British Grand Prix, 25/06/11

[BWitcher]

Watched the GP on TV after getting back from Cardiff last night.Did Pearson have a deal to keep saying the word "sensational".When someone got out of shape, and someone when underneath them "sensational"When Holder won his semi by passing no one he still said it was yes "sensational".Every time speedway is on the box Pearson describes it as "a great night of speedway"when sometimes its not,there seems to be a hard sell going on.The GP was ok for me not "sensational"some passing most up the inside.Its just a bit disappointing to see Gollob and Crump win their first heat(so they are quick)and then lolling around at the back,not making any impression when they missed the gate.I felt last years GP was better.

 

So you base it on whether Gollob or Crump can pass?

 

Failing to remember that BOTH of those were indeed overtaken by others, so by definition they simply weren't quick enough. As for most of the passes up the inside.. hmmm I remember quite a few around the outside. Those up the inside generally because the rider in front was on the outside line!

 

There were some absolutely fantastic races, just off the top of my head you had Sayfutdinov/Crump, Sayfutdinov/Nicholls, Gollob/Jonsson. There was a heat where Bjerre went from 1st to last and back to 1st again, with riders swapping positions behind him. Lindgren V Harris in the 2 man race was a superb battle. Lindgren/Holder was a great battle till the exclusion too. There were a number of other good races that off the top of my head I can't remember.

 

I would say the first 5 or 6 races were fairly processional, as tends to be the norm till the track settles down. After that, 1st class entertainment.

[ImpartialOne]

i'm looking forward to seeing any mistakes the sky team made

Blimey!

[squall]

I don't care how it come across on TV, being there Cardiff is just brilliant. As you run up the steps into the seating areas hearing the noise getting louder and louder until you walk in and that noise! WOW! 45,000 fans all cheering and booing. It's just brilliant.

 

I love it at Cardiff, I think it could all be from the gate but it would still be magical.

 

Throw in the chance to meet old and new friends. A great day out.

 

Seconded

[crumpiefan]

Blimey!

 

 

what i should have put was i'm looking forward to watching the gp again and interested in what the commentators say

about the various exclusions but i don't sit there making a mental note of any mistakes or things i don't agree with!!

 

(although when staechmann said that harris was correctly excluded in copenhagen that was a corker).

[DukesGreg]

I don't care how it come across on TV, being there Cardiff is just brilliant. As you run up the steps into the seating areas hearing the noise getting louder and louder until you walk in and that noise! WOW! 45,000 fans all cheering and booing. It's just brilliant.

 

I love it at Cardiff, I think it could all be from the gate but it would still be magical.

 

Throw in the chance to meet old and new friends. A great day out.

 

Fair comments, totally agreed.

 

However, I don't know what some of the people on here expect from a speedway meeting.

 

Once the track had bedded down, there were some great races.

 

 

Somebody has complained about passing on the inside... but isn't that good???? Riders were passing after going on the outside, and riders were nipping in to pass on the inside. So.. if there was passing on BOTH inside AND outside... isn't that, in general.. a good track??

 

People expect GP's and World Finals to have 20 superb races. They don't. I remember Wembley 81 being dubbed as one of the best meetings ever. If you watch the races on youtube, or the dvd... yes... they're good. However, there were 6 or so TOP CLASS TOP DRAWER races last night.. along with some other DECENT ones after the first few heats... and people are still moaning.

 

 

With nostalgia (olden days) comes some degree of sugar coating.

 

 

Last night was a great night out. I drove 240 miles home with my family, a 480 mile drive in a day, knowing full well that I'll never miss one again.. cash and circumstances permitting.

 

 

 

The racing was good (to deny it is rubbish), the stadium is amazing, the colours are amazing, the crowd numbers creep up every year, the noise is (happily) deafening, the roof is on, the Poles are loud (and really help make the atmosphere great), we had drama and a first bend spill in the final, and, in my opinion, a nice winner.

 

I'm struggling to find something to grumble about. Rare in itself.

[crumpiefan]

Fair comments, totally agreed.

 

However, I don't know what some of the people on here expect from a speedway meeting.

 

Once the track had bedded down, there were some great races.

 

 

Somebody has complained about passing on the inside... but isn't that good???? Riders were passing after going on the outside, and riders were nipping in to pass on the inside. So.. if there was passing on BOTH inside AND outside... isn't that, in general.. a good track??

