

No your not. You cherry pick the best riders available enticed by illegal points money. You have four riders from the Elite League draft riders and two rider riding in all three leagues. You also attempted to sign an Australian ringer as a reserve which was quite frankly disgraceful and bit you on the arse. You are doing no favours whatsoever to the National League.

Edited January 23, 2014 by roguetrader

[Hunty]

S

 

No your not. You cherry pick the best riders available enticed by illegal points money. You have four riders from the Elite League draft riders and two rider riding in all three leagues. You also attempted to sign an Australian ringer as a reserve which was quite frankly disgraceful and bit you on the arse. You are doing no favours whatsoever to the National League.

 

So giving riders platform to sucseed isnt going to help bring them on. We have a fan base that supports the riders through the HSSC by the 50/50 that makes 170+ each week that goes back to the riders. We have start of season nights that are in aid of the riders with all money going to them and this years is nearly sold out.

 

We all know how difficult it is to start off in speedway and as a club of management and supporters and sponsers we really give them the best opertuinty to push themselves to the next level

 

We have bumper crowd which surely attracts more sponsers because they will be sponsering a young lad who is going to be riding infront of more people at meeting.

 

Its not so much us 'Cherry Picking' riders is as much as most of the National League Riders would like to ride for the heathens because they are going to be managed well, supported well, given an opertiunity to ride a whole season cause its not often we have made rider changes.

 

We really do devlop riders and I struggle to name any that have not left us on a higher average or moved onto bigger and better things.

 

You quote that we have four riders from the elite league draft but out off the 23 that were in the elitle league draft 10 of them were Heathens or had riden for the Heathens over there short careers.

 

We support our team away, we take our well earned money to other clubs and spend it at there tracks, some National League Teams look for our fixture because they are in for a bumber crowd. Over 300 we took to Kings Lynn for the final how many Kings Lynn fans came to the first leg, you could count them on your fingers and toes. We took a coach and more to IOW we piled into Buxton and Stoke on the double header day we dare I say it our fans the majority at proberbly both tracks.

 

How we have done no favors to the NL is beyond me, I understand that we may have made the gap between PL and NL closer for ourselves whilst making it bigger for some other clubs but it happens in in all sports the better players go to the better clubs.

 

Simple as that, you will say its where the money is, but thats only because we have a fan base and management that can support it.

 

We are a big fish in a small pond, we are desperate for our own track to make the step up and then we might become the small fish in the big pond.

 

Untill this happens the Heathens will do everything they can to sucseed but the development of the riders comes first. Not all fans will agree but I belive that and ive said it loads of times on here but the best moment of last season wasnt winning everything it was watch a young lad Max Clegg take his first steps on to very big things.

Edited January 24, 2014 by Ommer UM Speedway Blog

[Bagpuss]

What has stopped the Heathens stepping up out of intetest? Is it a case of every spare penny going towards a new stadium fund? Its such a shame as both the club and Monmore Green would be an asset to the PL.

 

As it is the NL is a very lopsided league which is realistically a two horse race. Primarily its about youth development for me and its great to see plenty of youngsters getting their chance.

[June]

Ommer, I'm sorry but I cannot agree with your statements of Heathens developing riders. NO no no!! This is done in places like Scunny, Kings Lynn etc where these kids start riding their very small bikes at very young ages 5 or 6 years old. At Scunny its under the guidence Wayne Carter & Richard Hollingsworth and his gang of helpers. These kids develope on to the next size bike and so on. They go from the training track to the big track and delopement goes on. By the time these kids get to teenages they have developed style and speed and compete on either 250 or 500cc bikes in AM meetings. By the time they reach 14/15 they are ready for NL. This is the age when there should be an opening into the first league for all those lads that has stuck with speedway.They have earned their right to at least be given a chance. At this level teams offering big money to youngsters already in the N/L is at the expense of many lads missing out on team places. Money can always buy the best team! In any sport.