New Zealand Gp.

[PHILIPRISING]

Hello does anyone on here hae a NZ GP progrmme cover scan they could possibly email me. Many thanks.......

 

WHAT'S your email address? Or email me at phil@pinegen.co.uk

[Barcroftlad]

Hi folks. Haven't been on for a while but just thought you might like to know the latest news about GP NZ 2014 as reported in our local media a few days ago. Try as I might I can't find a link online but the report said that this third GP just might be the last one for NZ. Promoter Bill Buckley has reportedly lost a million dollars plus in the two run so far. It goes on to say that they will probably need a crowd attendance of around 20,000 to justify him carrying on. I think last time was about 10/12,000 from memory and maybe 14,000 at the first one. The previous two had racing starting at 4pm due to local issues with Council over sound levels. This time it seems the racing will be in the evening and a couple of weeks later in early April. I will be there to help the numbers having bought my ticket at the early release about three months ago! Seasons greetings to all. Cheers.

[Guest]

Hi folks. Haven't been on for a while but just thought you might like to know the latest news about GP NZ 2014 as reported in our local media a few days ago. Try as I might I can't find a link online but the report said that this third GP just might be the last one for NZ. Promoter Bill Buckley has reportedly lost a million dollars plus in the two run so far. It goes on to say that they will probably need a crowd attendance of around 20,000 to justify him carrying on. I think last time was about 10/12,000 from memory and maybe 14,000 at the first one. The previous two had racing starting at 4pm due to local issues with Council over sound levels. This time it seems the racing will be in the evening and a couple of weeks later in early April. I will be there to help the numbers having bought my ticket at the early release about three months ago! Seasons greetings to all. Cheers.

 

It is essential we stay optimistic about the continuation of the GP in New Zealand and that Western Springs achieves the attendance target figure you mention.

Essentially, and sadly, New Zealand is no longer a speedway orientated country - there are three main solo motorcycle speedway tracks Moore Park, Oreti and Rosebank, but none run on a weekly basis. They are up against some 30 venues that run more regularly for various car formulas - and in some cases stage sidecar racing.

I have read elsewhere that Bill Buckley is involved in a venture for a World Sprint Car Championship with drivers from USA, New Zealand, Australia and possibly South Africa involved. But that does not mean he has turned his back on the solos - far from it according to overseas forums.

We must remain positive about the continuation of the GP in New Zealand and that the attendance in 2014 will influence Bill Buckley to continue his association with the GP for many years to come.

Edited December 30, 2013 by Guest

[waiheke1]

here's the article - was planning to post it myself.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11178564

i'm pretty sure it understates the attendance at the first GP - estimates at the time were around 17-20k, and that's from people who regularly attend western springs.

but can't see them getting 25k, especially with the stons playing the same night. I'll be there with my whanau, hoping very much it isnt the last nz gp, but if it is will still be thankful for the three years that Bill has brought it to NZ. Stoked its going to be later this year, so the latter heats should be under lights, which does make it a better spectatcle. hope also the track is better than last year and more in line ith the first year track.

really Bill B deservced much better support from auckland council and auckland/nz tourism - but motorspsorts doesn't seem to attract the same support from these bodies that a more gentile sport might.

very interested also in how much he has had to pay BSI for the priviledge of hosting the gp. given that he holds the lease to western springs stadium, the two makor expenses must be the bsi fee (hich to be fair needs to cover the cost of shippin riders and equipment etc to NZ, which can't be cheap - but i ould very much like to know how much cream bsi are milking from this) and the track preparation.

[PHILIPRISING]

SADLY the 2014 NZ GP will clash with an appearance by the Rolling Stones in Auckland on the same night. While genuine speedway or indeed motorcycling fans might still prefer the GP the visit of the Stones will undoubtedly impact on the GP. Last year the England cricket team were in town and the date clashed with several other motorcycle events across NZ.

 

Also, it has to be said that Bill Buckley and those he appoints to run events at Western Springs don't go overboard in promoting the speedway, which might help cut his losses. I am told that over 40,000 motorsport fans attend the Springs over Christmas but offers from the likes of Jason Bunyan to attend with his bikes and to promote the speedway were met with total indifference.

 

It is also true that Buckley hasn't had much support from the local authorities but he can be an abrasive character and his bull (or should that be Bill) in a China shop approach doesn't pay dividends.

 

Bill is a very rich man and no doubt his accountants work their magic but there is no doubt much of his enthusiasm for bringing the speedway GP (which he loves) to Western Springs (which he loves even more) was ruled by his ego and that may be waning

[Humphrey Appleby]

really Bill B deservced much better support from auckland council and auckland/nz tourism - but motorspsorts doesn't seem to attract the same support from these bodies that a more gentile sport might.

very interested also in how much he has had to pay BSI for the priviledge of hosting the gp. given that he holds the lease to western springs stadium, the two makor expenses must be the bsi fee (hich to be fair needs to cover the cost of shippin riders and equipment etc to NZ, which can't be cheap - but i ould very much like to know how much cream bsi are milking from this) and the track preparation.

