Nothing Changes

[BWitcher]

 

 

 

According to them, money forced them. They said they couldn't sustain the costs likely to be incurred under the proposed higher points limit on the crowds they were getting in.

 

And now due to the further weakening of the league and shambolic way it has been run since then nobody else can afford it on the crowds they are getting in either.... as predicted at the time by many of us.

[The White Knight]

And now due to the further weakening of the league and shambolic way it has been run since then nobody else can afford it on the crowds they are getting in either.... as predicted at the time by many of us.

 

Well said BWitcher - at least we agree on something. :)

[E I Addio]

 

 

And now due to the further weakening of the league and shambolic way it has been run since then nobody else can afford it on the crowds they are getting in either.... as predicted at the time by many of us.

It was being run in a shambolic way before that. The point that Stuart Douglas was making in his Speedway Star interview just before the AGM was that the sport was being run on a poor business model and it is the business model that had to change, not cutting the number of meetings. He said, logically, in my view that if you halve the number of meetings you halve your losses but you still have a bad business model. Unforunately the majority of promoters, in their wisdom decided to save costs by cutting the number of meetings but to stick to the same old bad business model so they still have big losses.

 

I can't recite all the ins and outs of a three page SS interview plus various programme notes but logically its no good cutting costs if you still have a format that is losing big money thus we still have clubs like Swindon Brum and Belle Vue struggling to pay the bills and Peterborough only surviving on the generosity of decent owner. Whether of not the winters changes will bring about a better business model remains to be seen but I'm not holding my breath.

[BWitcher]

I don't disagree with anything you say in that post E I.

 

It was run in a shambolic way before, and since.

 

However that episode served to really drive home this fact more and more to many fans who have since either given up or only attend sporadically now.

 

My lack of sympathy with Douglas/Lakeside lies around them simply rolling over and accepting the Poole situation earlier. Once it became obvious that the SCB were going to take no action against Poole, Lakeside should have made it publically clear that it wasn't on. As it stands, the publics perception is that Lakeside were in agreement. Their statement after the postponement does not go far enough. They should have kicked up an almighty stink about it.

 

Yes, you tell us that is not the way they operate.. but it is the ONLY way to operate in the current setup. The sport will not get cleaned up until promoters take a stand over the dodgy practices.

[bigcatdiary]

I don't disagree with anything you say in that post E I.

 

It was run in a shambolic way before, and since.

 

However that episode served to really drive home this fact more and more to many fans who have since either given up or only attend sporadically now.

 

My lack of sympathy with Douglas/Lakeside lies around them simply rolling over and accepting the Poole situation earlier. Once it became obvious that the SCB were going to take no action against Poole, Lakeside should have made it publically clear that it wasn't on. As it stands, the publics perception is that Lakeside were in agreement. Their statement after the postponement does not go far enough. They should have kicked up an almighty stink about it.

 

Yes, you tell us that is not the way they operate.. but it is the ONLY way to operate in the current setup. The sport will not get cleaned up until promoters take a stand over the dodgy practices.

 

I can only agree with the above statement, the whole thing stinks of a rule for one and a rule for the other.

 

Belle Vue postponed and got clobbered, Poole postponed and got away scot free, Lakeside didn't come out of it with much credit either over the shambolic press releases that followed.

[E I Addio]

I don't disagree with anything you say in that post E I.

 

It was run in a shambolic way before, and since.

 

However that episode served to really drive home this fact more and more to many fans who have since either given up or only attend sporadically now.

 

My lack of sympathy with Douglas/Lakeside lies around them simply rolling over and accepting the Poole situation earlier. Once it became obvious that the SCB were going to take no action against Poole, Lakeside should have made it publically clear that it wasn't on. As it stands, the publics perception is that Lakeside were in agreement. Their statement after the postponement does not go far enough. They should have kicked up an almighty stink about it.

 

Yes, you tell us that is not the way they operate.. but it is the ONLY way to operate in the current setup. The sport will not get cleaned up until promoters take a stand over the dodgy practices.

