dontforgetthefueltapsbruv Posted September 9, 2012 Report Share Posted September 9, 2012 The current 38 match set up is too large and also has a skewed mix of matches given the difference in League Cup group sizes. KOC matches are rightly excluded as all clubs will not ride each other. Yet the southern teams only ride 4 of the other 12 clubs and cannot reach 38 matches and so will have to carry forward 2011 meetings. I would propose a reduction to 24 meetings and the use of League matches only for the 2013 start averages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bash Posted September 9, 2012 Report Share Posted September 9, 2012 I think that all competitive matches should count towards the averages as you are still riding against a premier league team. It's like in the elite league I'm sure play-off meetings don't count towards the riders averages. Why not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scaramanga Posted September 9, 2012 Report Share Posted September 9, 2012 dont think the rolling averages are a good thing as they are but it works for some and goes against others i think the reason the play offs dont count is because its classed as a little unfair that not all riders are taking part yet again theres winners and loosers in this the reason behind rolling averages is i believe it makes it harder for riders to manipulate there average Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
montie Posted September 9, 2012 Report Share Posted September 9, 2012 I think they work ok,a rider should be judged on his season performance i think ,not 12 meetings like before,being at 36 is a good reflection on a rider i think Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dontforgetthefueltapsbruv Posted September 9, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 9, 2012 (edited) i think the reason the play offs dont count is because its classed as a little unfair that not all riders are taking part yet again theres winners and loosers in this Hence my point about not using League Cup matches.The point from Bash re using ALL competitive has some merit - why exclude those in the KOC and not the League Cup. Edited September 9, 2012 by dontforgetthefueltapsbruv Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooksy Posted September 9, 2012 Report Share Posted September 9, 2012 Agreed. 38 matches is too many - takes too long for averages to fall in line with a rider's current ability, which is surely the point of them. But you need enough meetings to avoid distortion or manipulation through a brief spell of poor scores, for whatever reason?! 24 meetings seems about right IMO. And I don't see any reason why all competitive matches shouldn't count towards them. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crescent girl Posted September 9, 2012 Report Share Posted September 9, 2012 Disagree on change. While there will always be a case to moan "it ain't fair to us" in any system, rolling averages are the single best thing to arrive in UK speedway for years. At a stroke, they have ensured the abysmal malpractice of June 4th, 2010 will not be repeated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glasgowmicktiger Posted September 9, 2012 Report Share Posted September 9, 2012 Disagree on change. While there will always be a case to moan "it ain't fair to us" in any system, rolling averages are the single best thing to arrive in UK speedway for years. At a stroke, they have ensured the abysmal malpractice of June 4th, 2010 will not be repeated. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
george.m Posted September 9, 2012 Report Share Posted September 9, 2012 zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Hell hath no fury! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazc Posted September 9, 2012 Report Share Posted September 9, 2012 Disagree on change. While there will always be a case to moan "it ain't fair to us" in any system, rolling averages are the single best thing to arrive in UK speedway for years. At a stroke, they have ensured the abysmal malpractice of June 4th, 2010 will not be repeated. Oh dear the let's drag this up brigade have now manifested beyond the usual suspect's now, surely something more interesting has happened since then (or maybe not) seems everyone and there granny are experts on what happened or didn't and they are all in the know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crescent girl Posted September 9, 2012 Report Share Posted September 9, 2012 Oh, it happened all right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazc Posted September 9, 2012 Report Share Posted September 9, 2012 Oh, it happened all right. Why were you there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crescent girl Posted September 9, 2012 Report Share Posted September 9, 2012 Yes. Were you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazc Posted September 9, 2012 Report Share Posted September 9, 2012 Yes. Were you? Yes but for the Life off me i cannot understand why this keep's getting brought up yes it was embarrassing especially for us but it was over 2 years ago now, it really does get very very tiresome reading the same old same old,, I am sure nobody else has tried to manipulate the rules before or since then just big old bad Glasgow to be fair the stink that got kicked up about then was justified but do we need to keep harping on about it it does get rather boring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted September 9, 2012 Report Share Posted September 9, 2012 Yes but for the Life off me i cannot understand why this keep's getting brought up yes it was embarrassing especially for us but it was over 2 years ago now, it really does get very very tiresome reading the same old same old,,tbf, it's brought up as it's a good example of why we have rolling averages. I think 25ish meetings is about right, give or take a couple of meetings. I'd also have a 2 year/24 month cut off too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekker Posted September 9, 2012 Report Share Posted September 9, 2012 (edited) try 32 with all matches included. Edited September 9, 2012 by Dekker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
george.m Posted September 9, 2012 Report Share Posted September 9, 2012 Oh, it happened all right. If I remember right the majority if not all (I stand to be corrected) Glasgow fans on BSF were, utterly appalled and embarrassed by what happened and said so on here. We didn't hold back and riders and promotion got both barrels. What is becoming tiresome is the selective memory of some on here (not suggesting you) and others who weren't members at the time assuming otherwise (not suggesting you). The Glasgow fans on here really don't need their noses rubbing in the dirt, we felt the hurt more than anyone else. Trust me! You're pushing at an open door. If you weren't on here at the time, trust me we really weren't happy and made that quite clear. We paid good money and transport costs to get to Armadale too! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigeddiechek Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 It's all systemic when it comes to averages. I agree that 24 is a sensible figure. Although, I would like to point out, that average is, well, a pretty average function. We could be more sophisticated, or we could just bin them altogether. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YAMYAMBANDIT Posted September 11, 2012 Report Share Posted September 11, 2012 try 32 with all matches included. Question ? What happens when a rider rides in all 3 leagues, Elite, Premier & National DEVELOPMENT League. Which rolling aversge do you apply, or as it is a rolling average, should all points scored in each League by added together and averaged out. NL scores 15 points, PL scores 8, EL scores 4 totals 27, rolling average becomes a 9 ave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigeddiechek Posted September 12, 2012 Report Share Posted September 12, 2012 You would take the average of each average, then the average of that, if you know what I mean? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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