I find it hard to imagine these sorts of GPs can even expect to break even without some sort of subsidy, and I'd guess that was always the key with the NZ GP. A shame as NZ is the sort of place that GPs should be held.

 

Interesting that the attendances seem to be revised downwards from what was originally reported.

SADLY the 2014 NZ GP will clash with an appearance by the Rolling Stones in Auckland on the same night.

Why on earth did the FIM/BSI/local organisers pick the same date, or at least not move the date once the Rolling Stones were known to be playing?

 

It is also true that Buckley hasn't had much support from the local authorities but he can be an abrasive character and his bull (or should that be Bill) in a China shop approach doesn't pay dividends.

Bill is a very rich man and no doubt his accountants work their magic but there is no doubt much of his enthusiasm for bringing the speedway GP (which he loves) to Western Springs (which he loves even more) was ruled by his ego and that may be waning

Two years ago his praises were being sung - 'right man for the job', 'can get things done', 'in it for the long-term' and so on... Now he seems to be being set up for a fall, so the plug can be quietly pulled on the NZ GP and BSI can move onto the next promoter with more money than sense. Edited December 30, 2013 by Humphrey Appleby

[PHILIPRISING]

SPEEDWAY date was fixed first and not that easy to change after flights, etc, have been booked.

 

Buckley isn't being set up for a fall. No one ever pretended that without him a SGP in NZ wouldn't have happened and he only ever had a three year contract. Having spent some time with him earlier this year, and gone on radio programmes to help garner support for his lease at Western Springs to be extended (which it has but only for a short period) I know how frustrated he gets with the local authorities and those trying to have motorsports banned at Western Springs in favour of the more tranquil cricket.

 

Unfortunately Bill can also be his own worst enemy, he isn't getting any younger, his wife has a big influence on him and he may just feel that he has now "been there and done that."

 

Humphrey, no one forces these promoters "with more money than sense" to stage SGP rounds, they do it of their own free will, and Bill went into it with his eyes wide open. But I know it is all run through his multi-million dollar business so I doubt whether his losses, large as they will be, are quite what is being suggested after his accountants have been at work.

[Guest]

There has been a recent makeover of the track at Western Springs, but I am not sure how this may affect the Speedway GP in April.

Obviously the work was not done with the NZGP in mind, and could only provide the eventual base for when speedway takes place there.

http://www.springsspeedway.com/news/articles/2013/11/20/track-gets-345-tonne-make-over

[Humphrey Appleby]

Humphrey, no one forces these promoters "with more money than sense" to stage SGP rounds, they do it of their own free will, and Bill went into it with his eyes wide open.

Of course no-one forces them, but it amazes me how otherwise successful businessmen are prepared to run what are very likely to be loss-masking events on such unfavourable terms. Yes, entrepreneurs need to take risks in business, but with the odd exceptions, sport rarely makes any money for its proprietors so needs to be run differently to most commercial enterprises.

 

BSI may not of course care that much as they can always replace NZ with yet another round in Poland, but ultimately burning promoters around the world is not good for the wider sport. Speedway needs to be run on a much more mutually cooperative basis if it's going to survive, and whilst no-one is going to continually underwrite loss-making events however the sport is run, the difference between loss and profit will be less.

 

But I know it is all run through his multi-million dollar business so I doubt whether his losses, large as they will be, are quite what is being suggested after his accountants have been at work.

No doubt, but losses are still losses however creative the accounting.

[f-s-p]

Of course no-one forces them, but it amazes me how otherwise successful businessmen are prepared to run what are very likely to be loss-masking events on such unfavourable terms. Yes, entrepreneurs need to take risks in business, but with the odd exceptions, sport rarely makes any money for its proprietors so needs to be run differently to most cog.

Dont you have a childhood dream you want see happen?

 

...And when the time comes, when you would basically be making more money while having a dump then 90 % of the forum members combined in a year... Would you honestly NOT make it happen?

[G the Bee]

 

It is essential we stay optimistic about the continuation of the GP in New Zealand and that Western Springs achieves the attendance target figure you mention.

 

....

 

We must remain positive about the continuation of the GP in New Zealand and that the attendance in 2014 will influence Bill Buckley to continue his association with the GP for many years to come.

 

With respect, why?

 

In my opinion, simply because of its timing, the New Zealand GP is an inconvenience the sport could do without. A GP on the other side of the world at exactly the time when the domestic leagues in Europe (and most specifically the Elite League) are starting up. The fact that this year's GP is two weeks later than last year's means even more disruption than before for some clubs.

