Elite League 2014

[tellboy]

Which is ten times superior to the PL anyway. For rider quality.

Can't see it being 10 times better,especially as we seem to to see more Pl riders in it nowadays.

[Gemini]

......stevebrum......My only point is that any watering down and further loss of top riders is going to see some (myself included) lost to watching regular Speedway.

 

Goodbye to the 'some' then. Doesn't bother me not seeing top riders - in fact I have enjoyed watching the National League matches at Coventry more than the Elite League.

[stevebrum]

So it's rider quality over quality racing for you then???

 

I never fail to be excited watching EL speedway at Monmore Green so i am probably spoiled. So i am lucky to say i have both Quality and Quantity.

Have been to many tracks (PL/NL) throughout the years and some (Scunthorpe, Somerset, Stoke) have offered superb racing whilst i can name double those that offered the odd good heat.

You are trying to make it into a PL = better quality racing scenario. It isn't. The best prepared tracks offer the best racing - irrespective of leagues).

 

 

Goodbye to the 'some' then. Doesn't bother me not seeing top riders - in fact I have enjoyed watching the National League matches at Coventry more than the Elite League.

 

This is part of the problem we have Gemini. Can speedway really afford to say goodbye to a good percentage of its clientele?

Too be honest i am with you on the NL part. I would be much more interested watching young and up and coming riders than regular PL. However i wouldnt go week in week out to watch it tho.

[SteveLyric2]

I never fail to be excited watching EL speedway at Monmore Green so i am probably spoiled. So i am lucky to say i have both Quality and Quantity.

Have been to many tracks (PL/NL) throughout the years and some (Scunthorpe, Somerset, Stoke) have offered superb racing whilst i can name double those that offered the odd good heat.

You are trying to make it into a PL = better quality racing scenario. It isn't. The best prepared tracks offer the best racing - irrespective of leagues).

 

 

Hard to disagree with that point SB, but its not the whole issue is it? Its also about what the paying public (or non-paying public) believe is value for money, whatever the level of racing. Its a fact that top speedway in this country is currently unsustainable in its present form. The sport has to take a few steps back in order to re-establish its financial footing. (ps. Imo this also applies to the Swedish leagues and to a lesser extent the Polish ones too.) and reducing basic costs has got to be a good starting point for everyone involved, although I can't see it all happening for 2014!!

[MattK]

 

As dump that clutch has eloquently put it in the preceding post the immediate problem is how to get more meetings per season. The question of who is going to ride in them comes after that.

 

The problem is, if a club is losing money every time they hold a meeting, where is the incentive to run more meetings?

 

You say dropping the points limit will help reduce cost, but is there any evidence of this? Do the number ones in the Elite League this season earn any less than the number ones from five years ago when the majority were world class GP riders?

[uk_martin]

One of the biggest instant-results cost savings would be to have UK based riders only. A team (e.g. Wolves) that has 5 foreign based riders would incur air fares for the Swedes, Poles, Danes etc, of, (let's say for round figures) £100 each way, thus £200 return, thus £1,000 per meeting.

 

Yes I know you can get air fares to some places, below £100 each way, but given that there are a lot of rearranged fixtures taking place, that a lot of air fares have to be bought at the last minute, and therefore be at much much more than the lowest fares that airlines offer for advance bookings, so I'm thinking that an average of £100 each way won't be far off the mark.

 

So for a 30 meeting season, that's £30,000 off the season's running costs.

 

Anyone else got any ideas as to how to trim the costs as effectively?

Edited August 26, 2013 by uk martin

[MattK]

One of the biggest instant-results cost savings would be to have UK based riders only. A team (e.g. Wolves) that has 5 foreign based riders would incur air fares for the Swedes, Poles, Danes etc, of, (let's say for round figures) £100 each way, thus £200 return, thus £1,000 per meeting.

 

Do foreign riders demand the same points money as their British equivalent though?

Edited August 26, 2013 by MattK

[T.N.T.]

One of the biggest instant-results cost savings would be to have UK based riders only. A team (e.g. Wolves) that has 5 foreign based riders would incur air fares for the Swedes, Poles, Danes etc, of, (let's say for round figures) £100 each way, thus £200 return, thus £1,000 per meeting. So for a 30 meeting season, that's £30,000 off the season's running costs.

 

Anyone else got any ideas as to how to trim the costs as effectively?

