2012 Gp Wildcards Announced

[spook]

I agree with the last part. They should be told that unless they contest the qualifiers they have to make the top 8 next year or miss out.

 

Bomber's on borrowed time now as well as borrowed machinery and next year could well see the likes of Woffinden and Barker as more likely choices in 2013 if they make the progress I expect them to.

 

yep Woffy Woffy Woffy is virtually a certainty for 2013 if IMG keep their 'policy' and Tai remains fit and in form........... I suspect Bomber would be out on his ear for 2012 if Tai had wanted the wildcard

 

 

It's irrelevant whats he or anyone else has done in the past. Ivan Mauger has won more titles than any current day rider but you'd not give him a wildcards. What if Rickardsson made a comeback tomorrow?

 

What you should be asking is, "is Chris Harris one of the top 15 riders in the World at present - or will be next season?" IMO, he's borderline, same with Freddie. Don't forget, 8th is an arbitrary figure that has no meaning.

 

If a rider was the 10th best rider in the World for 10 years are you telling me you'd boot him out of the GPs after a season because he didn't qualify and replacing him with the 16th (or worse) best rider in the World? I wouldn't, I want to see the best 15 riders in the World in the GPs - sadly, I think Bjarne ruins that and there is the issue with qualifiers. But take out Bjarne for the old Laguta and I think you'd have a pretty spot on field. Lets not forget 12 month ago people were claiming we had the strongest GP line up ever, so to lose Rune, Kolodziej and Laguta and we're gaining Ward and Pepe I think we straight away have a better series than last year.

 

Pepe may be hot stuff in the leagues but he has shown time and time again that he does not get his act together for the GP's.......... the same could be said for Bjarne.......... Darcy should do well but I wouldnt expect any more than hanging around 8th overall for his first year............................... despite my opinion of Rune, he finished 4th last season... while Janusz was looking high top 8 material based on his league form (pre new silencer )....... i'm not sure people were expecting Rune and Janusz to have such stinking campaigns

 

It is still a very tough lineup on paper and probably one of the toughest in history..... but I think it probably is a slight step down from this season..... on paper

[JCookie]

Good choices IMO.

 

As for claiming the likes of Pedersen and PePe have more right than Lidngren, how does that work? Lindgren finishes 9th in the world in a GP series yet is deemed not worthy, the others qualify through 4/5 meetings and beat no GP riders yet are worthy?

[Ghostwalker]

Good choices IMO.

 

As for claiming the likes of Pedersen and PePe have more right than Lidngren, how does that work? Lindgren finishes 9th in the world in a GP series yet is deemed not worthy, the others qualify through 4/5 meetings and beat no GP riders yet are worthy?

 

that's because the likes of Harris, Lindgren, N. Pedersen and the other Gp riders does not bother to do the qualifiers but instead relies on nominations if they finish outside top 8.

If the nominations would be scrapped the GP riders would be forced to do the qualifiers. Perhaps they would qualify anyway but i wouldn't be surprised if a few of them would fail.

.Besides Lindgren, Antonio and Artem díd beat a GP rider in the qualifiers for 2011. They all beat Chris Harris.

 

For the 2010 GP series, Jarek Hampel, Chris Holder and Zorro successfully beat Chris Harris, Fredrik Lindgren, Rune Holta and Kenneth Bjerre all 4 of those were 2009 GP riders.

Edited October 12, 2011 by Ghostwalker

[JCookie]

And for 2011 none of the three faced even a single GP rider as far as I can see.

[pandorum]

Ward is a given. they would be mad NOT to offer it to him.

Same with Pedersen a series without Nicki would be one missing his speedway brilliance and whining ability. Both worth watching.

The other two are very shaky choices.

Another pity pick for the Brits.

Will Harris stink out the season in 2012 and have a couple of good meets to big up his case or will he actually show he deserves a place?

Time will tell on that.

For me he does not deserve it nor does Fast Freddie.

