Backless Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 (edited) Dont know dont care, Im bloody fuming > and so shoud the rest of the Newport, perhaps the BSPA are anti Newport, because facts dont lie. Well, your facts regarding the Newcastle total include Mark Lemon & Jason King. Of course there wouldn't be any comment if they were replaced on the day by Derek Sneddon & Kyle Newman, with Richie Worrall at reserve. As in previous years, there's a qualifying number of matches to prevent team manipulation. Glasgow suffered last year. As at the 1st of July Doyle had ridden 3 matches, Gjedde 1. Instead of slagging off the organisers, it might be an idea to look closer to home, at a "promotion" who have run 5 home meetings since Easter. Edited July 19, 2011 by Backless Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lioness Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 fair points backless IF the qualifying criteria had been known in advance and thats why I have sympathy with the fans of the teams who have just missed out The whole problem if they are going to have a limited number of teams on the day and no qualifiers is that they make the rules up a few weeks before hand. Certain Newport fans werent so quick to shout 'foul' last season when Glasgow and Redcar were affected with Screen and Grieves. The whole situation could be avoided however if they would publish the criteria BEFORE the season starts, not a couple of weeks before the event when they have decided how they want to manipulate it That applies to ALL so called 'super' seven events Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RHayes Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 Well, your facts regarding the Newcastle total include Mark Lemon & Jason King. Of course there wouldn't be any comment if they were replaced on the day by Derek Sneddon & Kyle Newman, with Richie Worrall at reserve. As in previous years, there's a qualifying number of matches to prevent team manipulation. Glasgow suffered last year. As at the 1st of July Doyle had ridden 3 matches, Gjedde 1. Instead of slagging off the organisers, it might be an idea to look closer to home, at a "promotion" who have run 5 home meetings since Easter. And what could they do if no teams wanted to come down, throw out pointless challenge matches? I dont what the number of meetings Doyle and Gjedde had done have got to do with it, Gjedde and Doyle both averages anyway before then so your argument there is a bit pointless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Backless Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 fair points backless IF the qualifying criteria had been known in advance and thats why I have sympathy with the fans of the teams who have just missed out The whole problem if they are going to have a limited number of teams on the day and no qualifiers is that they make the rules up a few weeks before hand. Certain Newport fans werent so quick to shout 'foul' last season when Glasgow and Redcar were affected with Screen and Grieves. The whole situation could be avoided however if they would publish the criteria BEFORE the season starts, not a couple of weeks before the event when they have decided how they want to manipulate it That applies to ALL so called 'super' seven events Well they were known last year - if only in the west half of Scotland. Nothing's changed. They're hardly going to detail the fine print of qualifying in the short press release. Qualifiers wouldn't necessarily solve the situation. Newcastle (as I quoted them above) would have walked through the qualifiers early in the season (say Bach, Lemon, Robson, Sneddon)only to be represented by (at present) Robson, Nedermark, Sneddon & Newman. Where the BSPA have screwed things up is with Leicester, unless they're going to exclude Karlsson, Nemo & Bager Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RHayes Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 fair points backless IF the qualifying criteria had been known in advance and thats why I have sympathy with the fans of the teams who have just missed out The whole problem if they are going to have a limited number of teams on the day and no qualifiers is that they make the rules up a few weeks before hand. Certain Newport fans werent so quick to shout 'foul' last season when Glasgow and Redcar were affected with Screen and Grieves. The whole situation could be avoided however if they would publish the criteria BEFORE the season starts, not a couple of weeks before the event when they have decided how they want to manipulate it That applies to ALL so called 'super' seven events Why would we? We werent able to qualify last season because we didnt have enough points, whereas this we and Newcastle have and have been excluded in favour for two sides with lower top 4 averages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Backless Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 And what could they do if no teams wanted to come down, throw out pointless challenge matches? I dont what the number of meetings Doyle and Gjedde had done have got to do with it, Gjedde and Doyle both averages anyway before then so your argument there is a bit pointless. Is that the best that can be offered for one match in May & one in June/ "Nobody wanted to play with us"? The argument made is to stop team