No Sky Or League Sponsorship Money Etc...

[Guest]

Drastic changes are needed IMO -
No GP riders for the current season to be allowed in the British league.
Elite & Premier to combine into 2 leagues with a North/South split. (I'm sure some Premier teams will probably hate that).
Full home & away fixtures.
Eastbourne to run on a sunday afternoon.

[SteveLyric2]

Drastic changes are needed IMO -

No GP riders for the current season to be allowed in the British league.

Elite & Premier to combine into 2 leagues with a North/South split. (I'm sure some Premier teams will probably hate that).

Full home & away fixtures.

Eastbourne to run on a sunday afternoon.

That's pretty much what I would propose for the coming season!!

WRONG, the EL contract runs out on December 31st. So technically we are still covered.

Its unlike you to come out with something so helpful SB!!?? So on that basis, we shall at least look forward to the End of Season Sky programme that usually appears around Christmas/New Year!!

[pandorum]

Elite & Premier to combine into 2 leagues with a North/South split. (I'm sure some Premier teams will probably hate that).

 

Why should the PL suffer for the failures of the EL.

They got themselves into this mess let them sort it out themselves and not involve the bit of UK speedway that seems to be able to run a tap.

The PL has enough problems of it's own without being burdened by the EL's ineptitude.

 

Why is it everytime the top league fails it is the second tier that has to pull them out of the mire they infliicted on themselves.

[magnificentseven]

Why should the PL suffer for the failures of the EL.

They got themselves into this mess let them sort it out themselves and not involve the bit of UK speedway that seems to be able to run a tap.

The PL has enough problems of it's own without being burdened by the EL's ineptitude.

 

Why is it everytime the top league fails it is the second tier that has to pull them out of the mire they infliicted on themselves.

It would seem not everything in the PL is sweetness and light as there are reports of some teams wanting to move into the EL as they are unhappy with the way the PL is being run.

[stevebrum]

Its unlike you to come out with something so helpful SB!!?? So on that basis, we shall at least look forward to the End of Season Sky programme that usually appears around Christmas/New Year!!

Dress it how you like, just sticking to facts. Id say that was useful.;-)

[Starman2006]

So on that basis, we shall at least look forward to the End of Season Sky programme that usually appears around Christmas/New Year!!

Can't wait..

[Guest]

Why should the PL suffer for the failures of the EL.

They got themselves into this mess let them sort it out themselves and not involve the bit of UK speedway that seems to be able to run a tap.

The PL has enough problems of it's own without being burdened by the EL's ineptitude.

 

Why is it everytime the top league fails it is the second tier that has to pull them out of the mire they infliicted on themselves.

I absolutely respect your point of view.

[Woz01]

Why should the PL suffer for the failures of the EL.

They got themselves into this mess let them sort it out themselves and not involve the bit of UK speedway that seems to be able to run a tap.

The PL has enough problems of it's own without being burdened by the EL's ineptitude.

 

Why is it everytime the top league fails it is the second tier that has to pull them out of the mire they infliicted on themselves.

Surely British Speedway as a whole is more important than the PL division? If that means the two leagues have to merge so be it. Both EL and PL have issues to deal with over the winter.

[Steve0]

Why should the PL suffer for the failures of the EL.

They got themselves into this mess let them sort it out themselves and not involve the bit of UK speedway that seems to be able to run a tap.

The PL has enough problems of it's own without being burdened by the EL's ineptitude.

 

Why is it everytime the top league fails it is the second tier that has to pull them out of the mire they infliicted on themselves.

To say that problems only exist in the EL and everything is fine in the PL is naïve in the extreme. We are talking about British Speedway and for British Speedway to survive and move forward you need to look at the whole - not just individual parts.

[dontforgetthefueltapsbruv]

I will play devils advocate here for the PL - where were the 'we are all in it together' EL fans when the Sky pie was being cut up and the PL only got the crumbs off the plate?

 

That said I do think the all in it together attitude is needed right now tv money or as more likely not.

[Cockney Rebel]

Why should the PL suffer for the failures of the EL.

They got themselves into this mess let them sort it out themselves and not involve the bit of UK speedway that seems to be able to run a tap.

The PL has enough problems of it's own without being burdened by the EL's ineptitude.

 

Why is it everytime the top league fails it is the second tier that has to pull them out of the mire they infliicted on themselves.

I don't understand this attitude. If the EL fails, ie: clubs close down, the riders who don't race abroad will want to find employment in the Premier league, are you saying these riders should be ignored and left with no job? On the other hand if they are employed by some PL clubs this will lessen the opportunity for riders comimg through the system. If the whole EL collapsed how would ten clubs going out of business not affect the PL? Some fans won't go to PL matches cos they think it's a lower standard so they will be lost to the sport. One of the reasons for the relative success of the PL is the movement of riders from PL to EL. Riders come through the ranks develop into heat leaders and move on to the EL leaving room for others to come through. If there was nowhere for them to go the whole sport would stagnate. The PL needs the EL as much as the EL needs the PL it would be very difficult for one to manage without the other.

