Wimbledon Stadium: Some Important News

[lucifer sam]

A brief history lesson for you so you might understand just how exciting this news is.

 

If you consider the upcoming destruction of one of the most historic and famous speedway stadiums in the UK as "exciting", then maybe you're on the wrong forum.

 

Dreadful news.

 

All the best

Rob

Edited December 11, 2015 by lucifer sam

[Mr Snackette]

Not sure if Mr Snackette is being deliberately inflammatory in suggesting that as Wimbledon speedway supporters we could have in effect saved speedway at Plough Lane. Anyone wanting to understand the real financial background should read the previous excellent posts by Arthur Cross.

 

The stadium owners made it abundantly clear that they didn't want speedway. It's no surprise that Galliard Homes wanted to develop the site to maximise housing whilst meeting the requirement to maintain sporting use. Motor sport of any kind is not compatible with that.

 

I would be interested to see the financial plan. I hope AFC has done it's homework. Sport is littered with sucessful business people who loose the plot when it comes to sport.

 

Not being deliberately inflammatory at all, just telling it the way it is.

 

The Consortium that took over Wimbledon FC made it clear that they saw no future for the club, not just in the borough / area, or indeed London. Unlike speedway, the fans were not prepared to accept that position. They got off their backsides and did something about it.

 

When their club was hijacked to Milton Keynes they were in the second tier of football in this country. They had to reform and were placed in the NINTH TIER, little more than park football. Hard work and determination saw them rise like "Phoenix from the Flames".

 

If there was the same passion, commitment, and desire then speedway could have been saved. The problem was there were insufficient people who were interested in saving speedway in the area.

My final word (or maybe not!!):

 

 

Edited December 11, 2015 by Mr Snackette

[Sir Sidney]

We will have to disagree on that. For speedway to have had a chance it would have needed both someone with sufficient money to invest and an owner willing to sell - neither of which were in place. I think you do the speedway supporters an injustice.

[RobMcCaffery]

I find it shocking that someone who purports to be a speedway person can celebrate the loss of one of its finest venues, no matter what their justification.

 

No matter what.

 

This isn't about crowing over other people's failings or the efforts of others. We have lost the last hope of a return of speedway to Wimbledon.

 

Of course the economic reality was that without a huge upturn in the sport's popularity the sport was highly unlikely ever to justify the use of such a large venue on a regular basis but this triumphalism is insensitive and quite clearly a provocation, no matter what the poster claims.

 

To me this is rather like celebrating a loved one's death because someone you like is going to inherit their house.

 

Some may think that attitude appropriate. Thank God I don't. No matter what the arguments regarding this matter posting that large triumphalist image of the Dons 'returning' to Plough Lane (personally I thought they were settled in Stadium MK) is offensive and inflammatory to anyone who genuinely has speedway in their heart and is totally inappropriate in a speedway forum.

 

This case does emphasise that like the bawling spoilt child holding its breath, football gets what it wants.

I suggest the poster pisses off to a football forum.

 

Sorry for the language but some deserve little more. Contemptible post.

[Mr Snackette]

Oh, dear Rob McCaffery......have I struck a raw nerve?!!

 

Ir's a pity that you are unable to formulate your argument, without resulting to personal attacks.....anyway, let's try and deal with your points in a logical non-confrontational manner.

 

I must confess I am surprised that you are so easily shocked. I think it's worth celebrating that the stadium is still going to be used for sporting purposes. Far better than Custom House which is now a housing estate, far better than Rayleigh Wier which is now a supermarket, far better than Hyde Road Stadium which is now a car auction site......and so I could go on!!

 

To correct you, I'm not a "speedway person"....and I really don't understand what that means. You can label me a "Sports Fan" if you like. Over the years, I have derived as much pleasure from watching Eddie Reynolds score four goals (all with his head!!) in Wimbledon's 1963 FA Amateur Cup Final victory against Sutton United, as I did when Olle Nygren and Trevor Hedge raced to a 5-1 for a 40-38 victory over West Ham.

 

It's a pity that you hadn't read a little more, as it would have prevented you from making the comment "I thought they were settled in Stadium MK", which is, of course, the Franchise and not the "DONS".

 

Mind you the pièce de résistance is ".....like the bawling spoilt child holding its breath, football gets what it wants....."

 

That would be the spoilt child who had their team taken away from them, and only through the sheer hard work, commitment, and enthusiasm of the fans themselves got their club back.

 

It just emphasises the difference between those sports fans, who get off their backsides and make things happen, rather than those who do nothing but sit and pontificate!!!!!!

 

Pip Pip!!!!!!!!

