Why So Few Brits

[Sherborne Green]

I am putting this in the EL section but it applies to all speedway in this country (Note: So is therefore moved to where it should be). No solutions here but just questions and personal thoughts.

 

There are few Brits in the EL and not so many in the PL. The NL has several but how many carry onto progress? There are a few that have done very well but these are few.

 

Many reasons spring to mind but three I think are strong are lack of practise and training facilities, lack of finance for equipment and travel plus the third which I think could be a big factor the very large choice of other sports they can choose from in this country that cost less and are far cheaper to take part in, also if they are good bring far bigger financial rewards.

 

I mean the obvious soccer which is everywhere but also rugby and cricket for two examples that do not exist in Poland, Sweden and Denmark.

 

These three countries bring on constant streams of new young riders but look at their training facilities and the fact that they start very young. Soccer can always take some away but they do not have as many choices as here.

 

Australia is very different. They produce riders all the time and have a great choice of sports. However, they do have much more space than any of us for young lads to get out on motor cycles.

 

As I said I have no solutions but would be interested in others views.

[Crump99]

Finances, support & application in that order, but if young Brits got the first two then the third might happen? A painted van with International speedway rider on the side and teenage girls wanting your autograph does not mean that you've turned into Emil Sayfutdinov. It's more than likely you're the next Lewis Bridger, if you reach that level at all!

Edited July 22, 2013 by Crump99

[T.N.T.]

A view is also an opinion on what could be a solution and the cause of the problem.

 

 

My main problem has always been averages of foreign riders. There is nothing wrong in the averages they get when they first appear in Britain, but this is only for a short time. Most never reach that figure season after season, so we are left with foreign riders taking up team places in the Premier League on new much lower averages that they really achieve.

 

So a team will sign a foreign rider, only ever heard of in the village / town he has come from on an assesed average which is accepted by all parties. After a certain number of matches, the same rider gets a new average which could be half of the starting average he had. This new average he keeps (possibly around 3-5 points) and takes up the place that could be taken up by one of the many British riders that is struggling to make ends meet in the National League.

 

 

So to stop this, a new foreign rider keeps his assessed average until he reaches that figure. He will never get an average below that assessed average he started on. Should that rider be injured at any time however, his REAL average will be used and not his assessed average.

 

 

EXAMPLE; Stefan Nilsson joins Berwick on an assessed 7.00 average. After 12 matches, he is given a new average of 4.22 as an official GSA. However he will still use his 7.00 average as he hasn't gained the required level. He then misses a meeting so Berwick can only use a guest fo a 4.22 rider.

 

Should Berwick wish to replace him, they will still have to fit under the points limit or if it's like for like, they can only sign a new rider upto 4.22.

 

 

This would mean that virtually ALL Premier League riders in the reserves berths would be BRITISH. Add to this, British riders that are not averaging more than six points in the National League can sign up to a Premier League team on a 2.00 average. ..... The conversion rate from PL to NL (and vica versa) is x 3. So a British rider averaging 6.60 in the National League can sign up in the PL on a 2.20 average. To start in the PL on a 3.00 average, they will have to average 9.00 in the NL.

 

No foreign riders are allowed in the National League unless they have an assessed 10.00 average and keep it. Should they sign up to a PL team after, they take up their PL assessed average that they would have started on, not a third of their NL average.

[Steve0]

I think if you look at the teams with the most Brits, we have:

 

Birmingham (4) - 57% of the team

Swindon (3) - 43%

Coventry (3) - 43%

Lakeside (2) - 29%

 

And the hall of shame:

Belle Vue (1) - 14%

Wolves (1) - 14%

Kings Lynn (1) - 14%

Eastbourne (0) - 0%

Peterborough (0) - 0%

Poole (0) - 0%

Edited July 22, 2013 by Steve0

[stevebrum]

I think if you look at the teams with the most Brits, we have:

 

 

 

And the hall of shame:

 

Wolves (0) - 0%

 

 

Have you missed a big something here??

