Not Converted

[Tsunami]

just read this post and an interesting point is I went to the raw show last year in Miami the day after Wrestlemania.watching it on tv you would think it was packed out but the seats behind the camera were only about three quarters full.apparently Vince McMahon insists tickets are sold first of all for seats in front of the cameras to give the impression of sold out arenas.good promoting eh

 

The same happens with televised snooker. The fans that are in are the ones that you see, with no one to the sides and beside the main camera.

[slickmick]

And that confirms the point I have been making for years, marketing a flawed product is an absolute no no. Despite your good intentions those people are now lost forever to the sport, I doubt any persuading will get them to go again, those potential customers now lost.

Over the years I have taken friends to meetings, at various tracks, and whether it was a meetings with lots of passing or processional and only interesting to us purists who go on a regular basis, but totally meaningless to first timers( I have only been rude to one person, but her criticism wasn't the racing but because the bar in the grandstand at wimbledon didn't serve her preferred spirit, she got told how to get to the nearest tube station, shame really the bloke was really getting into the speedway). Over the years various people have said to me when it was mentioned I go to Speedway, People say "bit boring isn't it they just go round in circles following each other". Trying to explain the fact that the bikes have no brakes and fixed gearing and do 4 laps in about a minute, will get a "oh really" response. Alternately they will think it is the same as motogp or motocross. So it is not just a new thing but ageless, People either love it, or find it boring, you will not convert them. Edited April 7, 2013 by slickmick

[BWitcher]

Over the years I have taken friends to meetings, at various tracks, and whether it was a meetings with lots of passing or processional and only interesting to us purists who go on a regular basis, but totally meaningless to first timers( I have only been rude to one person, but her criticism wasn't the racing but because the bar in the grandstand at wimbledon didn't serve her preferred spirit, she got told how to get to the nearest tube station, shame really the bloke was really getting into the speedway). Over the years various people have said to me when it was mentioned I go to Speedway, People say "bit boring isn't it they just go round in circles following each other". Trying to explain the fact that the bikes have no brakes and fixed gearing and do 4 laps in about a minute, will get a "oh really" response. Alternately they will think it is the same as motogp or motocross. So it is not just a new thing but ageless, People either love it, or find it boring, you will not convert them.

 

You are illustrating what I have been saying. Most people have pre conceived ideas. If the sport was marketed correctly you would be surprised how many can be converted.

 

Look at fashion.. Clothes, hairstyles etc. they change constantly, not because people suddenly don't like certain clothes anymore but because they are, to all intents and purposes, told they don't like them anymore as its not 'cool'.

 

Of course there will be folk who simply aren't going to be interested as its not their thing, but there are thousands who could be.

[Trees]

just read this post and an interesting point is I went to the raw show last year in Miami the day after Wrestlemania.watching it on tv you would think it was packed out but the seats behind the camera were only about three quarters full.apparently Vince McMahon insists tickets are sold first of all for seats in front of the cameras to give the impression of sold out arenas.good promoting eh

isn't that what BSI do at Cardiff?

 

a mate of mine at rye house last night said, going to a speedway meeting was like watching a vintage pathe news film!. harsh but true.

That might be the case at Rye, horrible place!!!

[Grachan]

isn't that what BSI do at Cardiff?

 

It's nothing new. They did in in Los Angeles for the 1982 World Final. My parents went and they got moved before the start to where the cameras would pick up the crowd.

[oldace]

just read this post and an interesting point is I went to the raw show last year in Miami the day after Wrestlemania.watching it on tv you would think it was packed out but the seats behind the camera were only about three quarters full.apparently Vince McMahon insists tickets are sold first of all for seats in front of the cameras to give the impression of sold out arenas.good promoting eh

a mate of mine at rye house last night said, going to a speedway meeting was like watching a vintage pathe news film!. harsh but true.

The same happens with televised snooker. The fans that are in are the ones that you see, with no one to the sides and beside the main camera.

isn't that what BSI do at Cardiff?

 

 

That might be the case at Rye, horrible place!!!

