If One Rule Could Be Changed In League Speedway By A Public Vote, Which One Would You Change And Why & How? Closing Date: 31/10/2013

[Daniel Smith]

So, those that want the introduction of squad systems just like Poland because it's a better format than guests may want to think again after the farce in the Polish Play-Off Final

 

I'll stick with the guest option thanks

Edited September 22, 2013 by screamer

[orion]

You back the new rule yet you say they are both Micky mouse? Baffling i have also said to you that the old rule had its flaws the play offs i am not keen on but are a success so they are here to stay.The double points should go immediately in my view a farce.

Point out when I said I backed the new rule ? I never did and it was never my point .no wonder why you find it baffling when everytime you fail to take on board the points being made ..

[stratton]

 

Point out when I said I backed the new rule ? I never did and it was never my point .no wonder why you find it baffling when everytime you fail to take on board the points being made ..

Your points are pretty flawed to be honest, i actually think you have no conviction in what you are saying half the time.

[kelvinht]

Elite League teams must ride on only one or maybe two set nights per week avoiding main Polish/Swedish league nights. PL tracks not allowed to ride on those two nights either. Lessens the need for guests and r/r due to riders having primacy elsewhere and enable double uppers to always be available. Guest and r/r could then be just for injured riders, nothing else. May even enable some kind of squad system so guest or r/r is even more limited.

[orion]

Your points are pretty flawed to be honest, i actually think you have no conviction in what you are saying half the time.

Well if that is the case why don't you showed us all where ? somehow i doubt you can ...

[The White Knight]

Elite League teams must ride on only one or maybe two set nights per week avoiding main Polish/Swedish league nights. PL tracks not allowed to ride on those two nights either. Lessens the need for guests and r/r due to riders having primacy elsewhere and enable double uppers to always be available. Guest and r/r could then be just for injured riders, nothing else. May even enable some kind of squad system so guest or r/r is even more limited.

 

Just because the Elite League is totally b*llsed up - DON'T start dictating to the Premier League when, where and how THEY ride their Speedway. :mad:

 

I suggest you look at putting your Elite League house in order and leave the other Leagues alone. Perhaps, though, the Elite League is beyond help. :rolleyes:

[MattK]

Just because the Elite League is totally b*llsed up - DON'T start dictating to the Premier League when, where and how THEY ride their Speedway. :mad:

 

I suggest you look at putting your Elite League house in order and leave the other Leagues alone. Perhaps, though, the Elite League is beyond help. :rolleyes:

 

That is a somewhat blinkered view. If the likes of Cook, Doyle, Barker and Allen could only ride in one league, which do you think they would choose? The Elite and the Premier leagues need each other.

 

As for putting houses in order, there are plenty of Premier league clubs struggling financially. That isn't a uniquely Elite league problem.

[The White Knight]

That is a somewhat blinkered view. If the likes of Cook, Doyle, Barker and Allen could only ride in one league, which do you think they would choose? The Elite and the Premier leagues need each other.

 

As for putting houses in order, there are plenty of Premier league clubs struggling financially. That isn't a uniquely Elite league problem.

 

No Premier League Teams I know of have ridden with only THREE of their OWN Riders. That IS uniquely an Elite League problem.

[orion]

 

 

No Premier League Teams I know of have ridden with only THREE of their OWN Riders. That IS uniquely an Elite League problem.

I could name Workington without even thinking about it .

[The White Knight]

I could name Workington without even thinking about it .

 

When, and where?

[orion]

 

 

When, and where?

May 25th v Glasgow rr and 3 guests

[The White Knight]

May 25th v Glasgow rr and 3 guests

 

Thank you orion. I will take your word for that - I didn't know about it.

[ch958]

Thank you orion. I will take your word for that - I didn't know about it.

 

yes but thats once twk - your point is still valid - the PL is not without problems but i would suggest there are more and deeper problems in EL and its all down to money

 

make the sport cheaper (I'll leave that to those who are mechanically savvy) and i'm sure it can be done and riders will take less cash from the sport

[stratton]

What i love about the PL is that most of us can predict what the 1/7 of the line ups are going to be.Ok Orion will have a few examples that says this is not so but generally this is not the case.On the other hand the EL well where do you start endless guests,R/R, double /uppers missing,this year has been terrible for this so big changes have to be made.But can the EL and PL work together? i hope so for the good of the sport we shall wait and see.I would like to see one big league maybe up to 16 teams teams all living within a budget and go from there.

[embique]

They should wipe the slate clean with regards to rules and start again as it is far too confusing for any newcomers.

 

There should be rule on a minimum number of British riders in PL teams and each EL team must have at least 1 at reserve.

[waiheke1]

I just don't understand how anyone can defend the double points rule, especially after a 10 points deficit. It gives the chance of pulling from 10 points down to 3 in 1 heat. I did not like the tactical substitution either but at least, a team could only pull back 4 points, they were still 6 points down if they gained a 5-1 heat advantage. The only people that really benefit from this rule is television as it may keep neutral viewers interested in a one sided meeting. Let's be honest, most people would love to see their own side winning 60-30 every meeting & with little away support in most meetings, there are very few people at that meeting who want to see the scores falsely adjusted. I think that it is even more of a joke in the World Cup, where surely the best team on the night should win the title!

Of course, ith the old rule, you could use the tac sub as 6 points down.

