Barrycuda Posted January 6, 2014 Report Share Posted January 6, 2014 Perhaps it would be more practical if the suggested protected rides for the reserves was rethought. It shouldn't hurt if the reserves occasionally line up with the better riders. There will I presume, always be at least one similar standard opposing rider to race against. Everything would then benefit. The race format would be more sensible. The averages would be more reflective and the so called protected reserves should benefit from riding with and against riders who are better than them. In my opinion both the old thirteen heat and present fifteen heat format as been fairly reasonable and balanced with rider pairings. Regarding juniors at reserve. At Boston there many meetings that started with a heat before the main meeting that involved two or more junior riders racing to decide one or two reserve places. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pointsmeanplayoffs Posted January 8, 2014 Report Share Posted January 8, 2014 Has no-one mentioned that the current system of heat pairings is also 'uneven' when it comes to calculating a CMA? If you look at the average combined CMA of opposition riders for say A. Racer riding at No. 2, he will come across opponents with a somewhat higher average combined CMA than if A. Racer was riding at No. 7. It's why when a reserve steps up to the main body of the team - usually at No.2 or No. 4, then they find it a lot harder to score points. Just saying that the current system isn't exactly perfect, so why should we expect the new system to be so? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobMcCaffery Posted January 8, 2014 Report Share Posted January 8, 2014 Has no-one mentioned that the current system of heat pairings is also 'uneven' when it comes to calculating a CMA? If you look at the average combined CMA of opposition riders for say A. Racer riding at No. 2, he will come across opponents with a somewhat higher average combined CMA than if A. Racer was riding at No. 7. It's why when a reserve steps up to the main body of the team - usually at No.2 or No. 4, then they find it a lot harder to score points. Just saying that the current system isn't exactly perfect, so why should we expect the new system to be so? Just because there are imperfections in the current system it doesn't mean we should not be concerned by the far, far greater problems that the new system will create. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philfromcov Posted January 8, 2014 Report Share Posted January 8, 2014 i think for the reserves its quite easy anyway. they have two protected races against the other reserves, so for the following year they shouldn't count just the heats against the main body of the team, doing this is any reserve achieved a 2 point average i would be surprised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g13webb Posted January 10, 2014 Report Share Posted January 10, 2014 As expected, I see it's been announced in the SS, that the top three riders will now ride in Team Positions 1, 3, 5. leaving places 2 and 4 for the second strings. This ruling alone has taken away the team managers options of places riders in more advantage positions. What Next????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted January 10, 2014 Report Share Posted January 10, 2014 As expected, I see it's been announced in the SS, that the top three riders will now ride in Team Positions 1, 3, 5. leaving places 2 and 4 for the second strings. This ruling alone has taken away the team managers options of places riders in more advantage positions. What Next????? It was always going to have to happen if reserves were not going to meet heat leaders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy robin Posted January 10, 2014 Report Share Posted January 10, 2014 As expected, I see it's been announced in the SS, that the top three riders will now ride in Team Positions 1, 3, 5. leaving places 2 and 4 for the second strings. This ruling alone has taken away the team managers options of places riders in more advantage positions. What Next????? Does that mean that highest average at No1, 2nd highest at No3 & 3rd highest at No 5 & can managers choose 2 & 4 or is that down to averages as well?. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g13webb Posted January 10, 2014 Report Share Posted January 10, 2014 Does that mean that highest average at No1, 2nd highest at No3 & 3rd highest at No 5 & can managers choose 2 & 4 or is that down to averages as well?. Pass. