Genesis Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 Just get rid of that damned joker, win it on merit not becasue you were outgunned for a third of the meeting and allowed to catch up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan_boon Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 (edited) Alternate with World Pairs. Format changes to an 8-team, round robin with 2 groups of four. Using the UK as an example, matches would go as follows: Saturday: A1 vs A2, Eastbourne. A3 vs A4, Leicester. Sunday: B1 vs B2, Newport. B3 vs B4, Glasgow. Monday: A1 vs A3, Wolverhampton. A2 vs A4, Belle Vue. Tuesday: B1 vs B3, Scunthorpe. B2 vs B4, Birmingham. Wedsneday: A1 vs A4, Poole. A2 vs A3, King's Lynn. Thursday: B1 vs B4, Sheffield. B2 vs B3, Swindon. Friday: Semi-Final 1 @ Coventry. Saturday: Semi-Final 2 @ Lakeside. Sunday: Final @ Peterborough. Edited July 17, 2011 by alan_boon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiegal Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 I don't want it in Denmark as the tracks are poor and Poland again would be boring. Why not in Australia at the MCG with a audience of 90,000 people. That would be awesome. And every year on 25th December a kind old man comes down teh chimney with gifts for the children Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscar Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 The change I would make to SWC rules are not to use the joker until 8 points behind and can only be used in a programmed ride,not as a tactical substitute as is usually the case.If Poland wanted to use Gollob in say heat 11 but his next programmed ride is heat 14 then wait or chance your arm with someone else.I would also have each team with 1 reserve each,we were lucky this year that no rider had to withdraw during a meeting,image a team having no riders in some heats due to injury. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumpiefan Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 The change I would make to SWC rules are not to use the joker until 8 points behind and can only be used in a programmed ride,not as a tactical substitute as is usually the case.If Poland wanted to use Gollob in say heat 11 but his next programmed ride is heat 14 then wait or chance your arm with someone else.I would also have each team with 1 reserve each,we were lucky this year that no rider had to withdraw during a meeting,image a team having no riders in some heats due to injury. at the risk of sounding anti poland just cast your mind back to the farce a few years ago. was it walasek who was last twice then was 'signed off' by the doc then balinski came in and changed things. too many rules,too many loopholes. i'd prefer no joker but i'd stick with the tactical subsitute. and certainly they need to rotate the final more,i appreciate that poland sells out and has the best atmosphere but in the interests of fairness there is poland,sweden,denmark,gb etc etc. one country staging the final 4 times in 7 seasons is not right imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HenryW Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 Alternate with World Pairs. Format changes to an 8-team, round robin with 2 groups of four. It would be nice to have a tournament like that, but there would be far too many completely one sided matches with the current standard of Nations. If you look at the top 8 from this year, can you really see anyone wanting to go and watch Denmark, Poland, Sweden or Australia racing against Germany or the Czech Republic? A round robin of the top 4 with the top 2 going head to head for the title might just about work, but even that might provide some one sided matches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImpartialOne Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 Just finished watching it as I was at newport last night, it was superb, but what I Dont Understand is the commentry EG Poland Become the Ist Team to Win the world cup 3 years on the trot, well Sweden won it in 1962/3/4, and Denmark Won it an amazing 6 times in 1983/4/5/6/7/8, Now thats a Record.Please SKY Get your History Correct Sky are actually correct as the World Cup has only been in existence since 2001. Before that it was the World Team Cup. Pedantic possibly, but true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImpartialOne Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 I never said that the meeting should 16 heats. I said 16 normal heats with all riders racing each other, then have four nominated heats. So there would be a grand total of 20 heats, in the meeting. That's still 5 heats less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fullbore Posted July 18, 2011 Report Share Posted July 18, 2011 Reserves would be good, but we all saw how easy it was to bend the rules a few years ago in Leszno when a rider was off the pace and had to "pull out". Strict guidelines would be a necessity if reserves were to be introduced. Well allow the reserve to replace a rider at any time but make the replacement permanent, so if a team decides to replace a rider for tactical reasons and another rider later is unable to race then they have no reserve left to use. Niamh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fullbore Posted July 18, 2011 Report Share Posted July 18, 2011 Just finished watching it as I was at newport last night, it was superb, but what I Dont Understand is the commentry EG Poland Become the Ist Team to Win the world cup 3 years on the trot, well Sweden won it in 1962/3/4, and Denmark Won it an amazing 6 times in 1983/4/5/6/7/8, Now thats a Record.Please SKY Get your History Correct Actually they said with the Ove Fundin Trophy 3 years on the trot. Niamh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigcatdiary Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 Interesting information come to light since the Final was broadcast The Referee Jim Lawrence DIDNT change his mind in heat 21, sky inadvertently showed the wrong result before the referee had declared it. Whats really bad is that Pearson and Tatum now know they got it wrong on the night having made a meal out of it and havent had the decency to admit they