[pandorum]

I don't understand this attitude. If the EL fails, ie: clubs close down, the riders who don't race abroad will want to find employment in the Premier league, are you saying these riders should be ignored and left with no job? On the other hand if they are employed by some PL clubs this will lessen the opportunity for riders comimg through the system. If the whole EL collapsed how would ten clubs going out of business not affect the PL? Some fans won't go to PL matches cos they think it's a lower standard so they will be lost to the sport. One of the reasons for the relative success of the PL is the movement of riders from PL to EL. Riders come through the ranks develop into heat leaders and move on to the EL leaving room for others to come through. If there was nowhere for them to go the whole sport would stagnate. The PL needs the EL as much as the EL needs the PL it would be very difficult for one to manage without the other.

I did not say any of that mate, you did, I simply asked why the 2nd tier should let itself be absorbed by the top tier as people seem to assume will rescue the EL.

The top tier got itself into a mess let the top tier get itself out of it.

Speedway clubs wither and die all the time.

Will the EL care if Glasgow or the IOW go out of business?

To say that problems only exist in the EL and everything is fine in the PL is naïve in the extreme. We are talking about British Speedway and for British Speedway to survive and move forward you need to look at the whole - not just individual parts.

I did not say any of that either once again you said that not me.

I was talking about the EL as that's what the thread is about.

The PL has a lot of problems but is not the mess the EL is.

 

I have been saying speedway needs to work together on this forum for years now. But it only seems to happen when the top flight gets itself in a mess.

Edited November 5, 2013 by pandorum

[Steve0]

I will play devils advocate here for the PL - where were the 'we are all in it together' EL fans when the Sky pie was being cut up and the PL only got the crumbs off the plate?

That said I do think the all in it together attitude is needed right now tv money or as more likely not.

As if the fans had any say on how the money was dished out. I believe the contract is/was for EL speedway so that would explain why the PL only "got the crumbs off the plate". I think you would need to ask Sky/Go Speed/BSPA why only a couple of PL matches have been broadcast in recent seasons.

[Pirate Nick]

I do find it amusing, this we're all in it together" attitude spouted by some Elite League fans.

 

The Elite League is historically only "all in it together" when they are in the proverbial do do.

[dontforgetthefueltapsbruv]

As if the fans had any say on how the money was dished out. I believe the contract is/was for EL speedway so that would explain why the PL only "got the crumbs off the plate". I think you would need to ask Sky/Go Speed/BSPA why only a couple of PL matches have been broadcast in recent seasons.

I think you are missing the point made.I didnt mean those fans had the power to enforce anything.

 

But now that the money has run out many on here are saying we need to pull together which wasnt the rallying call previously.

 

With regard to the money generally it has been squandered whichever route it was funnelled down. Too late to worry about that now.

[Cockney Rebel]

I did not say any of that mate, you did, I simply asked why the 2nd tier should let itself be absorbed by the top tier as people seem to assume will rescue the EL.

The top tier got itself into a mess let the top tier get itself out of it.

Speedway clubs wither and die all the time.

Will the EL care if Glasgow or the IOW go out of business?

I know you didn't say that but, taking it to it's logical conclusion if the EL can't get out of the hole it's partly dug for itself what happens to it? Do the PL promoters just let it die or help it survive? Would the PL be absorbed into the El or the EL into the PL?

The Elite League is not an entity that exists by itself it's an organisation of ten clubs, who happen to employ riders that demand more money. If those clubs that are struggling can't afford the cost of staying in it they won't just close down they'll naturally want to join an organisation where they can afford to run ie; the Premier League, so would the PL be able to handle one club dropping down or two or three or all ten. Perhaps we could have a Prelite League or an Elmier League.

 

Seriously though there doesn't seem to be a simple solution so we'll just have to wait and see what they come up with next week. If SKY are waiting till they see what shape the the EL is going to take and the BSPA can't decide what to do until they know how much money, if any, they're going to get then there's going to be a bit of a stand off. It might be better for them to plan without the SKY or whoever's money and then if something comes along that'll be a bonus. If SKY do come up with some more dosh I fear nothing much will change.

 

One thing all this does show is that although we all have different opinions about what should happen we all care about our great sport, if we didn't this discussion wouldn't be taking place.

[skthecat]

All the leagues need each other, El needs Pl to get some of its new riders from when older EL riders retire or leave the sport for whatever reason, also the EL needs the PL for EL riders to drop down to rather than retire or lose form/come back from injury

Same scenario with PL and NL + some MDL riders step up into the NL on there way to the top

 

So despite what different posters say/believe, ALL the leagues need to work in some sort of symbiotic fashion to keep the leagues living and employing all the levels of UK riders with the top 2 leagues having a smattering of top quality international riders.....

[jimmy jimmy]

There is no need to put it together as one league, why not take the opportunity to have Division 1 and Division 2 with promotion and relegation?

Or the EL becomes a PL plus

[stevebrum]

There is no need to put it together as one league, why not take the opportunity to have Division 1 and Division 2 with promotion and relegation?

Or the EL becomes a PL plus

There would be no need for a PL plus, not many will pay EL prices for a glorified PL standard line up.

 

One league has been tried before and failed.

[Humphrey Appleby]

If SKY are waiting till they see what shape the the EL is going to take and the BSPA can't decide what to do until they know how much money, if any, they're going to get then there's going to be a bit of a stand off.

I very much doubt Sky are waiting for anything. They're trying to cut costs in light of what they've spent on football and F1, and speedway is not sufficiently interesting for them to continue paying for.

 

They might deign to retain coverage if the BSPA are prepared to offer it either for nothing, or pay them, but I suspect the sport can forget about getting anything out of it.

Edited November 6, 2013 by Humphrey Appleby