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted January 10, 2014 Report Share Posted January 10, 2014 ONCE AGAIN WE ARE GOING ON ABOUT NEW RULES!!! When is this constant change to Speedway Rules going to stop. Year after year the 'Powers that be' change the Rules, usually to suit themselves, certainly not for the benefit of their Customers/Supporters. In fact their Customers/Supporters are always the LAST to be considered, even though it is us who pay to watch. SKY Television just has to 'snap it's fingers' and 'hey presto' the Rules are changed - whether it is for the benefit of the Sport or not. Nobody listens to the Customers/Supporters. Their input is NIL. The impression given to me, and to many I suspect, is that they, the 'Powers that be', don't know what they are doing. When they change the Rules they seem to release them to their supporting Public in dribs and drabs. Usually, the Rule is altered, changed or quietly dropped because they have found problems with the application of said Rule. This obviously reinforces the idea that they don't know what they are doing. Why can't they get a set of Rules in place and leave them alone for a few years - the way they go on currently is, frankly, pathetic. No the wonder Customers/Supporters are walking away - there is NO consistency or credibility in Speedway any more. I sometime wonder HOW the Sport survives Season to Season. They STILL expect us to turn up every week and pay our money though. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hobbit Posted January 10, 2014 Report Share Posted January 10, 2014 According to Graham Drury at our recent management / fans meeting, your three heat leaders have to ride at 1, 3 & 5 BUT, there is no rule as to which one rides where. The team manager chooses. This sounds find but is barking mad IF the new race format is bring structured to paid the top average rider against the tip average rider etc etc !!! Simply won't work if each team deploys it's three heat leaders in different positions. Drury also said that should your number one rider get hurt in his first ride, then each rider in the main body if the team who by definition therefore, has lower average than said number one, can take ONE ride each to cover the number ones rides. This prevents the new reserves having to cover the number one and things becoming farcical If this us his it's going to work , I can only assume that the team managers can also put the two second strings at either number two or four, regardless of which of them has the higher average. Again, I don't see how this firs in with the talk about the new race format pitting equal levels of riders against each other. No wonder it's taking an eternity for the new race formula to be finalised and ratified Drury also said it might be wise for teams not to go slide their lineups until Ll promoters and managers knew the race format. I'm hoping this us what the a tummies are doing as opposed to putting together a dirt cheap team with every boy doses unwanted riders. Can hear you all laughing your heads off. Wooden spoon looms for the a dummies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grachan Posted January 10, 2014 Report Share Posted January 10, 2014 ONCE AGAIN WE ARE GOING ON ABOUT NEW RULES!!! When is this constant change to Speedway Rules going to stop. Year after year the 'Powers that be' change the Rules, usually to suit themselves, certainly not for the benefit of their Customers/Supporters. In fact their Customers/Supporters are always the LAST to be considered, even though it is us who pay to watch. SKY Television just has to 'snap it's fingers' and 'hey presto' the Rules are changed - whether it is for the benefit of the Sport or not. Nobody listens to the Customers/Supporters. Their input is NIL. The impression given to me, and to many I suspect, is that they, the 'Powers that be', don't know what they are doing. When they change the Rules they seem to release them to their supporting Public in dribs and drabs. Usually, the Rule is altered, changed or quietly dropped because they have found problems with the application of said Rule. This obviously reinforces the idea that they don't know what they are doing. Why can't they get a set of Rules in place and leave them alone for a few years - the way they go on currently is, frankly, pathetic. No the wonder Customers/Supporters are walking away - there is NO consistency or credibility in Speedway any more. I sometime wonder HOW the Sport survives Season to Season. They STILL expect us to turn up every week and pay our money though. I understand you frustration, but I'm pretty sure it's nothing to do with Sky Television. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveLyric2 Posted January 10, 2014 Report Share Posted January 10, 2014 (edited) I'm sure we'll all know what the new rules/ formats are before the first meeting!! Whats the rush?? Its not as if there are any racecards to design/fill in til March anyway!!? Edited January 10, 2014 by Skidder1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted January 10, 2014 Report Share Posted January 10, 2014 I understand you frustration, but I'm pretty sure it's nothing to do with Sky Television. I suspect that you are right. I only used them as an example. SKY have been instrumental in changing Rules in the past. :mad: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy robin Posted January 10, 2014 Report Share Posted January 10, 2014 ONCE AGAIN WE ARE GOING ON ABOUT NEW RULES!!! When is this constant change to Speedway Rules going to stop. Year after year the 'Powers that be' change the Rules, usually to suit themselves, certainly not for the benefit of their Customers/Supporters. In fact their Customers/Supporters are always the LAST to be considered, even though it is us who pay to watch. SKY Television just has to 'snap it's fingers' and 'hey