Speedway Outpricing Itself?

[oldtimer]

Yes it is too expensive for the entertainment given, an adult at my Premier League track has to pay £18-50. £15 admission £1 car park and £2-50 programme. It could easily be a more entertaining evening but most promoters think just put on 15 heats and that's it, no other entertainment going on apart from track grading.

[ciderman]

you are 100% correct....

 

look at the crowds at the darts comps...

 

great hype and promotion from barry hearn has taken the sport to a new level, simply the sport hasnt changed but the way it is sold has...

 

speedway truly is the ultimate extreme sport, with many participants 18 - 25, therefore it should be followed manically by the 'monster/red bull' generation yet the stadiums are still 'full' of 40+ somethings. with hardly a teenager in sight...

 

not down to the sport that, simply to its marketing...

Darts is popular because people can get dressed up in, sit in warm surroundings and get pissed, then they can heckle a few blokes.

How many of them would go and watch a darts match in a pub? All Hearn has created is a good reason to get drunk on a night out, it's what the majority of Brits love- entertainment with alcohol.

 

It certainly doesn't match Speedway for thrills. Speedways problem has been a lack of forward vision and investment in building its own stadiums when it had a huge following from the 60's to 80's BSPA to blame, For the sport to truly move forward it has to go indoors,or have coverd track similar to Torun. Cardiff proves it. Big crowd, great atmosphere, seats,drink, Not some 1930's run down stadium with tannoy speakers playing 70's music whilst watching tractors drive round!

As much as people knock the GP's, the day out in a covered stadium,with all the benefits it brings takes some beating!

[mickthemuppet]

Darts is popular because people can get dressed up in, sit in warm surroundings and get pissed, then they can heckle a few blokes.

How many of them would go and watch a darts match in a pub? All Hearn has created is a good reason to get drunk on a night out, it's what the majority of Brits love- entertainment with alcohol.

 

It certainly doesn't match Speedway for thrills. Speedways problem has been a lack of forward vision and investment in building its own stadiums when it had a huge following from the 60's to 80's BSPA to blame, For the sport to truly move forward it has to go indoors,or have coverd track similar to Torun. Cardiff proves it. Big crowd, great atmosphere, seats,drink, Not some 1930's run down stadium with tannoy speakers playing 70's music whilst watching tractors drive round!

As much as people knock the GP's, the day out in a covered stadium,with all the benefits it brings takes some beating!

But how many GP's are in covered stadiums?

[TwoMinuteWarning]

Going to a speedway meeting in the 21st Century is like entering a time warp, or an episode of the "Goodnight Sweetheart" TV series.

 

I first went to speedway in the early 1960's - very little has changed!

 

The bikes are faster (TOO fast), there are air fences now, and coloured leathers.

 

None of which turns the all-to-often mundane speedway meeting into a 21st century entertainment, or improves the standard of racing.

 

Speedway needs a massive injection of capital - but I can't see where it's coming from. The promoters do their best - but with very limited money available.

 

Speedway basically hasn't changed since the 1960's. The paying public's expectations have.

[Tony White]

It has not changed much since the late 40s

 

Regards Tony

[george.m]

Would speedway gain in the long run with reduced admission prices. We keep seeing admission prices rising with people having less money to spare. If admission prices were considerably reduced would they attract more people, once in the stadium they would then buy a programme, drink, hot dog, etc.

 

Tracks are nowhere near filled to capacity, so would say reducing to admission something like £8, overall generate more money through increased attendances. Speedway is run whether there are 500 of 5000 supporters and many who do not go now would be maybe willing to pay say £8 rather than £14. Anyone got any views on this?

 

There are often venues and places open to the public, not only speedway, where I look at the admission price and say, no way, too expensive, I cannot afford that. This is OK for the venue if by charging high prices they can run at crowd capacity level but if people are reluctant to pay these high prices and do not turn up, it then it soon becomes a loss making event.

