Gp Practice

[The Know]

NEXT year practice will start at 6pm on the Friday preceding race day except in Auckland where (subject to confirmation) it will be at 3pm because of noise constraints.

 

Wouldn't disagree that practice can be (is) boring but it is for the benefit of the riders and to a lesser degree track staff and TV companies and not the public. There were numerous examples last season when riders who didn't practice fared better than those that did but, trust me, any suggestions to curtail practice have been vigorously opposed by the riders.

 

Efforts to introduce some form of timing to practice have and will continue to be looked at but how riders would be rewarded remains an open discussion.

 

I appreciate what The Know is suggesting but it simply isn't practical for riders to travel to a GP and be eliminated before the event has even begun. That was the major bone of contention with the knock-out format used a few years ago. I can still remember Greg Hancock turning up for the opening round at Prague in 1998 as the defending World Champion and packing his bags after just two races.

 

Competing in the GP is a huge commitment for riders and they need to know that they will at least have five races (and the appropriate TV time) in every round. It is on that basis that they try and sell themselves to sponsors. I am sure Meridian Lifts would much rather back a rider who was guaranteed exposure rather than be involved in a sort of Russian roulette system.

 

There have even been thoughts of holding practice on a Saturday morning. That would be fine if speedway tracks were concrete rather than dirt and wouldn't suffer the inevitable damage that practice (equivalent to over two full meetings) incurs.

 

I know what you are saying but practice has to have a meaning. Even if it is gate pick for the fastest riders on race day. Transponders are the way to go as i have said for years. This would also remove the stupid red line on the finish line for a close heat and the stop watch timing which is not accuarate.

Regarding the advertizment on a rider it is a package of both domestic and sgp, which if a rider is hurt early on you will lose most of this for the year unless you do several riders. To us this would not hurt income as speedway generates none and never really has, its a fun thing.

 

I still believe the sgp is the best thing for speedway but it needs new ideas and staff like they had in the past to push if forwards and not backwards.

Edited December 12, 2011 by The Know

[Humphrey Appleby]

I still believe the sgp is the best thing for speedway but it needs new ideas and staff like they had in the past to push if forwards and not backwards.

 

Interesting. The official line is that the 'old' BSI had taken things as far as they could, and IMG would take the SGP to a higher level.

 

To be honest, although individual racing is not my thing, I wouldn't have any objections if the SGP developed into a standalone circus. However, it still seems miles away from that.

 

Pretty unbelievable that transponders are still not being used as its cheap and well proven technology now.

 

Also, Programmes are printed, signage prepared, TV graphics... I can think of various reasons why it wouldn't work as far as a SGP is concerned.

 

I don't see that as being a real argument. When the knockout format was used, the fans and television never knew who was going to be in which heat. They had to get out their pens and write in the riders names themselves (and television producer must have done the proverbial same thing). In fact, if you use the 'continental style' programme layout for the current format, you only need to write in a riders name once, and that's even ignoring the iPhone type apps that are becoming more prevalent.

 

I'd agree there's a stronger argument that you want all the GP regulars to be in the Saturday event and taking at least five rides, but my suggestion is more to hold qualifying between non-regulars such as wildcards. Two track reserves already have to turn up without the guarantee of any rides at all, so giving a few riders 2 or 3 rides and the chance to qualify for the GP proper would be better than what happens now.

 

Some suitable format could surely be devised if the will were there, but it's not really about the fans, is it?

Edited December 12, 2011 by Humphrey Appleby

[PHILIPRISING]

TRANSPONDERS from Tag Heuer were trailed at Gorzow and are still being looked at. But (sorry to disagree with Humphrey again) the whole operation doesn't come cheap. Agree they would add something to practice and help with close finishes, etc. No doubt they will happen sooner rather than later.

 

The old BSI (John Postlethwaite) had taken the GP about as far as they could. JP readily admits that to develop the series further it needed the commercial muscle of a company like IMG behind it. And so it has proved.