 

People expect GP's and World Finals to have 20 superb races. They don't. I remember Wembley 81 being dubbed as one of the best meetings ever. If you watch the races on youtube, or the dvd... yes... they're good. However, there were 6 or so TOP CLASS TOP DRAWER races last night.. along with some other DECENT ones after the first few heats... and people are still moaning.

 

 

With nostalgia (olden days) comes some degree of sugar coating.

 

 

Last night was a great night out. I drove 240 miles home with my family, a 480 mile drive in a day, knowing full well that I'll never miss one again.. cash and circumstances permitting.

 

 

 

The racing was good (to deny it is rubbish), the stadium is amazing, the colours are amazing, the crowd numbers creep up every year, the noise is (happily) deafening, the roof is on, the Poles are loud (and really help make the atmosphere great), we had drama and a first bend spill in the final, and, in my opinion, a nice winner.

 

I'm struggling to find something to grumble about. Rare in itself.

 

 

i think wembley 81 had two good races if i remember - penhall beating olsen and penhall beating knudsen. the rest of the meeting was

pretty ordinary.

to me cardiff is the best sporting day of the year.

[Bagpuss]

I don't care how it come across on TV, being there Cardiff is just brilliant. As you run up the steps into the seating areas hearing the noise getting louder and louder until you walk in and that noise! WOW! 45,000 fans all cheering and booing. It's just brilliant.

 

I love it at Cardiff, I think it could all be from the gate but it would still be magical.

 

Throw in the chance to meet old and new friends. A great day out.

 

 

Seconded

 

 

Fair comments, totally agreed.

 

Fourthed

[Matt Davis]

Fourthed

Im not sure "fifthed" is a word, so i will just say i agree

[DunRobin]

Whilst being there may be exciting, I think that it colours how you actually see the racing because of the excitement generated. I don't see how anyone could sy the the track was good, it was just about OK. The fact that not a single heat was won from gate 1 shows that the track was not perfect & in fact for the first 14 heats, I think all of the heat wins came from gates 2 & 4. Later in the meeting this changed & gates 2 & 3 were the best. This is the problem with one off tracks, so much depends on gate position & to me this spoils the meeting. There was definitely some good racing but not a good track.

[DukesGreg]

Whilst being there may be exciting, I think that it colours how you actually see the racing because of the excitement generated. I don't see how anyone could sy the the track was good, it was just about OK. The fact that not a single heat was won from gate 1 shows that the track was not perfect & in fact for the first 14 heats, I think all of the heat wins came from gates 2 & 4. Later in the meeting this changed & gates 2 & 3 were the best. This is the problem with one off tracks, so much depends on gate position & to me this spoils the meeting. There was definitely some good racing but not a good track.

 

 

Well for me, good racing equals a good track.

 

Hancock won the Final, and was the top scorer... with a low 12 points for this kind of event. He dropped 3 points along the way, so it's genuinely, in my opinion, a good and fair track.

 

To drop 3 points and finish top, and see overtaking on both inside and out... that will do for me.

[BWitcher]

Too much emphasis is being put on the gates with regards to the overall racing in my opinion.

 

Sure, from a point of 'fairness' to the riders, in an ideal world the starting gates would be equal, or as close to as possible (in almost every speedway meeting certain gates are better than others).

 

In terms of exciting racing, equal starting gates could well have the opposite effect, allowing the better riders on the night to hit the front regardless of their gate. As it was, some riders had to work extra hard from the less favoured starts.

[DukesGreg]

We should let Ole Olsen set them up again if we're not chuffed with them.

 

 

Just watched the meeting back for a second time...

 

 

Did Pearson REALLY suggest... and mean... that Ben Barker was going to ride in a Semi-Final, which could have had an effect on the result in a first bend situation... after the tapes situation???

 

 

Please... tell me he was pulling my leg.

Edited June 26, 2011 by DukesGreg

[manchesterpaul]

MP we have all had spreadsheets that do this for for years ..... what we don't have to do at the same time though is look at the track... look at our screens .... listen to the producer in our ears and then also commentate

 

Surely it's a lot harder to have to calculate the permutations in one's head? Therefore, to be able to throw a 'quick glance' at a large full screen view of a spreadsheet with the correct info in plain sight would be easier.

 

It's enough to drive anyone insane... let alone inhibit them from making sense.... the point is though that our excel masterpieces are not enough.... they are too small... too fiddly and all those races where every point is vital requires a little calculation which quite frankly they dont have time or concentration for .......... I find myself lost in my monitor screen, comparing wins, 2nds, head to heads etc and suddenly realise that a race is about to start......

