'speedway Riders - History, Results'

[Bryn]

Hmm, yes but the point is that there is this website purporting to be a definitive record of Speedway riders' records in the British leagues but actually deliberately supresses info. on whole sections of riders' careers... And the reason? The completely ridiculous, bigotted views of one individual who , completely laughably, believes the third division to be 'junior racing'...

Stll at least it's been admitted now...

Are you going to do as I suggested then Parsnips old fruit?

[Guest]

 

Surely it is THEIR choice as to what information they decide to spend time inputting?! If it is insufficient there is always the option of either not looking at it or putting your own money, time and effort towards devising a more complete picture. If those behind the site hadn't decided to donate their time towards the project, the only way to view such information would be via buying a book or painstakingly researching it yourself. Maybe some would indeed like to see Conference League information added but this clearly takes additional time and effort to collate. Are you offering to do this for them? So many people expect/demand things for free without considering the time and effort that somebody else spends to deliver it.

 

I don't agree. The site is SUPPOSED to be comprehensive. It is not so far as speedway's Third Tier is concerned. Overall it also only covers certain years of the sport. It was set up to attract people to look at it surely, not for viewers who detect failings that to be vilified when they draw attention to its failing points. Or told to creating a website of their own!±

I have every right to look at it and debate what it is there. Websites are created to attract people to view them. If this History Site is not there for that purpose one must wonder why it was created in the first place?

[AndyJ]

 

I don't agree. The site is SUPPOSED to be comprehensive. It is not so far as speedway's Third Tier is concerned. Overall it also only covers certain years of the sport. It was set up to attract people to look at it surely, not for viewers who detect failings that to be vilified when they draw attention to its failing points. Or told to creating a website of their own!±

I have every right to look at it and debate what it is there. Websites are created to attract people to view them. If this History Site is not there for that purpose one must wonder why it was created in the first place?

 

Where does it say that it is supposed to be comprehensive? http://wwosbackup.proboards.com/thread/2931/introduction

It would be reasonable to comment or ask along the lines of; "it's a shame it doesn't also include Conference League", "do you have any plans to add Conference League?" or "would you like me to collate the Conference League data and contribute to your site?" but criticism is surely unwarranted. It is quite clear that the site, as it stands right now, is an extremely useful resource even if it isn't a complete picture. I'd suggest that any vilification is a direct result of the critical nature of yours/Parsloes posts and unreasonable expectations/demands you (appear to) have for other peoples free time.

Edited November 25, 2013 by Tkdandy

[Guest]

 

Where does it say that it is supposed to be comprehensive? http://wwosbackup.proboards.com/thread/2931/introduction

It would be reasonable to comment or ask along the lines of; "it's a shame it doesn't also include Conference League", "do you have any plans to add Conference League?" or "would you like me to collate the Conference League data and contribute to your site?" but criticism is surely unwarranted. It is quite clear that the site, as it stands right now, is an extremely useful resource even if it isn't a complete picture. I'd suggest that any vilification is a direct result of the critical nature of yours/Parsloes posts and unreasonable expectations/demands you (appear to) have for other peoples free time.

 

The website ignores the fact that riders also rode in the Third Tier. If the Link works, here's a prime example:

 

http://wwosbackup.proboards.com/thread/3142

 

No details of the fact that one of his clubs/leagues involved the Conference League which I am certain that he was!

Edited November 26, 2013 by Guest

[frigbo]

Looks like some people have way too much time on their hands. The site clearly states it's scope but some still seem surprised and alarmed. I've no interest in the third tier and do not count it as anything more than junior racing.

 

That's my view and stance. It 's not going to change because a couple of people see fit to whinge about something they don't have to look at. Easy to whine about something that has cost them no effort or time.

 

With regards to the database queries. Unfortunately my db skills would fit onto a postage stamp. More than happy for someone with the required knowledge to help exploit the usability of the data if they wish.

[Guest]

Looks like some people have way too much time on their hands. The site clearly states it's scope but some still seem surprised and alarmed. I've no interest in the third tier and do not count it as anything more than junior racing.

 

Then why does Speedway Star give so much coverage - over many years, previously to the Conference League - and now to the National League with full match reports and news slots for the various clubs involved. It also covers the junior leagues - there are several of them - to a much lesser degree.

What further credibility to your vision of what constitutes junior racing with full scale National action in main sream venues venues like Coventry, King's Lynn, Central Park (Sittingbourne), Buxton, IoW, Wolverhampton and Stoke. These matches are far from being junior racing run over just a few heats following a senior speedway match.

Edited November 25, 2013 by Guest

[Parsloes 1928 nearly]

I've no interest in the third tier and do not count it as anything more than junior racing.

But frankly your bigotted opinion on this is just plain wrong.

Not just the World Champ but ALL members of the last GB World Cup squad rode earlier in the career in the third tier. By leaving out that fact the site organisers completely devalue the allegedly 'hard work' they've done putting together what is, as a result, a completely flawed data-base.