 

There are talented riders out there just as good in the world leagues as both of them and maybe some new blood would have added to the series.

Harris in 2011 added very little. Some excitement true but so did Artem Laguta and he was neevr going to do anything either.

 

As long as we have this mentality of relying on charity our riders will never aspire to the heights of Loram, Lee, Collins and Havelock.

Just bit part players who know they will get included because they are British.

 

Can't see how this helps either Bomber or Brit speedway. A few years in the wilderness may well wake our leaders up a bit.

[Ghostwalker]

And for 2011 none of the three faced even a single GP rider as far as I can see.

 

as i said that is entirely because the GP riders KNOW that they will get a nomination if they are outside top 8 which means they don't bother with the qualifiers.

You can't blame the qualifiers for not beating GP riders if they GP riders don't ride in the qualifiers? Therefore qualifiers are more worthy then the charity cases.

Edited October 12, 2011 by Ghostwalker

[emerald tyke]

I'm glad to see Bomber, Freddie and Nicki getting a permanent wild card picks for 2012. Sensible decision I think as all the riders seem to have had trouble getting used to the new silencers/and the different way the machine performs and this at least gives them chance to have another try but think only for the 1 extra year!........if they don't "up their form" and get into their stride in 2012 they souldn't be picked again for 2013. Obviously then let some other rider have a go as it seems to be quite hard to get into the Gps otherwise.

[spook]

as i said that is entirely because the GP riders KNOW that they will get a nomination if they are outside top 8 which means they don't bother with the qualifiers.

You can't blame the qualifiers for not beating GP riders if they GP riders don't ride in the qualifiers? Therefore qualifiers are more worthy then the charity cases.

 

but this takes us full circle to if we think IMG are doing a good job or not

 

why do the riders think it is ok to miss qualifiers? along with the cluttered calendar..... it is because if they do badly in them it makes it more difficult for IMG to give them a wildcard......... with the way that IMG do things we can see how this gives them more options............. for instance if Bomber had entered the qualifiers and crashed and burned on top of his dip in GP and league form I think even IMG would have found it difficult to justify giving him a card.............. I do not currently see IMG insisting that riders do the qualifiers

 

Pepe & Bjarne are good examples why IMG need the wildcards.... maybe they have just been unlucky in the past... or maybe they were not prepared enough..... either way they have both had disastrous campaigns historically.... make 3 qualifiers like that and it makes it important that there are wildcards in there who are on the pace or it will be a GP field of two standards

 

I do think IMG are doing a good job ... and especially when we consider what it would most likely be like left to the FIM or another pocket of the speedway fraternity ............. I dont think it is a bad thing to question the way that they do things but it is easy to miss the woods for the trees

[fullbore]

Therefore qualifiers are more worthy then the charity cases.

 

Laguta more worthy than Nicki?

 

Niamh

[Ghostwalker]

spook, imo the reason to why the likes of Bjarne and Pepe manage to qualify is due to the lack of established opponents. If there would be plenty of GP riders would ride the

qualifiers its would perhaps be less likely that riders like Bjarne, Pepe... would qualify.

 

Freddie managed to go through the qualifiers for 2011 so he obviously knows how to do it and that it can be done.

 

IMG has managed a few good picks the latest years, like Emil, Holder and AJ but several of their other picks have not been successful,

[home straight]

spook, imo the reason to why the likes of Bjarne and Pepe manage to qualify is due to the lack of established opponents. If there would be plenty of GP riders would ride the

qualifiers its would perhaps be less likely that riders like Bjarne, Pepe... would qualify.

 

Spot on

[spook]

spook, imo the reason to why the likes of Bjarne and Pepe manage to qualify is due to the lack of established opponents. If there would be plenty of GP riders would ride the

qualifiers its would perhaps be less likely that riders like Bjarne, Pepe... would qualify.

 

Freddie managed to go through the qualifiers for 2011 so he obviously knows how to do it and that it can be done.

