How Many Teams In Nl In 2012

[TMW]

Why did you even bother replying ?.

 

TMW, do you live in a different World ? one where something is given to you on a Plate, cus if that World exists tell me about it, b,cuz i have never come across it. In all walks of life surely its mostly about dedication and sacrifices to get where we want to be, unless we have a rich sugar Daddy i applaud Deanno for coming on here and talking a great deal of sense, from a riders point of view, and not just a keyboard cop.

He talks/writes a great deal of common sense, okay agreed not all straight forward with regards occasional rides in the Pl, but from the NL perspective it is enlightening.

 

Other careers pay you to learn, but they mostly pay at an existance level, same for the NL, its not about buying Joe Knickersons Gp Bike, having the latest bike Covers, Gold Chromed Wheel Rims, or the sexiest i Phone , its a learning process and Mechanical Knowledge surely needs to be part of it.

 

No offence intended

 

I didn't reply because unless Dean can do some of his bike work at work,(which some riders can because of the nature of their work), gets free help or he is an insomniac. Either way circumstances don't fit all riders and it is unfair to imply they should

[Diesel]

Your word NL dosnt owe you a living, and your trying to give riders who are struggling to make ends meet some advise..

It dosnt matter what league these lads ride they are ALL doing it for a living other wise why would risk there necks and as a rider you will know that Dean.

Deano's point is that in any other motorsport these riders would be paying to ride, they would be risking their necks because they enjoy it.

[teddy2706]

Why is this a good opportunity to have a go or mock Dean?

He expressed an opinion and answered some questions from interested people.

Most people involved in motorsport that have no real backers prepare their own machinery in their own time (usually evenings), just as Dean seems to.

The fact that he doesn't pay people to do what he is able to do himself merely shows he is resourceful and doesn't waste money.

He made the point about other riders not to belittle them, more to demonstrate that in his opinion it is possible to prepare an engine in NL one's self and be competetive, the fact that he has beaten other riders who do outsource their engine building re-inforces this and shows he is perfectly able to build competetive engines that suit him just fine.

I have watched Dean on a few occasions this season and I am content that my gate money is, in part going to him and others like him and I admire him more now I know that he builds his own engines.

[roguetrader]

Surely its not rocket science for promoters to get together in the NL prior to the AGM, Postphone bringing in the new Silencers, Scrap using Dirt Deflectors, only use the cheaper Carbs, only use the cheaper Clutch plates, Tyres dont seem to be a major issue, also this fashionable thing about sending engines away is very costly. I can see where a few thousand is wasted year on year, but i must Stress we are talking NL League only, and yes i can hear people saying, but what about if i am offered rides in the PL, my equipment isnt competitive, thats why i said have a pree AGM meeting to find ways round problems these ideas may create.

 

The idea is "Survival" to reduce riders costs, therefore to reduce promoters costs, who then maybe then will be able to not only survive but possibly pass on a small saving in some way to the spectators, who are also having to take ever increasing household costs,and Travel costs, as we all know, etc,etc.

 

Time for a reality check on this thread. The new silencers will be in the National League next season. Dirt deflectors wont be scrapped. Riders will use whatever carb they want, probably Blixts. They will use whatever combination of clutch plates they want. Tyres do make a difference. Whilst I respect Deans views I dont agree with all of them.

 

To compete with the top riders in the National League, who are mostly Premier League reserves or main body riders, like Lambert, Howarth, Garrity, Birks, Irving, Branford,Worralls etc you need a decent engine. Saying you have beaten heat leaders around the renowned tricky Buxton circuit is not a fair comparison. You cannot just service a engine without some specific equipment like a press and valve timing. Get it wrong and you can kiss goodbye to between £1000 - £2500 which makes an average service of between £200 - £300 quite reasonable.

 

All motorsport is expensive. Speedway is one of the cheaper ones. It is like anything in life. If you cant afford it you cant do it.

[TMW]

Why is this a good opportunity to have a go or mock Dean?

He expressed an opinion and answered some questions from interested people.