 

Reducing the price of speedway will in the main only reduce the rate the current fan base leaving the sport due to cost/value for money.

It will attract few new customers, but might help those who do attend, return.

[Sir Jasper]

The problem for promoters with this is that cutting prices in half means that you would need to double your attendance to make the same amount of income. And that just wouldn't happen.

 

Is it overpriced as compared to the alternative forms of entertainment? I pay £20 on average to watch Leeds United at Elland Road, £15 to watch as many films as possible every month and £10 to £15 to watch university theatre in Cambridge or £17 to watch Elite League Speedway. Apart from when I go to Peterborough (which is about 200 yards away) the cost of running the car is generally more that the cost of the entrance ticket.

 

To me the issue is costs primarily the riders wages, so you have to do something to bring these down if ever you are going to bring admission prices down.

To make a living riders can't afford to do that.

 

The problem is, every promoters excuse is riders wages. To be quite frank, that is absolute garbage and lazy promoting to make comments like that.

 

The sport can improve & become cheaper but it has to be done by the BSPA.

 

The first job is to get rid of GoSpeed. Employ somebody to go out there and market British Speedway as a whole, not individual teams. Get out there & ask, ask again, ask again, ask again, ask again, ask again, ask again, ask again, ask again & ask again. Somebody will sponsor speedway.

 

The Redbull Elite League

The EasyJet Premier League

 

Energy drinks & Aviation is the main route I'd start with. 1000's of flights taken per season by riders, these guys could easily create good business for these airlines.

 

The point is the BSPA overall are responsible for saving speedway and not individual clubs & riders cutting there wages. Get a major sponsorship and people will come. It's how things work these days. Today people are sucked in & follow brands even if the product is garbage. Just blind the public with razzle dazzle and they'll want a bit of it.

 

To be honest I agree with both points of view. Yes it needs to be promoted better, yes it needs somebody who is able to get all pulling together to make money. F1 is similar in some way, yes the FIA is involved but in terms of promoting and making money there is a guy at the top and all realise the best way to make money etc is to pull together.

 

Now for the controversial bit, plesse bear in mind I have the utmost respect for the riders and would love to be able to what they do but.......

 

Riders wages are a problem, who is to say Speedway should provide them a living? Yes its great that they wish to hurtle around on a bike with no brakes but that certainly does not entitle them to make a living from it. I agree Football players / tennis players / golfers get paid / win exorbitant amounts but market forces dictate this and simply cant be used in such an arguement. The facts are there is not as much public interest in Speedway, therefore less cash so it simply cant be spread around as much. It was only 20 or so years ago that middle of the road riders would have to work in the winter or even in the week to make ends meet yet nowadays you see riders of a lesser standard almost have a sense of entitlement to get paid well has the advent of "professional" speedway riders enahanced the sport?

 

There is a poster on here (an ex rider I believe) whose forum name escapes me at this moment, and he is forever mentioning younger riders having kit that looks nice and sparkly but they are not able to ride it well, this adds to the attitude of thinking they are entitled to something out of speedway eg did Harris not have one of his best GP's on a 10 year old engine?

 

Riders ultimately have a choice in their career choices and how much they are willing to spend on it all but in the grand scheme of things it does not entitle them to anything I am afraid. I expect many will deem that riders deserve every penny they get, again its not a sentiment I am really opposed to but if there are not many pennys to go around an adjustment of thinking is required.

[The White Knight]

To be honest I agree with both points of view. Yes it needs to be promoted better, yes it needs somebody who is able to get all pulling together to make money. F1 is similar in some way, yes the FIA is involved but in terms of promoting and making money there is a guy at the top and all realise the best way to make money etc is to pull together.

 

Now for the controversial bit, plesse bear in mind I have the utmost respect for the riders and would love to be able to what they do but.......

