LagutaRacingFan Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 The danes are not using the young riders, They are using their form riders. Iversen and Pedersen are 2 of the best riders in the world Jepsen Jensen is a better rider at this moment than the likes of Bjerre,Bjarne and Andersen Madsen has been in stunning form for Tarnow and his Swedish side. Just because Bjerre,Bjarne and Andersen who have been terrible this season doesn't make the Danish side a young team, The trio of GP riders are in poor form and they would be out of there depth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G the Bee Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 Glad someone agrees. Sadly there is no quick fix to get results we all want but unless gb starts giving the young ones a chance gb will end up struggling in the qualifiers anyway But lets not forget that the Danes didn't just throw random yougsters into the competition. Both MBJ and MJJ have proved that they have the ability to beat the worlds best consistently on the continental tracks. We don't have a youngster anywhere near that level. The biggest problem for GB is that only Harris and Woffinden have stepped up to anything near international level since Scott Nicholls and Lee Richardson made the step up over ten years ago. Tonight showed that once we move away from the confines of British tracks, we have two international level riders and nothing else. If we had two other riders at the same level as Harris and Woffinden it would make all the difference. We would have been there or therabouts tonight. The fact is, we shouldn't be relying on a rider like Nicholls (who is clearly past his best) to score big in these events. Just like the Danes do not need to rely on Hans Andersen any more. Over the last ten years, we have been let down by the inability of riders like Stead, Howe, Allen and, more latterly Kennett, Barker and Bridger to make the step up. Whether this is down to a lack of ability/desire/commitment who knows. Bridger won't move away from his comfort zone at Eastbourne. He tried it for a season, struggled, went back the following year and has stayed there this year. Barker spends half his time pinching proverbial sweets off kids in the PL. Kennett had a poor 2010, is having a dire 2012 but had a good 2011. The problem is, the 'silencergate' events have, in my opinion, put a huge question marks over those results. I would love to see Roynon and Auty in the team next year but they really need to get themselves fixed up on the continent first. 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaptooth Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 But lets not forget that the Danes didn't just throw random yougsters into the competition. Both MBJ and MJJ have proved that they have the ability to beat the worlds best consistently on the continental tracks. We don't have a youngster anywhere near that level. The biggest problem for GB is that only Harris and Woffinden have stepped up to anything near international level since Scott Nicholls and Lee Richardson made the step up over ten years ago. Tonight showed that once we move away from the confines of British tracks, we have two international level riders and nothing else. If we had two other riders at the same level as Harris and Woffinden it would make all the difference. We would have been there or therabouts tonight. The fact is, we shouldn't be relying on a rider like Nicholls (who is clearly past his best) to score big in these events. Just like the Danes do not need to rely on Hans Andersen any more. Over the last ten years, we have been let down by the inability of riders like Stead, Howe, Allen and, more latterly Kennett, Barker and Bridger to make the step up. Whether this is down to a lack of ability/desire/commitment who knows. Bridger won't move away from his comfort zone at Eastbourne. He tried it for a season, struggled, went back the following year and has stayed there this year. Barker spends half his time pinching proverbial sweets off kids in the PL. Kennett had a poor 2010, is having a dire 2012 but had a good 2011. The problem is, the 'silencergate' events have, in my opinion, put a huge question marks over those results. I would love to see Roynon and Auty in the team next year but they really need to get themselves fixed up on the continent first. Very intelligent post 100% Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandorum Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 We won't ever see riders coming through the system until we reorganise our league system to give them opportunities at all levels instead of doing it for everybody else. Auty, Roynon and co will never be that level unless they first make the grade at the top (albeit weak) level here and then abroad like MJJ, Zmarzlik, Dudek and a host of other foreigners have done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G the Bee Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 We won't ever see riders coming through the system until we reorganise our league system to give them opportunities at all levels instead of doing it for everybody else. Auty, Roynon and co will never be that level unless they first make the grade at the top (albeit weak) level here and then abroad like MJJ, Zmarzlik, Dudek and a host of other foreigners have done. I can see it going further than that. Go back to the time of Olsen and Mauger up until the late 80s/early 90s. A