Most people involved in motorsport that have no real backers prepare their own machinery in their own time (usually evenings), just as Dean seems to.

The fact that he doesn't pay people to do what he is able to do himself merely shows he is resourceful and doesn't waste money.

He made the point about other riders not to belittle them, more to demonstrate that in his opinion it is possible to prepare an engine in NL one's self and be competetive, the fact that he has beaten other riders who do outsource their engine building re-inforces this and shows he is perfectly able to build competetive engines that suit him just fine.

I have watched Dean on a few occasions this season and I am content that my gate money is, in part going to him and others like him and I admire him more now I know that he builds his own engines.

 

If voicing a different opnion is having a go then guilty as charged.......If it just looking at another side of the story then not guilty........

 

 

One thing I will say even if it is cheaper as Dean says to DIY. Would the top riders, who are as rogurteader says PL reserves who do do it for a living. ride for less money I think not.

 

I'll leave you to decide!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

I would say if you want to watch X (naming no names) in the NL you are going to have to pay. it's a s simple as that.

 

 

There needs to be more teams in the NL to give the lads more meetings 18 meetings a season unless you are in the PL is not enough to keep your riding up (nothing to do with finance but ability) going for a month here and a month there with no meetings is not good cos as in any walk of life you lose your momentum. Some riders have been known to have brilliant meetings and then had wait weeks to take it anywhere.......Challenges are good experience and I would like to see these to bring new riders through but they are not league meetings weather your team wins or loses affects your position in the table I say bring back NL Trophey etc.....

 

I hope more teams track a team in 2012 but then you get into the territory of top riders being missing for a lot of the meetings because of PL commitments....... and would double up tracks have enough blank fixtures and would enough people attend 15 home meetings when they aren't attending 9.

[THE DEAN MACHINE]

Deano's point is that in any other motorsport these riders would be paying to ride, they would be risking their necks because they enjoy it.

im happy someone gets my point ,

[THE DEAN MACHINE]

im not saying rider x should ride for less money ,my point is if rider x did his own engines and learnt to do them as good as tuner x (which is not difficult) and which has been done many times before ,he would be a lot better off finacially from speedway , and could some expert out there in speedway land tell me what is so tricky about buxtons track , i will tell you ,riders come to the track and they are already beaton before they even ride it ,and you can pay for the best engines in the world but if you got that attitude you wont go far in the sport , i am only trying to help in a small way but if you know better then thats fine ,i am being open and honest about how i see NL speedway from a riders point of view, and just to throw a spanner in the works , who would win a race GREG HANCOCK using my engine V any premier league rider ?

[THE DEAN MACHINE]

Time for a reality check on this thread. The new silencers will be in the National League next season. Dirt deflectors wont be scrapped. Riders will use whatever carb they want, probably Blixts. They will use whatever combination of clutch plates they want. Tyres do make a difference. Whilst I respect Deans views I dont agree with all of them.

 

To compete with the top riders in the National League, who are mostly Premier League reserves or main body riders, like Lambert, Howarth, Garrity, Birks, Irving, Branford,Worralls etc you need a decent engine. Saying you have beaten heat leaders around the renowned tricky Buxton circuit is not a fair comparison. You cannot just service a engine without some specific equipment like a press and valve timing. Get it wrong and you can kiss goodbye to between £1000 - £2500 which makes an average service of between £200 - £300 quite reasonable.

 

All motorsport is expensive. Speedway is one of the cheaper ones. It is like anything in life. If you cant afford it you cant do it.

1st i agree about the silencers,dirt deflectors and so on they will all be used ,it was just a suggestion,2nd yes you do need a decent engine but why couldnt you make that decent engine yourself ,a press would cost around £200 and the timing equipment and the bits and peices around £100, if it needs more extensive work yes you need more machinery but for serviceing that £300 should be enough , once you know how to do valve timing ,i dont think you will get it wrong ,and i dont know a rider who hasnt got an engine back from service and its blown on 1st race or sometimes on warm up , it a race engine "it happens "

[TMW]

im happy someone gets my point ,

 

I don't think it is getting your point that is the problem. I think it is casting certain aspersions.......Youngsters are more intereted in the latest Mobile Phone....Riders would rather have new covers than chains...... The question of commitment...... etc etc etc. I think if you had just put your point people may have tended to agree with you more although some do.

