Rye House 2012

[montie]

My man?

 

Lots of non-Brits would still be waiting - thats the whole point. Why have an assessed average if it's just there to be manipulated?

 

If Kasper/Casper (the press release can't decide how his name is spelled) isn't up to the rigours of PL racing, why bring him over, and why give him the opportunity to learn his trade ahead of others?

 

Because there isnt enough coming through to learn there trade,until that happens there no point in moaning about about,Len has to protect his interests in Rye and its supporters,hence signing Kasper

 

Len does his bit with training schools and a NL team so you cant really fault him

[Ben91]

The right move to make in my opinion, we should really be trying to bring another assessed youngster in to replace Luke too though, the points are available to do so. I'll keep saying the name in the hope that it'll happen but Anton Rosen looks like he could be another in the Linus mould.

 

Charlie recommending us Kasper could hint that he'll be sticking around for next season too, which is good news.

 

http://speedwayresults.com/rider.php?name=Kasper&surname=Nielsen

[Ben91]

That's just an institutionalised way of thinking. How many young Brits are given the chance to further their careers in Sweden, Denmark or Poland? That doesn't stop those countries producing the "conveyor belt".

 

It will take time to adjust the British Leagues to this radical new way of thinking, i.e. short-termism will have to take a back-seat, but in the longer term, based on the Swedish/Danish/Polish models it has to be of value.

 

I wonder how many of our young lads have approached clubs abroad, I bet there's hardly any. I bet there's also hardly any who are prepared to travel. Most of (not all) the young British riders are more interested in the lifestyle and being swooned over by 15 year old girls who for some reason adore them than actually going out and being successful in the sport, that's where we are going wrong. The riders have the wrong attitude.

[markm]

Most of the British lad have not got the money to go abroad or the backing u can be sure if we had the money we wood be trying to get out they.

[Lord Skid]

Not sure where the Bunyan knocking is coming from. He is only at reserve still due to rolling averages, he's currently sitting at 6.14 with bonus points, 5.35 without. Shows he has picked up a lot of bonus points.

 

We have really missed Neathy this year despite what some will undoubtedly say, though hopefully Charlie will stay with us as our number one for next season. I doubt we will ever see Nelson again, whilst if Luke is going to miss half of next season we have to plan without him for the whole campaign.

 

There are two team spots to be filled, it'd make sense to blood two new assessed Scandinavian riders and get them real starting figures for next season as I've already mentioned we should be checking out Anton Rosen.

 

I'd expect the team next year to include Mellgren, Bunyan, Kling (Len seems to like him) Garrity and hopefully Gjedde too.

Looks like Bunyan is playing a cute game, 16 points for Rye over the weekend, 8 points for Peterborough last night EL, lots of bonus points, big paypacket, but keeping average low for Rye next year and d/u in EL.

[Ben91]

What a wonderfully sweeping generalisation.

 

Not a generalisation at all, you name me one rider who isn't like that and I'll tell you five who are.

 

Most of the British lad have not got the money to go abroad or the backing u can be sure if we had the money we wood be trying to get out they.

 

So you're saying that Swedes, Danes and Poles are more affluent than us? I think not.

[scaramanga]

I wonder how many of our young lads have approached clubs abroad, I bet there's hardly any. I bet there's also hardly any who are prepared to travel. Most of (not all) the young British riders are more interested in the lifestyle and being swooned over by 15 year old girls who for some reason adore them than actually going out and being successful in the sport, that's where we are going wrong. The riders have the wrong attitude.

not too far from the truth there i would think

[wjm]

That's just an institutionalised way of thinking. How many young Brits are given the chance to further their careers in Sweden, Denmark or Poland? That doesn't stop those countries producing the "conveyor belt".

 

It will take time to adjust the British Leagues to this radical new way of thinking, i.e. short-termism will have to take a back-seat, but in the longer term, based on the Swedish/Danish/Polish models it has to be of value.

 

The “conveyor belt” part is the problem though.

 

If that rule was to be enforced you would almost wipe out about 20 riders currently in the PL, a few of the riders not meeting their average like Aspegren, Mellgren and Eklof are more than welcome additions to the PL.

 

If in turn you decided that these guys couldn’t gain a team building average and were then replaced by people like McKinna, Warwick and Cockle, this would do serious short, and long term damage to the PL (no disrespect to the guys, but the options are limited as we have no “conveyor belt”.)