 

Granted the impact on the Elite League is somewhat lessened this year because of the lack of GP riders in Britain this season but we will still have a situation where 5 of our 10 teams will have to manage the disruption of limited availability of their star riders until the latter part of the second week of April.

 

If New Zealand was a speedway hotbed then, perhaps, I could understand the need (and almost, perhaps, the entitlement) for them to have a GP and accept the disruption it causes. But the fact is that the glory days of New Zealand as a speedway nation as good as ended 20+ years ago when Larry Ross and Mitch Shirra (the last two international standard New Zealand riders) wound down their international careers.

Edited December 30, 2013 by G the Bee

[Guest]

 

It is essential we stay optimistic about the continuation of the GP in New Zealand and that Western Springs achieves the attendance target figure you mention.

 

We must remain positive about the continuation of the GP in New Zealand and that the attendance in 2014 will influence Bill Buckley to continue his association with the GP for many years to come.

 

 

 

With respect, why?

 

My reason is based on the fact that the GPs need to be as worldwide as possible and possibly where needed increase interest in speedway where it is needed. As it stands, the GPs are virtually a European competition spectatorwise. To have one in New Zealand is a move away from Europe, and hopefully a success there may in time lead to hold another GP in Australia - staged in conjunction with the NZ meeting.

Then who knows, perhaps Argentina, USA and even Canada could be slotted on to the same schedule?

Edited December 30, 2013 by Guest

[Humphrey Appleby]

Dont you have a childhood dream you want see happen?

...And when the time comes, when you would basically be making more money while having a dump then 90 % of the forum members combined in a year... Would you honestly NOT make it happen?

Nothing wrong with philanthropy, but no matter how much money I could throw away, I wouldn't be throwing it in the direction of a commercial company with little interest in the sport I liked. On the contrary, I'd be making approaches to other GP organisers with a view to running the show for the collective good of the sport.

If New Zealand was a speedway hotbed then, perhaps, I could understand the need (and almost, perhaps, the entitlement) for them to have a GP and accept the disruption it causes. But the fact is that the glory days of New Zealand as a speedway nation as good as ended 20+ years ago when Larry Ross and Mitch Shirra (the last two international standard New Zealand riders) wound down their international careers.

In fairness, New Zealand is as deserving of a GP as some countries in the series, and the series does need some non-European GPs if it's to be taken seriously as a World Championship.

 

It's indeed not ideal that it can't be organised outside of the European season, but there are 11 others that also fall into this category so it would be a unfair to single New Zealand out.

[Barcroftlad]

 

With respect, why?

 

In my opinion, simply because of its timing, the New Zealand GP is an inconvenience the sport could do without. A GP on the other side of the world at exactly the time when the domestic leagues in Europe (and most specifically the Elite League) are starting up. The fact that this year's GP is two weeks later than last year's means even more disruption than before for some clubs.

 

Granted the impact on the Elite League is somewhat lessened this year because of the lack of GP riders in Britain this season but we will still have a situation where 5 of our 10 teams will have to manage the disruption of limited availability of their star riders until the latter part of the second week of April.

 

If New Zealand was a speedway hotbed then, perhaps, I could understand the need (and almost, perhaps, the entitlement) for them to have a GP and accept the disruption it causes. But the fact is that the glory days of New Zealand as a speedway nation as good as ended 20+ years ago when Larry Ross and Mitch Shirra (the last two international standard New Zealand riders) wound down their international careers.

I believe that Bill Buckley knew exactly the risk that he was running when he put up his money to guarantee three GPs in NZ. From what I have read in different sources, including in here, that the possibliity of reviving a leg in Australia was also in the minds of the organisers. Sorry if it is inconvenient to you G the Bee but I can tell you that there were many old timers present at the two GPs run so far who, like me, have been starved of top class racing in NZ. It was lovely to see some old fellas struggling on their walking frames, determined to not miss a second of this treat we had. You are quite right in that the glory days as a speedway nation are behind us. For my own selfish part, Speedway racing is all about team racing which I grew up with, but when I chose a life down under I recognised there were things I couldn't bring with me. Something worth mentioning and that is the new track which Bill Buckley put in for the GP. Several riders who took the microphone at the meetings complimented Auckland on their track and the stadium, some even stating that it was the best track they had ever ridden. Cheers.

[PHILIPRISING]

Nothing wrong with philanthropy, but no matter how much money I could throw away, I wouldn't be throwing it in the direction of a commercial company with little interest in the sport I liked. On the contrary, I'd be making approaches to other GP organisers with a view to running the show for the collective good of the sport.

 

In fairness, New Zealand is as deserving of a GP as some countries in the series, and the series does need some non-European GPs if it's to be taken seriously as a World Championship.

