Haza Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 For a start I'd prefer our own rider rather than a guest, but in addition to that it seems double up guests may well qualify on their PL average (although thats not completely clear) in which case Lawson's average will be too high. let Kozza get race fit first at Berwick before we use him - Lawson elite league average fits that's all I know he would be an awsome guest against the Pussycats point to prove and all that . If we can use him he'd be my choice . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starboy118 Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 let Kozza get race fit first at Berwick before we use him - Lawson elite league average fits that's all I know he would be an awsome guest against the Pussycats point to prove and all that . If we can use him he'd be my choice . So much for an Elite league. Talking about having to use guests already and the season is still two months away. Pathetic. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluPanther Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 So much for an Elite league. Talking about having to use guests already and the season is still two months away. Pathetic. The elite lge has been watered down so much, you can hardly taste the flavour anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irk Deflector Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 let Kozza get race fit first at Berwick before we use him - Lawson elite league average fits that's all I know he would be an awsome guest against the Pussycats point to prove and all that . If we can use him he'd be my choice . Richard Lawson would be an excellent guest for KL or any other team at Peterborough. Should be an interesting encounter given your top fours experience of the EOS track. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haza Posted January 27, 2013 Report Share Posted January 27, 2013 So much for an Elite league. Talking about having to use guests already and the season is still two months away. Pathetic. so I'm pathetic lets just look at this is du rider first priority is to his PL club Berwick have a meeting Good Friday so what do we do ?? maybe run with 6 riders then?? Or go with a guest maybe mm looks like a guest could be the answer I've tried to keep this simple for you . I don't make the rules guess we could have built the team with no du in side but we have 2 in Smith and Stead clashing with there PL clubs is going to happen so think you will have to get used to guests . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagpuss Posted January 27, 2013 Report Share Posted January 27, 2013 (edited) I don't think he's having a go at you, more the system and I have to say he has a point. This year there will probably be more riders than ever turning out for teams they have no affinity or connection to with three double up spots available per team and no double up 'partners'. The situation is crying out for a squad system of some sort eg having a squad of ten to cover for reserves and / or double uppers when they aren't available. For example at Lynn we could have Olly Allen, Lasse Bjerre and Alex Davies in the squad with team kevlars ready to step in should Stead, Alden or Kozza be unavailable for any reason. Not too dissimilar to the double up system as it has been but there should be no guests or R/R allowed outside your squad for second strings and reserves. Edited January 27, 2013 by Bagpuss 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starboy118 Posted January 28, 2013 Report Share Posted January 28, 2013 so I'm pathetic lets just look at this is du rider first priority is to his PL club Berwick have a meeting Good Friday so what do we do ?? maybe run with 6 riders then?? Or go with a guest maybe mm looks like a guest could be the answer I've tried to keep this simple for you . I don't make the rules guess we could have built the team with no du in side but we have 2 in Smith and Stead clashing with there PL clubs is going to happen so think you will have to get used to guests . No, that is most definitely not what I meant. I think the situation is pathetic and contributes to people turning away from the sport. I personally got fed up to the back teeth with seeing guests and r.r. just about every week and is one of the reasons why I hardly ever go anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC2 Posted January 29, 2013 Report Share Posted January 29, 2013 ................. but there should be no guests or R/R allowed outside your squad for second strings and reserves. So a four man team if your six squad riders aren't available? Not so bright eh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagpuss Posted January 29, 2013 Report Share Posted January 29, 2013 No need for that last remark really was there? The idea would be to plan the fixtures so there are as few clashes as possible and to pick riders who aren't riding on the same night all the time. If its another wet summer with umpteen rain offs and lots of rearranged fixtures then there'd have to be contingencies of course but having six squad members unavailable should be avoidable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted January 29, 2013 Report Share Posted January 29, 2013 No, that is most definitely not what I meant. I think the situation is pathetic and contributes to people turning away from the sport. I personally got fed up to the back teeth with seeing guests and r.r. just about every week and is one of the reasons why I hardly ever go anymore. Guests have always been the norm in our dangerous sport, has never put me off, I'm betting you're just one of those people who have fallen out of love with speedway after many years of support and this is just one of the excuses you put forward?? Although like most, you can't let it go completely or you wouldn't be on here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveLyric2 Posted January 29, 2013 Report Share Posted January 29, 2013 Seems like Matt Ford's proposal for a squad system should have got more support after all!!! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