[Blazeaway]

As a Dons fan I'm glad in a kind of warped way that the end is now nigh for Wimbledon Stadium. All the time the dilapidated eyesore is standing there was a vain hope that speedway might return. There was never any chance speedway would be included in any new plans.

 

RIP Wimbledon Speedway.

[iris123]

A few years back now...http://www.speedway-forum.co.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=48562&hl=%2Bstock+%2Bcars+%2Bspeedyguy&do=findComment&comment=1512884

 

Sad as the situation is, I can understand Snackettes position.Speedway died a long death at Plough Lane and it was terrible what happened to Wimbledon football club for the fans.I am pretty sure the community and especially the council will give more support to the football than they ever would to speedway

[racers and royals]

The greyhound view http://www.racingpost.com/news/greyhounds/council-waves-through-plough-lane-planning/2002284/top/

[Sir Sidney]

A few years back now...http://www.speedway-forum.co.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=48562&hl=%2Bstock+%2Bcars+%2Bspeedyguy&do=findComment&comment=1512884

 

Sad as the situation is, I can understand Snackettes position.Speedway died a long death at Plough Lane and it was terrible what happened to Wimbledon football club for the fans.I am pretty sure the community and especially the council will give more support to the football than they ever would to speedway

My objection to Mr Snackette's position is not that planning permission has been given to AFC and Galliard (that was probably inevitable ), but his assertion that the speedway supporters could have prevented it if they had bothered to try. I don't wish any ill on AFC, but cannot agree with Mr Snackette's view on alleged fan apathy.

[salty]

Mixed feelings on this one. Pleased to see the real footballing Dons getting back to the borough where they belong. Very disappointed to see the end of Greyhound racing at Plough Lane.

As for Speedway, once the battle lines were drawn between the two rival developments - AFC v Paschal Taggart - there was never really any hope. A faint possibility of riding in on the Taggart plans, but once they were disclosed and required housing to fund the development then that was the end for any chance of resurrecting the two wheel Dons.

It seems hopes rest with Boris Johnson intervening after listening to the Wandsworth Council complaints, but given how happy he was to see West Ham flog Upton Park to Galliard, I would be surprised to see him do anything.

[Blazeaway]

Mixed feelings on this one. Pleased to see the real footballing Dons getting back to the borough where they belong. Very disappointed to see the end of Greyhound racing at Plough Lane.

As for Speedway, once the battle lines were drawn between the two rival developments - AFC v Paschal Taggart - there was never really any hope. A faint possibility of riding in on the Taggart plans, but once they were disclosed and required housing to fund the development then that was the end for any chance of resurrecting the two wheel Dons.

It seems hopes rest with Boris Johnson intervening after listening to the Wandsworth Council complaints, but given how happy he was to see West Ham flog Upton Park to Galliard, I would be surprised to see him do anything.

 

Couldn't give a flying one about the dogs after the way we were treated.

[salty]

 

Couldn't give a flying one about the dogs after the way we were treated.

Aye, but it wasn't "the dogs" as such was it? It was the GRA who are owned by a bunch of venture capitalists.

The true greyhound fraternity wanted rid of them as well.

[Guest]

I don't see how anyone can call this news "brilliant" from a speedway perspective. The last faint hope we had of seeing the bikes return to Plough Lane has gone.

 

I spent my teenage years following the likes of Kelvin, Todd and Simmo then was fortunate to assist in a very minor way in the CL days, all now sadly consigned to history.

 

Mr Snackette - crow all you like about it on a football forum but have the bloody decency to remove your image from your earlier post. This is a SPEEDWAY forum and you are rubbing our noses in it.

[The White Knight]

Oh, dear Rob McCaffery......have I struck a raw nerve?!!

 

Ir's a pity that you are unable to formulate your argument, without resulting to personal attacks.....anyway, let's try and deal with your points in a logical non-confrontational manner.

 

I must confess I am surprised that you are so easily shocked. I think it's worth celebrating that the stadium is still going to be used for sporting purposes. Far better than Custom House which is now a housing estate, far better than Rayleigh Wier which is now a supermarket, far better than Hyde Road Stadium which is now a car auction site......and so I could go on!!

 

To correct you, I'm not a "speedway person"....and I really don't understand what that means. You can label me a "Sports Fan" if you like. Over the years, I have derived as much pleasure from watching Eddie Reynolds score four goals (all with his head!!) in Wimbledon's 1963 FA Amateur Cup Final victory against Sutton United, as I did when Olle Nygren and Trevor Hedge raced to a 5-1 for a 40-38 victory over West Ham.

 

It's a pity that you hadn't read a little more, as it would have prevented you from making the comment "I thought they were settled in Stadium MK", which is, of course, the Franchise and not the "DONS".