 

Don't have the big earners in the league. 30 meetings at roughly £2,500 per meeting = £75,000 per season

 

also take off the air fares and possibly two of these riders in each team, that's roughly £160,000 a year saving

 

 

SWINDON; Troy Batchelor 8.31, Jason Doyle 7.15, Edward Kennett 6.48, Nick Morris 5.32, Ashley Birks 3.77, Kyle Howarth 3.69, ...... 3.00 = 37.72

 

WOLVES; Tai Woffinden 9.22, Adam Skornicki 6.23, Ty Proctor 5.78, Ricky Wells 5.55, Jacob Thorssell 4.60, Ashley Morris 3.00, Tom Pery 3.00 = 37.38

 

 

Still get to see some top clas riders that entertain and also see the young stars of tomorrow coming through the ranks ..... and cost effective !!

[uk_martin]

Do foreign riders demand the same points money as their British equivalent though?

 

I dare say that every rider will "demand" what they are worth. How about the theory that being "spoilt" with continental pay rates, they may even consider asking for more to make it worth their while being in the UK.

 

SWINDON; Troy Batchelor 8.31, Jason Doyle 7.15, Edward Kennett 6.48...

 

Oi !!!

 

Just thinking about these air fares...isn't it time that Ryanair, Wizzair, or in the case of Martin Smolinski, Singapore Airlines started to give something back to the sport that earns them, between all the riders in the EL and PL somewhere between £250,000 and £300,000 per year?

 

How about a Ryanair British League, next year? Or maybe "Speedway" could be rebranded as "Wizzway"? Or maybe the fans can all get nice oriental massages off the Singapore Stewardesses

[stevebrum]

Hard to disagree with that point SB, but its not the whole issue is it? Its also about what the paying public (or non-paying public) believe is value for money, whatever the level of racing. Its a fact that top speedway in this country is currently unsustainable in its present form. The sport has to take a few steps back in order to re-establish its financial footing. (ps. Imo this also applies to the Swedish leagues and to a lesser extent the Polish ones too.) and reducing basic costs has got to be a good starting point for everyone involved, although I can't see it all happening for 2014!!

 

Agreed its not the whole issue.

But if you offer an inexpensive cheaper option it wont attract the numbers required to sustain it as a credible sport.

Obviously if all leagues cut their cloth accordingly then there would be no leagues for the top boys to race in!

[MattK]

SWINDON; Troy Batchelor 8.31, Jason Doyle 7.15, Edward Kennett 6.48, Nick Morris 5.32, Ashley Birks 3.77, Kyle Howarth 3.69, ...... 3.00 = 37.72

 

 

But Batchelor would expect #1 points money, Doyle second headleader points money etc. and the cost savings would be negligible.

 

In order to make a significant cut in costs, the leagues need to be merged, the top 25% of riders jettisoned and the remaining riders to ride for Premier League points money.

 

Anything else is just papering over the cracks.

[Leicester Hunter]

How about a Ryanair British League, next year?

Not likely! All teams will be moved a minimum of 50 miles from base camp, you'll have to be in the stadium 90 minutes before the start and pay to use the bogs!

[Kester]

Not likely! All teams will be moved a minimum of 50 miles from base camp, you'll have to be in the stadium 90 minutes before the start and pay to use the bogs!

The admission price will be £1, but you have to pay £15 to walk through the turnstiles, £5 to carry a programme board and supporters over 70 kg will have to pay an additional tax.

[uk_martin]

The admission price will be £1...

 

Unless you decide at the last minute to go, in which case the admission will be £398.00 to go in, and it'll be your fault for not booking your ticket way ahead in advance.

[G the Bee]

The problem is, due to the constant mis-management of the product (especially over the last ten-years), the top-level of the sport in this country has reached rock bottom. At the moment we are scraping along in a sort of half-way-house between being a league with some of the world's top riders and being a glorified Premier League.

 

In my opinion one of the biggest problems is that the league has become steadily weakened over the last ten years as promotions continued to dilute the product to appease the weakest teams rather than working together to ensure the weakest teams could increase their competitiveness without diluting the value of the product. I believe the best years for the EL were its formative years up until around 2003. From that point on, the product has declined year-on-year.

 

I have said before that speedway promoters must be the only business owners who think they can consistently provide a product which is, year-on-year weaker than the year before yet steadily increase the price of the product and expect their business to be successful.