 

By the way Spook please read as well my reply to crumpiefan below which contains a very pretinent point.

 

Anyway on to your own observations, this is where i'm stunned (not at yourself lol). Again, i have zilch education in use of computers, programming or spreadsheets. Everything i learn is on a need to do basis. My girlfriend will often chuckle becasue i can actually get computers to do all sorts of amazing things, but at the same time be oblivious to a simple shortcut method in a word processor (because i don't work as a secretary etc.). But, if i on such an uneducated basis (computer wise) can provide a speadsheet that DOES ACCOMPLISH the calculations you mention above and present them in plain sight, why can't a professional broadcasting organization like Sky create or access the same?

 

I don't even use Excel, i use a free open source spreadsheet, and i haven't created a masterpiece. One doesn't need a masterpiece to do these calculations within a speadsheet. Again i state it isn't complex mathematics. My spreadsheet automatically sorts and colour codes the qualifiers and any unable to qualify despite having races to come. You simply glance at the screen.

 

Why on earth with even a simple spreadsheet would yourself or anyone have to bury your head in the screen?, the spreadsheet should automatically sort for you and colour code too.

 

Have a glance at my SGP MiniMax racacard for the British Grand Prix and on that you will see how my interactive spreadsheet displays the heats (with accumulative meeting and series scores for each rider in every race). Then take into account my interactive version also instantly displays the rider grid sorted by race wins etc. etc. Plus it also has the overall series standings instantly sorted too.

 

There is absolutely no need to study the screen and think, it's all done for you. All one has to do is type in 3,2,1,0 or whatever mishap befell a rider regards engine failures, falls or exclusions. If he's unfortunate to be struck by lightning then type in whatever word you wish such as zapped (lol) in the heat and it won't effect the speadsheet calculations. Indeed it will recognize that not finishing because one was struck by lightning is worth less than a last placed zero points finish and sort accordingly hee hee.

 

re: Sam Ermo ... yes he uses a Kandysoft spreadsheet (the plug I believe you are referring to) but I doubt that what he is doing is being seen by Kelvin or Nigel.... there is probably more chance that they are following the score updates on speedwayworld.tv... or filling their own spreads

 

I've tried not to mention the name of the software in order to give them the benefit of the doubt. As we all know it's human input error that is often the cause of errors in output of a computer. Although, even allowing for that, i do wonder at times if it works anywhere as well as my own quickly cobbled together version. Plus, of course, it could well be that the information from the software isn't being passed on to the commentators. So, i'll not decry the software without being in full possession of the facts. Why does Sam not correct the commentators or even fill us in with the information of what is at stake a lot more than he barely does now?

 

At the end of the day they have a studio team and they frequently make reference to Sam and his software etc. Yet we still find ourselves with incorrect information and the comical tell-tale sudden hesitation in the voice of the presenters when something clearly isn't right and often accompanied by puzzled looks. So shame on Sky if the correct information isn't being passed on to the viewers.

 

 

as regards the scorecards,i appreciate that the tv team have a lot of things going on in the background and also that sometimes

they are relying on the sgp scores or even ermolenkos software,but i couldn't agree more. i can be sat at home with the

speedway star scorecard or at the meeting with the programme but come the semis i seem to have a better grasp of who's in,who's out

and who has which pick.

the amount of times they'll say next up its aj and you know yourself its not!

overall though i think sky do a good job,after all if it wasn't on sky would we see any live speedway on tv?

 

I forgot to mention that in my original post, but let's be clear regarding some of the blunders last night (and in previous years) one did not need a spreadsheet to know that certain riders were already out of the meeting or had already qualified for the semi-finals. It was as you say yourself, and is often the case, that one just glances down at a basic racecard and can see why someone is out or in. No calculations needed it's staring you in the face.

 

Again my gripe and blame isn't aimed at the commentators as they have a lot of things to do. I certainly don't think i would be able to do their job. But it's up to the production team to have information fed to them. Whether that is by giving them a monitor with a spreadsheet 'like mine' lol that at a glance shows you what's what or someone who has one and then passes the info to them on a slip of paper or as a(nother) voice in their headphones.

