Hazza29 Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 Think the best man lost on the night. Kerr beat boxall in heat 11 and boxall was behind blackbird when they got a rerun in 19. Also think Kerr was harshly done by in the run off. Should of been both back in my opinion. Shouldn't be won like that. Well done to Steve but Lewi was the best rider of the night. Good meeting and the line up was the strongest I've ever seen it. Some great young talent coming through. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonny the spud Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 I wasn't there but someone tweeted that some fans cheered when Adam Ellis crashed and fractured his wrist. Nice people! This seems to be happening all too frequently lately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halifaxtiger Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 I can't help but wonder what those who think this meeting was either 'great' or a good advert for the NL would regard as a poor meeting or a bad advert. True, the times were very fast but other than that the racing was rubbish, with hardly a pass all night. One day events of this kind will be allocated to those who put on a good show and by that criteria alone. I know people who will not go to this meeting because it is held at Rye House. Starke definitely moved over but to those who have condemned him what would you have done in his shoes ? Exactly the same. I thought the decision to exclude Morley was harsh and when Carr touched the tapes early on it was because they had been held for too long. I heard the booing but wasn't sure who it was aimed at. If it was Nielsen, it is yet another example of why Dudley supporters have such a poor reputation. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arson fire Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 Starke definitely moved over but to those who have condemned him what would you have done in his shoes ? Exactly the same. not at all. It's an Individual and a disgraceful Way to treat the competition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 Starke definitely moved over but to those who have condemned him what would you have done in his shoes ? Exactly the same. not at all. It's an Individual and a disgraceful Way to treat the competition. I still think that what Paul Starke "may" have done is part and parcel of speedway. It's happened many, many times elsewhere in competitions far more important than the NLRC is. It may annoy fans of other club's but I doubt many supporters - if any? - from Starke's club are worried or annoyed by the incident. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arson fire Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 I still think that what Paul Starke "may" have done is part and parcel of speedway. It's happened many, many times elsewhere in competitions far more important than the NLRC is. It may annoy fans of other club's but I doubt many supporters - if any? - from Starke's club are worried or annoyed by the incident. its cheating... Or unsporting at best.. same as he did at Berwick earlier on in the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMW Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 (edited) not at all. It's an Individual and a disgraceful Way to treat the competition. It will always rear it's ugly head if there are 2 riders from a team, in this case 3 . At the end of the day Blackbird had a better chance of winning at that point than Starke and these 2 lads do seem to have taken the Dudley supporters to their hearts.. I like the idea they are thinking of their supporters than personal glory and to be fair how did that incident change the result Think the best man lost on the night. Kerr beat boxall in heat 11 and boxall was behind blackbird when they got a rerun in 19. Also think Kerr was harshly done by in the run off. Should of been both back in my opinion. Shouldn't be won like that. Well done to Steve but Lewi was the best rider of the night. Good meeting and the line up was the strongest I've ever seen it. Some great young talent coming through. Although it is hard on Kerr and yes he should have been allowed in the re run Boxall is a seasoned campaigner and knew what he had to do. You can't knock experience. If he has to win he wins, in the NL anyway Edited September 22, 2013 by TMW 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagpuss Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 (edited) I heard the booing when Stefan was walking back to the pits after he had fallen in heat twenty, presumably it relates to the play off final last year? If so then deary, deary me. Edited September 22, 2013 by Bagpuss Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldy Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 I still think that what Paul Starke "may" have done is part and parcel of speedway. It's happened many, many times elsewhere in competitions far more important than the NLRC is. It may annoy fans of other club's but I doubt many supporters - if any? - from Starke's club are worried or annoyed by the incident. Another reason that I don't go to speedway or football anymore. How do I know what Stark did if I did't go?. I don't but as you say it happens many times elsewhere and regardless of how "important" the meeting is, it should not be allowed. I don't accept the fact that these things are part and parcel of any sport. If cheating is seen at any level by the ref then it has to be stamped on and punished. When we accept it then all credibility for achievements done from it are lost. Really surprised by Halifax comments that we would all do the same, I have always respected his views but We are not all the same and must not accept these things. Most seem to feel; "if you can get away with cheating then it is ok" . Not sorry I don't accept that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Smith Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 I still think that what Paul Starke "may" have done is part and parcel of speedway. It's happened many, many times elsewhere in competitions far more important than the NLRC is. When can you remember it happening and with whom??? Certainly don't see it in the GP's. Holder and Ward had some great races against each other. Freddie Lindgren certainly ain't trying to do Woffy any favours. There's never in my memory been an incident of team riding in the PLRC, ELRC and British Final. Truth is you've just made that up. Team riding in an individual is a disgrace Can't comment on last night but thought I'd chuck my two pence in 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