 

IMG has managed a few good picks the latest years, like Emil, Holder and AJ but several of their other picks have not been successful,

 

so you are saying if the guys who are being given wildcards were to go into qualifying... then Pepe and Bjarne wouldnt qualify?

 

Which of their picks have not been successful? And why did IMG pick them in the first place?

[salty]

Which of their picks have not been successful? And why did IMG pick them in the first place?

Tai. Harris for all but one year (last) when he did finish in the top 6. Nicholls - a number of seasons.

All picked purely because they were British.

[Ghostwalker]

1. so you are saying if the guys who are being given wildcards were to go into qualifying... then Pepe and Bjarne wouldnt qualify?

 

Which of their picks have not been successful? And why did IMG pick them in the first place?

 

1. No i what i say is that if the wild cards were scrapped, together with a limit at top 5 for automatically qualifying, those who want to be sure of spot in the Grand Prix

the next season would have to enter the qualifying. If they did that there would be tougher opposition in all of the qualifying rounds which would mean that it presumable

would be less likely to se riders like BP and PP qualifying in the end.

 

2.:

 

outside top 8 2007-2011, top 9: 2006:

 

wild card for season:

 

2011: Nicki Pedersen, Janusz Kołodziej

2010: Tai Woffinden, Hans Andersen, Fredrik Lindgren, Chris Harris.

2009: Scott Nicholls, Chris Harris, Fredrik Lindgren

2008: Chris Harris, Krzysztof Kasprzak, Fredrik Lindgren

2007: Antonio Lindbäck, Chris Harris, Bjarne Pedersen

2006: Niels Kristian Iversen, Antonio Lindbäck, Scott Nicholls, Piotr Protasiewicz, Lee Richardson

 

 

Qualifiers for season:

 

2011: Artem Laguta, Antonio Lindbäck, Fredrik Lindgren

2010: Magnus "Zorro" Zetterström

2009: Grzegorz Walasek, Sebastian Ulamek

2008: Niels Kristian Iversen, Lukas Dryml, Bjarne Pedersen

2007: Wieslaw Jagus

2006: only WC,no qualifiers.

Edited October 12, 2011 by Ghostwalker

[spook]

Tai. Harris for all but one year (last) when he did finish in the top 6. Nicholls - a number of seasons.

All picked purely because they were British.

 

yes absolutely and takes us once again full circle back to the question of if we think IMG are doing a good job or not....... if they are and the alternative isnt worth thinking about then it is naive to think that they wont make sure they put bums on seats

 

1. No i what i say is that if the wild cards were scrapped, together with a limit at top 5 for automatically qualifying, those who want to be sure of spot in the Grand Prix

the next season would have to enter the qualifying. If they did that there would be tougher opposition in all of the qualifying rounds which would mean that it presumable

would be less likely to se riders like BP and PP qualifying in the end.

 

 

and again we are going full circle to if IMG are doing a good job or not............ well are they?

 

yes quota and the such like isnt very romantic for a world championship but it just wouldnt be good for the sport or coverage if half the field was from Poland .......or some other undesirable make up of numbers

 

Just for arguments sake...... can I ask what kind of a step back it would be for the GP's to have a field of:

 

Hancock

Jonsson

Hampel

Crump

Sayfutdinov

 

Kasprzak

Pepe

Bjarne

A Laguta

Nicholls

Richardson

Walasek

Ulamek

Dryml

Sullivan

Woffinden

 

this is what could happen with your method

(and yes I do know some of them dont try to qualify anymore )

 

 

my heart tells me that we should have some grand qualifying arrangement.... minimal WC's.... no corporate consideration etc etc ....... but this is the real world and I only need to take a quick scan around world speedway to see what a mess the GP's/world championship could be

 

we have riders cheating, UK and Polish promoters bringing the sport into disrepute, laughable TV deal brokered in UK, riders threatening to strike over silencers in Poland, riders not being paid, clubs going down........................... considering all of that IMG seem to me to be a very solid and reliable, flagship, cornerstone of our sport and I think what they do works ........ on the whole