 

And, of course it is about the fans whether they be at the event or watching on TV. No audience no GP. But many of the complaints registered on this forum would appear to be almost exclusive to the UK.

 

The series is moving ahead, several major stadiums are seriously enquiring about staging events in the near future, and the likelihood of a Grand Prix in Australia is coming ever closer.

[rusky]

 

Pretty unbelievable that transponders are still not being used as its cheap and well proven technology now.

 

 

 

Transponders have been looked at by the FIM through their association with TAG Heur and I'm fairly sure they will be seen this year. They were looked at pre 2011 season, and the issue was where & how to mount them so that they were in exactly the same position on each bike, and so that they couldn't be moved during the meeting.

[Humphrey Appleby]

TRANSPONDERS from Tag Heuer were trailed at Gorzow and are still being looked at. But (sorry to disagree with Humphrey again) the whole operation doesn't come cheap.

 

I've sat through several presentations about transponders, so I'm well aware of the cost. A decent timing loop system as used in other motorsports with 20 transponders is in the order of GBP 4K, and that's probably before any sort of discount. If the premier speedway competition can't find that sort of money as a one-off investment, then times really must be tough...

 

I'd agree the positioning of the transponder is a bit of a issue in speedway, as the finish line rules would need to be modified. Similarly, the ideal position for the transponder towards the front of the bike would make it vulnerable to being knocked off. However, none of this is insurmountable and provided the positioning is the same for all bikes, it shouldn't matter too much.

 

But many of the complaints registered on this forum would appear to be almost exclusive to the UK.

 

Hardly surprising as it's the British Speedway Forum. Perhaps if one went to the Polish equivalent, one would find the complaints to be almost exclusive to Poland...

[The Know]

TRANSPONDERS from Tag Heuer were trailed at Gorzow and are still being looked at. But (sorry to disagree with Humphrey again) the whole operation doesn't come cheap. Agree they would add something to practice and help with close finishes, etc. No doubt they will happen sooner rather than later.

 

The old BSI (John Postlethwaite) had taken the GP about as far as they could. JP readily admits that to develop the series further it needed the commercial muscle of a company like IMG behind it. And so it has proved.

 

And, of course it is about the fans whether they be at the event or watching on TV. No audience no GP. But many of the complaints registered on this forum would appear to be almost exclusive to the UK.

 

The series is moving ahead, several major stadiums are seriously enquiring about staging events in the near future, and the likelihood of a Grand Prix in Australia is coming ever closer.

 

The transponder system is not expensive. I put a package togeather a few years back for the system including flights, staff ,install of loop at every track and left nothing to chance but they didnt want to pay i spent a lot of time on it and sorting postion of transponder. very easy to do and cheap. all school boy motocross i go to have them so what DOES that say about the sgp.

 

show me where it has moved forward and the investment from img ? Aus wont make money like NZ .

[PHILIPRISING]

IT has moved forward in a number of ways, especially behind the scenes, and the investment has been considerable especially in terms of presentation, temporary tracks (huge sums spent on materials for Cardiff, Copenhagen and Gothenburg, which are now stored in climate controlled environments), etc.

 

Transponders: perhaps you should try them again.

 

Australia: doesn't necessarily have to make shed loads of money but taking place a week before or after NZ, given that all the riders and other paraphernalia would be there anyway, makes it a much more viable proposition.

[kiwi]

Transponders and all the timing equipment is already used widely throughout NZ for the car classes and sidecars that run on car tracks.

Western Springs have had all that on hand for years and all linked to the big screen. transponders are hired by the drivers on the night.

 

School boy Road Cycling have plastic chips that clip onto the forks with cable ties

[Gearhead]

 

 

And, with respect Gearhead, I probably speak to more riders at a GP than you and actually attend every riders' briefing at every GP. Quite often the call from riders is for MORE practice not less.Some, like Sayfutdinov, often don't take all their sessions. Others, like Hancock, Gollob and Crump would probably ride all day if you gave them the chance.