proud panther Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 Just imagine how good this meeting could have been if it was held on a proper race track. Been to Rye House for this meeting the last 2 years, & the racing has been terrible. Time to move it to Lynn or Peterborough in my opinion. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 (edited) When can you remember it happening and with whom??? Certainly don't see it in the GP's. Holder and Ward had some great races against each other. Freddie Lindgren certainly ain't trying to do Woffy any favours. There's never in my memory been an incident of team riding in the PLRC, ELRC and British Final. Truth is you've just made that up. Team riding in an individual is a disgrace Can't comment on last night but thought I'd chuck my two pence in Take a look at comments on world championships in the 1950s and 1960s for starters? My speedway memories as an active follower go back to 1946 - I have seen and heard some incredible things in that time, and not just from the spectator's side of the safety fence! Edited September 22, 2013 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G the Bee Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 (edited) When can you remember it happening and with whom??? Certainly don't see it in the GP's. Holder and Ward had some great races against each other. Freddie Lindgren certainly ain't trying to do Woffy any favours. There's never in my memory been an incident of team riding in the PLRC, ELRC and British Final. Truth is you've just made that up. Team riding in an individual is a disgrace Can't comment on last night but thought I'd chuck my two pence in When people mention that it has happened in meetings far more important than the NLRC they are probably referring to the 1969 World Final. It is a running joke in our house that my dad practically cleared a section of Wembley with his vocal blast at Ivan Mauger after he finished behind his Belle Vue team mate Soren Sjosten in heat 20. Mauger had gone unbeaten to this point and was already world champion. Sjosten's win enabled him to finish on 11, securing him a run-off against Barry Briggs for second (which he lost so ultimately finished third on the night). Had Mauger beaten Sjosten, Sjosten would have gone into a run off with Nigel Boocock for third. Many, including my dad, were convinced that Ivan was helping his Belle Vue team mate out. Ivan, in his autobiography states he was wary of Sjosten and was simply staying out of his way as he had no need to beat him. The fact is, this is precisely why semis and a final is by far the best way to decide a meeting. The 20 heat qualifying event prior to semis (be that one semi or two) and a final limits the opportunities for a rider to help anyone out, whether deliberate or inadvertantly. No matter what his original motivation was, Mauger would have been unable to influence Sjosten finishing on the rostrum in 1969 and Starke would have been unwilling to move over last night to let Blackbird through as he would still have been looking for a top 6 or 8 finish himself. Anyone who believes that the flawed and anachronistic 20 heat format was/is the best way to decide a meeting is, in my opinion, letting misplaced nostalgia cloud their judgement. Edited September 22, 2013 by G the Bee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Opinionated Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 Not forgetting Penhall at White City if course..... Not forgetting Penhall at White City if course..... Not forgetting Penhall at White City if course..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 When people mention that it has happened in meetings far more important than the NLRC they are probably referring to the 1969 World Final. It is a running joke in our house that my dad practically cleared a section of Wembley with his vocal blast at Ivan Mauger after he finished behind his Belle Vue team mate Soren Sjosten in heat 20. Mauger had gone unbeaten to this point and was already world champion. Sjosten's win enabled him to finish on 11, securing him a run-off against Barry Briggs for second (which he lost so ultimately finished third on the night). Had Mauger beaten Sjosten, Sjosten would have gone into a run off with Nigel Boocock for third. The fact is, this is precisely why semis and a final is by far the best way to decide a meeting. The 20 heat qualifying event prior to semis (be that one semi or two) and a final negates the need for this kind of rubbish to happen. Mauger would have been unable to help Sjosten out in 1969 and Starke would have been unwilling to move over last night to let Blackbird through as he would still have been looking for a top 6 or 8 finish himself. Anyone who believes that the flawed and anachronistic 20 heat format was/is the best way to decide a meeting is, in my opinion, letting misplaced nostalgia cloud their judgement. Not forgetting Penhall at White City if course..... Not forgetting Penhall at White City if course..... Not forgetting Penhall at White City if course..... And more...World Team Cups and more dark deeds at