Teams Making The Move Up

[muirspud]

So why after a long time are we see ing more and more clubs linked with making the step up to Elite league now than in years gone by?

 

Surely with a potential no sky deal, it would put teams off? What other incentives are there to go Elite? Is everything down to what teams pay riders per point, thus making the Elite league less lucrative in years gone by than now?

 

Id love to watch real racing on sky every week than the usual snore fest. Get the racing tracks on sky from the prem like somerset and sheffield etc My memories of going to Sheffield every week and the joys of when the top boys came to town was brilliant, PLRC's, Nothern riders champs, and they held a big invitational when Rickardson, Crump, Sullivan, Hammil came to town and im sure Hamill won in 99/00? Great to see that program again.

 

Were promtions to scared to move up in the glory days incase of failure? Had the tracks, potential riders waiting there, fans and sky willing to pay the money to see them.

 

Just hope British speedway can get back to some sort of level it used to be and compete on a world stage it can and has before.

 

 

[RedcarRacer]

Well those at the Wolves forum, seem to have come away with the idea of there being three possible teams moving up - Leicester we knew, but also Ipswich (wouldnt be a huge shock) and then Workington...personally would have thought Somerset would be more likely or even Sheffield but, who knows!

[Lord Skid]

More probably moving up, but the structure will be completely different, so it's not EL and PL as we know it.

[comet49]

I've noticed with Leicester and Ipswich the cost of travelling being given as a reason, it's along way for Ipswich and their fans to come up north, then there's no guarantee of a meeting with rain-offs. Leicester aren't near other Premier teams and in the Elite would have the Midlands derby matches, always good for business. If Somersets thinking the same then it's getting to North and South divisions thinking again, besides the existing Prem teams only Belle Vue could be classed as north, if Stoke could come back in, possibly, but they're only 60 odd mile from Birmingham.

 

It does seem silly in such a struggling sport that Plymouth travel to Glasgow and vice versa, I just hope something good comes out of the AGM to get crowds up again.

 

Edit..just seen the post linking Workington, surprises me but don't know.

Edited November 5, 2013 by comet49

[Humphrey Appleby]

So why after a long time are we see ing more and more clubs linked with making the step up to Elite league now than in years gone by?

I haven't looked at figures too closely in the past seasons, but there's always been a number of BPL teams that have done as well or better crowd-wise than the BEL. The problem was that costs in the BEL were something like 60% higher due to the riders being used, so teams needed someone willing to underwrite the inevitable losses.

 

The other issue was race days, as I think a high percentage of BPL teams need to race Friday, Saturday or Sunday. The SGP increasingly made it unattractive for weekend teams to race in the BEL, so that well have been another discouragement.

 

If it's accepted that the top flight can no longer hope to attract the top riders, and costs come down substantially as a result, then it may well prove more attractive for some teams to move up. Conversely, without certain teams in the BPL, it may induce other teams to move down to the National League, heralding a return to a two-tier system.

 

I think the traditional 'them-and-us' views espoused by BPL fans are a little short-sighted, as a cost-effective structure for the sport is dependent on integrated approach. Without a top flight, there will likely always be a few teams wanting to sign much better riders than other teams in the league, and that inevitably pushes up costs. The BPL is a 'success' precisely because there is a BEL for the 'ambitious' teams to race and bankrupt themselves in.

It does seem silly in such a struggling sport that Plymouth travel to Glasgow and vice versa, I just hope something good comes out of the AGM to get crowds up again.

Yes, but as discussed before, it's difficult to achieve a meaningful regional split with the current distribution of teams. Some teams in the Midlands would still be faced with long trips north, whilst hardly meeting (or not meeting at all) neighbouring teams that just happen to fall into another region.

 

Moreover, the likes of Ipswich to Plymouth is not far off the distance between Ipswich and Berwick (346 vs 326 miles), so you'd not necessarily be saving as much travel as imagined.

[Woz01]

Id guess Leicester and Ipswich would be the favourites but the 3rd? I would have said Sheffield but they are up for sale, id like Somerset to make the move up looks a fantastic track.

[topaz325]

Cannot see Workington moving up, costs, no local derbies, riders not willing to travel north,Saturday night racing at DP, although we used to race on Fridays , etc....oh and racing usually better in PL

[jenga]

no thanks to the lite league. i am all for ippo moving up, just to get rid of em. but mr louis has had one bite of the cherry and spat it out, plus the potential of no sky money and the whole lite league struggles to get riders in and make it pay.. if worky did go lite in 2014 the there would be an awful lot of fans picking and choosing meetings to go to..I.M.O.

[Fromafar]

Another con job by EL PROMOTERS trying to save their necks just like the early 90's. It certainly won't be paying EL pay rates that have been on offer in recent seasons if rumours prove correct.Dont see any PL TEAMS with crowds to support moving up.Interesting though.

[Humphrey Appleby]

It certainly won't be paying EL pay rates that have been on offer in recent seasons if rumours prove correct.Dont see any PL TEAMS with crowds to support moving up.Interesting though.

Errr.. surely the point is that cheaper EL means lesser crowds are needed to make it pay, and perhaps a wider variety of teams may be more attractive.

[Fromafar]

Errr.. surely the point is that cheaper EL means lesser crowds are needed to make it pay, and perhaps a wider variety of teams may be more attractive.