 

Riders wages are a problem, who is to say Speedway should provide them a living? Yes its great that they wish to hurtle around on a bike with no brakes but that certainly does not entitle them to make a living from it. I agree Football players / tennis players / golfers get paid / win exorbitant amounts but market forces dictate this and simply cant be used in such an arguement. The facts are there is not as much public interest in Speedway, therefore less cash so it simply cant be spread around as much. It was only 20 or so years ago that middle of the road riders would have to work in the winter or even in the week to make ends meet yet nowadays you see riders of a lesser standard almost have a sense of entitlement to get paid well has the advent of "professional" speedway riders enahanced the sport?

 

There is a poster on here (an ex rider I believe) whose forum name escapes me at this moment, and he is forever mentioning younger riders having kit that looks nice and sparkly but they are not able to ride it well, this adds to the attitude of thinking they are entitled to something out of speedway eg did Harris not have one of his best GP's on a 10 year old engine?

 

Riders ultimately have a choice in their career choices and how much they are willing to spend on it all but in the grand scheme of things it does not entitle them to anything I am afraid. I expect many will deem that riders deserve every penny they get, again its not a sentiment I am really opposed to but if there are not many pennys to go around an adjustment of thinking is required.

 

Good Post.

 

Sadly you are right, the problem is I cannot see anything improving soon to increase the number of pennies coming in. Once last years Government 'cuts' really bite there will be less disposable income for most people. On top of that the Government are proposing yet another raft of 'cuts', about 10% I believe. When they hit the general public - I really fear for the future - not just for some Tracks - but for the future of Speedway, as we know it, altogether.

 

It won't just be Speedway, other minor Sports will suffer too.

[peatbog]

Reducing the amount of meetings could be the answer, Elite League teams to meet home and away once only, so for fans the cost per month is halved.

[The White Knight]

Reducing the amount of meetings could be the answer, Elite League teams to meet home and away once only, so for fans the cost per month is halved.

 

What about the Premier/National Leagues?

[Gemini]

Reducing the amount of meetings could be the answer, Elite League teams to meet home and away once only, so for fans the cost per month is halved.

 

It's not much more than that now as teams only meet certain other teams once already.

I agree with a lot of Sir Jasper's post. Seems to me that riders themselves could cut costs as there is often a wholesale clearout at the end of each season and all new stuff brought in. Not meaning to pick on Chris Harris but to use him as an example, Martin Smolinski is apparently using one of his 2012 engines and it's going like a rocket so why get rid?

[Fromafar]

To be honest I agree with both points of view. Yes it needs to be promoted better, yes it needs somebody who is able to get all pulling together to make money. F1 is similar in some way, yes the FIA is involved but in terms of promoting and making money there is a guy at the top and all realise the best way to make money etc is to pull together.

 

Now for the controversial bit, plesse bear in mind I have the utmost respect for the riders and would love to be able to what they do but.......

 

Riders wages are a problem, who is to say Speedway should provide them a living? Yes its great that they wish to hurtle around on a bike with no brakes but that certainly does not entitle them to make a living from it. I agree Football players / tennis players / golfers get paid / win exorbitant amounts but market forces dictate this and simply cant be used in such an arguement. The facts are there is not as much public interest in Speedway, therefore less cash so it simply cant be spread around as much. It was only 20 or so years ago that middle of the road riders would have to work in the winter or even in the week to make ends meet yet nowadays you see riders of a lesser standard almost have a sense of entitlement to get paid well has the advent of "professional" speedway riders enahanced the sport?

 

There is a poster on here (an ex rider I believe) whose forum name escapes me at this moment, and he is forever mentioning younger riders having kit that looks nice and sparkly but they are not able to ride it well, this adds to the attitude of thinking they are entitled to something out of speedway eg did Harris not have one of his best GP's on a 10 year old engine?

 

Riders ultimately have a choice in their career choices and how much they are willing to spend on it all but in the grand scheme of things it does not entitle them to anything I am afraid. I expect many will deem that riders deserve every penny they get, again its not a sentiment I am really opposed to but if there are not many pennys to go around an adjustment of thinking is required.