 

It's indeed not ideal that it can't be organised outside of the European season, but there are 11 others that also fall into this category so it would be a unfair to single New Zealand out.

 

BUCKLEY wasn't throwing money in BSI's direction. He had a dream about staging a Speedway GP at his beloved Western Springs and was financially able to make it come true. He also bought his wife an Aston Martin which was probably not a financially sound idea either but it wasn't just throwing money at their Indian owners. He was to make her happy.

I believe that Bill Buckley knew exactly the risk that he was running when he put up his money to guarantee three GPs in NZ. From what I have read in different sources, including in here, that the possibliity of reviving a leg in Australia was also in the minds of the organisers. Sorry if it is inconvenient to you G the Bee but I can tell you that there were many old timers present at the two GPs run so far who, like me, have been starved of top class racing in NZ. It was lovely to see some old fellas struggling on their walking frames, determined to not miss a second of this treat we had. You are quite right in that the glory days as a speedway nation are behind us. For my own selfish part, Speedway racing is all about team racing which I grew up with, but when I chose a life down under I recognised there were things I couldn't bring with me. Something worth mentioning and that is the new track which Bill Buckley put in for the GP. Several riders who took the microphone at the meetings complimented Auckland on their track and the stadium, some even stating that it was the best track they had ever ridden. Cheers.

 

CORRECT. Last year there was inconsistency in the starting positions, largely as a result of the way the water ran off the track after watering, and hopefully that will be tackled and rectified in April. But the shape and size of the track and the actual surface was highly praised by the riders on both previous occasions.

[manchesterpaul]

Sorry but the impact of a Rolling Stones concert negatively impacting on the attendance of a SGP is wierd and farcical.

[Humphrey Appleby]

BUCKLEY wasn't throwing money in BSI's direction.

Would look to be paying a fair whack for the privilege, given how BSI's revenue in the region has jumped substantially.

 

He had a dream about staging a Speedway GP at his beloved Western Springs and was financially able to make it come true. He also bought his wife an Aston Martin which was probably not a financially sound idea either but it wasn't just throwing money at their Indian owners. He was to make her happy.

Sums up the wider problems in speedway really. Affluent businessmen in flights of fancy doing a wedge on a team or GP, but never considering the bigger picture of where the money is going.

[PHILIPRISING]

Would look to be paying a fair whack for the privilege, given how BSI's revenue in the region has jumped substantially.

 

 

Sums up the wider problems in speedway really. Affluent businessmen in flights of fancy doing a wedge on a team or GP, but never considering the bigger picture of where the money is going.

 

BIT like those throwing millions at F1 events

 

Sorry but the impact of a Rolling Stones concert negatively impacting on the attendance of a SGP is wierd and farcical.

 

NOT in Auckland ... already know of some who had intended going to the speedway but have now switched to the Stones

MIND you, looked online and tickets for the Stones start at £272! Might put a few off...

[The White Knight]

 

BIT like those throwing millions at F1 events

 

 

NOT in Auckland ... already know of some who had intended going to the speedway but have now switched to the Stones

MIND you, looked online and tickets for the Stones start at £272! Might put a few off...

 

 

Fancy giving up Speedway to watch some doddery old Pensioners, who should know better, staggering about on Stage making a right royal racket. It beggars belief.

 

There REALLY are some sad people in this World.

 

They also must have more money than sense.

[Humphrey Appleby]

BIT like those throwing millions at F1 events

Not comparable at all. Most F1 GPs are staged by consortia or national governments who do it for touristic reasons or to otherwise increase exposure for their countries. Even if they lose money on the actual events, there's a fair bit of analysis to demonstrate they make bigger returns indirectly.

 

In addition, GP hosts are not expected to ship all the cars, drivers and teams to their tracks. That's taken care of by Formula One Management, and what's more, 50% of the F1 revenue (maybe around $500 million) also goes to the teams. [This compares to about 6% of revenue being paid as prize money in the SGP which comes out of the 15% or so paid to the FIM.]

 

I'd guess the Welsh government sees the ~4 pound per spectator subsidy it pays BSI to stage the GP in Cardiff as being worthwhile in bringing business into the Welsh capital (and they may be right), but Cardiff is effectively a regional city that otherwise wouldn't be at the forefront of most peoples' minds in planning a visit. Cardiff is also promoted by BSI so presumably all the gate and programme money accrues to them.

 

By contrast, neither Auckland City Council nor the NZ government/tourist board seems to see speedway as being worthy of subsidy, so any local promoter has the double whammy of transport costs and staging fees to take into account.

 

NOT in Auckland ... already know of some who had intended going to the speedway but have now switched to the Stones

It isn't just about whether speedway fans might go to the Stones concert. All media attention will be on the Stones in the lead-up, and I'd think the chances of speedway getting much in the way of publicity will be virtually zero.