foamfence Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 1.5bhp out of an 85bhp bike is actually quite a significant advantage. On tarmac possibly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 On tarmac possibly. Fair point and I accept raw power is actually not the answer in speedway. So if what we're saying is that power is just going to be wasted as wheel spin, Gollob and co won't want it so won't bother with Titanium then will they? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE DEAN MACHINE Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 (edited) Fair point and I accept raw power is actually not the answer in speedway. So if what we're saying is that power is just going to be wasted as wheel spin, Gollob and co won't want it so won't bother with Titanium then will they? In the real world no they wont but we are dealing with a generation that believes a soft drink with enough sugar to kill a horse really does give you the edge over you rivals and the same belief will be for titanium. Edited February 14, 2013 by THE DEAN MACHINE 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
21st century heathen Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 What I can't get my head around is that if the riders are saying 'we do not want this' then why would they go out and buy it? I absolutely do not want a Subway sandwich for lunch today, so I'm not going to buy one!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE DEAN MACHINE Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 (edited) What I can't get my head around is that if the riders are saying 'we do not want this' then why would they go out and buy it? I absolutely do not want a Subway sandwich for lunch today, so I'm not going to buy one!! titaniums performance apart , speedway is all psychological , you have to believe you will win , you can have all the best equipment money can buy but without the belief you wont win , to believe in yourself everything has got to be perfect and if another rider has got titanium parts and you havent you start to doubt your bike is good enough (may not be fact ) but you will think it and that slight doubt is enough for the oppostion to beat you , speedway bikes are really easy to ride but to race into a 1st corner with 3 other idiots takes 100% belief and the slightest doubt in you or your bike means you wont win . i cant explain it any simpler than that Edited February 14, 2013 by THE DEAN MACHINE 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ford Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 Fair point and I accept raw power is actually not the answer in speedway. So if what we're saying is that power is just going to be wasted as wheel spin, Gollob and co won't want it so won't bother with Titanium then will they? On a track with long straight’s with all things being equal apart from an extra 1000 revs out of one of the engine’s, at the end of a long straight it should be quite an advantage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
21st century heathen Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 speedway bikes are really easy to ride No they're not. You guys just make it look easy! I completely understand the point you're making, and agree with you that psychology can play a huge part. But, if as you've stated and seems to be the general view that nobody wants the titanium parts then why is anyone going to buy them? Why don't the riders just refuse en masse to buy the parts? Has any rider actual come out in favour and stated that he's going to buying in to it? Just rhetorical questions Dean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OGT Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 titaniums performance apart , speedway is all psychological You're right, there are loads of stories of riders complaining that they're bikes were crap, giving them to tuners/mechanics to fettle and all they'd do was polish the cases, then when they got them back, they'd be a different rider. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_minall Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 I think he was also the driving force and designer/seller of the Interspan type ignition boxes. That I'm not sure of. I became friends with a chap at interspan (I think) back in 2003 when I was about to sign for Newport. I think the chaps name was Tony, not entirely sure. We had several conversations about magic boxes and which high profile riders use his products - he didn't at any point mention the great TR, thought he would have been the first person to mention? Also funnily enough at no point did he ever try to sell me a magic box, or even let me try one! Coil packs all the way. Cheap and easy. No they're not. You guys just make it look easy! I agree with Dean - compared to other motorcycle sports, speedway is definitely one of the easiest. I know we ramble on about throttle control and body positioning, but it really isn't that hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 I don't know about anyone else - but - I am learning a tremendous amount from all of these Posts on this Thread. I hope it keeps going. GREAT Thread - and thank you to everyone taking part in the Discussions. :) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE DEAN MACHINE Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 No they're not. You guys just make it look easy! I completely understand the point you're making, and agree with you that psychology can play a huge part. But, if as you've stated and seems to be the general view that nobody wants the titanium parts then why is anyone going to buy them? Why don't the riders just refuse en masse to buy the parts? Has any rider actual come out in favour and stated that he's going to buying in to it? Just rhetorical questions Dean. It just needs one rider to buy it get a result and everyone will have it . I think all the gp riders have already tested it by now. Speedway bikes are very easy to ride but racing them is rocket science