It's nothing new. They did in in Los Angeles for the 1982 World Final. My parents went and they got moved before the start to where the cameras would pick up the crowd.

 

It is known as "dressing the house", Selling tickets in a manner that can make a venue look full when it is only two thirds full.

 

Why do you think they do that? Refer to Bwitchers earlier point

[Trees]

I think we all know why they do it, not so easy to do at an EL meeting though, unless the cameras are very, very strategically placed!

[The White Knight]

just read this post and an interesting point is I went to the raw show last year in Miami the day after Wrestlemania.watching it on tv you would think it was packed out but the seats behind the camera were only about three quarters full.apparently Vince McMahon insists tickets are sold first of all for seats in front of the cameras to give the impression of sold out arenas.good promoting eh

 

I thought you were going to say the Crowd was 'Rock' Bottom.

 

 

I'll get me coat......................................

 

 

You are illustrating what I have been saying. Most people have pre conceived ideas. If the sport was marketed correctly you would be surprised how many can be converted.

 

Look at fashion.. Clothes, hairstyles etc. they change constantly, not because people suddenly don't like certain clothes anymore but because they are, to all intents and purposes, told they don't like them anymore as its not 'cool'.

 

Of course there will be folk who simply aren't going to be interested as its not their thing, but there are thousands who could be.

 

Back to BLACK LEATHERS I say - now THAT'S - COOL!!! B)

Edited April 8, 2013 by The White Knight

[BWitcher]

I think we all know why they do it, not so easy to do at an EL meeting though, unless the cameras are very, very strategically placed!

 

Which is why, right from the beginning they should have been getting crowds in and ensuring it looked like the place to be on TV. Sadly they've blown it.

[oldace]

Which is why, right from the beginning they should have been getting crowds in and ensuring it looked like the place to be on TV. Sadly they've blown it.

 

Do you mean a few old folks sat in deckchairs filling in programmes or knitting with a few dogs running about is not going to inspire a younger audience into thinking this is a must attend type of event

[SCB]

Do you mean a few old folks sat in deckchairs filling in programmes or knitting with a few dogs running about is not going to inspire a younger audience into thinking this is a must attend type of event

Oh that's it, you have just, in the eyes on the BSF massive, posted you want old people to die. How dare you!

[Trees]

So EL speedway needs rentateenagecrowd then!! LOL

[keef robin]

I can only talk for my local track in Swindon. The track and weather hasn't been good so far this year. Crowds are low, and the lack of passing because of the conditions wont attract newbies, or sustain the interest of a lot of the diehards. People don't want to stand around for ages in between races in the freezing cold.

 

I work as a cabbie in town and speak to a lot of passengers about the sport. Most show an interest, but think the admission price is too high. A few have been, half enjoyed it and are still attending, but a few found it too boring, or moaned about the poor views and bad facilities.

I had a 30-year break from the sport from 70s-2004, and was still attracted by the noise and smell of the bikes. Didn't like the fact that the British league is now 3rd.choice for riders, and there are so many overseas riders. The sport is stuck in a70s/80s timewarp, the stadium hadn't changed. The racing is the same, but a lot fewer fans means hardly any atmosphere. There's too many changes in riding personnel as well, no continuity. Doesn't seem as good value-for-money without second-halves now.

I have taken mates to the Cardiff GP, which they enjoyed, but they wouldn't watch a league match.

Still look forward to tonight's meeting as much as when I did when I was a kid in the 60s/70s.

Edited April 8, 2013 by beefy keefy

[moxey63]

Nothing new, tv comapnies moving people to make the crowd look bigger. At Belle Vue they asked the people on the centre green to stand on the terraces for a while.

 

As for introducing newbies to speedway... I'd give it a wide berth right now. Imagine some would get confused, thinking whether they have attended their first track-grading conference or speedway match, or why this rider was racing for this club only last night but is now riding for another club

 

First impressions and all that... best getting the product right before attracting people that are just there... mainly to fill out the racecard and add another programme to that pile in the back bedroom.

