Swc Final Line Ups

[Sprog1]

WE can argue all night about the degree of greatness that Gollob deserves but has there ever been a more entertaining rider? His performance last night was breathtaking and truly inspirational for his team-mates whose heads were drooping after a poor start.

 

Gollob is a good rider. No denying that. But they all seem good/entertaining when they are at their peak. Anyone who only started watching speedway recently would find it difficult to believe that Nicki P. was a 3-times world champion and almost invincible at one point in his career.. He looked quite an ordinary rider on last nights performance. Tony Rickardsson's era now seems a long time ago and his brilliance is gradually being forgotten as times move on. There was a time when Peter Collins was thought to be one of the most spectacular and entertaining riders ever but he is now nothing more than a name to many fans. So the list goes on. Neilson, Gunderson, Michanek, Mauger Fundin and the rest. All been and gone.

 

History will judge Gollob just as it has judges all the others. The time will come when Gollob starts to look well past his sell-by date and starts going downhill, just as all the others did eventually. Perhaps that's the best time to assess him.

 

 

 

[SCB]

How many times were the above two in the top 3 of the world championship ? Gollob as well as winning one world title has won the World Cup many times mainly being top scorer and captain and been at the top of the sport for a very long time as well as being one of the most entertaining riders of all time .

 

To me Gollob is true great for many reason than just winning one world title .

Don't forget his technical ability too. He fully understand his bike and what his engines do. I'm sure he tunes some of his engines himself, or at least used to. Not many of the top guys can claim that!

[Blazeaway]

I agree with that wholeheartedly, he took the meeting by the scruff of the neck and turned it upside down in those 2 heats. Chris Harris has shown similar inspirational qualites in domestic racing and if he can continue to improve we may well one day have our own version of Gollob, now that would be nice, it may be 10 or so years away though.

 

He hasn't improved though has he? In fact he's gone backwards big time in the GP's. Harris is a decent rider who is occasionally brilliant, Gollob is and has been for a long time a brilliant rider.

[foreverblue]

Interesting comments from Ryan Sullivan in interview during the Wroclaw v Torun match,he was asked if Austrailias chances would have been better if he had been in the team.His reply was..

 

"Austrailia dont want me in the team and I was cheering on Poland anyway."

Thats very sad a rider,just because he has fell out with his team mates doesn't want his country to win,says everything you need to know about Sullivan.

[THE DEAN MACHINE]

Don't forget his technical ability too. He fully understand his bike and what his engines do. I'm sure he tunes some of his engines himself, or at least used to. Not many of the top guys can claim that!

and that is what makes gollob a legend,he knows how to make his bikes work ,when sky show gollob in the pits in a gp or swc he is on his knees changeing the bike set up himself

[Boris41]

Thats very sad a rider,just because he has fell out with his team mates doesn't want his country to win,says everything you need to know about Sullivan.

 

He obviously enjoys his life in Poland and they have always been very good to him so why not?? I'd rather support a sportsman/team that shows class on and off the sporting field no matter what nationality they are e.g. I would have Nadal over Murray anyday.

 

Australia's loss in my eyes, I have said in previous posts that they had a great chance to win this year but they let history get in the way. Equal blame should be put on both sides! I don't believe with Ryan's record and current form on the continent that he has anything to prove. I mean even if he is on the decline at least he was competitive in the GP's and reached World Number 3 unlike Schlein and Watt who have never been in the GP's. 2 time world cup winner and almost made it a hat trick. Since 2003 the Aussies have only had two podiums which shows their decline until this year where they couldn't seize their moment!!

 

Moreover Batchelor will never get into the GP qualifying unless he competes in his homeland, at least Ryan went back home in 2004 and became Australian Champion to earn a spot in GP qualifying. Why is Troy expecting a hand out as per the speedway star article where he was moaning when others bother to make the effort, the prime example was Leigh Adams.

