Sgp/bsi And Sec/one Sport It Is War Now

[NeilWatson]

Oh dear that will not help Coventry being a fri night track.

 

We were well aware of Chris' status as first reserve when he was signed. We have raced with GP riders in the team before with a Friday race-night........

Edited December 4, 2013 by NeilWatson

[PHILIPRISING]

LOTS of sportsmen and women, including motorcyclists, don't earn a living on prize money, especially from the FIM!

 

When John Postlethwaite first secured the commercial rights for the SGP from the FIM, who had been touting it around since its inception, at his first meeting with the riders he told them that if they were to make significant money from the series it would be through sponsorship. He would provide the TV coverage and the stages on which they would perform, the rest was up to them.

 

Some, like Tony Rickardsson, benefitted massively. For many sponsorship is harder to come by than others but there are plenty who have earned very good money from deals secured on the basis of the TV exposure provided by the SGP in appearing in some major venues. That is fact. And, of course, SGP riders do get paid to ride with a pre-season payment and prize money, although you and others may consider that a mere pittance. Maybe it is but the World Championship is the cream on the cake and plenty, like Jason Crump for example, saw it that way.

 

Incidentally, I also made some enquiries about showing the SGP on TV in Russia. Apparently there is zero interest, most TV companies don't even know who Emil Sayfutdinov is.

 

As for Eurosport, TV companies contracted to BSI like those in Denmark, Poland and Sweden are adamant that they do not want the SGP shown on Eurosport (other than the British version which is in effect a separate entity) because of its possible effect on their own audiences.

[RobMcCaffery]

As for Eurosport, TV companies contracted to BSI like those in Denmark, Poland and Sweden are adamant that they do not want the SGP shown on Eurosport (other than the British version which is in effect a separate entity) because of its possible effect on their own audiences.

 

There are several versions of Eurosport, Philip, with some having some distinctive deals. For example the Hungarian/Romanian service used to show the FA Premier League live.

 

As for stations in Denmark, Poland and Sweden being unhappy with Eurosport showing SGP in opposition, well imagine what Sky would have said a couple of years ago if it had been suggested that Eurosport would show the SGP as well when THEY had paid for the UK and Ireland rights?

[Humphrey Appleby]

When John Postlethwaite first secured the commercial rights for the SGP from the FIM, who had been touting it around since its inception, at his first meeting with the riders he told them that if they were to make significant money from the series it would be through sponsorship.

He probably didn't mention he'd be the biggest earner though...

]

Incidentally, I also made some enquiries about showing the SGP on TV in Russia. Apparently there is zero interest, most TV companies don't even know who Emil Sayfutdinov is

And they never will if there's no exposure in Russia. Surely part of the role of a rights holder is to do some promotion and generate some interest?

[500cc]

 

 

CANNOT imagine you can force any one to ride even if they have entered but whether or not the FIM have sanctions at their disposal I'm not sure.

 

 

I'd assume Emil will simply be entering both competitions, and I suspect Pedersen will as well. The ball is then in the authorities court once the ride in the SEC. If they ban them at the point from the SGP, apart from the embarrassment (SEC wins that one), then I'd suspect a big court battle in which I'd favour the riders. I'd only see one loser in this confrontation, and its not the SEC.

[PolskiZuzel]

 

(...) Despite Emil's success. speedway isn't big in Russia as a whole which is probably why there isn't a TV deal in place.

 

 

Without getting too deeply into this subject I would only say this: Did you see Eurosport coverage of the SEC round in Togliatti?

If you did, perhaps you would have to change your opinion

[RobMcCaffery]

 

Without getting too deeply into this subject I would only say this: Did you see Eurosport coverage of the SEC round in Togliatti?

If you did, perhaps you would have to change your opinion

 

Okay, it's big in Togliatti.....

[PHILIPRISING]

He probably didn't mention he'd be the biggest earner though...

 

And they never will if there's no exposure in Russia. Surely part of the role of a rights holder is to do some promotion and generate some interest?

 

JOHN Postlethwaite saw the potential of the SGP where others, many from far bigger organisations, didn't and had the guts to gamble and pile millions into it. He could just as easily have lost. I don't see any harm in someone making a profit. Presumably whoever you work for, even if it is yourself, tries to do just that. You or I could have taken on the SGP but imagine we had neither the balls nor the finance.