 

Whatever you think or don't think about Lakesides behaviour (and lets face it without information none of know all the facts) the fact remains that its a symptom of an inherently faulty system). Belle Vue have a dodgy pipe burst and the SCB have someone down there immediately. Kings Lynn call a meeting off three days in advance on the basically implausible excuse that they didn't think that their electricians could change a fuse in three days and the SCB didn't bother to ask why. It beggars belief to think that they wouldn't have been able to fix it the same day if it was the SWC or GP challenge that was about to take place.

 

Then we have Peterborough cancelling a match because, if the press release is to be believed Trevor Swales is so dumb he asked "someone from Sky" rather than the SCB to clarify if he could have a facility for Kenny Bjerre. Whoever it was he spoke to ( Terry Russell we have since been told) said it "should" be OK but the SCB said it wasn't so we have another unnecessary postponement. And all that is before we get to the shambles of who did or didn't use illegal riders, and riders not being paid by some clubs despite the SCB being told when the captains signed the team sheets off..

 

I realise it suits some peoples agenda ( and it certainly suits bigcatdiary's agenda) to hang everything on Lakeside but its clear that flippant cancellations go much deeper than Poole-v- Lakeside but what exactly are Lakeside supposed to have done? Write to the Daily Mail ? Remember that in 2009 it was Lakeside that asked the SCB to investigate the allegations of Poole cheating and that was a complete waste of time. e know the SCB were supposed to be looking into the matter on their meeting of 10th July but nothing has been heard since. How do you know know the stories about Poole being fined are not true ? The fact that unless you have some inside information yourself you know no more than the rest of us. That is the point. Once again complete silence from the SCB is the root of the problem. Peterborough have said very little about the Kings Lynn appeal leaking out on the crucial day of the Belle Vue Poole match, and very little about Swindon taking their assets. Is that because they took it lying down or is it possible that Rick Frost has learned a thing or two since 2010 and now knows there is more than one way to skin a cat ?

 

Bottom line is that the SCB is the ruling body of the sport and as far as maladministration is concerned al roads lead back to them.

Edited October 4, 2013 by E I Addio

[orion]

 

 

 

 

According to them, money forced them. They said they couldn't sustain the costs likely to be incurred under the proposed higher points limit on the crowds they were getting in.

Yet it again it was not forced it was there choice as I said they just like Boro and Cov they were not willing to take part in the league under certain rules ...

 

 

 

I realise it suits some peoples agenda ( and it certainly suits bigcatdiary's agenda) to hang everything on Lakeside but its clear that flippant cancellations go much deeper than Poole-v- Lakeside but what exactly are Lakeside supposed to have done? Write to the Daily Mail ?

Stand up For Cov and Boro .at the agm ...a perfect time to sort things out ...but what they do ? just helped Ford and his vendetta v Cov ...once they done that any other things they had to say meant nothing .

[bigcatdiary]

 

 

Whatever you think or don't think about Lakesides behaviour (and lets face it without information none of know all the facts) the fact remains that its a symptom of an inherently faulty system). Belle Vue have a dodgy pipe burst and the SCB have someone down there immediately. Kings Lynn call a meeting off three days in advance on the basically implausible excuse that they didn't think that their electricians could change a fuse in three days and the SCB didn't bother to ask why. It beggars belief to think that they wouldn't have been able to fix it the same day if it was the SWC or GP challenge that was about to take place.

 

Then we have Peterborough cancelling a match because, if the press release is to be believed Trevor Swales is so dumb he asked "someone from Sky" rather than the SCB to clarify if he could have a facility for Kenny Bjerre. Whoever it was he spoke to ( Terry Russell we have since been told) said it "should" be OK but the SCB said it wasn't so we have another unnecessary postponement. And all that is before we get to the shambles of who did or didn't use illegal riders, and riders not being paid by some clubs despite the SCB being told when the captains signed the team sheets off..

 

I realise it suits some peoples agenda ( and it certainly suits bigcatdiary's agenda) to hang everything on Lakeside but its clear that flippant cancellations go much deeper than Poole-v- Lakeside but what exactly are Lakeside supposed to have done? Write to the Daily Mail ? Remember that in 2009 it was Lakeside that asked the SCB to investigate the allegations of Poole cheating and that was a complete waste of time. e know the SCB were supposed to be looking into the matter on their meeting of 10th July but nothing has been heard since. How do you know know the stories about Poole being fined are not true ? The fact that unless you have some inside information yourself you know no more than the rest of us. That is the point. Once again complete silence from the SCB is the root of the problem. Peterborough have said very little about the Kings Lynn appeal leaking out on the crucial day of the Belle Vue Poole match, and very little about Swindon taking their assets. Is that because they took it lying down or is it possible that Rick Frost has learned a thing or two since 2010 and now knows there is more than one way to skin a cat ?