were wrong on Sky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILIPRISING Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 Interesting information come to light since the Final was broadcast The Referee Jim Lawrence DIDNT change his mind in heat 21, sky inadvertently showed the wrong result before the referee had declared it. Whats really bad is that Pearson and Tatum now know they got it wrong on the night having made a meal out of it and havent had the decency to admit they were wrong on Sky. BUT they weren't wrong ... the information they had (as did we in the pits, which is why Crump was lined-up ready to come out as the joker, was that Ward had finished last. It was only when the referee was informed that Australia were playing their joker that it came to light that the wrong information had been relayed to the TV truck, from where the graphics are operated, and indeed to the Race Director. Cannot blame Sky, who were just one of many taking their info from the host broadcasters, or indeed either Nigel or Kelvin who were simply acting on the info coming through their headsets and the pictures from the pits that had Crump on the grid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie B Posted July 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 Another racing formula you could use for World cups is. Teams of four riders, with a reserve that can come in at any time. No Joker. Riders race in pairs (ex; A 1&2 vs B 1&2, the C 1&2, D 1&2, B 3&4, C 3&4, D 3&4 etc) they then would race against each teams pairings, thus having six rides. The meeting would then consists of 24 heats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImpartialOne Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 (edited) Another racing formula you could use for World cups is. Teams of four riders, with a reserve that can come in at any time. No Joker. Riders race in pairs (ex; A 1&2 vs B 1&2, the C 1&2, D 1&2, B 3&4, C 3&4, D 3&4 etc) they then would race against each teams pairings, thus having six rides. The meeting would then consists of 24 heats. This sounds like a similar format i came up with a few years ago which I think would work and it makes it a team event. I think mine though swapped pairings about during the meeting and the last few heats ended up so that all the 1s and 2s raced each other again. I binned it so can't remember now. Edited July 19, 2011 by ImpartialOne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucifer sam Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 Sky are actually correct as the World Cup has only been in existence since 2001. Before that it was the World Team Cup. Pedantic possibly, but true. It's the same competition, just rebranded that's all. One sucession of wins not mentioned so far is ours - the British team won in 1971/72/73/74/75. How times have changed. All the best Rib Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucifer sam Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 IF it ain't broke - and on the evidence of last night it isn't - why change it? Fantastic event, especially for those of us lucky enough to be there. Do you honestly like the joker rule? Surely that part is broken. Apart from that, I agree that the current format works. I would like see team riding. Maybe the World Cup is not the event for that, but rather the return of more test matches (one test match per Elite League track would be good - taking on the Aussies, Swedes and Danes in three-match rubbers). All the best Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImpartialOne Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 (edited) It's the same competition, just rebranded that's all. One sucession of wins not mentioned so far is ours - the British team won in 1971/72/73/74/75. How times have changed. All the best Rib I did notice that, Rib although it was under two different names. Edited July 19, 2011 by ImpartialOne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImpartialOne Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 Do you honestly like the joker rule? Surely that part is broken. Apart from that, I agree that the current format works. I would like see team riding. Maybe the World Cup is not the event for that, but rather the return of more test matches (one test match per Elite League track would be good - taking on the Aussies, Swedes and Danes in three-match rubbers). All the best Rob Our boys definitely need more test matches but as Ermolenko pointed out they need test matches in Poland to get something working on the big pacey tracks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILIPRISING Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 Do you honestly like the joker rule? Surely that part is broken. Apart from that, I agree that the current format works. I would like see team riding. Maybe the World Cup is not the event for that, but rather the return of more test matches (one test match per Elite League track would be good - taking on the Aussies, Swedes and Danes in three-match rubbers). All the best Rob I WOULDN'T say I like it but I understand why it is there. I think us Brits get more worked up about it partly because our interpretation of "joker" is different from that of fans abroad who, from the evidence of my own eyes, have no problem with it. And, like it or not, we live in a commercial world and the TV channels love it especially when, as on Saturday, it helps create a close finish. That will not please the purists in the UK but we are now such a small player in world speedway that our opinions and views carry rapidly decreasing weight. Lots of sports, notably cricket, create rules designed to improve the TV spectacle as well as for those watching live. I very much doubt whether many of the 15,000 fans in Gorzow on Saturday have a problem with the joker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucifer sam Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 I did notice that, Rib although it was under two different names. The team has always been called Great Britain, according to FIM documentation. All the best Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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