presto' the Rules are changed - whether it is for the benefit of the Sport or not. Nobody listens to the Customers/Supporters. Their input is NIL. The impression given to me, and to many I suspect, is that they, the 'Powers that be', don't know what they are doing. When they change the Rules they seem to release them to their supporting Public in dribs and drabs. Usually, the Rule is altered, changed or quietly dropped because they have found problems with the application of said Rule. This obviously reinforces the idea that they don't know what they are doing. Why can't they get a set of Rules in place and leave them alone for a few years - the way they go on currently is, frankly, pathetic. No the wonder Customers/Supporters are walking away - there is NO consistency or credibility in Speedway any more. I sometime wonder HOW the Sport survives Season to Season. They STILL expect us to turn up every week and pay our money though. Fantastic post & more importantly all costs get cut apart from fans paying through the turnstiles. According to Graham Drury at our recent management / fans meeting, your three heat leaders have to ride at 1, 3 & 5 BUT, there is no rule as to which one rides where. The team manager chooses. This sounds find but is barking mad IF the new race format is bring structured to paid the top average rider against the tip average rider etc etc !!! Simply won't work if each team deploys it's three heat leaders in different positions. Drury also said that should your number one rider get hurt in his first ride, then each rider in the main body if the team who by definition therefore, has lower average than said number one, can take ONE ride each to cover the number ones rides. This prevents the new reserves having to cover the number one and things becoming farcical If this us his it's going to work , I can only assume that the team managers can also put the two second strings at either number two or four, regardless of which of them has the higher average. Again, I don't see how this firs in with the talk about the new race format pitting equal levels of riders against each other. No wonder it's taking an eternity for the new race formula to be finalised and ratified Drury also said it might be wise for teams not to go slide their lineups until Ll promoters and managers knew the race format. I'm hoping this us what the a tummies are doing as opposed to putting together a dirt cheap team with every boy doses unwanted riders. Can hear you all laughing your heads off. Wooden spoon looms for the a dummies. Gonna be alot of riders going sick during meetings after 2 bad rides if that's the case as that loophole will be broken very early. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orion Posted January 10, 2014 Report Share Posted January 10, 2014 I suspect that you are right. I only used them as an example. SKY have been instrumental in changing Rules in the past. :mad: When ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted January 10, 2014 Report Share Posted January 10, 2014 When ? Play Offs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orion Posted January 10, 2014 Report Share Posted January 10, 2014 Play Offs. Rule ? or Rules ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted January 10, 2014 Report Share Posted January 10, 2014 Rule ? or Rules ? Green Helmet Cover. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orion Posted January 10, 2014 Report Share Posted January 10, 2014 Green Helmet Cover. The swines !! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
New Science Posted January 11, 2014 Report Share Posted January 11, 2014 ONCE AGAIN WE ARE GOING ON ABOUT NEW RULES!!! When is this constant change to Speedway Rules going to stop. Year after year the 'Powers that be' change the Rules, usually to suit themselves, certainly not for the benefit of their Customers/Supporters. In fact their Customers/Supporters are always the LAST to be considered, even though it is us who pay to watch. SKY Television just has to 'snap it's fingers' and 'hey presto' the Rules are changed - whether it is for the benefit of the Sport or not. Nobody listens to the Customers/Supporters. Their input is NIL. The impression given to me, and to many I suspect, is that they, the 'Powers that be', don't know what they are doing. When they change the Rules they seem to release them to their supporting Public in dribs and drabs. Usually, the Rule is altered, changed or quietly dropped because they have found problems with the application of said Rule. This obviously reinforces the idea that they don't know what they are doing. Why can't they get a set of Rules in place and leave them alone for a few years - the way they go on currently is, frankly, pathetic. No the wonder Customers/Supporters are walking away - there is NO consistency or credibility in Speedway any more. I sometime wonder HOW the Sport survives Season to Season. They STILL expect us to turn up every week and pay our money though. Arn't you the guy who vociferously campaigns for the double point rule to be changed at the end of every season ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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