rider knew that he had to race in GB to make it at the highest level. That is no longer the case and has not been for a while. Gollob and Holta were the first of the modern generation to prove you did not need GB (althougn Gollob did a couple of seasons over here) to succeed at international level. I can see a time when a young British rider who truly has desire to be the best abandons the UK league network at an early age and goes straight to Poland and works his way up through their league system. Learning the language, learning the set-ups (which we clearly lag behind on) making the contacts etc just as Mauger, Olsen and countless others who followed them did. Just like, I imagine, Emil Sayfutdinov did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedy den boy Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 plus points for team GB 1-WOFFINDEN-sheer delight on his face when he won that joker ride,looks like he really wants to do well for GB ,although he spent a fair chunk of time growing up in Australia. 2-C.HARRIS -seems on the pace with the very best . minus points 1.S NICHOLLS -Been great for the team in the past,but when you cant be asked to bring your best bikes from the uk is quite frankly not on and someone from the management back up team should have said if you dont bring your best gear over,dont come .The machines he was using were last seasons swedish bikes and although they might have been updated they clearly were not fast enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacques Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 I can see it going further than that. Go back to the time of Olsen and Mauger up until the late 80s/early 90s. A rider knew that he had to race in GB to make it at the highest level. That is no longer the case and has not been for a while. Gollob and Holta were the first of the modern generation to prove you did not need GB (althougn Gollob did a couple of seasons over here) to succeed at international level. I can see a time when a young British rider who truly has desire to be the best abandons the UK league network at an early age and goes straight to Poland and works his way up through their league system. Learning the language, learning the set-ups (which we clearly lag behind on) making the contacts etc just as Mauger, Olsen and countless others who followed them did. Just like, I imagine, Emil Sayfutdinov did. Another great post! The bit i've highlighted is the bit that gets me. We have one rider in the GP series and as far as I understand it, he has no idea about what is going on with his bikes? He gets off it when a race is done and leaves it to his mechanics......... Now, look at the World champions recently. Gollob is the one that springs to mind. He knows as soon as he's got on his bike what the issue are, one duff heat and he was sorted tonight. He always fiddling and changing things on his bikes...I thought it would be a requisite to know your bike? That said Martin Smolinski boasts himself a mechanical engineering background .. We a falling behind nationally and internationally and we have nobody to blame but ourselves! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billybikespeedway Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 looked like it worked out pretty good for the danes. Imo what Britain needs is youth speedway and speedway schools, but since there is no(?) 80cc tracks and most (?) teams are owned by promoters it probably isn't likely. The BSPA missed the Chance of Buying Newport When the Malletts Pulled out, A track With No Restrictions No Curfew ,Available 7 days a week ( weather permiting ) Track time unlimited Gb Coach Phil Morris Close By , But No to much self interest in their own clubs,than to see the way forward for British Speedway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spanner47 Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 Love those Danes when they're being interviewed (naughty boys), and thanks to sky for leaving Ms W at home, made the show much more watchable. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bumb1e Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 I think the Danes did really well, after Gollob was excluded in the first heat, you could tell it was going to be their night. Iversen has really found the right set up this year, I hope it's not just a one-off season for him and he can go on and get even better, always thought he would be a good rider. But when he dropped out of the GP's he got lost a little bit. Pedersen was his usual out the gate and gone, they need to change Madsen before the final, I would bring Bjerre in. He looked good when I saw him guesting for Lynn against Cov. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EC Rides Again Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 I can see it going further than that. Go back to the time of Olsen and Mauger up until the late 80s/early 90s. A rider knew that he had to race in GB to make it at the highest level. That is no longer the case and has not been for a while. Gollob and Holta were the first of the modern generation to prove you did not need GB (althougn Gollob did a couple of seasons over here) to succeed at international level. I can see a time when a young British rider who truly has desire to be the best abandons the UK league network at an early age and goes straight to Poland and works his way up through their league system. Learning the language, learning the set-ups (which we clearly lag behind on) making the contacts etc just as Mauger, Olsen and countless others who followed them did. Just like, I imagine, Emil Sayfutdinov did. But lets not forget that the Danes didn't just throw random yougsters into the competition. Both MBJ and MJJ have proved that they have the ability to beat the worlds best consistently on the continental tracks. We don't have a youngster anywhere near that level. The biggest problem for GB is that only Harris and Woffinden have stepped up to anything near international level since Scott Nicholls and Lee Richardson made the step up over ten years ago. Tonight showed that once we move away from the confines of British tracks, we have two international level riders and nothing else. If we had two other riders at the same level as Harris and Woffinden it would make all the difference. We would have been there or therabouts tonight. The fact is, we shouldn't be relying on a rider like Nicholls (who is clearly past his best) to score big in these events. Just like the Danes do not need to rely on Hans Andersen any more. Over the last ten years, we have been let down by the inability of riders like Stead, Howe, Allen and, more latterly Kennett, Barker and Bridger to make the step up. Whether this is down to a lack of ability/desire/commitment who knows. Bridger won't move away from his comfort zone at Eastbourne. He tried it for a season, struggled, went back the following year and has stayed there this year. Barker spends half his time pinching proverbial sweets off kids in the PL. Kennett had a poor 2010, is having a dire 2012 but had a good 2011. The problem is, the 'silencergate' events have, in my opinion, put a huge question marks over those results. I would love to see Roynon and Auty in the team next year but they really need to get themselves fixed up on the continent first. Spot (and indeed) On GB is becoming an increasingly irrelevant backwater as far as the development of world class riders is concerned. The best young Poles and other Eastern Europeans like Vaculik see no need to come here to ride apart from a few token meetings to gain a little experience of smaller tracks when they feel like it. The Aussies have learned the basics and plenty more before they arrive at Heathrow and see the motherland as a stepping stone to the riches on offer in Poland and Sweden. Only the most committed young Aussies travel half way round the world.They realise it's do or die to make a career when they get here. The Danes have a well structured ladder taking kids from 80CC up to league racing so that they emerge at 16/17 as fully fledged quality riders and they arrive in GB to ride at PL level as there are so many of them that they need the opportunity to ride somewhere/anywhere! Despite the best efforts of Morris and co there is no real structure for Youth development here, it's all piecemeal and hand to mouth at best. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fentiger888 Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 Think we just have to face it we are miles and miles behind australia poland denmark & sweden. Firstly middlo should go, things have moved on from the 90s, hes decision to leave nicholls in and take king out was the final straw, nicholls is past world championship standard with no ambition left where king still has desire and wants to go further and by taking him out of the last ride will only knock the lads confidence further after a very hard night for him and middlo had nothing to gain by that move, terrible team management, id say a good GB manager would be someone like phil morris, sean wilson or if we could pick anyone gary havelock would be the man for the job, he been there done it got the t-shirt, he has plenty of bulldog git and passion and knows current day racing. Tonight just showed how far off the pace we are, IF harris was in the australian danish or polish team he would just be a average middle man in the team yet he is our leader and the one we rely on and turn too!!! Many years of poor standard club promoters in the british leagues and no help from the british authorities are now showing the gulf in talent between us and other countries and sadly too many of the young british lads only concern is money money money, the bridgers, barkers steads etc spend to much time thinking about how much they are earning and flashing it around rather than concentrating on how to take their career forward then reaping the benifits further down the line!!!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 I get a bit bored of our annual post SWC autopsy........... its the same old story every year.... except for a visible slight loss of ground..... which lets face it has been happening since the early 80's It isnt Middlo's fault..... or any other previous manager's ............. and I'm starting to see that it isn't the riders' fault either The issue lies with the BSPA and has done for decades......... the league rules dont encourage grass roots growth...... and a determined governing body would have found a way by now to emulate a successful program like the Danish 80cc's............. it is never going to be good enough to just have one or two guys committed to what ultimately is a lost cause the moment Tenerife decides it is (ie the year later)... it has to be something that everyone is committed to and has a long term plan 