 

We have also failed to move with the times. If we want to provide a product which has the worlds best riders in it then we need to pay attention to the needs of those riders. I believe that a fixed race night (or nights) as the other main leagues adopt has been needed for years. Unfortunately the powers that be have consistently came up with all manner of reasons why this would not work in the UK without ever really showing the 'can do' attitude to make it a reality. They will point out that certain clubs cannot guarantee their stadium week-in-week-out on a certain day. Others will state that their landlords have other sports (usually greyhounds) on other nights of the week. However my argument is that where there is a will there is a way. Sure it may have meant certain teams would have had to move into the PL if they could not meet the requirements of the EL in terms of race night but others would have moved up to take their place.

 

It is certain that we can't keep on the way we are going, lurching from one season to the next with no long-term plan. The way I see it, we have two options.

 

1) Start from scratch again. Go single race-night and tempt some more of the 'world-class' riders back, to get the league back to the standard it was 10 years ago. Hope that, over a steady period of time, crowds improve. I actually believe that, in terms of fixtures, less quantity and more quality will get the crowds back. Look at the Cov v. Poole meeting earlier this season. Bees hadn't had a home meeting for a few weeks, Poole come to town with Holder, Ward and Janowski and the crowd was excellent. Of course, the crowds won't come flocking back overnight. This would also, of course, depend on a new multi-year contract with Sky. It would also probably require the asset system to be re-structured with riders initially allocated to clubs. Clubs who have a large asset base wiped out could be compensated by receiving a greater percentage of the Sky money for a fixed period of time.

 

2) Strip it right back. Accept the days of the EL are gone. Build clubs without the global superstars unless they are either ACU registered (like Tai) or based over here.

 

On thing is for sure. Dropping the points limit drastically for next season will not in itself fulfill the aims of number 2. When riders like Kildemand, Batchelor, Larsen, Cook are all on 8 point+ averages at the end of 2014, the points limit for 2015 will have to rise to accommodate that. And that is when certain clubs will bring back some of the 'Global Superstars' on their 2013 averages and we will be back to square 1.

[BWitcher]

 

The admission price will be £1, but you have to pay £15 to walk through the turnstiles, £5 to carry a programme board and supporters over 70 kg will have to pay an additional tax.

 

Ah more claptrap I see.

 

It's amazing how many people fall for the spin put out there by the British Airways of the world.

 

Always amuses me that folk moan about Ryanair effectively giving them a choice of not paying for services you don't want.

[uk_martin]

Always amuses me that folk moan about Ryanair effectively giving them a choice of not paying for services you don't want.

 

Sorry Mr O'Leary !!!

[BADGER69]

The problem is, due to the constant mis-management of the product (especially over the last ten-years), the top-level of the sport in this country has reached rock bottom. At the moment we are scraping along in a sort of half-way-house between being a league with some of the world's top riders and being a glorified Premier League.

 

In my opinion one of the biggest problems is that the league has become steadily weakened over the last ten years as promotions continued to dilute the product to appease the weakest teams rather than working together to ensure the weakest teams could increase their competitiveness without diluting the value of the product. I believe the best years for the EL were its formative years up until around 2003. From that point on, the product has declined year-on-year.

 

I have said before that speedway promoters must be the only business owners who think they can consistently provide a product which is, year-on-year weaker than the year before yet steadily increase the price of the product and expect their business to be successful.

 

We have also failed to move with the times. If we want to provide a product which has the worlds best riders in it then we need to pay attention to the needs of those riders. I believe that a fixed race night (or nights) as the other main leagues adopt has been needed for years. Unfortunately the powers that be have consistently came up with all manner of reasons why this would not work in the UK without ever really showing the 'can do' attitude to make it a reality. They will point out that certain clubs cannot guarantee their stadium week-in-week-out on a certain day. Others will state that their landlords have other sports (usually greyhounds) on other nights of the week. However my argument is that where there is a will there is a way. Sure it may have meant certain teams would have had to move into the PL if they could not meet the requirements of the EL in terms of race night but others would have moved up to take their place.

 

It is certain that we can't keep on the way we are going, lurching from one season to the next with no long-term plan. The way I see it, we have two options.