 

At a time when a lot of tracks are struggling as it is, the last thing that is needed is to water down the product, and create a “pay and demand” culture for the limited number of talented Brits that are out there.

 

It seems pretty obvious looking at the progressing Young Brits in the PL what has to happen, we need more tracks/facilities like Scunthorpe where riders can gain the track time to be ready for PL racing (Auty, Haines, Howarth, The Worrals, Birks, Woffinden).

 

Sad as it is, simply being British doesn’t mean you either deserve a PL place, nor will having a PL place automatically develop and enhance a riders talent ,there are numerous examples of riders over the years that almost every PL promoter had wanted to give the chances to, and have given chances to that show that.

 

Before any rule is implemented that says “you must have a Brit” more has to be done to ensure that there is a steadier stream of Brits coming through to meet the demand, as things stand, any “must sign a Brit” rule, would render the points limit redundant as you would falsify the strength of some sides in comparison to others (yes that currently happens, but smart team building and using the wider range of options available allows teams to counter that).

 

I wont argue for a second that we don’t need more British talent, but it needs to change at a grass roots level, CL next and then think about the PL, the transition from CL/PL/EL needs to be worked on, that doesn’t mean you need to devalue the products as it wouldn’t do the riders any good either if they reached the international stage (not every riders will). We just need to find more training track time rather than solely competitive track time, we need more faculties to allow riders to develop at a younger age, not knee jerk changes to league structure.

Edited August 7, 2012 by wjm

[Fromafar]

Most of the British lad have not got the money to go abroad or the backing u can be sure if we had the money we wood be trying to get out they.

If you don't have the money or the backing I think they maybe consider their future in the sport because speedway is not a "hobby" sport IMO.Give it a serious shot by all means but if not progresing after 3-4 seasons try somthing else IMO.The foriegners do seem to be more wealthy than their British counterparts though or have found better sponsers.

[Backless]

 

 

I wonder how many of our young lads have approached clubs abroad, I bet there's hardly any. I bet there's also hardly any who are prepared to travel. Most of (not all) the young British riders are more interested in the lifestyle and being swooned over by 15 year old girls who for some reason adore them than actually going out and being successful in the sport, that's where we are going wrong. The riders have the wrong attitude.

 

And how many of those have their own logo-emblazoned " Xxxxx Xxxxx Racing " clothing - cos that'll help them be better riders.

 

As much as blame can be laid at the door of the sport's authorities for the lack of "conveyor belt", of those who are supposedly trying to break into the sport, there seems to be a bafflingly large number who make a hobby of it all.

[Rayleigh]

So does that mean the team is now.

 

Gjedde

 

Nielson

 

Mellgren

 

r/r

 

Hawkins

 

Morley

 

Bunyan

 

So Nielson (self confessed over priced at 7), Hawkins (struggling at reserve) and r/r in the main body of the side and little Ben at No 6,

 

I get the big picture for next season but I hold my breath for monday with Workington a visiting.

 

 

[Shadders]

So does that mean the team is now.

 

Gjedde

 

Nielson

 

Mellgren

 

r/r

 

Hawkins

 

Morley

 

Bunyan

 

So Nielson (self confessed over priced at 7), Hawkins (struggling at reserve) and r/r in the main body of the side and little Ben at No 6,

 

I get the big picture for next season but I hold my breath for monday with Workington a visiting.

God help us!!

[JCookie]

The “conveyor belt” part is the problem though.

 

If that rule was to be enforced you would almost wipe out about 20 riders currently in the PL, a few of the riders not meeting their average like Aspegren, Mellgren and Eklof are more than welcome additions to the PL.

 

If in turn you decided that these guys couldn’t gain a team building average and were then replaced by people like McKinna, Warwick and Cockle, this would do serious short, and long term damage to the PL (no disrespect to the guys, but the options are limited as we have no “conveyor belt”.)

 

At a time when a lot of tracks are struggling as it is, the last thing that is needed is to water down the product, and create a “pay and demand” culture for the limited number of talented Brits that are out there.

 

It seems pretty obvious looking at the progressing Young Brits in the PL what has to happen, we need more tracks/facilities like Scunthorpe where riders can gain the track time to be ready for PL racing (Auty, Haines, Howarth, The Worrals, Birks, Woffinden).