manipulation. Gjedde had ONE match for Newport. That's the point. The fact that he has a previous career is what's irrelevant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Backless Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 (edited) Why would we? We werent able to qualify last season because we didnt have enough points, whereas this we and Newcastle have and have been excluded in favour for two sides with lower top 4 averages. Lioness wasn't (I presume) suggesting that Newport fans would be up in arms over Screen & Grieves. The point is that the rules are in place and have been for some considerable time - not just to be implemented to suppress the Welsh Why would we? We werent able to qualify last season because we didnt have enough points, whereas this we and Newcastle have and have been excluded in favour for two sides with lower top 4 averages. And what team do you think Newcastle are going to put out? If team manipulation prevention doesn't meet with your satisfaction, what about only including riders who have the requisite number of functioning limbs? Edited July 19, 2011 by Backless Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RHayes Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 Is that the best that can be offered for one match in May & one in June/ "Nobody wanted to play with us"? The argument made is to stop team manipulation. Gjedde had ONE match for Newport. That's the point. The fact that he has a previous career is what's irrelevant. Grow up, act like an adult - if its at all possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Backless Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 Grow up, act like an adult - if its at all possible. Seemed like a perfectly apt response to "And what could they do if no teams wanted to come down". Why else would teams "come down"? Just for a chat? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RHayes Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 (edited) Seemed like a perfectly apt response to "And what could they do if no teams wanted to come down". Why else would teams "come down"? Just for a chat? Btw, which team do you support? Edited July 19, 2011 by LFC1892 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The~SAINT Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 Grow up, act like an adult - if its at all possible. says the man who called somebody "a complete fool" BEFORE checking his facts!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RHayes Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 says the man who called somebody "a complete fool" BEFORE checking his facts!!!!! My mathematics are correct, unless they do it differently in Sheffield? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lioness Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 Well they were known last year - if only in the west half of Scotland. Nothing's changed. I would disagree there Backless though I could be interpreting it wrong. Michael Max clearly stated on quite a few occasions from centre green recently - including last night - that they werent sure if they were in or not and were waiting on a decision or clarification from the BSPA. To save any misunderstanding though surely the simple thing is every year post with the rest of the stuff the criteria for the super seven events and agree them at the conference? I understand your point on qualifiers, a team could have a totally different top four by the time the finals come round but I suppose tht just highlights there is no perfect solution Why would we? We werent able to qualify last season because we didnt have enough points, whereas this we and Newcastle have and have been excluded in favour for two sides with lower top 4 averages. The point being that too many who are now up in arms were the ones who were basically not bothered when it happened to other clubs - self interest is not just prevalent amongst the promoters. That doesnt change the fact that I do have sympathy for those clubs who missed out but in fairness as Backless has indicated, most of us could see that Gjedde would not be included for Newport. Perhaps if we as well as the promoters looked at the bigger picture and didnt just make our voices heard when its 'our' club they might just start to listen (on the other hand this IS the BSPA we ar0e talking about! Btw, which team do you support? I dont know who Backless supports and tbh I think its irrelevant - he is looking at the broad picture on a shared event. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RHayes Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 (edited) I would disagree there Backless though I could be interpreting it wrong. Michael Max clearly stated on quite a few occasions from centre green recently - including last night - that they werent sure if they were in or not and were waiting on a decision or clarification from the BSPA. To save any misunderstanding though surely the simple thing is every year post with the rest of the stuff the criteria for the super seven events and agree them at the conference? I understand your point on qualifiers, a team could have a totally different top four by the time the finals come round but I suppose tht just highlights there is no perfect solution The point being that too many who are now up in arms were the ones who were basically not bothered when it