Errr.. surely the point is that cheaper EL means lesser crowds are needed to make it pay, and perhaps a wider variety of teams may be more attractive.

Possibly ,but the standard of rider it will attract means it will be an Elite League in name only.Its only bailing out a failed regime IMO.Will the admission prices be reduced to match the grade of product on offer.

[Pirate Nick]

Id guess Leicester and Ipswich would be the favourites but the 3rd? I would have said Sheffield but they are up for sale, id like Somerset to make the move up looks a fantastic track.

Doubt that Somerset would make the move, they have a good set up there and have just won the PL title. Why would they want to increase their outgoings by 2/3 with no guarantee of Sky money or increased attendance?

[EnglishRoundabout]

I have no doubt they would increase their attendances Pirate Nick, but certainly the outgoings would increase.

[comet49]

I haven't looked at figures too closely in the past seasons, but there's always been a number of BPL teams that have done as well or better crowd-wise than the BEL. The problem was that costs in the BEL were something like 60% higher due to the riders being used, so teams needed someone willing to underwrite the inevitable losses.

 

The other issue was race days, as I think a high percentage of BPL teams need to race Friday, Saturday or Sunday. The SGP increasingly made it unattractive for weekend teams to race in the BEL, so that well have been another discouragement.

 

If it's accepted that the top flight can no longer hope to attract the top riders, and costs come down substantially as a result, then it may well prove more attractive for some teams to move up. Conversely, without certain teams in the BPL, it may induce other teams to move down to the National League, heralding a return to a two-tier system.

 

I think the traditional 'them-and-us' views espoused by BPL fans are a little short-sighted, as a cost-effective structure for the sport is dependent on integrated approach. Without a top flight, there will likely always be a few teams wanting to sign much better riders than other teams in the league, and that inevitably pushes up costs. The BPL is a 'success' precisely because there is a BEL for the 'ambitious' teams to race and bankrupt themselves in.

 

Yes, but as discussed before, it's difficult to achieve a meaningful regional split with the current distribution of teams. Some teams in the Midlands would still be faced with long trips north, whilst hardly meeting (or not meeting at all) neighbouring teams that just happen to fall into another region.

 

Moreover, the likes of Ipswich to Plymouth is not far off the distance between Ipswich and Berwick (346 vs 326 miles), so you'd not necessarily be saving as much travel as imagined.

Berwick and Plymouth are both in the Premier League so Ipswich wouldn't be travelling to either if they went Elite. I believe the fans would like meetings with Eastbourne and Lakeside again too. As always, time will tell.

[Reliant Robin]

Possibly ,but the standard of rider it will attract means it will be an Elite League in name only.Its only bailing out a failed regime IMO.Will the admission prices be reduced to match the grade of product on offer.

I'm sure prices could be reduced to Premier League type rates.....oh wait. It has been Elite in name only for some time, same as the Premier again in that regard.

 

I'd like to see a couple more teams move up, but only if it can be afforded. Ipswich moved down and have managed to stabilise by all accounts so wouldn't want to see that work undone. But if the top league (whatever name) is able to become realistic on running cost then there's no reason a couple of the better attended second tier Clubs couldn't make the move. More likely than the one big league we saw in the early-mid 90's

Edited November 6, 2013 by Reliant Robin

[luluthetiger]

Leaving the NL clubs (and Glasgow, who really seem sadly doubtful) out of it, if there was total integration and a strictly north-south divide, you would have:

 

North: Belle Vue, Berwick, Edinburgh, Newcastle, Redcar, Scunthorpe, Sheffield, Workington, Leicester,Peterborough and Wolverhampton.

 

South: Birmingham, Coventry, Eastbourne, King's Lynn, Lakeside, Poole, Swindon, Ipswich, Plymouth, Rye House and Somerset

 

Which is why any such talk of "one big league, split north and south" will never fly.

 

Plan B, anyone?

[Fromafar]

I'm sure prices could be reduced to Premier League type rates.....oh wait. It has been Elite in name only for some time, same as the Premier again in that regard.I'd like to see a couple more teams move up, but only if it can be afforded. Ipswich moved down and have managed to stabilise by all accounts so wouldn't want to see that work undone. But if the top league (whatever name) is able to become realistic on running cost then there's no reason a couple of the better attended second tier Clubs couldn't make the move. More likely than the one big league we saw in the early-mid 90's

If the GP men and the other no1's were missing then one big league might be the way to go.Doubt it will happen though.Difficult times for the sport IMO.I Personaly don't think many PL promoters would relish moving up.We shall see though.

[Humphrey Appleby]

If the GP men and the other no1's were missing then one big league might be the way to go.

Maybe two big leagues. 14-16 in an enlarged top flight but with lower costs (so 4-6 teams would move-up), and the rest in the National League.

[Fromafar]

Maybe two big leagues. 14-16 in an enlarged top flight but with lower costs (so 4-6 teams would move-up), and the rest in the National League.

That is more likely if they can persuade enough PL TEAMS to move up.Having been round most of the Northern tracks last season the crowd levels suggest it would be a bit of a gamble especially if a couple of Northern Teams made the jump and took away some of the Northern "local" derbies which does seem to attract travelling support.

[eric i]

Maybe Leicester, Ipswich, Somerset, Rye House and Plymouth joining a weaker top flight making 15 teams. Leaving the 8 northern PL teams to have a small league where they play each other twice. The National league would remain as it is.