 

I'm sorry Dean I don't believe you work a 60 hr week AND THEN start on your bikes (on your own) aswell as getting to the isle of wight. and last year Plymouth and Weymouth. An argument needs to be credible

 

But I stand corrected if I am wrong

Edited October 19, 2011 by TMW

[THE DEAN MACHINE]

I don't think it is getting your point that is the problem. I think it is casting certain aspersions.......Youngsters are more intereted in the latest Mobile Phone....Riders would rather have new covers than chains...... The question of commitment...... etc etc etc. I think if you had just put your point people may have tended to agree with you more although some do.

 

I'm sorry Dean I don't believe you work a 60 hr week AND THEN start on your bikes (on your own) aswell as getting to the isle of wight. and last year Plymouth and Weymouth. An argument needs to be credible

 

But I stand corrected if I am wrong

well i dont ride for the isle of wight its buxton and i dont work 9 to 5 hours ,i work any hour day or night, week or weekends and who else does my bikes ?,on a sunday i get back from buxton around 7pm and my bikes are washed and prepped before i go bed and just for good measure i also work for hynek stichauer as mechanic (but he was injured in august ), i will admit i dont get much time for anything else but i fit it in , i do sacrifice pretty much everything else in my life , and if you are that interested in my work habits, on race days you will see that most of the time i working in the area of the track im riding at ,be it plymouth ,weymouth or wherever,yes im lucky in that respect but its still work, also about commitment of SOME youngsters im not trying to get people to agree with me im just saying what i see ,if you dont agree with me then thats fine

Edited October 19, 2011 by THE DEAN MACHINE

[Fozzie4388]

Scunthorpe/Sheffield looking doubtful for 2012.

 

http://www.thisisscunthorpe.co.uk/Saints-Team-likely-disbanded-end-campaign/story-13610261-detail/story.html

[Halifaxtiger]

Scunthorpe/Sheffield looking doubtful for 2012.

 

http://www.thisisscunthorpe.co.uk/Saints-Team-likely-disbanded-end-campaign/story-13610261-detail/story.html

 

Very bad news if that is the case because Scunny have been one of most successful teams at capturing new assets with the potential to make it in the PL. Have to say that while I can appreciate that it is a drain on resources I am surprised at this decision for that reason alone.

 

I'd also take issue with the barbs aimed at other NL clubs, particularly the stand alone ones.

 

When Scunthorpe were a stand alone third tier club they were definitely win at all costs, paid over the odds and the likes of Wayne Carter and Buzz Burrows were hardly there for development.

 

Its a criticism I have made before; you can't follow a set of policies when you are a stand alone club then complain about others doing exactly the same thing when you are not.

Edited October 20, 2011 by Halifaxtiger

[scribbler]

Very bad news if that is the case because Scunny have been one of most successful teams at capturing new assets with the potential to make it in the PL. Have to say that while I can appreciate that it is a drain on resources I am surprised at this decision for that reason alone.

 

I'd also take issue with the barbs aimed at other NL clubs, particularly the stand alone ones.

 

Scunthorpe when a stand alone club they were definitely win at all costs, paid over the odds and the likes of Wayne Carter and Buzz Burrows were hardly there for development.

 

Its a criticism I have made before; you can't follow a set of policies when you are a stand alone club then complain about others doing exactly the same thing when you are not.

 

Can't agree with you...

 

Scunthorpe invariably used a minimum of experienced riders. Wayne Carter was always captain - until he had to retire - due to a Speedway injury. The season where the CL Scorpions won everything was the season when the team contained 16 year olds Josh and Tai and an even younger Joe Haines with - I think - Byron Bekker, Benji Compton, Scott Richardson and Ritchie... hardly experienced riders - just young and with potential.

 

The loss of Scunthorpe will be the loss of British riders in the PL and EL. A sad day for British Speedway if Rob Godfrey does stop having a team in the NL...