[Gemini]

Imagine some would get confused, thinking whether they have attended their first track-grading conference or speedway match.

 

What I don't understand (although I realize I'm probably being really thick as usual) is exactly why the track needs to be graded after every 4 heats - if we're lucky as it could be much more at some tracks? The dirt moves out producing more outside racing lines but then gets dragged back again. Is it REALLY necessary or just one more thing to lengthen the time the meeting takes to run so we're not leaving after an hour?

[cityrebel]

What I don't understand (although I realize I'm probably being really thick as usual) is exactly why the track needs to be graded after every 4 heats - if we're lucky as it could be much more at some tracks? The dirt moves out producing more outside racing lines but then gets dragged back again. Is it REALLY necessary or just one more thing to lengthen the time the meeting takes to run so we're not leaving after an hour?

most tracks in this country don't have enough dirt on to need grading every four heats!, two meetings i went to last week were raced on concrete, yet still the tractor came out grading invisible shale!.

[mikebv]

most tracks in this country don't have enough dirt on to need grading every four heats!, two meetings i went to last week were raced on concrete, yet still the tractor came out grading invisible shale!.

 

same thing happened at BV tonight...

 

didnt need a tractor to pull a grader , they could have used a brush to 'tidy up' the dust...

 

bottom line of course though is deep tracks simply cannot be handled by the majority of riders,

 

this may be due to ability or modern machinery, (or maybe both?)

 

either way, not having circuits that you need throttle control on which by definition increase opportunities for mistakes, does lead to pretty much 'first out of the gate' wins, which then leads to a lack of spectator response meaning a flat atmosphere....

[Trees]

They grade tracks often to smooth out the ruts made by the bikes and to spread the material over the track!! You must have seen how dangerous a track can become when there is loads of dirt near the fence with riders risking all to get their back tyre in the dirt? A few years back when Lynn was a differently prepared track to what it is no

w (Buster doesn't put as much material on any more!) Huggy would grade after every race and riders could pass inside and outside and race times were the same throughout the meeting, it turned a good shaped race track into a great race track and was hailed as the best track in the country by many riders. It annoys me that fans moan about the grading of tracks, it's a very necessary part of speedway, look at the debacle of the GP tracks and the televised tracks, only being able to be graded after every 4 when it might need it more often, ridiculous, but never mind the riders and the quality of racing just as long as the advertisers are catered for :-S

[ABS]

They grade tracks often to smooth out the ruts made by the bikes and to spread the material over the track!! You must have seen how dangerous a track can become when there is loads of dirt near the fence with riders risking all to get their back tyre in the dirt? A few years back when Lynn was a differently prepared track to what it is no

w (Buster doesn't put as much material on any more!) Huggy would grade after every race and riders could pass inside and outside and race times were the same throughout the meeting, it turned a good shaped race track into a great race track and was hailed as the best track in the country by many riders. It annoys me that fans moan about the grading of tracks, it's a very necessary part of speedway, look at the debacle of the GP tracks and the televised tracks, only being able to be graded after every 4 when it might need it more often, ridiculous, but never mind the riders and the quality of racing just as long as the advertisers are catered for :-S

 

Spot on. This makes it possible to overtake on the inside as well as the outside - a contest of technique vs throttle.

[SCB]

most tracks in this country don't have enough dirt on to need grading every four heats!, two meetings i went to last week were raced on concrete, yet still the tractor came out grading invisible shale!.

Enough dirt? Did Swindon last night have enough dirt? It's more than having "enough dirt". I've walked a few tracks now over the years and have ridden (very badly and very slow) a track which didnt look to have that much dirt but I assure you have bloody loads once you got onto it and were bumping around.

 

It's no good having loads to dirt on the track for the guy who hits the front to go fast, nobody will pass him. It's about having racing lines (plural) and a consistent track where riders can be confident of being 2 inches from the fence or another ride.

 

Dirt does NOT mean good racing. Slick does not mean rubbish racing!

 

I do agree though, seeing tractors grade bald tracks is amusing