And no point others, who for some reason want be apologists for such a shoddy piece of work, saying, 'well you do the hard work and add the third tier data then', because the site organisers are making it 100% clear on here they don't want it.

And we thought 'Revisionists' only existed in the old Soviet Union, eh..!

Edited November 25, 2013 by Parsloes 1928 nearly

[Guest]

No Conference League or National League, but a similar league - the late 1950s Southern Area League - is?

I just looked up an old friend Vic Ridgeon who rode SAL from 1954-57. The History Site gives this info on him (and I wonder if more SAL riders are included?):

Vic Ridgeon

Born:

06.12.1928, London, England

Died:

12.05.2009

British Clubs:

Yarmouth (1950-1953)
Rye House (1954-1957)
Wolverhampton (1961, 1962)
Rayleigh (1963)
Sunderland (1964)
Glasgow (1964)
Exeter (1966)

Year..Clubs..Meetings..Rides..Points..Bonus..Average..Maxima

1966..Exeter..4..11..3..0..1.09

Read more: http://wwosbackup.proboards.com/thread/2470#ixzz2lhVIsHRg

[frigbo]

This is great fun. I dread to think what the reaction would be if something important happens!!

[Guest]

This is great fun. I dread to think what the reaction would be if something important happens!!

 

Like maybe recognising the importance of the Third Tier?

Edited November 26, 2013 by Guest

[frigbo]

The last post sums up the perspective of this thread far more eloquently than I ever could.

Edited November 25, 2013 by frigbo

[daveallan81]

Are you pair professional bores or is it just some kind of hobby?

[Parsloes 1928 nearly]

Are you pair professional bores or is it just some kind of hobby?

Hmm, says the man advertising,

"Excel Speedway Racecards & Sundry Speedway Related Items

Old Pics, Results Sheets 1928-2007, Racecards, all sorts of stuff"..?!

[frigbo]

I do hope you've got that 3rd teir (sic) covered, 'Dave?'

Edited November 26, 2013 by frigbo

[Guest]

I do hope you've got that 3rd teir (sic) covered, 'Dave?'

 

Going back further in time, and I realise it is outside the 1965 start season for the History Site. But in your opinion was the old National League Division Three third tier speedway or junior racing?

At its 1947 start it was made up mainly of newcomers and juniors from senior clubs - just a handful of pre-war riders gained places? All the teams though had their own stadiums.

Edited November 26, 2013 by Guest

[Mike.Butler]

i see the Western Junior League appearances haven't been included..

[Guest]

i see the Western Junior League appearances haven't been included..

 

I can appreciate your concern but even I think a line has to be drawn somewhere. The Western League and others of this ilk are regionalised and therefore must surely be regarded as junior racing?

Competitions like the Conference League and current National League are staged on a national basis and through this earn the criteria of being Third Tier speedway - at least that's my view.

Edited November 26, 2013 by Guest

[AndyJ]

Irrespective of what you'd like to see there, isn't the point that the line has already been drawn by those who update the site?

Frigbo has made it quite clear that EL and PL are the focus of the site. Considering it his HIS free time, HIS site and quite frankly HIS choice, isn't this all rather irrelevant?

To me this is akin to knocking on a strangers door, being invited in for a brew and then criticizing the fact that they don't offer you Earl Grey.

If you want Earl Grey go home and make your own!

 

Serious question: Are Gustix and Parsloes two alter-egos of the same person trolling for kicks?

[Parsloes 1928 nearly]

Serious question: Are Gustix and Parsloes two alter-egos of the same person trolling for kicks?

Tbh that is a pathetic comment and I demand its withdrawal.

The expression 'trolling' is over-used (as an insult) on this Forum but this takes it to another extreme.

There is NOTHING in my contribution to this thread which in any way constitutes 'trolling' and you frankly are a disgrace for making such a comment.

 

----------

 

What this thread has done has shown how a data-base meant to be an account of riders' careers is deliberately tampered with to wipe out whole parts of such careers. Not because it's too difficult to find the stats - but deliberately left out because of the bias of the compiler(s). Fair enough - it's up to them but something at least we now understand WHY this is the case.

[AndyJ]

Tbh that is a pathetic comment and I demand its withdrawal.

The expression 'trolling' is over-used (as an insult) on this Forum but this takes it to another extreme.

There is NOTHING in my contribution to this thread which in any way constitutes 'trolling' and you frankly are a disgrace for making such a comment.

 

As per Wikipedia: In Internet slang, a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows discord on the Internet by starting arguments or upsetting people^, by posting inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community (such as a forum, chat room, or blog), either accidentally or with the deliberate intent of provoking readers into an emotional response or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

 

I would argue that some of your comments such as "Is there anymore more stupid a thing than this so-called 'history' site" and "The completely ridiculous, bigotted views of one individual who , completely laughably, believes the third division to be 'junior racing'" could be construed as (admittedly in a relatively mild form) trolling. Surely you could have pointed out the omission or asked the question without starting the thread by insulting the efforts of those behind the history site? In my book the unsolicited insult is trolling and completely unnecessary.