You have hit the nail on the head IMO

[ch958]

Sir Jasper has totally nailed this topic - PL riders should really be semi pro at best (I know quite a few are). Crowds are similar to Conference North/South in football - they are semi pro

Admission fees at that level of football are around 10/12 pounds

and thats about right too

Facts are facts - not enough money coming throught he gate to sustain professional wages certainly at PL level

 

and do you know what - the speedway racing would still be as good as it is now

Edited April 13, 2013 by ch958

[ABS]

A season ticket at Blackburn Rovers last year worked out at roughly £12 per match and for that you got to see many of the best players in the world (none in the Rovers team) every week. I am not from Blackburn, nor am I a fan of the team, but this represented great value for money and through it being reasonably priced for what you were getting, I paid my £230 and enjoyed watching the games.

 

I go to Belle Vue every week, where it costs £16.50 for effectively 17 minutes of actual entertainment, which is representative of EL pricing, so it's pretty clear to see that speedway does not represent value for money and will struggle to attract newcomers and retain them.

 

Something should be done to bring the gate price down to the £12-£13 level.

[LagutaRacingFan]

Admission prices are too high, Cinema or speedway?

 

No contest

Edited April 13, 2013 by Jepsen Jensen Fan Club

[Alpha]

I posted this on the "Not Converted" thread last week and I think it is relevent to this thread.

 

In the last 20 years i've been watching speedway I don’t think the amount of passing has varied much at all. All of the changes to bike to improve racing (i.e. dirt deflectors) have made little or no difference to the product. As someone above said, I think the bikes are faster now but quality of racing remains unchanged. In my opinion, the biggest factor affecting quality of racing is the track layout and the racing lines around the circuit. At some tracks there is one line that is soo much faster than the others that it is very difficult to pass a rider if he is on that line. I’ve been to most tracks in the county and we know some are more conducive to passing than others. Changing the bikes, tyres, engines etc will not alter that.

 

That brings me onto my second point. The only thing holding back good crowds is the cost of speedway (to both supporters and riders). EL supporters paying £16 - £18 per adult with prices going up by the year. Speedway has always been more of a working class sport with people attending generally earning below the national average earnings (£26,500 if you believe the BBC, I think it's actually much lower). By rising the admission prices to cover promoters cost you are reducing the crowd and by proxy reducing the gate income in the style of the Laffer curve for tax income. People just won’t pay it in the current economic climate.

Promoters say most of them operated at a loss last year, but why is that? I guess stadium rent and H&S/insurance are a big factor but the wages to some riders are too high. If their cost were lower they could be paid less (but still earn the same amount), lower cost for promoters, lower cost to supporters in admission fees, = more supporters through the gate = more gate income (Admittedly simplified a little).

 

Sadly the costs are only going up with the latest silly idea to increase cost even further by allowing the use of titanium component. Maybe the bikes will go 2 mph faster down the straights but I don't think it warrants another £2 on admission price. Sure the riders pay it, but ultimately the costs will be passed onto the supporters.

 

A step forward as is often proposed is a single spec engine mass produced and sealed to prevent changes. I vaguely remember Honda being approached about 10 years ago to produce an engine (derivative of a 500cc MX engine) but the proposal was turned down by BSPA? This would reduce costs for riders and even up the field for those riders with less money available to spend on massive tuning bills.

 

Lower the price and the supporters will come.

[SteveLyric2]

Unfortunately I think that you have some EL promoters and some fans who believe that it is only 'the top riders' (ie GP standard) that fans want to come and see. Within that point of view is the fear factor that many fans would not continue to come if the there were no top riders (or they were only competing in a small Super League of sorts). For the sport to continue, the weekly 'bread and butter' league speedway in the uk needs to be affordable and sustainable. Good racing will still generate a whole new breed of 'stars' that can create their own publicity - the knack for promoters is only to pay what they can afford and for fans to only be charged what they can afford!

Edited April 15, 2013 by Skidder1