Edited July 17, 2011 by Boris41

[Trees]

and that is what makes gollob a legend,he knows how to make his bikes work ,when sky show gollob in the pits in a gp or swc he is on his knees changeing the bike set up himself

All riders need to know how their bike works don't they??

[ImpartialOne]

Gollob is a good rider. No denying that. But they all seem good/entertaining when they are at their peak.

The time will come when Gollob starts to look well past his sell-by date and starts going downhill, just as all the others did eventually. Perhaps that's the best time to assess him.

Hilarious!

 

So let's judge Ivan Mauger as a mediocre league rider for Exeter in 1984.

Let's judge Tony Rickardsson as a man who suffered concussion and pulled out of the GP after a couple of dodgy meetings and retired quietly.

Let's judge Erik Gundersen on his last World Final finishing nowhere.

Let's judge Sam Ermolenko as the aging mediocre rider struggling for points in his final season.

Or Shawn Moran as the guy who lost his bottle and quit Premier League equivalent.

 

If you think that's how everyone remembers world class riders then you don't know much at all.

[SCB]

I don't know, if we're going to rate Gollob on how he performed in the twighlight of his career he has won a World Title in his 40's. How many have done that?

[ImpartialOne]

Personally I was just please to see Poland win it with Johnny Knoxville in the team!

[HenryW]

Hilarious!

 

So let's judge Ivan Mauger as a mediocre league rider for Exeter in 1984.

Let's judge Tony Rickardsson as a man who suffered concussion and pulled out of the GP after a couple of dodgy meetings and retired quietly.

Let's judge Erik Gundersen on his last World Final finishing nowhere.

Let's judge Sam Ermolenko as the aging mediocre rider struggling for points in his final season.

Or Shawn Moran as the guy who lost his bottle and quit Premier League equivalent.

 

If you think that's how everyone remembers world class riders then you don't know much at all.

I know exactly what you are meaning with the general sentiment of this post and agree with it.

 

However, as a big fan of Erik, I would suggest that comment was a bit rough. He finished 4th, only 1 point behind 2nd despite having suffered an engine failure during the meeting, so hardly "no-where" and not really comparable to the others you listed.

 

Basically, I don't think he really belongs in that list.

[ImpartialOne]

I know exactly what you are meaning with the general sentiment of this post and agree with it.

 

However, as a big fan of Erik, I would suggest that comment was a bit rough. He finished 4th, only 1 point behind 2nd despite having suffered an engine failure during the meeting, so hardly "no-where" and not really comparable to the others you listed.

 

Basically, I don't think he really belongs in that list.

I guess what I meant was a bad one by his high standards. I didn't check but thought he finished lower down but may have been thinking of 1986.

Edited July 17, 2011 by ImpartialOne

[HenryW]

I guess what I meant was a bad one by his high standards. I didn't check but thought he finished lower down but may have been thinking of 1986.

That might be the case...He DID have a stinker in 86

That was the only time he finished outside the top 4 in his World Final appearances, if I remember right. I think that he was 4th in 81, 83 and 89 and a medalist the other years.

[Parsloes 1928 nearly]

A magnificent Speedway meeting.

And let's be clear about this, this was what the sport is all about, a one-off event - hugely high pressure, superb quality, everything on the line on the night with all responding to that fact.

THIS is what it would be like if we had what the sport deserves. a proper World Final for the individual title...

And frankly after seeing this how can ANYONE possibly argue against that...

 

And the other indisputable fact, Tomas Gollob is surely one of the all-time greatest riders in our sport...

[Parsloes 1928 nearly]

Jerzy Szczakeil a true great ? Egon Muller a true great ? Your're having a laugh !

 

Er, well the greatest rider who ever lived, Peter Collins only won one world title so I can't accept your logic here...

[Trees]

And frankly after seeing this how can ANYONE possibly argue against that...

BSI, they can't make as much money from a one off ............. whatever next!