So under the new rules, from being able to use the tac sub, you can go to 1 point up in two heats.

Under the old rule, you could go two points up within two heats.

In the above scenarios, under the new rule, without the tac sub you would have been two down (instead of a 5-1, 5-1 you got a 8-1,5-1,so the tac sub gives a three point wring).

under the old rule, without tac subs you would potentially have still been six points down (as instead of a potential 1-5.5-1 a double tac sub could give you a 5-1,5-1, so an 8 point swing).

 

look at the swindon-poole meeting today. Under the old rule, anyone think Poole woudl have finished 10 points down? As it was they got an extra 4 points, whcihc didn't impact at all on swindons total. under the old rules, ward, janowski and hancock would all have got an extra ride. even if those rides only added 4 points to pooles total, swindon would have got 4 less points, so would only hold a 6 point lead. ha dthose ridrs resulted in 6 extra points for poole (not unrealistic), swindon would hold only a two point lead.

 

now don't get me wrong, as i have stated earlier, i'm not a fan of the new rule, and prefer the old one. but that's not because i think the new rule is "less fair" (it clearly isnt), a farce or a joke - its beacuse the old rule is the one i grew up with and am used to. I suspect that is the case with many on here, no matter how they try to justify it.

[skthecat]

Ok, I need this point clarifying and pretty quick..

So, a team has to have at least 1 British rider at reserve.....

First green sheets come out and the aforememtioned Brit has rode himself into the main body of the team, and theres not another Brit in the team that can move down to reserve???????

 

What happens next????

 

Cheers

Never to Old

 

[Mr Ore]

Of course, ith the old rule, you could use the tac sub as 6 points down.

 

A good balanced post. For years the question regarding why a team can declare R/R before a match starts yet lose a top rider as soon as the tapes have gone up in heat 1 and not have any facility has never been addressed. Ignoring the fact that he was a guest, another wrong with the sport, and already using r/r Sheffield's faint hopes at Ipswich were totally lost with Ollie Allan's heat 1 fall with only reserves able to cover his remaining rides. As a result, with Simon Lambert's injury too, they also could only track 1 rider in several heats and do nothing about it. Although needing to be six behind at least with the old rule Ricky Wells, for example, could have an extra TS ride in addition to r/r yet with the present double points borax watched his team being only able to track one rider in the knowledge they were going to fall further behind.

 

Two birds killed therefore in keeping the the match competitive and also ensuring more liklihood of 4 rider heats by going back to the old rule. Regarding the rubbish about poor reserves having to face heat leaders in heat 8 you can learn much more racing a top guy than you can beating a poorer rider easily. Also with various rules stopping people actually being able to earn a living owing to having an average 0.01 too high and being unable to get a team place, it is crocodile tears to use alleged sympathy for the plight of a second string in maybe not getting an easy win but at least having the opportunity to do so. How much better too when a second string lead a number 1 in heat 8; creating a good atmopshere as the (usually) home fans got behind the alleged lesser rider? Plus even if a home rider wins heat 8 under existing double points he could still be beaten points wise by a rider he has just left in his wake.

 

Finally with the 6 point TS and need to have 3 rides a team manager actually had to think ahead as did most of the crowd who would discuss whom to bring in and when between heats. If you replaced a reserve in two of his races you had to ensure he came in for someone else to get his obigatory third ride. It is funny how a team manager with bu**er all to do now is called a great tactician. Under the old rule you at least needed some skills.

[orion]

Of course, ith the old rule, you could use the tac sub as 6 points down.

So under the new rules, from being able to use the tac sub, you can go to 1 point up in two heats.

Under the old rule, you could go two points up within two heats.

In the above scenarios, under the new rule, without the tac sub you would have been two down (instead of a 5-1, 5-1 you got a 8-1,5-1,so the tac sub gives a three point wring).

under the old rule, without tac subs you would potentially have still been six points down (as instead of a potential 1-5.5-1 a double tac sub could give you a 5-1,5-1, so an 8 point swing).

 

look at the swindon-poole meeting today. Under the old rule, anyone think Poole woudl have finished 10 points down? As it was they got an extra 4 points, whcihc didn't impact at all on swindons total. under the old rules, ward, janowski and hancock would all have got an extra ride. even if those rides only added 4 points to pooles total, swindon would have got 4 less points, so would only hold a 6 point lead. ha dthose ridrs resulted in 6 extra points for poole (not unrealistic), swindon would hold only a two point lead.

 

now don't get me wrong, as i have stated earlier, i'm not a fan of the new rule, and prefer the old one. but that's not because i think the new rule is "less fair" (it clearly isnt), a farce or a joke - its beacuse the old rule is the one i grew up with and am used to. I suspect that is the case with many on here, no matter how they try to justify it.

Great post spot on ...like me no fan of the new rule but as I have pointed ready the old rule was a joke as well .

[barrow boy]

Why was the old rule not a joke ? but somehow the new rule is ? don't just say stuff explain why ...are you telling me that being able to bring in your number one and Two in heat 8 in the old days was not mickey mouse ?

For what it is worth I also feel that both rules are unfair but the current one is more so. When I challenged a certain someone about this he was of the opinion that double points were introduced to keep the racing interesting. Racing can still be interesting if the match score is one-sided but at least it is genuine and not false. The old rule was not fair on the lesser riders who were constantly replaced. It might work better now if heats 2,8 & 14 were exempt.