I don't know about anyone else - but - I am learning a tremendous amount from all of these Posts on this Thread. I hope it keeps going. GREAT Thread - and thank you to everyone taking part in the Discussions. :) I wish i were as good a rider as i am at explaining speedway 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsunami Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 That I'm not sure of. I became friends with a chap at interspan (I think) back in 2003 when I was about to sign for Newport. I think the chaps name was Tony, not entirely sure. We had several conversations about magic boxes and which high profile riders use his products - he didn't at any point mention the great TR, thought he would have been the first person to mention? Also funnily enough at no point did he ever try to sell me a magic box, or even let me try one! Coil packs all the way. Cheap and easy. Might have the wrong box, but he did produce a top ignition box which were exclusively bought through him and cost a fortune. One of our Danes had one in about 2002 and that's how I knew about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedibee Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 (edited) saying that the extra power is wasted is misleading really . good tuners and great riders will be able to make the power usable . so a factory pilot such as Gollob who has both the technical backup and rider skill to make use of it will be seen to have an advantage . lesser riders will then think that the only reason they dont go as fast as gollob is because he has it and they don't . which is partly true , so the parts will become the key to success for many . Edited February 14, 2013 by speedibee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f-s-p Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 Might have the wrong box, but he did produce a top ignition box which were exclusively bought through him and cost a fortune. One of our Danes had one in about 2002 and that's how I knew about it. Was it Polsport or something like that? One of the first programmable ones... They all ended in the bin after one or two too many EF's in the polish league meetings. Trick indeed had his own Penske frame. Had some innovative things built on it. I thought it was pretty lame from him to say after he retired that there was nothing special on it. But whatever the truth behind it, it was all truly well played and even forced Crump to spend some of his valuable time on developing his own adjustable front suspension... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CS18 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 The story behind Rickardsson's Penske frame has been explained in a long article in Racecar Engineering a couple of years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f-s-p Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 The story behind Rickardsson's Penske frame has been explained in a long article in Racecar Engineering a couple of years ago. Finnish track racing magazine Speedwaysanomat also did it's own feature on the subject. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_minall Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 The story behind Rickardsson's Penske frame has been explained in a long article in Racecar Engineering a couple of years ago. Finnish track racing magazine Speedwaysanomat also did it's own feature on the subject. Does anyone have links to these articles? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhr Posted February 15, 2013 Report Share Posted February 15, 2013 (edited) Was it Polsport or something like that? One of the first programmable ones... They all ended in the bin after one or two too many EF's in the polish league meetings. Trick indeed had his own Penske frame. Had some innovative things built on it. I thought it was pretty lame from him to say after he retired that there was nothing special on it. But whatever the truth behind it, it was all truly well played and even forced Crump to spend some of his valuable time on developing his own adjustable front suspension... Tony's ignition box was jezpol from Poland. Where I don't think the use of titanium should be allowed, as there was no need last year, I will not be using it. Ok, I understand I am not a top rider but I'm decent enough and the costs far outweigh the benifits. I may get proven totally wrong on the 1000m LongTrack but I think a good engine is a good engine. There is also the fact that there maybe lots of problems using the stuff, like not being able to cut valves. We compete in a dirty sport so how can you 100% say that no dust get in? Also and I cannot say about all con rods but what I've seen they use steel inserts and this could lead to other problems. I am sure top riders will try it, maybe keep it , maybe not but these riders would win anyway as they are the best Edited February 15, 2013 by dhr 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedibee Posted February 15, 2013 Report Share Posted February 15, 2013 I don't know about anyone else - but - I am learning a tremendous amount from all of these Posts on this Thread. I hope it keeps going. GREAT Thread - and thank you to everyone taking part in the Discussions. :) And me ,TWK I just learned that speedway is easy , suppose that's why riders from other sports say not bloody likely you have to be a nutter to ride one of them things on a narrow track with 3 other nutters and no brakes , but then again if 2 world champions are saying it's easy I suppose it must be 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TesarRacing Posted February 15, 2013 Report Share Posted February 15, 2013 I don't know about anyone else - but - I am learning a tremendous amount from all of these Posts on this Thread. I hope it keeps going. GREAT Thread - and thank you to everyone taking part in the Discussions. :) Absolutely TWK - quite agree! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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