[montie]

 

 

I'd also take issue with the barbs aimed at other NL clubs, particularly the stand alone ones.

 

When Scunthorpe were a stand alone third tier club they were definitely win at all costs, paid over the odds and the likes of Wayne Carter and Buzz Burrows were hardly there for development.

 

 

Bit unfair that HT,Wayne Carter and Buzz came in to do a certain job within the team,a bit you could say like Lee Smethills this year,add Sarjeant,Morris,Howarth,Worralls,Briks,Irving,Wrathall,Nilsson,Tully,Auty,Haines and Woffy plus many others,it hardly points towards win at all cost

 

This years team are a classic example of NL speedway at its best

[teddy2706]

well i dont ride for the isle of wight its buxton and i dont work 9 to 5 hours ,i work any hour day or night, week or weekends and who else does my bikes ?,on a sunday i get back from buxton around 7pm and my bikes are washed and prepped before i go bed and just for good measure i also work for hynek stichauer as mechanic (but he was injured in august ), i will admit i dont get much time for anything else but i fit it in , i do sacrifice pretty much everything else in my life , and if you are that interested in my work habits, on race days you will see that most of the time i working in the area of the track im riding at ,be it plymouth ,weymouth or wherever,yes im lucky in that respect but its still work, also about commitment of SOME youngsters im not trying to get people to agree with me im just saying what i see ,if you dont agree with me then thats fine

 

I should leave it Dean, some folk who aren't used to working long hours will never get it!

For someone to say they don't believe you is just a piece of ignorance from someone who is probably a couch potato.

The fact that you manage to fill your life to the extent that you do would be a cause for admiration anywhere else in the world, but sadly, not in Britain, the home of underachievers and dossers.

I suggest that your detractors continue their couch potato habits and watch 'The World's Fastest Indian' and see what can be acheived by determined and resourceful people like Dean.

[June]

Got to have a say on this subject seeing as its one closest to my heart. It cannot be easy to run 2 teams, as not many clubs do. Thanks to Mr godfrey we've had 4 years with both N/L and P/L racing. Ever increasing costs plus the Stock cars, weekend practice sessions. all take loads of effort. I will miss watching NL but I felt as though I'd lost my team when it was announced we'd see only 5 meetings at Scunny. so this comes as no surprise. Cannot agree with some of the comments though; When we come back to speedway in the C/L we only ever had the odd elder rider. As already mentioned Wayne & Buzz acting as coaches to very young riders. Iv'e hardly missed a meeting ( only for hols ) and have to say that mainly our teams were always very young riders. and looking back at those days I have to say they were some of the best days of watching speedway, be it at Quibel Park, Ashbyville and EWR. The years of 2006/2007 will never be forgotten. As a family we still watch these DVDs over and over again. If a certain Richie Dennis reads this. " you are still as popular in this household now as you was then " Thanks to Mr Godfrey a lot of youngsters have been given a good start. I shudder to think where the young ones will get similar chances now. COME ON YOU SAINTS YOU STILL HAVE THE JOB TO FINISH.!

[scribbler]

Got to have a say on this subject seeing as its one closest to my heart. It cannot be easy to run 2 teams, as not many clubs do. Thanks to Mr godfrey we've had 4 years with both N/L and P/L racing. Ever increasing costs plus the Stock cars, weekend practice sessions. all take loads of effort. I will miss watching NL but I felt as though I'd lost my team when it was announced we'd see only 5 meetings at Scunny. so this comes as no surprise. Cannot agree with some of the comments though; When we come back to speedway in the C/L we only ever had the odd elder rider. As already mentioned Wayne & Buzz acting as coaches to very young riders. Iv'e hardly missed a meeting ( only for hols ) and have to say that mainly our teams were always very young riders. and looking back at those days I have to say they were some of the best days of watching speedway, be it at Quibel Park, Ashbyville and EWR. The years of 2006/2007 will never be forgotten. As a family we still watch these DVDs over and over again. If a certain Richie Dennis reads this. " you are still as popular in this household now as you was then " Thanks to Mr Godfrey a lot of youngsters have been given a good start. I shudder to think where the young ones will get similar chances now. COME ON YOU SAINTS YOU STILL HAVE THE JOB TO FINISH.!