 

Point taken,and if the riders generally are ok with practice that's fine,but I stand by what I said that they said things were diferrent on race day and its hard to judge riding on your own and against others.It wouldn't be a big problem if there wasn't any practice,afterall there is many a track record broken in a riders' 1st race at a track,also when these top riders race at new tracks anywhere,they never have any problems,how many times do we see the GP tracks cut up badly and become dangerous even?

Scrapping practice wouldn't do any harm to our domestic calendar too,Ipswich had more people through the turnstliles last year when they went PL,compared the the previous EL campaign,as we all know how the GPs have always caused clubs to have riders missing or go without fixtures etc,(and just think of all the money saved on hotel bills etc :-) )

Funny you mention Gollob,yes he'd ride all day,but it still doesn't stop him changing bikes before re-runs and when coming to the line for a race..

 

Ps transponders are usually mounted at the front of the headstock,for example behind the fork cover on a Speedwaybike

Edited December 13, 2011 by Gearhead

[PHILIPRISING]

GEARHEAD ... don't get me wrong, I also fail to understand what riders actually glean from practice most of the time and also find the whole two hour session tedious. And you are right, more often than not riders will comment that the track on race day is totally different to what it was in practice, although that is less common now with temporary tracks.

 

One reason that practice will now start at 6pm is to try and better replicate atmospheric and weather conditions the next day. For example: practice under a hot sun will be very different to racing conditions the following evening. However, unlike say road racing on a surface that never changes, or motocross where it doesn't really matter, speedway surfaces are notoriously fickle and are obviously susceptible to weather conditions whether it be sun and wind or just rain.

 

Preparing the perfect speedway track isn't an exact science, although it must be said that the progress made by Ole Olsen in ascertaining the optimum mix of materials (now in place at Cardiff, Copenhagen, Gothenburg and, hopefully, Auckland) is narrowing the gap but there again practice can often wreck all their efforts.

 

However, as previously stated, riders want practice, which in effect they see as a rehearsal for the following day, and it would be tough to deny them that.

[jimmy jimmy]

Why is everyone bothered about spicing up a practice session? It's just that, practice, if its boring to watch, go to a bar instead, or have a look around (or if at Vojens, dont get there until saturaday!)

[PHILIPRISING]

BEST suggestion yet

[The Know]

IT has moved forward in a number of ways, especially behind the scenes, and the investment has been considerable especially in terms of presentation, temporary tracks (huge sums spent on materials for Cardiff, Copenhagen and Gothenburg, which are now stored in climate controlled environments), etc.

 

Transponders: perhaps you should try them again.

 

Australia: doesn't necessarily have to make shed loads of money but taking place a week before or after NZ, given that all the riders and other paraphernalia would be there anyway, makes it a much more viable proposition.

 

moved forward, maybe in cost of dirt and storage but presentation is no better really than old bsi days. i have seen no real step forward apart from odd little thing and this is what the public see.

 

transponders, why waste more of my time. they have all the costs and they would not really have gone up much. did talk about it in sweden but went no further a bit like the gp did .

 

nz and aus, see your point about this but cant really see either making real money unless subsidised by a third party. dont think the sgp is big enough to go this far or popular enough in these places.

[Humphrey Appleby]

I still believe the sgp is the best thing for speedway but it needs new ideas and staff like they had in the past to push if forwards and not backwards.

 

Given how much money IMG have lost in the UK in recent times, I'd have thought some heads would have already rolled.

[Grand Central]

moved forward, maybe in cost of dirt and storage but presentation is no better really than old bsi days. i have seen no real step forward apart from odd little thing and this is what the public see.

 

I have to agree. Having been to Cardiff every year I cannot think of one single improvement in presentation that has been evident since IMG became involved.

It's not bad, but it's not really that good. And it certainly hasn't improved over time.

The venue and the event make Cardiff a great day. Kevin Coombs and X factor rejects don't.

I notice that Philip Rising rightly asserted his greater knowledge of the behind-the-scenes goings-on, but I think he may be very poorly placed to express opinions on the front-of house presentation. I think that is probably best left to the judgement of paying ticket holders.