 

BSI/IMG have explored new markets (New Zealand and Finland of late) but you only have to look at a map and see the sheer size of Russia to appreciate that country is a very different ball game. I think they stood a better chance with the SWC - national pride and all that - but Emil and the Laguta brothers pretty well scuppered that last year. Even their own federation doesn't take speedway too seriously...

[Walshy1974]

 

JOHN Postlethwaite saw the potential of the SGP where others, many from far bigger organisations, didn't and had the guts to gamble and pile millions into it. He could just as easily have lost. I don't see any harm in someone making a profit. Presumably whoever you work for, even if it is yourself, tries to do just that. You or I could have taken on the SGP but imagine we had neither the balls nor the finance.

 

BSI/IMG have explored new markets (New Zealand and Finland of late) but you only have to look at a map and see the sheer size of Russia to appreciate that country is a very different ball game. I think they stood a better chance with the SWC - national pride and all that - but Emil and the Laguta brothers pretty well scuppered that last year. Even their own federation doesn't take speedway too seriously...

How'd you see this one playing out? With WC riders stating their intentions to ride in the SEC.

[Humphrey Appleby]

JOHN Postlethwaite saw the potential of the SGP where others, many from far bigger organisations, didn't and had the guts to gamble and pile millions into it.

I don't think much, if any of it, was his money and it wasn't 'millions'. The parent Benfield Group appear to have been the primary backers of the venture, although one can only speculate at the reasons why a re-insurance group should wish to be involved with speedway.

 

Presumably whoever you work for, even if it is yourself, tries to do just that. You or I could have taken on the SGP but imagine we had neither the balls nor the finance.

I actually work for, and always have worked for non-for-profit organisations. Commercial organisations are better at doing many things, but not-for-profits are appropriate for industry collaborations, particularly in sport. It does not mean they cannot or shouldn't make money, but that money should be used for the benefit of their industry stakeholders and not disappear off to shareholders outside of that industry.

 

The national speedway authorities are primarily at fault for not seizing the opportunity of the SGP, but upon their failure to do anything, the FIM should have insisted on a profit-sharing scheme in return for selling off the rights. The FIM has a duty to represent the interests of its stakeholders, in this case speedway, but the revenue it derives from speedway-related activities does not in any way appear to benefit speedway.

 

This aside, I've never had any issue with an individual or company seeing an opportunity and being rewarded for taking the risk. However, the SGP is entirely about the riders, and if I were the stars of the show and saw the shareholders and FIM pocketing more than six times the amount being paid out in prize money, not to mention the CEO being paid multiple times more than what the world champion took home in prize money, then I'd certainly be asking questions about what's a fair split of proceeds.

 

Now I appreciate the SGP did not always make money so there might be an argument about the SGP being a sponsorship vehicle in the early days, but that's become increasingly spurious. As an example, tennis grand slams pay out around 25% of their revenue in prize money, which would be about 2.5 million quid (or 400% more than now) if you applied the same equation to the SGP.

Edited December 5, 2013 by Humphrey Appleby

[PHILIPRISING]

How'd you see this one playing out? With WC riders stating their intentions to ride in the SEC.

 

NOT sure what Emil will do but think the rest will stay with the SGP if they have to ... Nicki Pedersen has made some noises but would his sponsors rather see him at Holsted than PARKEN? He also has Swedish sponsors....

 

It still remains an un-necessary war but the only people who can resolve it are those in Geneva.

 

Matthew Harding, who a Director at Benfield Greig and was involved in Chelsea before his untimely death due to a helicopter crash, was one of the reasons Benfield Sports International (BSI) got off the ground and while it is true that much of the early funding came from Benfield Greig later on JP bought them out.

 

Benfield Greig became involved because Postlethwaite, who had been Commercial Director at Benneton's F1 team and knew many of those at the insurance giant, convinced them of its potential, especially as a TV product.

[Humphrey Appleby]

Benfield Greig became involved because Postlethwaite, who had been Commercial Director at Benneton's F1 team and knew many of those at the insurance giant, convinced them of its potential, especially as a TV product.