 

Wanted the 'LIKE' button for your post June

 

I've never really 'got into' PL at EWR because I couldn't attend meetings. I've always loved the CL/NL and followed it online. I'll be really sad to see Scunthorpe without an NL team - even though I'll understand the reasoning behind the decision...

 

The NL will lose a team and management willing to develop British riders. As I stated earlier...it'll be a sad day for British Speedway if/when the Saints stop being an NL team.

[spin king]

Got to have a say on this subject seeing as its one closest to my heart. It cannot be easy to run 2 teams, as not many clubs do. Thanks to Mr godfrey we've had 4 years with both N/L and P/L racing. Ever increasing costs plus the Stock cars, weekend practice sessions. all take loads of effort. I will miss watching NL but I felt as though I'd lost my team when it was announced we'd see only 5 meetings at Scunny. so this comes as no surprise. Cannot agree with some of the comments though; When we come back to speedway in the C/L we only ever had the odd elder rider. As already mentioned Wayne & Buzz acting as coaches to very young riders. Iv'e hardly missed a meeting ( only for hols ) and have to say that mainly our teams were always very young riders. and looking back at those days I have to say they were some of the best days of watching speedway, be it at Quibel Park, Ashbyville and EWR. The years of 2006/2007 will never be forgotten. As a family we still watch these DVDs over and over again. If a certain Richie Dennis reads this. " you are still as popular in this household now as you was then " Thanks to Mr Godfrey a lot of youngsters have been given a good start. I shudder to think where the young ones will get similar chances now. COME ON YOU SAINTS YOU STILL HAVE THE JOB TO FINISH.!

Someone pass me the sick bucket.

[montie]

Someone pass me the sick bucket.

 

Still not got over Josh leaving Spinny???

 

or is it the the major power shift between to the two steel citys that making you feel un-well??

Edited October 20, 2011 by montie

[norwichkev]

Bit unfair that HT,Wayne Carter and Buzz came in to do a certain job within the team,a bit you could say like Lee Smethills this year,add Sarjeant,Morris,Howarth,Worralls,Briks,Irving,Wrathall,Nilsson,Tully,Auty,Haines and Woffy plus many others,it hardly points towards win at all cost

 

This years team are a classic example of NL speedway at its best

He was doing quite well and making sense until I got to:

 

"But I don't believe it will. There are too many teams out to win at all costs and bringing older riders in."

 

May have been a bit of inner reflection - Smethills, Compton and then Oliver very late on - pot, kettle, black maybe? Be honest, you want to win it and will do whatever you can, and leave others to do the same.

 

Coupled with:

 

Monties comments ( usually makes out he is well informed ) on Belle Vue agreeing to extend the deadline "or maybe they were made to extend the deadline!!!!" - maybe you are right, Mildenhall then moved the date when Scunny would have been without a number of riders. Would hate to lose any club from NL but are we looking at the NL Matt Ford?, if so bye, bye would prefer you not there.

 

Maybe you could look at running for most of the season without re-declaring a side and leaving Nielsen as a Number 8 ( better ave than a lot of other teams reserves ) within the rules but in the spiriit of the NL?

 

Of course the question is has this held back Stefan's career this year? would he have made it into the top 5? - but then again is it part of a win at all cost policy - of course not mentioning is it 4 Double up riders? which of course keeps 4 young Brits out of the sport. Would like all clubs in the NL to be in it to win it, but do not rate hypocrisy.

 

Think Scunny have done a superb job and were execellent at West Row last time around, although from this years team how many did Malcolm bring to the club? Maybe when he left the draw also left? and the young talent will emerge elsewhere.

 

As a club you are better than the wording of some press statements, while great to promote a meeting with some provocation taking cheap shots at others possible not showing the club in the best light, although to be fair, the article could have been misquoted.

 

Kev