[stevebrum]

Er, well the greatest rider who ever lived, Peter Collins only won one world title so I can't accept your logic here...

 

 

Herin lies the point.

 

Who is the greatest rider ever is open to suggestion.

Edited July 18, 2011 by stevebrum

[BongoBrian]

It was a very good meeting, but the best? Come on now, what about e.g. the 2006 Polish GP at Bydgoszcz? Or the 2004 World Cup race-off or 2007 World Cup Final? Or the 2006 Elite League play-off final. Seems you have the Sky TV mentaility of calling the most recent the best

 

All the best

Rob

 

2006 just to early for me and didn't see any televised meetings then. Just about went to Ashfield for the first time around 2006. So yeah, I think The world cup final was the best meeting that I have witnessed on TV and going by the examples you give, only as recent as 2007, it was probably the best televised meetings in quite some time.

[Sprog1]

Hilarious!

 

So let's judge Ivan Mauger as a mediocre league rider for Exeter in 1984.

Let's judge Tony Rickardsson as a man who suffered concussion and pulled out of the GP after a couple of dodgy meetings and retired quietly.

Let's judge Erik Gundersen on his last World Final finishing nowhere.

Let's judge Sam Ermolenko as the aging mediocre rider struggling for points in his final season.

Or Shawn Moran as the guy who lost his bottle and quit Premier League equivalent.

 

If you think that's how everyone remembers world class riders then you don't know much at all.

 

More like you can't handle a debate without trying to get insulting. Did I say we would judge Mauger or any of the others only on their way down ? Did I say that's how everyone remebers world calss riders? No, that's something you have chosen to make up.

 

The point I was making was that any given rider looks good at the time he is at his peak. When we look at at then with hindsight our opinions crystalise. There are plenty of people on here who don't remember Mauger or even Ermolenko at their peaks so they are making judgments on a narrower sample of riders. They all have their moments and fade into history. Before long Gollob will be past his peak and will be surpassed as hero of the hour by possbly Sayfutinov or Ward, just as Briggs was surpassed by Mauger, and Mauger was surpassed by Penhall, and so on.

 

Philip Risings post asked if there has ever been a more entertaining rider than Gollob. My point is that the day after a brilliant meeting is not the best time to judge whether a rider was the best/ most entertaining rider ever, but rather it is when the dust settles and we can reflect their at his performances more objectively. With the benefit of hindsight no doubt some will still say Gollob was the greatest thing since sliced bread, others won't.

 

In am not sure how your mind has converted that to saying we should only judge Mauger and the rest on the basis of their twilight years, unless it is your basic inability to read a few sentences without without launching into insults, before you have sat and thought about the context of the discussion and the nature of the post being answered.

 

Perhaps it would help if I get my row of beads out and explain it in simple terms. In my opinion the best time to judge a riders qualities is when we look back on his career with hindsight. Some people may agree with me, some won't. Simple as that.. Can you manage that without your inferiority complex getting the better of you and launching into another tirade ?

Edited July 18, 2011 by Custer Mouse

[Sprog1]

I don't know, if we're going to rate Gollob on how he performed in the twighlight of his career he has won a World Title in his 40's. How many have done that?

 

From memory I think Mauger was in his 40th year when he won his last world title, Tommy Price was , I think about 38 when he won his first and I I read somewhere that Aub Lawson was about 45 when he finished 3rd in 1959. we have to remember though that sportsmen generally tend to go on longer in their careers than they did years ago. Fundiin Briggs and Ronnie Moore were all about 21 or 22 when they won their first World Titles but were more or less on the slide in terms of world class by their mid thirties. On the other hand, ivan Mauger didn't take his first World Crown until his late 20's but stayed at the top until a later age.

 

Maybe it is something to do with hunger. Perhaps those who wait longer for success seem to carry on longer and those whom get success at a young age perhaps go off the boil a bit earlier. Not sure where Greg Hancock fits into that theory though !