 

Bottom line is that the SCB is the ruling body of the sport and as far as maladministration is concerned al roads lead back to them.

 

Bottom line is that the mess UK Speedway is in at the moment has to be shouldered in the main by the BSPA MC, the SCB Members and staff they both employ to effectively run the sport in the UK.

 

In the last few years countless strokes have been pulled and although the MC haven't actually pulled all of them they have allowed the offenders to constantly get away with this behaviour and have done absolutely nothing to change anything to prevent others doing the same.

 

The result has seen countless supporters and promoters drift away from the sport clearly fed up with the way the sport continues to stumble from one PR disaster to another and the way it effectively handles things whilst at all time treating the supporters with utter contempt and attempting to keep them completely in the dark.

 

It's looking like Sky have also had enough and who can blame them after the farcical events of the recent Belle Vue v Poole debacle.

 

I rather think the forthcoming AGM will be discussing more important things than the usual helmet colours and tactical ride changes.

 

 

[E I Addio]

 

Stand up For Cov and Boro .at the agm ...a perfect time to sort things out ...but what they do ? just helped Ford and his vendetta v Cov ...once they done that any other things they had to say meant nothing .

 

 

I don't know if it has escaped your notice, but my comment was about the cancellation of the Poole-v- Lakeside meeting, which was in 2013, the Cov/Peterboro walk out was in 2010. Bit difficult to discuss these things when you are confusing different dates.

 

If you are talking about the 2013 AGM Cook has already said certain issues will be raised and for all you or I know Lakeside and Boro might be working together. it would certainly be in their joint interests to, as they have both been stitched up this year and Cook and Frost seem to get on very well these days. We shall have to wait and see

 

 

 

Bottom line is that the mess UK Speedway is in at the moment has to be shouldered in the main by the BSPA MC, the SCB Members and staff they both employ to effectively run the sport in the UK.

 

In the last few years countless strokes have been pulled and although the MC haven't actually pulled all of them they have allowed the offenders to constantly get away with this behaviour and have done absolutely nothing to change anything to prevent others doing the same.

 

The result has seen countless supporters and promoters drift away from the sport clearly fed up with the way the sport continues to stumble from one PR disaster to another and the way it effectively handles things whilst at all time treating the supporters with utter contempt and attempting to keep them completely in the dark.

 

It's looking like Sky have also had enough and who can blame them after the farcical events of the recent Belle Vue v Poole debacle.

 

I rather think the forthcoming AGM will be discussing more important things than the usual helmet colours and tactical ride changes.

 

Then the differences between our respective points of view now are so minimal it would be splitting hairs to continue arguing about it. So many clubs are losing big money they are going to have discuss things more important than helmet colours etc, because if they don't their will be a number of clubs not running next year, in all the leagues.

 

I think this is the closest we have ever been to complete agreement on a topic, which is a nice change

[The White Knight]

Reading this Thread I am in despair. I did not know a lot about the content the above Posts, the only thing that surprises me is that Speedway is still running at all. :sad: :sad:

[Vincent Blachshadow]

 

 

I realise it suits some peoples agenda ( and it certainly suits bigcatdiary's agenda) to hang everything on Lakeside but its clear that flippant cancellations go much deeper than Poole-v- Lakeside but what exactly are Lakeside supposed to have done?

 

 

 

They should have pointed out there is no facility within the rules to allow a cancellation for the reasons given and that they want the match ridden. Ford would more than likely have called the match off anyway but, with the opposition putting in an objection the MC would have had no alternative but to hold an inquiry, not sweep the whole thing under the carpet as Lakeside's capitulation allowed them to.

[E I Addio]

 

 

They should have pointed out there is no facility within the rules to allow a cancellation for the reasons given and that they want the match ridden. Ford would more than likely have called the match off anyway but, with the opposition putting in an objection the MC would have had no alternative but to hold an inquiry, not sweep the whole thing under the carpet as Lakeside's capitulation allowed them to.