 

 

re bjarne and pepe and your scenario........ if 11 of the riders have to qualify with no wildcards then that theoretically means that 10 of the gp field go into the qualifiers...... surely that means we either get the same stragglers back or Bjarne and Pepe in? I dont see how it makes it more difficult for them tbh

 

2.:

 

outside top 8 2007-2011, top 9: 2006:

 

wild card for season:

 

2011: Nicki Pedersen, Janusz Kołodziej

2010: Tai Woffinden, Hans Andersen, Fredrik Lindgren

2009: Scott Nicholls, Chris Harris, Fredrik Lindgren

2008: Chris Harris, Krzysztof Kasprzak, Fredrik Lindgren

2007: Antonio Lindbäck, Chris Harris, Bjarne Pedersen

2006:Niels Kristian Iversen, Antonio Lindback, Kingdom Scott Nicholls, Piotr Protasiewicz, Lee Richardson

 

 

Qualifiers for season:

 

2011: Artem Laguta, Antonio Lindbäck, Fredrik Lindgren

2010: Magnus "Zorro" Zetterström

2009: Grzegorz Walasek, Sebastian Ulamek

2008: Niels Kristian Iversen, Lukas Dryml, Bjarne Pedersen

2007: Wieslaw Jagus

2006: only WC,no qualifiers.

 

ok so the wildcards...... the brits have been covered ........Lindgren and Andersen are perfectly reasonable picks and also have been on the pace............. KK would have been chosen to boost the Polish numbers for that year and probably deserved a shout through his league form.............for Lindback in 2007 see Ward in 2011..... and Bjarne also will have been making up Danish numbers.....

 

I really dont see an issue with the picks tbh and any rider who stunk out the place or didnt invest as much as they should have were shown the door as far as I know

Edited October 12, 2011 by spook

[SCB]

Tai. Harris for all but one year (last) when he did finish in the top 6. Nicholls - a number of seasons.

All picked purely because they were British.

Harris was given a wildcard for 2007 - proved to be correct really, Won a GP, had a 3rd. Finished joint 7th.

 

In 2007 he score the same number of points as the guys in 7th and 8th giving him a place for 2008. It suggested he was one of the best 15 rider in the World if he could score the same number of points as the guy in 7th in the World Championship and finished 9th himself. He also won a GP and had a podium finish.

 

He was lucky to get a place for 2009 TBH, he did nothing in 2008.

 

In 2009 he finished 5th in the qualifier. Suggesting there was nobody outside the GP's better than him.

 

Then he qualified by finishing 6th in the series, joint 5th but Greg finished high due to GP wins. Had they used that to separate the 3rd guys in 2007 and not a run-off, Bomber would have been 7th.

 

 

He's had one season where his qualification was dubious, every other years he's probably been deserving.

Edited October 12, 2011 by SCB

[ImpartialOne]

1. No i what i say is that if the wild cards were scrapped, together with a limit at top 5 for automatically qualifying, those who want to be sure of spot in the Grand Prix

the next season would have to enter the qualifying. If they did that there would be tougher opposition in all of the qualifying rounds which would mean thattot presumable

would be less likely to se riders like BP and PP qualifying in the end.

 

2.:

 

outside top 8 2007-2011, top 9: 2006:

 

wild card for season:

 

2011: Nicki Pedersen, Janusz Kołodziej

2010: Tai Woffinden, Hans Andersen, Fredrik

Lindgren

2009: Scott Nicholls, Chris Harris, Fredrik Lindgren

2008: Chris Harris, Krzysztof Kasprzak, Fredrik Lindgren

2007: Antonio Lindbäck, Chris Harris, Bjarne Pedersen

2006: Niels Kristian Iversen, Antonio Lindbäck, Scott Nicholls, Piotr Protasiewicz, Lee Richardson

 

 

Qualifiers for season:

 

2011: Artem Laguta, Antonio Lindbäck, Fredrik Lindgren

2010: Magnus "Zorro" Zetterström

2009: Grzegorz Walasek, Sebastian Ulamek

2008: Niels Kristian Iversen, Lukas Dryml, Bjarne Pedersen

2007: Wieslaw Jagus

2006: only WC,no qualifiers.