500cc Posted January 29, 2013 Report Share Posted January 29, 2013 Guests have always been the norm in our dangerous sport Absolutely. Not ideal, but there aren't many alternatives. A squad system wouldn't eliminate it and would bring different issues. What is so wrong is that in January we already know meetings where teams will be running three guests, and that's before we look at covering injuries. This is a very important year for the sport (recessions, Sky contract), and they've managed to create that situation. Dreadful administrative management. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagpuss Posted January 29, 2013 Report Share Posted January 29, 2013 Ah yes Skidder, but Uncle Matt wanted a system where riders who don't race over here could fly in and out as they pleased when it suited them just to pick up a few extra meetings. I'm talking about a system to cover the lower ends of teams, particularly double uppers. While guests will always be necessary when a side suffers multiple injuries its a joke, as others have said, to be planning ahead for guests two months in advance, and is open to abuse with track specialists around. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
500cc Posted January 29, 2013 Report Share Posted January 29, 2013 Seems like Matt Ford's proposal for a squad system should have got more support after all!!! And there in lies the problem with Matt Ford. I actually think he is one of the people who could help make this sport better, but he is too focused on making it better for his own club. And now it appears he’s lost the trust of other promoters who no longer appear to be backing his ideas. He went to the press about how Holder and Ward needed to job share, how it would get Crump back into the EL etc. Did he mention double-uppers? Did he mention PL riders? I don’t think so. What he was actually after were rule changes allowing rides to pick and choose when they rode in the UK. It was about managing the top riders workload. That was all he was interested in. It was about rides not riding in the UK and the threat of Holder or Ward choosing not to. Did he once discuss the problem of guests for the riders committed to the UK who get injured? Matt Ford’s ideas are always based on self-interest and are played out publicly Of course his first priority is his own club and that’s fine, but constantly trying to get one over the other clubs is another matter. Clubs need to work together if the sport is to survive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC2 Posted January 29, 2013 Report Share Posted January 29, 2013 No need for that last remark really was there? The idea would be to plan the fixtures so there are as few clashes as possible and to pick riders who aren't riding on the same night all the time. If its another wet summer with umpteen rain offs and lots of rearranged fixtures then there'd have to be contingencies of course but having six squad members unavailable should be avoidable. No, you're right. I apologise. I like your squad idea & anything that encourages rider/club loyalty but it wouldn't work unless (i) all EL matches were on a Wednesday/Thursday & all PL on Fri/Sat/Sun, (ii) the PL riders were fairly shared between the EL clubs, & longer term (iii) annual equalisation should be tempered with greater rider retention, possibly by allowing three year contracts for riders & their increased averages being ignored for team building. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g13webb Posted January 29, 2013 Report Share Posted January 29, 2013 Seems like Matt Ford's proposal for a squad system should have got more support after all!!! No, Matt Ford didn't want a squad system, for the benefit the sport in general, he just wanted to use his top two riders as his joint No 1. The squad system could be very beneficial as long as it was done correctly and was fair to all clubs. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluPanther Posted January 29, 2013 Report Share Posted January 29, 2013 No, Matt Ford didn't want a squad system, for the benefit the sport in general, he just wanted to use his top two riders as his joint No 1. The squad system could be very beneficial as long as it was done correctly and was fair to all clubs. Agreed, if he had proposed a squad system for the reserve berths, to include at least one British rider in each team, then maybe he would have won support for his idea. As it was, the motive behind it was self interest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveLyric2 Posted January 29, 2013 Report Share Posted January 29, 2013 And there in lies the problem with Matt Ford. I actually think he is one of the people who could help make this sport better, but he is too focused on making it better for his own club. And now it appears he’s lost the trust of other promoters who no longer appear to be backing his ideas. He went to the press about how Holder and Ward needed to job share, how it would get Crump back into the EL etc. Did he mention double-uppers? Did he mention PL riders? I don’t think so. What he was actually after were rule changes allowing rides to pick and choose when they rode in the UK. It was about managing the top riders workload. That was all he was interested in. It was about rides not riding in the UK and the threat of Holder or Ward choosing not to. Did he once discuss the problem of guests for the riders committed to the UK who get injured? Matt Ford’s ideas are always based on self-interest and are played out publicly Of course his first priority is his own club and that’s fine, but constantly trying to get one over the other clubs is another matter. Clubs need to work together if the sport is to survive. ...and of course there is no self-interest at all, if a proposal comes from any other Promoter!!!?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagpuss Posted January 29, 2013 Report Share Posted January 29, 2013 Of course there is, with no independant governance its dog eat dog. But Matty boy is the one who goes squealing to the media just before the AGM with all his big ideas. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveLyric2 Posted January 29, 2013 Report Share Posted January 29, 2013 Of course there is, with no independant governance its dog eat dog. But Matty boy is the one who goes squealing to the media just before the AGM with all his big ideas. At least he has some big ideas, unlike some of his small-minded colleagues, who continue to push the top level of the sport down to its lowest common denominator!! Maybe - just maybe - his squad proposal might have kept Sky a bit more interested?!! (Apologies for this on the KL thread!) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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