 

Mind you the pièce de résistance is ".....like the bawling spoilt child holding its breath, football gets what it wants....."

 

That would be the spoilt child who had their team taken away from them, and only through the sheer hard work, commitment, and enthusiasm of the fans themselves got their club back.

 

It just emphasises the difference between those sports fans, who get off their backsides and make things happen, rather than those who do nothing but sit and pontificate!!!!!!

 

Pip Pip!!!!!!!!

If that bloody Poster isn't a provocation to all Speedway Fans everywhere - I don't know what is?

 

Take the sodding thing off this 'SPEEDWAY' Forum.

 

If this upsets you - I couldn't give a toss - you have upset me with that image.

 

How insensitive can you get.

 

I've only got two words for you mate - and one of them is - OFF!!!

[Mr Snackette]

My objection to Mr Snackette's position is not that planning permission has been given to AFC and Galliard (that was probably inevitable ), but his assertion that the speedway supporters could have prevented it if they had bothered to try. I don't wish any ill on AFC, but cannot agree with Mr Snackette's view on alleged fan apathy.

 

It is nothing to do with the recent planning process.....by then it was far too late. The apathy was there from 1991 onwards. Whilst there were individuals who showed some gumption in wanting to preserve the Dons, they were far too few in number. More importantly, they didn't have the ability to galvanise local support and get the local community behind the project. To be blunt, too few people cared.

 

And that's the difference. The football fans were not prepared to allow their club to be hijacked by The Syndicate, and actually did something to preserve THEIR CLUB, with the ultimate aim of returning the club to their "spiritual home"...which is why today is so wonderful. Even when they were playing in the United Counties League (THE NINTH TIER of English football) they still attracted crowds in excess of 2,000. Those founding fathers, and the people / fans all shared a dream that eventually they would return to the borough.

 

It shows what can be achieved if people really want something to happen. I can speak with some authority on the subject as I had the privilege of leading the Ipswich "Save our Speedway Campaign" in the 1990s. Owing to a massive rent rise (sound familiar Dons' fans?), the Ipswich Promotion were upping sticks and moving to Oxford. Fortunately, Ipswich speedway fans were not so apathetic as those in the capital and were determined not to lose speedway in their town. With the support of the local MP, local businesses and the fans themselves the whole town was behind the campaign. And it worked!!!

 

As AFC Wimbledon and the Ipswich "SOS Campaign" proved you will only be successful if you have the support of your local community. The reality is, and what some people on here need to grasp, is that too few people give (or gave) a "rats" whether Wimbledon Speedway survived.

[The White Knight]

 

It is nothing to do with the recent planning process.....by then it was far too late. The apathy was there from 1991 onwards. Whilst there were individuals who showed some gumption in wanting to preserve the Dons, they were far too few in number. More importantly, they didn't have the ability to galvanise local support and get the local community behind the project. To be blunt, too few people cared.

 

And that's the difference. The football fans were not prepared to allow their club to be hijacked by The Syndicate, and actually did something to preserve THEIR CLUB, with the ultimate aim of returning the club to their "spiritual home"...which is why today is so wonderful. Even when they were playing in the United Counties League (THE NINTH TIER of English football) they still attracted crowds in excess of 2,000. Those founding fathers, and the people / fans all shared a dream that eventually they would return to the borough.

 

It shows what can be achieved if people really want something to happen. I can speak with some authority on the subject as I had the privilege of leading the Ipswich "Save our Speedway Campaign" in the 1990s. Owing to a massive rent rise (sound familiar Dons' fans?), the Ipswich Promotion were upping sticks and moving to Oxford. Fortunately, Ipswich speedway fans were not so apathetic as those in the capital and were determined not to lose speedway in their town. With the support of the local MP, local businesses and the fans themselves the whole town was behind the campaign. And it worked!!!

 

As AFC Wimbledon and the Ipswich "SOS Campaign" proved you will only be successful if you have the support of your local community. The reality is, and what some people on here need to grasp, is that too few people give (or gave) a "rats" whether Wimbledon Speedway survived.

I see you haven't removed that bloody Poster yet.

[iris123]

 

 

 

I also think the Poster is extremely provocative to Wimbledon speedway supporters.

And so what do you do?Put it up again..........blooming great idea that if it is upsetting people

[Sir Sidney]

 

It is nothing to do with the recent planning process.....by then it was far too late. The apathy was there from 1991 onwards. Whilst there were individuals who showed some gumption in wanting to preserve the Dons, they were far too few in number. More importantly, they didn't have the ability to galvanise local support and get the local community behind the project. To be blunt, too few people cared.