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigFatDave Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 I'm sure all true Speedway Fans will join together in the Back the Brits campaign to support young riders. I'm equally positive the vast majority who've been mouthing off on here about the poor state of UK Speedway won't put their hands in their pockets, even to buy a 50P sticker, to help those lads on the Darren & Sharon Boocock Scholarship who are making a determined effort to improve themselves by giving up the delights of a British Winter to slog away under sunny skies in far away Australia. These boys learn everything from the ground up: from building and maintaining a bike to washing it down afterwards - a la Gollob - and their determination to succeed is evident in their results, making those of us who support them Downunder extremely happy with the return on our investment. All you have to do is put your money where your mouth is - remember, Money Talks, Bulldust Walks. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougieD Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 The records getting worn out now. Every time we fail the "we need to change it from roots up" brigade start and they are 100% right. But posting on here everytime is getting boring. Whats it going to change, nothing at all.Maybe if somebody got a pettition going at each track with signitures galore & then it getting presented a month before the AGM it might have some effect, but I doubt it. We are in the hands of the money grabbing, self interest only promoters & I feel always will be. They dont care about the national team, they can only see to the end of there own car parks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 They dont care about the national team, they can only see to the end of there own car parks Surely they have to be concerned about their own car parks cos if they don't get the fans in they shut? If our stadiums were owned akin to Denmark, Sweden, Poland and I guess Russia then british speedway would be in a better position I think. I was disappointed to hear the brits say again that when the track went slicker they went backwards, surely they need to work out how to go forward and concentrate on gating technique, is it rocket science? There is probably something in the weight of the rider factor too ...... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ytsejam Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 against the rules 1 joker OR tac sub NOT both unless you come in as a tac sub / joker How come Harris came in for King in heat 18 then?!..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wjm Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 This might be nonsense, but IMO, a big issue with the Brits is the mechanical setup, they seem to be sadly lacking, especially when the track changes. Seemed to happen in both the Lynn meeting and last night, once the track shifted from what they had been performing well on they seemed to start going backwards. I know this is a small thing, and perhaps it was some sort of reverse psychology going on, but Harris said something like “I thought I had the right setup, but I didn’t, but it is working anyway so I won’t change it”, while he was going well, it seemed a strange thing to say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fentiger888 Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 Bigfatdave your comment is way off the mark, it is not up to us supporters to throw money at it, that is the authorities & promoters job to run their business and make it a success of it, they should set up youth system to benifit their own business and grow their asset base instead of filling their teams with every nation bar brits and paying well over the odds to do so!!! As supporters we all pay enough, we pay decent money to get it, most chip in buying raffle tickets, club or rider hats coats etc, we chip in to the SRBF, we do more than enough! The authorities & promoters show us no future system so why should we do their job for them just to cover over the cracks, look the the GPs they have came in, got big sponsors on board, promoted it correctly and made it a very good product. Sadly to many clubs are run by businessmen who see it as their little hobbie for 1 day a week although sum promoters do run it as business full time and guess what they are the doing ok! You moan at us supporters to put our money where our mouth is but may i ask how much do the authorities and club promoters invest Into this scheme! For too long now speedway has been run people who are out of touch of what modern day speedway needs and acting like little kids not wanting to share their toys with only their own interests at heart not seeing the damage they are causing to british speedway overall and when and if british speedway completely falls apart they will blame it all on the supporters by saying not enough people came through the gates! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevebrum Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 The danes are not using the young riders, They are using their form riders. They are using their young riders . mikkel B will be back for Saturday in place of Madsen i reckon. Plus they are doing the right thing. Mikkel and MJJ are 2 stars of the future. In fact stroke that they are already doing it on the World stage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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