 

At the risk of repeating myself the SCB had it listed for discussion on 10th July, but that is the last thing the public were told, so we don't know what happened.

 

Not sure if you are trying to draw a distinction between "discussion" and "inquiry" but Lakeside previously asked the SCB to hold an inquiry into the cheating allegations against Poole in 2009 and a fat lot of good that turned out to be. It didn't take a request for an inquiry when Poole were on the sharp end of a cancellation by Belle Vue. They had someone down there the same day and the whole thing was done and dusted in about two weeks. That really sums the whole thing up. When the SCB want to act can get it done on no time flat, when it suits them to do otherwise, nothing happens.

[rob tatum]

Nothing changes & nothing major has for donkeys years THAT'S THE PROBLEM whilst most sports have realised that we are now in the 21st century speedway (GPs not included)are still stuck in the 50s but without the crowds. Complaining about r/r, guests,poole various promoters etc etc is pointless this sport is on the edge & something needs to be done NOW please.

[The White Knight]

At the risk of repeating myself the SCB had it listed for discussion on 10th July, but that is the last thing the public were told, so we don't know what happened.

 

Not sure if you are trying to draw a distinction between "discussion" and "inquiry" but Lakeside previously asked the SCB to hold an inquiry into the cheating allegations against Poole in 2009 and a fat lot of good that turned out to be. It didn't take a request for an inquiry when Poole were on the sharp end of a cancellation by Belle Vue. They had someone down there the same day and the whole thing was done and dusted in about two weeks. That really sums the whole thing up. When the SCB want to act can get it done on no time flat, when it suits them to do otherwise, nothing happens.

 

There DOES seem to be a 'one Rule for us and one Rule for them' attitude prevalent at present. :sad:

 

What is needed is consistency - a level Playing Field for EVERYONE!!!

[Vincent Blachshadow]

 

 

At the risk of repeating myself the SCB had it listed for discussion on 10th July, but that is the last thing the public were told, so we don't know what happened.

 

Not sure if you are trying to draw a distinction between "discussion" and "inquiry" but Lakeside previously asked the SCB to hold an inquiry into the cheating allegations against Poole in 2009 and a fat lot of good that turned out to be. It didn't take a request for an inquiry when Poole were on the sharp end of a cancellation by Belle Vue. They had someone down there the same day and the whole thing was done and dusted in about two weeks. That really sums the whole thing up. When the SCB want to act can get it done on no time flat, when it suits them to do otherwise, nothing happens.

 

Poole riders were at the BV track telling the world there was no problem, not accepting the situation and laying down. Slightly different to shrugging shoulders and going along with it.

[E I Addio]

 

 

Poole riders were at the BV track telling the world there was no problem, not accepting the situation and laying down. Slightly different to shrugging shoulders and going along with it.

 

That post is so stupid it doesn't warrant a reply.

[tyke]

That post is so stupid it doesn't warrant a reply.

 

Is that an oxymoron !

[orion]

I don't know if it has escaped your notice, but my comment was about the cancellation of the Poole-v- Lakeside meeting, which was in 2013, the Cov/Peterboro walk out was in 2010. Bit difficult to discuss these things when you are confusing different dates.

 

 

Not sure if it escapes your notice but your comment at the start of the topic was about nothing changing since 2009 after Douglas making his great speech about trying to change things ..maybe I have got this wrong but I thought 2010 was after 2009

[E I Addio]

Not sure if it escapes your notice but your comment at the start of the topic was about nothing changing since 2009 after Douglas making his great speech about trying to change things ..maybe I have got this wrong but I thought 2010 was after 2009

 

Yep, you have got it wrong. Their was no great speech involved, and never was.

 

Having got to the stage of having come to virtual agreement with bigcatdiary, which is very rare for the two us, I guess that if me and bigcat agree on something we must be right so I'll have to leave others who have difficulty following the line of discussion on the thread to talk amongst yourselves. Post number 48 pretty much sums up the situation, as I have already said. If anyone disagrees with that post then I can't help them any further. Time to move on.

[orion]

Yep, you have got it wrong. Their was no great speech involved, and never was.

 

 

Correct ..it was just a load of hot air without any action ...standard stuff from Cook and Douglas ..see we agree as well .