 

And that's the difference. The football fans were not prepared to allow their club to be hijacked by The Syndicate, and actually did something to preserve THEIR CLUB, with the ultimate aim of returning the club to their "spiritual home"...which is why today is so wonderful. Even when they were playing in the United Counties League (THE NINTH TIER of English football) they still attracted crowds in excess of 2,000. Those founding fathers, and the people / fans all shared a dream that eventually they would return to the borough.

 

It shows what can be achieved if people really want something to happen. I can speak with some authority on the subject as I had the privilege of leading the Ipswich "Save our Speedway Campaign" in the 1990s. Owing to a massive rent rise (sound familiar Dons' fans?), the Ipswich Promotion were upping sticks and moving to Oxford. Fortunately, Ipswich speedway fans were not so apathetic as those in the capital and were determined not to lose speedway in their town. With the support of the local MP, local businesses and the fans themselves the whole town was behind the campaign. And it worked!!!

 

As AFC Wimbledon and the Ipswich "SOS Campaign" proved you will only be successful if you have the support of your local community. The reality is, and what some people on here need to grasp, is that too few people give (or gave) a "rats" whether Wimbledon Speedway survived.

 

Some interesting points. I didn't know about your involvement in Ipswich, but well done. I enjoy my occassional visits to Foxhall.

 

A few differences between Ipswich and Wimbledon though i would say. Presumably at Ipswich you were able to work with a landlord who was prepared to negotiate, who wanted to retain the stadium for oval based motor sport and who wasn't in a position to develop the site for housing (I don't know, but I would imagine the Foxhall Heath would have some protection in place against development).

 

You say that the apathy at Wimbledon was there from 1991. Perhaps Wimbledon would have been better remaining in the National League as it was then, rather that moving back up to the British League and losing money. I remember John Davis making a plea to the GRA to accept less rent, but in the end they chose to let speedway close and get no rent. Perhaps a portent for the future did we but know it

 

You do acknowledge that 'there were individuals who showed some gumption in wanting to preserve the Dons' which resulted in us returning to our spiritual home for the Conference / National League years in the 2000s. I'm very grateful that there were people who had the gumption to get the Dons back. I'm sure they will confirm that they were preparing to move back up to the Premier League, as the support justified it, but the landlords made it clear that they were not interested.

 

The promoters did engage with the local MP and Council, but to no avail. They investigated many other potential sites but to no avail. Whilst there may well be several hundred pitches on which to play ninth tier football to gain a foothold I would guess there was only one viable site in London or the surrounding area at which a Wimbledon team could stage speedway at any level - and the owners of that site, as was their right, didn't want it.

 

Given that the owners have held out for and now received planning permission for 600 properties I would imagine they are quite satisfied. I haven't seen the plans but if we assume conservatively that they might be worth £250,000 each (probably more) it is no suprise that developing the site was far more attractive than letting an ageing stadium at a comparitively low rent to a tenant / tenants that it didn't want . I'm sure as an IFA you would recommend your clients to maximise their assets and, similarly, would not recommend clients paying a rent that was greater than was sensible or affordable.

 

My gripe is not with AFC Wimbledon. I wish the site plan was to develop to cater for all sports - but that wouldn't stack up financially as the housing would have had to go - not something that I would think Galliard Homes would find attactive. It is better to see the site used for sport than not.

 

In absolute terms you are right in that too few people cared that Wimbledon speedway survived - simply because speedway as a whole has too few supporters - but please don't denigrate those that do care by implying that Wimbledon fans were apathetic when others were not. That stance does you no credit.

[Mr Snackette]

Regardless of whoever won the planning application, the chances of Wimbledon Speedway taking to the track again was minuscule. I think this was a position that most people would accept.

 

Ironically the real threat to speedway is probably going to impact 70 miles up the road.

 

Spedeworth accepted that, regardless of the planning issues, their time at Wimbledon was coming to an end. It has been suggested that the reason for their investment in refurbishing Foxhall is to make it their all year round base for car racing.

 

My son who drives a stock-rod under the auspices of Spedeworth has been told that this is the last year that cars will be at Wimbledon. The rumour amongst the stockcar fraternity is that Spedeworth is planning to run at least 40 meetings at Foxhall from 2017 onwards.

 

Given that the current Suffolk Coastal Council regulations limit Foxhall to running 56 events per year, if these rumours prove to be correct, it would place a serious doubt upon the Witches continuing at the stadium

[damosuzuki]

At the end of the day football is pushed constantly by the media as if it's the only game in town. When really it's a bunch of puffs poncing around for 90 minutes.

 

If Speedway was on every second night of the week I'm sure there would be a much bigger support. Never fear though, Glasgow are going to change all of this.