orion Posted July 10, 2012 Report Share Posted July 10, 2012 There should be reserve no questions about it especially since it's very dangerous sport and injuries are common in don't know what they were thinking when they came out with that idea. i Think most fans see it that way it's just common sense . A rider will get injured early doors in one these meetings it's just matter of time it might even happen this week . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spanner47 Posted July 11, 2012 Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 Imagine this scenario. 1st heat a rider get injured and is the innocent party, the other rider gets excluded, but we start with a 2 rider race. It's going to happen sooner or later, for christs sake bring back the res. As for the joke, no wonder there's no mention of the SWC on the BBC sport website, unless it's tucked away with the tiddly winks world championship somewhere and i cant find it. This is a great sport, but it gets no coverage (and is treated as a joke) because of things like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grachan Posted July 11, 2012 Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 Each team should have a reserve who can only take a max of two rides at anytime in the meeting, so not only them a chane to replace the injured rider also stops the kind of stunt the poles pulled in the final the other year ..i expect it won't change thou intill something like the above happens . Something like this did happen before, but reserves were allowed then. 1989 World Team Cup Final - all 4 riders in the opening heat were wiped out of the rest of the meeting. You'd think they would learn from history in case it happened again. I like the "substitute" idea that was raised earlier. That works well. The Joker is ridiculous and in many cases (eg Poland winning a few years back and Russia on Saturday) grossly unfair on the team that wins on track. It's the daftest rule. Exactly. If it was any team but GB that pulled that stroke this thread would have reached ten pages by now. I'm not so sure about that. It's a regular thing for it to be used in that way. Australia would have done exactly the same had the race line-up been different or they felt it was worth waiting. But, yes, allowing not only a Joker but a TS at the same time does make it ridiculous and you can get a 6 point swing in one race rather than 3 points with a straight Joker and wipe out your deficit in one go. It's crazy really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_minall Posted July 11, 2012 Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 A quality point was made by David Howe over twitter - he said that the Joker shouldn't be allowed unless you are 8 points behind - that way you can't pull back the entire deficit in 1 race. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grachan Posted July 11, 2012 Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 A quality point was made by David Howe over twitter - he said that the Joker shouldn't be allowed unless you are 8 points behind - that way you can't pull back the entire deficit in 1 race. Nope. Would still be daft. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevebrum Posted July 11, 2012 Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 Anyone watching tbe racing we have seen in the SWC will not be thinking its a knockout, they'll be thinking bloody great racing. I don't like the rule but it's a minor irritation in an otherwise phenomenal competition. Absolutely spot on. A quality point was made by David Howe over twitter - he said that the Joker shouldn't be allowed unless you are 8 points behind - that way you can't pull back the entire deficit in 1 race. If it has to be in then 8 points should be the minimum. How a team 6 down can potentially draw level in one race is plain crazy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noggin Posted July 11, 2012 Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 (edited) i Think most fans see it that way it's just common sense . A rider will get injured early doors in one these meetings it's just matter of time it might even happen this week . If say for example Gollob is ruled out after his first ride, why not just say the remaining 3 riders take his rides, (rider must withdraw from meeting through Injury, not some fake headache or whatever). No need for an extra man in the pits. A quality point was made by David Howe over twitter - he said that the Joker shouldn't be allowed unless you are 8 points behind - that way you can't pull back the entire deficit in 1 race. I have often found this bizarre, if they want to keep the joker, it shouldn't have the effect of rendering the leading teams advantage gone in one race. Its about getting you back into contention, not all of sudden coming from nowhere to lead the meeting.... Edited July 11, 2012 by noggin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook Posted July 11, 2012 Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 Be careful what you wish for..... Any self respecting fan of sport, of course wouldnt choose to have rules that were used in 'its a knockout' .... but the simple fact of the matter is that we've just had two fantastic and nailbiting opening rounds. I'm sure that wasnt purely down to the tactical rules, but they certainly allow for what they are designed to ...and that is to allow something to be ridden for, so heads dont go down half way through the meeting because a team is adrift I tend to agree with others about it being 8 points....... another solution is to stop combining the joker with the tactical ...which would make things harder but even then after these opening two rounds I cant disagree that what is in place is good for the sport Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie B Posted July 11, 2012 Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 I have said on this forum for many years, that the joker should be either scrapped or all teams to have a joker, which (nowadays) to be used between heats 5-16. Why can't all teams have a reserve that could be used just like in the old World Team Cup and numerous four team tournaments, in the past. Allowing the reserve to ride at any time. This would stop a team getting a rider to feign an injury. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orion Posted July 11, 2012 Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 If say for example Gollob is ruled out after his first ride, why not just say the remaining 3 riders take his rides, (rider must withdraw from meeting through Injury, not some fake headache or whatever). No need for an extra man in the pits. For simple reason how do you know when someone is hurt and not fakeing it to gain an advantage ? For example King falls in his first ride and says is arm hurts and he can't ride any more and then the better riders take the rest of his rides . You got to get the balance right between letting someone replace a injured rider but at the same time not letting that side gain an advantage by doing so ..the idea about having two reserves who can take a max of two rides each sounds perfect . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stoneylegend Posted July 11, 2012 Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 For what its worth im out when it comes to the Joker and not because it played against us at KL on Monday, it would be far easier to have no handicap if your behind, however i understand the reasons for this ie telly, keeping the meeting close etc....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noggin Posted July 11, 2012 Report Share Posted July 11, 2012 For simple reason how do you know when someone is hurt and not fakeing it to gain an advantage ? For example King falls in his first ride and says is arm hurts and he can't ride any more and then the better riders take the rest of his rides . You got to get the balance right between letting someone replace a injured rider but at the same time not letting that side gain an advantage by doing so ..the idea about having two reserves who can take a max of two rides each sounds perfect . Unlikely to happen then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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