 

Of course, i totally agree that it is good to have Sky showing speedway. I certainly wouldn't pick a broadcast to pieces regarding how many times a commentator stumbles over his words or repeats a phrase regularly. I always strongly suggest that those who over criticize such things to get a tape recorder and commentate on a couple of meetings. Then play it back see how often one is stumbling over one's words and often talking broken biscuits. Also, see how many catchphrases you end up with. Then theres the silence to fill inbetween the actual racing. Do take into consideration though that you won't have to hold a conversation with a co-commentator and have people talking to you and directing you to do things at the same time.

 

Of course i'm grateful to Sky for speedway and i've often praised their broadcasts too. However, let's remember it's a two-way deal, it isn't charity bestowed upon us. I only purchased Sky originally because of them broadcasting speedway. Accessing their 'exclusive' coverage of football was never a problem, I never missed a Manchester United match in any competition for years thanks to high quality streaming.

 

Sky now get from me monthly the considerable fees for the absolute total package they have. Whilst that is because i follow other sports such as Mixed Martial Arts, Nascar, American Football, American Ice Hockey and via the various channels practically every football tournament in the world and all of the top leagues, additionally we'll watch the film channels too etc....it is only because they show speedway that i initially purchased Sky. I'm sure many other fans have gone on to subscribe to more packages over time after getting it solely for speedway originally.

 

Therefore, i don't think it's too much to ask that they provide their viewers with CORRECT vitally important information ahead of the semi-finals.

 

Anyways, i truly enjoyed last night and thanks to Sky for broadcasting it WITH a studio team too. I can only barely imagine how good it must have been to have actually been there in the crowd at the meeting. Glad all those who went undoubtedly got an enjoyable reward for toddling along to the GP.

[Robyn1972]

I don't care how it come across on TV, being there Cardiff is just brilliant. As you run up the steps into the seating areas hearing the noise getting louder and louder until you walk in and that noise! WOW! 45,000 fans all cheering and booing. It's just brilliant.

 

I love it at Cardiff, I think it could all be from the gate but it would still be magical.

 

Throw in the chance to meet old and new friends. A great day out.

 

Don't think there was anything approaching 45k fans there yesterday TBH - looked way down on attendance to us. That notwithstanding it was enjoyable - although nothing like as good as last year. From a social perspective though - brilliant, can't be beaten. Sensational, even.

[BWitcher]

Don't think there was anything approaching 45k fans there yesterday TBH - looked way down on attendance to us. That notwithstanding it was enjoyable - although nothing like as good as last year. From a social perspective though - brilliant, can't be beaten. Sensational, even.

 

Where were you looking?

 

Think it depends what side of the stadium you were sat on and where. The top tier along the back straight looked pretty full, along the home straight, much much less so.

[tigerblues]

I haven't looked to quote it but I'm sure I've read on here today that there were over 43000 there Fully agree with what SCB said about the event in any case.

[Jacques]

Fourthed

 

 

Im not sure "fifthed" is a word, so i will just say i agree

 

Sixthed

 

Don't think there was anything approaching 45k fans there yesterday TBH - looked way down on attendance to us. That notwithstanding it was enjoyable - although nothing like as good as last year. From a social perspective though - brilliant, can't be beaten. Sensational, even.

 

I thought that, but having watched it back, the back straight stands were full. The crowd definitely looked more on the tv .

 

We had a brilliant time, in fact i'd say it was best weekend i've had there yet!!

[PHILIPRISING]

I haven't looked to quote it but I'm sure I've read on here today that there were over 43000 there Fully agree with what SCB said about the event in any case.

 

OFFICIAL attendance was 43,640 which, given the economy, the current state of domestic speedway in the UK and the lack of British riders. is quite remarkable and a great tribute to the loyal fans of the sport in this country.

 

BSI are quick to point out that no matter what they do, and the huge amounts of money they spend ensuring that the whole package can stand alongside any other sporting event held in Britain, ultimately it is the fans who make it happen.

[Cheekee Raylee Monkee]

 

Stevey Wonder would have seen Emils huge roller. Justice was served by him losing it under severe pressure from Holder,

but Noddy failed to get away cleanly in the rerun and that was that.

 

 

Remind me. Who does Email ride for in the UK? And Holder?

 

Oh yeah. Thought so.......

[ImpartialOne]

what i should have put was i'm looking forward to watching the gp again and interested in what the commentators say

about the various exclusions but i don't sit there making a mental note of any mistakes or things i don't agree with!!

 

(although when staechmann said that harris was correctly excluded in copenhagen that was a corker).

Stekkers was spot on but let's not go over that one again.