Someone didn't do there home work very well.

 

Only the best BRITISH rider in the GP and and British Champion.

[hyderd]

A view is also an opinion on what could be a solution and the cause of the problem.

 

 

My main problem has always been averages of foreign riders. There is nothing wrong in the averages they get when they first appear in Britain, but this is only for a short time. Most never reach that figure season after season, so we are left with foreign riders taking up team places in the Premier League on new much lower averages that they really achieve.

 

So a team will sign a foreign rider, only ever heard of in the village / town he has come from on an assesed average which is accepted by all parties. After a certain number of matches, the same rider gets a new average which could be half of the starting average he had. This new average he keeps (possibly around 3-5 points) and takes up the place that could be taken up by one of the many British riders that is struggling to make ends meet in the National League.

 

 

So to stop this, a new foreign rider keeps his assessed average until he reaches that figure. He will never get an average below that assessed average he started on. Should that rider be injured at any time however, his REAL average will be used and not his assessed average.

 

 

EXAMPLE; Stefan Nilsson joins Berwick on an assessed 7.00 average. After 12 matches, he is given a new average of 4.22 as an official GSA. However he will still use his 7.00 average as he hasn't gained the required level. He then misses a meeting so Berwick can only use a guest fo a 4.22 rider.

 

Should Berwick wish to replace him, they will still have to fit under the points limit or if it's like for like, they can only sign a new rider upto 4.22.

 

 

This would mean that virtually ALL Premier League riders in the reserves berths would be BRITISH. Add to this, British riders that are not averaging more than six points in the National League can sign up to a Premier League team on a 2.00 average. ..... The conversion rate from PL to NL (and vica versa) is x 3. So a British rider averaging 6.60 in the National League can sign up in the PL on a 2.20 average. To start in the PL on a 3.00 average, they will have to average 9.00 in the NL.

 

No foreign riders are allowed in the National League unless they have an assessed 10.00 average and keep it. Should they sign up to a PL team after, they take up their PL assessed average that they would have started on, not a third of their NL average.

 

would/could that interfere with the EWR

[Sherborne Green]

I hear what you say about the number of Brits in each UK team but who else is there to get places in the teams.

 

Where are these riders. Look at GPs apart from Wolffy who else is world class.

 

These are the points I was making in my original post.

[stevebrum]

.

 

Where are these riders. Look at GPs apart from Wolffy who else is world class.

 

 

 

According to Steve0 Wolves have no Brits

[SteveLyric2]

According to Steve0 Wolves have no Brits

Surprised Steve0 didn't put Swindon down for 4!!!!

[Steve0]

 

 

Have you missed a big something here??

Someone didn't do there home work very well.

 

Only the best BRITISH rider in the GP and and British Champion.

 

Ok - maybe I think of him as Aussie Corrected it now - sorry - honest oversight! I would have put Swindon down for 4 but Nick Morris chose to ride for Australia - can't say I'm surprised with the performance of our SWC team managers!!

Edited July 22, 2013 by Steve0

[Sophies Mate]

I think if you look at the teams with the most Brits, we have:

 

Birmingham (4) - 57% of the team

Swindon (3) - 43%

Coventry (3) - 43%

Lakeside (2) - 29%

 

And the hall of shame:

Belle Vue (1) - 14%

Wolves (1) - 14%

Kings Lynn (1) - 14%

Eastbourne (0) - 0%

Peterborough (0) - 0%

Poole (0) - 0%

 

 

First time for a long time that the Eagles have not had a British Rider in their side in fact back in 2008 we had five British riders in the team Scotty, Lewis Lee, Brundle and Eddie Kennett ...............

[AlanF]

1. When times were good, British speedway never really invested in the future. Stars emerged despite the system, not because of it. Used grass track as its source for kids.

 

2. Initial short termism opened the door to foreign riders in the Premier League (or whatever the title was at the time). Legally, you couldn’t stop EC riders getting in, but the promoters could have chosen not to sign them.