happened to other clubs - self interest is not just prevalent amongst the promoters. That doesnt change the fact that I do have sympathy for those clubs who missed out but in fairness as Backless has indicated, most of us could see that Gjedde would not be included for Newport. Perhaps if we as well as the promoters looked at the bigger picture and didnt just make our voices heard when its 'our' club they might just start to listen (on the other hand this IS the BSPA we ar0e talking about! I dont know who Backless supports and tbh I think its irrelevant - he is looking at the broad picture on a shared event. Agreed, if the cliching point is that Gjedde cant ride for us then fair enough but if Gjedde cant ride, will Leicester use Bager, Niemenen and Karlsson? Of course they will even though they've done less meetings than Charlie. Criteria needs to be satated at the beginning of the season then at least the supporters, who are always kept in the dark, will know whats going on. Edited July 19, 2011 by LFC1892 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DW Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 I think it's obvious why Newport and Berwick are not in the fours and it's because their teams at that time didn't have their new signings riding enough meetings. Ipswich seem to be in due to Lemon's absence. Not sure whether Sweetman would be eligible for Glasgow as Grajczonek seems to be the qualifying rider as of 1/7/11. Equally Leicester may have to track a team of reserves!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinny Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 I have no problem with us not being in if the fact that Doyle, Gjedde and Sedgmen didnt ride enough meetings at the cut off date. What I do have a problem with is how Leicester will track a team of Karlsson, Bager, Nieminen and Bondarenko despite three of them signing well under a month ago. Theres no way Leicester as hosts will field a team of Bondarenko, graversen, Oliver and Wright. That is what my argument is, if Leicester do field their bottom 4 riders then fair enough but we all know that wont happen. The sport is a farce. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulco Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 I have no problem with us not being in if the fact that Doyle, Gjedde and Sedgmen didnt ride enough meetings at the cut off date. What I do have a problem with is how Leicester will track a team of Karlsson, Bager, Nieminen and Bondarenko despite three of them signing well under a month ago. Theres no way Leicester as hosts will field a team of Bondarenko, graversen, Oliver and Wright. That is what my argument is, if Leicester do field their bottom 4 riders then fair enough but we all know that wont happen. The sport is a farce. There lies the biggest problem . Most Newport fans might be upset , but can kind of understand that maybe Gjedde , Doyle and Sedgmen might have been signed too late for them to be included . However if the hosts are then allowed to use Neiminen , Bagar and Karlsson it flies in the face of all known qualifying criteria . Ok nobody wants to force the hosts to field a ridiculously weak foursome , but it's a big problem for the organisers - though it's one of their own making . But no doubt they'll just stick their heads in the sand and ignore any difficult questions . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The SAINT Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 My mathematics are correct, unless they do it differently in Sheffield? we don't do maths any different in sheffield but we do check who is eligible BEFORE doing the adding up!!!! leicester are in it as HOSTS ie/ to make the event financially viable eg/ does anyone remember englands most glorious summer 1966 - we DIDN'T qualify for that event - we were in it as hosts (as is every world cup hosting country). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flagrag Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 It was confirmed to me last week that Leicester are unable to use Nemo and Karlson as will not have rode enough matches by the meeting date. The team will likely be Bager,Bondarenko,Oliver,Graverson and Wright as reserve. There was also some doubt on Lasse Bjerre as meant to be riding in Poland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
screm Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 There lies the biggest problem . Most Newport fans might be upset , but can kind of understand that maybe Gjedde , Doyle and Sedgmen might have been signed too late for them to be included . However if the hosts are then allowed to use Neiminen , Bagar and Karlsson it flies in the face of all known qualifying criteria . Ok nobody wants to force the hosts to field a ridiculously weak foursome , but it's a big problem for the organisers - though it's one of their own making . But no doubt they'll just stick their heads in the sand and ignore any difficult questions . Im sure there will be some kind if subsection in the rulebook that covers the Leicester situation very nicely.IMO if Newport get into the Fours they should be able to use their best 4. Wonder if the BSPA have ever thought of qualifiers for the Fours,you never know they may be popular meetings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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