Why then did they put up most of the money, but relinquish their rights to share in the profits?

[Walshy1974]

 

NOT sure what Emil will do but think the rest will stay with the SGP if they have to ... Nicki Pedersen has made some noises but would his sponsors rather see him at Holsted than PARKEN? He also has Swedish sponsors....

 

It still remains an un-necessary war but the only people who can resolve it are those in Geneva.

 

Matthew Harding, who a Director at Benfield Greig and was involved in Chelsea before his untimely death due to a helicopter crash, was one of the reasons Benfield Sports International (BSI) got off the ground and while it is true that much of the early funding came from Benfield Greig later on JP bought them out.

 

Benfield Greig became involved because Postlethwaite, who had been Commercial Director at Benneton's F1 team and knew many of those at the insurance giant, convinced them of its potential, especially as a TV product.

Having read some posts on various discussions on here I was under the illusion that riders were earning more from doing SEC than the GP's. Have I misinterpreted that they earn more on SEC, but their sponsors ultimately line the rider's pocket and want their name/brand advertised globally?

[Ghostwalker]

West Row, price money is bigger in SEC then SGP and regarding the sponsors I think it varies from rider to rider depending

on who the sponsors are and what their main market is,

 

The SEC have probably a wider covering in Europe thanks to that Eurosport broadcasts it all over Europe which

means that sponsors will get exposure on countries that otherwise wouldn't have any speedway on tv.

 

 

SGP on the other hand probably (?) have a bigger coverage outside Europe but on many different broadcasters,

[Walshy1974]

West Row, price money is bigger in SEC then SGP and regarding the sponsors I think it varies from rider to rider depending

on who the sponsors are and what their main market is,

 

The SEC have probably a wider covering in Europe thanks to that Eurosport broadcasts it all over Europe which

means that sponsors will get exposure on countries that otherwise wouldn't have any speedway on tv.

 

 

SGP on the other hand probably (?) have a bigger coverage outside Europe but on many different broadcasters,

Thanks. So if I've got this right, the rider has some power in this situation as he knows what benefits him, then his sponsors have quite some say in what he should be doing as we're not talking Terry's Taxis sponsoring him are we, then SEC have the power of the bigger carrot in this case more money, then we have SGP who hold the Trump card in sponsors want their rider in the SGP so to have their image/logo advertised on a larger scale (12 Gp's v 4 SEC), and I'm fairly certain along with any rider in any motorbike discipline any rider worth his salt wants a WC Medal rather than an European medal.. Jeez, what a rather large pickle it seems. One does hope for speedway's sake that common sense prevails and rider's can take part in both. Only time will tell I guess.

[f-s-p]

West Row, price money is bigger in SEC then SGP and regarding the sponsors I think it varies from rider to rider depending

on who the sponsors are and what their main market is,

 

The SEC have probably a wider covering in Europe thanks to that Eurosport broadcasts it all over Europe which

means that sponsors will get exposure on countries that otherwise wouldn't have any speedway on tv.

 

 

SGP on the other hand probably (?) have a bigger coverage outside Europe but on many different broadcasters,

on what do you base that SEC pays better that SGP?

[DutchGrasstrack]

Indeed... in the SEC you need to score if you want to get big prize money. All riders are guaranteed of 450 euro travel money. Then 450 euro will be paid per point (heat 1 to 20) plus another 650 euro per point in the final. In the SGP you are guaranteed of a 1.000 dollars (735 euros) if you finish last. The winner gets 12.000 dollars (8227 euros). There is no travel money.

If you score max points in the SEC: 15 * 450 plus 3 * 650 = 8700 euro. So it's only a little bit more in the SEC after all (if the rider scores max points) ..... and this only happened one time this year (Vaculik in Rzeszow).

 

 

(all info is based of the latest rules which are published on the FIM and FIM Europe websites)

Edited December 6, 2013 by DutchGrasstrack

[PHILIPRISING]

And there are 12 SGP rounds as opposed to four in the SEC ...

[hydrobob]

Common sense, speedway, same sentence....I don't think so.

[crangy]

more to the piont who is replacing gollop