 

3. With fewer places available, the pool of British riders from which somebody could “make it” on the world scene got smaller.

 

4. With a smaller pool, British success on the World level was greatly reduced.

 

5. The lack of success on the World level resulted in reduced media interest.

 

6. Reduced media interest resulted in reduced public interest.

 

7. Reduced public interest meant lower crowds and more tracks falling by the wayside.

 

8. Fewer tracks meant fewer places available.

 

9. Less money being generated at the gate means a need for survival and making this year’s team successful, not worrying about who was going to be in the team in 5 years’ time.

 

10. Survival mode means finding riders as cheaply as possible and already at the required standard.

 

11. Lack of money means that Sky money is spent on subsidizing business rather than improving the infrastructure that would help kids come through.

 

12. Gates are now so low and speedway so unfashionable, that youngsters are not attracted to it (watching or competing).

 

13. Because Speedway doesn’t attract the right demographic, decent sponsorship is hard to come by.

 

14. Costs are spiraling and without good sponsorship, kids can’t afford it.

 

15. If kids can’t afford it they will do something cheaper and a bit “cooler”.

 

16. How to break the cycle without throwing huge sums of money at it, I have no idea.

Edited July 22, 2013 by AlanF

[MattK]

Finances, support & application in that order, but if young Brits got the first two then the third might happen? A painted van with International speedway rider on the side and teenage girls wanting your autograph does not mean that you've turned into Emil Sayfutdinov. It's more than likely you're the next Lewis Bridger, if you reach that level at all!

 

Wouldn't speedway cost proportionally more for youngsters in Poland (same costs, lower average salaries) than it does in Britain?

[stratton]

 

 

Wouldn't speedway cost proportionally more for youngsters in Poland (same costs, lower average salaries) than it does in Britain?

Yes but they can practice seven times a week there?makes a bit of a difference don't you think? Edited July 22, 2013 by sidney

[Starman2006]

Yes but they can practice seven times a week there?makes a bit of a difference don't you think?

 

Spot on, and there is a lot more sponsorship in Poland. And backing come to that.

Edited July 22, 2013 by Starman2006

[MattK]

Yes but they can practice seven times a week there?makes a bit of a difference don't you think?

 

Can they?

 

I'd have thought that some track may make themselves available, but many, especially the bigger clubs wouldn't. How is this different from the UK and our availability of training tracks and other places to ride?

[Starman2006]

Can they?

 

I'd have thought that some track may make themselves available, but many, especially the bigger clubs wouldn't. How is this different from the UK and our availability of training tracks and other places to ride?

 

Yes they can.

[scottyfan]

The main reason there are not that many British riders making the jump to EL standard these days is because the PL decided to bring foreign riders into the league back in about 89/90 (well done Rye House)......Before that teams in the NL,as it was called then, were made up of British and a few commonwealth riders (Aussies,Kiwi's and the occasional Canadian).

Ever since the flood gates have opened for all EU riders to ride in the PL, the amount of emerging British riders who have emerged that are good enough to go on to be world class has dwindled rapidly, as everyone can see.

The last time GB won the World Cup was 1989......Which was exactly the same time as non commonwealth riders were allowed to ride in the NL/PL.......So is this just a coincidence?? I personally think not.

[BANANAMAN]

Spot on, and there is a lot more sponsorship in Poland. And backing come to that.

Don't you think a local business in Poole would sponsor an British rider if the club signed one with potential ? Do you think British youngsters get a fair crack of the whip at Poole ?

[Pirate Nick]

Don't you think a local business in Poole would sponsor an British rider if the club signed one with potential ? Do you think British youngsters get a fair crack of the whip at Poole ?

3 local sponsors that I know of already contribute a substantial amount of money to young Brits. One in particular is very supportive of the youth meetings.

 

I myself sponsor Kyle Newman although that's mainly because his sister makes great cup cakes

 

You'd be surprised how much support there is for the youngsters at Poole.