major international championships. It's what they call 'gamesmanship.' I don't condone it but accept it will never be stamped out. It's happened again, so it's claimed at the NLRC this weekend. So what? End of story IMO - because it will occur again somewhere in future years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Smith Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 Take a look at comments on world championships in the 1950s and 1960s for starters? My speedway memories as an active follower go back to 1946 - I have seen and heard some incredible things in that time, and not just from the spectator's side of the safety fence! When people mention that it has happened in meetings far more important than the NLRC they are probably referring to the 1969 World Final. It is a running joke in our house that my dad practically cleared a section of Wembley with his vocal blast at Ivan Mauger after he finished behind his Belle Vue team mate Soren Sjosten in heat 20. Mauger had gone unbeaten to this point and was already world champion. Sjosten's win enabled him to finish on 11, securing him a run-off against Barry Briggs for second (which he lost so ultimately finished third on the night). Had Mauger beaten Sjosten, Sjosten would have gone into a run off with Nigel Boocock for third. The fact is, this is precisely why semis and a final is by far the best way to decide a meeting. The 20 heat qualifying event prior to semis (be that one semi or two) and a final negates the need for this kind of rubbish to happen. Mauger would have been unable to help Sjosten out in 1969 and Starke would have been unwilling to move over last night to let Blackbird through as he would still have been looking for a top 6 or 8 finish himself. Anyone who believes that the flawed and anachronistic 20 heat format was/is the best way to decide a meeting is, in my opinion, letting misplaced nostalgia cloud their judgement. Not forgetting Penhall at White City if course..... Not forgetting Penhall at White City if course..... Not forgetting Penhall at White City if course..... But this is all opinion and guess work isn't it?? Has anyone actually said they let someone win, even years after an event?? Many of riders have gone through the card and won meetings before their last ride and ended up at the back. Doesn't mean they've purposely helped a fellow rider with intention. It's just human nature, already won you then don't try as hard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
secsy1 Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 When Arsenal lose today at home to Stoke and Manchester United let Manchester City win to allow a northern team to be above a southern team, will it be called gamesmanship Cheating is cheating and at present Cricket, Snooker and Football are cleaning up this gamesmanship lark due to money being involved. Betting and throwing matches. It is not needed and if it continues at the lowest level of our sport, how do any on here think that the sport can be ever taken seriously :approve: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenB1 Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 Well a great nights racing and plenty to talk about, so if you want to see it again or if you dint go and want to see it, T2TV covered the whole meeting and it is on a double DVD. Includes all 21 races and plenty of interviews, including the 1-2-3 and the presentations. Then you can judge for yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhidassa Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 Well done to Boxall, disappointing for Kerr but he had a great night. I do personally agree this would have been better at a track such as Peterborough; whilst I appreciate no track is truly neutral as at least one of the riders in the field is likely to have ridden there, I doubt any of the riders in the field last night has vast experience at Peterborough. Of course, it's a moot point now, and something I think should be considered for all of these events, but that's just my opinion. As for the Paul Starke incident... well, yes, he clearly looked for Blackbird then let him past. If he'd just made out he lost it slightly or had mechanical issues, there'd be less discussion.. but no. I like Paul, but I can't say I was impressed. I wouldn't have expected Robert or Lewis to gift each other points to help each other out - I'd expect them to be racing to do the best they could, as it was an individual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruno Posted September 22, 2013 Report Share Posted September 22, 2013 first of all congrats to steve boxall and lewis kerr,best two best riders on the night. I reckon lewis blackbird deserved third but I felt uncomfortable with what happened with starkey. it was blatant end of. it does happen at every level but this was so obvious it was shocking. would have been worse if blackbird had won the meeting. secondly the booing of Stefan Nielsen was out of order but again don't taint all heathens fans, it was just a couple of morons. all Dudley fans around me were clapping him as he walked past. not a good meeting in my opinion ,very little passing but its always the same at rye house. great set up but surely the track is the most important part of a meeting but how many times do we say that about other tracks as well. and finally to all who missed out on the fish and chips you were the lucky ones!! I think mine came out of the canal next door. horrible. last thing 18 pound with programme was to expensive. rant over but after spending around 40 pound and in my eyes not getting vfm it could be my last visit to the nlrc just has a couple of years ago was my last visit to Cardiff for the same reason and tbh to a few other tracks as well. sad but true 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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