Add Chris Harris to 2010 picks

[manchesterpaul]

Yes it was rightfully moved. Did I say it shouldn't be? No. I just like laughing at people who take it upon themselves to police the internet. Real heroes of our time.

 

The fact you think you've won some kind of victory because it was moved speaks volumes. Anyway chief, don't let me stop you catching those naughty internet offenders, I hear on the grapevine someone somewhere is planning on starting a a thread about golf in the GP section, best get it covered big guy.

 

Dear oh Dear such an infinitely sad reply! Did you also not see the emoticons i attached to illustrate it was said in light mood? I gave the single obvious and understandable reason for wishing it was in the correct section of the forums. I didn't personally insult the original poster. Simply pointed out why it needed to be in it's rightful section of the forum.

 

A 'victory' ????????? Nothing of the sort so pathetic could ever cross my mind. Also, i simply don't have the time and certainly not the inclination to engage in such low trivia occupying my mind. I've had a topic moved in the past to a different section and it never remotely registered for a second as being a 'loss'. Admittedly, it was a hard to judge where to post one. But all the same i wouldn't ever be over-sensitive for it to matter a jot or view such a thing as a victory or loss. I've never policed the internet in my life in the insultive way you are inferring. I'm actually heavily and with great success involved in many freedom of speech campaigns and projects. Only time i'd object to free speech is if it's insulting or abusive to others.

 

Ok that's more than enough in going so far as to give you a courtesy of a reply for your post. Now we move on to the rest of it and once again it's necessarily to issue MY standard statement of;

 

Please take note i'm not getting engaged in 'off-topic attacking the poster and not the post' conversations. There is way too much of it across the forums. It's a very inconsiderate waste of the forum owner's bandwidth, which presumably is not free, to use the forums for abuse, insults or creating and carrying out personal vendetta's and off-topic feuding when it's purpose of being a forum is for speedway discussion.

Edited October 12, 2011 by manchesterpaul

[ImpartialOne]

Blimey, let's have a minute...

[Jacques]

Dear oh Dear such an infinitely sad reply! Did you also not see the emoticons i attached to illustrate it was said in light mood? I gave the single obvious and understandable reason for wishing it was in the correct section of the forums. I didn't personally insult the original poster. Simply pointed out why it needed to be in it's rightful section of the forum.

 

A 'victory' ????????? Nothing of the sort so pathetic could ever cross my mind. Also, i simply don't have the time and certainly not the inclination to engage in such low trivia occupying my mind. I've had a topic moved in the past to a different section and it never remotely registered for a second as being a 'loss'. Admittedly, it was a hard to judge where to post one. But all the same i wouldn't ever be over-sensitive for it to matter a jot or view such a thing as a victory or loss. I've never policed the internet in my life in the insultive way you are inferring. I'm actually heavily and with great success involved in many freedom of speech campaigns and projects. Only time i'd object to free speech is if it's insulting or abusive to others.

 

Ok that's more than enough in going so far as to give you a courtesy of a reply for your post. Now we move on to the rest of it and once again it's necessarily to issue MY standard statement of;

 

Please take note i'm not getting engaged in 'off-topic attacking the poster and not the post' conversations. There is way too much of it across the forums. It's a very inconsiderate waste of the forum owner's bandwidth, which presumably is not free, to use the forums for abuse, insults or creating and carrying out personal vendetta's and off-topic feuding when it's purpose of being a forum is for speedway discussion.

 

Oh dear, oh dear...

 

 

I thought you were " far too busy" to spend time on here...You're going well I have to say. Do you post all the crap you do on toilet/comfort breaks? You must take lot's of them then..

Edited October 12, 2011 by Jacques