 

1) Start from scratch again. Go single race-night and tempt some more of the 'world-class' riders back, to get the league back to the standard it was 10 years ago. Hope that, over a steady period of time, crowds improve. I actually believe that, in terms of fixtures, less quantity and more quality will get the crowds back. Look at the Cov v. Poole meeting earlier this season. Bees hadn't had a home meeting for a few weeks, Poole come to town with Holder, Ward and Janowski and the crowd was excellent. Of course, the crowds won't come flocking back overnight. This would also, of course, depend on a new multi-year contract with Sky. It would also probably require the asset system to be re-structured with riders initially allocated to clubs. Clubs who have a large asset base wiped out could be compensated by receiving a greater percentage of the Sky money for a fixed period of time.

 

2) Strip it right back. Accept the days of the EL are gone. Build clubs without the global superstars unless they are either ACU registered (like Tai) or based over here.

 

On thing is for sure. Dropping the points limit drastically for next season will not in itself fulfill the aims of number 2. When riders like Kildemand, Batchelor, Larsen, Cook are all on 8 point+ averages at the end of 2014, the points limit for 2015 will have to rise to accommodate that. And that is when certain clubs will bring back some of the 'Global Superstars' on their 2013 averages and we will be back to square 1.

I agree with a lot of what you say but would add that speedway is a1970 sport trying to compete in 2013 It also takes place in outdated stadiums with one or two exceptions

[PHILIPRISING]

The problem is, due to the constant mis-management of the product (especially over the last ten-years), the top-level of the sport in this country has reached rock bottom. At the moment we are scraping along in a sort of half-way-house between being a league with some of the world's top riders and being a glorified Premier League.

 

In my opinion one of the biggest problems is that the league has become steadily weakened over the last ten years as promotions continued to dilute the product to appease the weakest teams rather than working together to ensure the weakest teams could increase their competitiveness without diluting the value of the product. I believe the best years for the EL were its formative years up until around 2003. From that point on, the product has declined year-on-year.

 

I have said before that speedway promoters must be the only business owners who think they can consistently provide a product which is, year-on-year weaker than the year before yet steadily increase the price of the product and expect their business to be successful.

 

We have also failed to move with the times. If we want to provide a product which has the worlds best riders in it then we need to pay attention to the needs of those riders. I believe that a fixed race night (or nights) as the other main leagues adopt has been needed for years. Unfortunately the powers that be have consistently came up with all manner of reasons why this would not work in the UK without ever really showing the 'can do' attitude to make it a reality. They will point out that certain clubs cannot guarantee their stadium week-in-week-out on a certain day. Others will state that their landlords have other sports (usually greyhounds) on other nights of the week. However my argument is that where there is a will there is a way. Sure it may have meant certain teams would have had to move into the PL if they could not meet the requirements of the EL in terms of race night but others would have moved up to take their place.

 

It is certain that we can't keep on the way we are going, lurching from one season to the next with no long-term plan. The way I see it, we have two options.

 

1) Start from scratch again. Go single race-night and tempt some more of the 'world-class' riders back, to get the league back to the standard it was 10 years ago. Hope that, over a steady period of time, crowds improve. I actually believe that, in terms of fixtures, less quantity and more quality will get the crowds back. Look at the Cov v. Poole meeting earlier this season. Bees hadn't had a home meeting for a few weeks, Poole come to town with Holder, Ward and Janowski and the crowd was excellent. Of course, the crowds won't come flocking back overnight. This would also, of course, depend on a new multi-year contract with Sky. It would also probably require the asset system to be re-structured with riders initially allocated to clubs. Clubs who have a large asset base wiped out could be compensated by receiving a greater percentage of the Sky money for a fixed period of time.

 

2) Strip it right back. Accept the days of the EL are gone. Build clubs without the global superstars unless they are either ACU registered (like Tai) or based over here.

 

On thing is for sure. Dropping the points limit drastically for next season will not in itself fulfill the aims of number 2. When riders like Kildemand, Batchelor, Larsen, Cook are all on 8 point+ averages at the end of 2014, the points limit for 2015 will have to rise to accommodate that. And that is when certain clubs will bring back some of the 'Global Superstars' on their 2013 averages and we will be back to square 1.

 

YOUR second paragraph could apply to speedway over the past 30 years let alone the last 10...

[mudflaps]

My opinion that's all.

You know what they say about opinions and ar$eholes?