 

Sad as it is, simply being British doesn’t mean you either deserve a PL place, nor will having a PL place automatically develop and enhance a riders talent ,there are numerous examples of riders over the years that almost every PL promoter had wanted to give the chances to, and have given chances to that show that.

 

Before any rule is implemented that says “you must have a Brit” more has to be done to ensure that there is a steadier stream of Brits coming through to meet the demand, as things stand, any “must sign a Brit” rule, would render the points limit redundant as you would falsify the strength of some sides in comparison to others (yes that currently happens, but smart team building and using the wider range of options available allows teams to counter that).

 

I wont argue for a second that we don’t need more British talent, but it needs to change at a grass roots level, CL next and then think about the PL, the transition from CL/PL/EL needs to be worked on, that doesn’t mean you need to devalue the products as it wouldn’t do the riders any good either if they reached the international stage (not every riders will). We just need to find more training track time rather than solely competitive track time, we need more faculties to allow riders to develop at a younger age, not knee jerk changes to league structure.

 

Great post and includes everything you could want to say about the situation. Looking at that list of Scunthorpe products is quite surprising and could you even add Ashley Morris to that? If only we had 4/5 more like Scunthorpe the results could be a massive boost.

[bolly]

This being a Rye House thread I know Scunthorpe are bringing on many young British riders, but we have had our fair share of British talent passing through our teams both NL and PL at the Rye.

Over the past few years I have watched to name a few;

 

Kennett

Woffinden

King

Roynon

Boxall

Garrity

Mear

Haines

 

Plus numerous British riders around the NL

 

Which I dont think is too bad for a little trick track in the a*se end of Hoddesdon.

[Tsunami]

This being a Rye House thread I know Scunthorpe are bringing on many young British riders, but we have had our fair share of British talent passing through our teams both NL and PL at the Rye.

Over the past few years I have watched to name a few;

 

Kennett

Woffinden

King

Roynon

Boxall

Garrity

Mear

Haines

 

Plus numerous British riders around the NL

 

Which I dont think is too bad for a little trick track in the a*se end of Hoddesdon.

 

I would think that Woffinden, Roynon,Garrity, and Haines were actually 'bought in' and not found at Rye House.

[Shadders]

 

 

I would think that Woffinden, Roynon,Garrity, and Haines were actually 'bought in' and not found at Rye House.

Nowhere in Bollys post does he claim Rye House "found" any of the above.

Edited August 7, 2012 by Shadders

[Pinny]

Some parts of the world are just more talented than others at certain sports.

 

Look at brazil and argentina... Class above english footballers yet you cant tell me their facilities back home are superior to english facilities??

[Arson fire]

Some parts of the world are just more talented than others at certain sports.

 

Look at brazil and argentina... Class above english footballers yet you cant tell me their facilities back home are superior to english facilities??

On the other hand....Sunderland have facility's next to none....but are still jacky white

[bolly]

I would think that Woffinden, Roynon,Garrity, and Haines were actually 'bought in' and not found at Rye House.

 

As Shadders states I make no claims for any of these riders although I think that most developed an honed their skills on our smaller more technical track.

 

The point I was trying to make was that Len has always tried to keep as many British riders in his teams, mostly young riders on their way up. And as a totally personal view I always thought of just us and Sheffield being comprised of a majority of British riders in the PL over the past few years.

 

As again this year 6 out of 7 of our initially declared PL riders were British which from memory is 2 more than any other PL team ??

[secsy1]

I wonder how many of our young lads have approached clubs abroad, I bet there's hardly any. I bet there's also hardly any who are prepared to travel. Most of (not all) the young British riders are more interested in the lifestyle and being swooned over by 15 year old girls who for some reason adore them than actually going out and being successful in the sport, that's where we are going wrong. The riders have the wrong attitude.

 

Spot on Rocket Ben. As you mention, lifestyle and girls tend to be the main pursuit of all our youngsters. Ultimately the main problem lies with the riders themselves for not progressing, attitude and commitment.

 

Fancy websites, clothing and generally looking the part are not an excuse. Everyone rabbits on about money, money, money, no opportunitys - well wake up an smell the methanol. More opportunitys than ever exist to progress now than ever before. Its not up to BSPA, Individual tracks or what ever excuse is put up, its down to the individual and their commitment.