Nominations 2011

[TrueBee]

It will be embarrassing if Kołodziej is not given a wild card...

[ladyluck]

It will be embarrassing if Kołodziej is not given a wild card...

 

Not as far as Hans Andersen is concerned, according to quotes attributed to the Dane in the Speedway Star. Andersen, it seems, believes Kołodziej's failure to get through the qualifiers means the Polish champion isn't worthy. Guess who Andersen thinks is worthy. Yes, he thinks Hans Andersen is worthy, despite his failure to qualify for a second season running. Andersen, of course, believes the qualifiers are beneath him. He has done ever since the last time he needed them, back in 2006.

[Blazeaway]

Not as far as Hans Andersen is concerned, according to quotes attributed to the Dane in the Speedway Star. Andersen, it seems, believes Kołodziej's failure to get through the qualifiers means the Polish champion isn't worthy. Guess who Andersen thinks is worthy. Yes, he thinks Hans Andersen is worthy, despite his failure to qualify for a second season running. Andersen, of course, believes the qualifiers are beneath him. He has done ever since the last time he needed them, back in 2006.

 

 

Outrageous, Andersen should be nowhere near the GP's next season.

[salty]

Not as far as Hans Andersen is concerned, according to quotes attributed to the Dane in the Speedway Star. Andersen, it seems, believes Kołodziej's failure to get through the qualifiers means the Polish champion isn't worthy. Guess who Andersen thinks is worthy. Yes, he thinks Hans Andersen is worthy, despite his failure to qualify for a second season running. Andersen, of course, believes the qualifiers are beneath him. He has done ever since the last time he needed them, back in 2006.

Andersen's comments made me smile as well. The actual quote was "Kolodziej missed out in the qualifier. If he had been so good, he should have qualified" Ironic doesn't do it justice since Hans finished 12th.

[hboy]

why was it he was number 12 he has also just been riding with broken finger and pressed rips

[ladyluck]

Andersen's comments made me smile as well. The actual quote was "Kolodziej missed out in the qualifier. If he had been so good, he should have qualified" Ironic doesn't do it justice since Hans finished 12th.

 

Andersen has, of course, started "bigging up" his injury problems, while conveniently forgetting Kołodziej's engine failure in Vojens. To be honest, Andersen always comes out with unworthy comments following a bitter defeat. He had those mysterious engine problems when Gollob made a mug of him in the SWC final in 2007 and the Poles were cheats anyway. It's a shame because there is talent there, but Andersen has slowly returned to type after that "up your's" season in 2006 when it really looked like he was going to be a genuine contender.

Andersen should start to take things on the chin, rather like his compatriot Nicki Pedersen has done.

Edited October 15, 2010 by ladyluck

[ladyluck]

why was it he was number 12 he has also just been riding with broken finger and pressed rips

 

Why did Kołodziej not qualify? Yes, he had an engine failure in his final ride in Vojens.

What was Andersen's excuse for his failure last season? Why has Andersen under-performed since that fabulous season in 2006 when he had a point to prove? Andersen drifted before that jolt of exclusion from the series at the end of 2005 and has drifted since he once again entered the comfort zone of believing a GP place was his by right.

[Ghostwalker]

Why did Kołodziej not qualify? Yes, he had an engine failure in his final ride in Vojens.

What was Andersen's excuse for his failure last season? Why has Andersen under-performed since that fabulous season in 2006 when he had a point to prove? Andersen drifted before that jolt of exclusion from the series at the end of 2005 and has drifted since he once again entered the comfort zone of believing a GP place was his by right.

 

one could also ask why Hans A (and AJ and Nicki too) didn't ride in the qualifiers.

Edited October 15, 2010 by Ghostwalker

[spook]

no one has an excuse if they don't ride in the qualifiers...... but as Dave Jessup can testify an ef is as good as a zero.... and while I dont disagree that Kolodziej has announced a world class status this year in particular ...I always find it disappointing when forumers start plumbing the depths to prove their point

 

It is a fact that Hans Andersen rode the latter group of GP's injured and that his form following that injury differed greatly from before......... previous to the injury he was top 8... in my book and in IMG's book a top 8 finish is good enough for the following year.... just like an ef is only as good as a zero, an injury can wreck a season that the record books will not show later

 

I have been far from being a Hans Andersen fan over the years but he would be hard done by to be kicked out of possibly the strongest lineup ever when he was sitting quite pretty before his misfortune............. I stand by what I have said from the start of the threads on this subject... and that is that it should be a close thing between Hans and Janusz...... the choice is almost certainly going to be political

[HenryW]

one could also ask why Hans A (and AJ and Nicki too) didn't ride in the qualifiers.

As a fan of his, I might a little biased, but I think Nicki should be left out of that kind of discussion.

 

Despite him suffering a bad season for him, Nicki made 8 semi-finals in 11 GPs, and in one of the others he was injured in his first race and then was obviously still injured in the next round. Only 2 riders made more semi-finals than Nicki this year, and they were Tomek and Jarek. If you discount the 2 injury GPs, Nicki was averaging over 9 points per GP yet finished just 5 points outside of the top 8...

 

Given that, and his SGP record over the years, I think it's perfectly acceptable for Nicki to have sat out the qualifiers to give other Danes a chance. After all, failure to qualify due to injuries to star performers was one of the primary reasons for BSI retaining the right to select riders for the series.

 

Anyway....If Nicki had done the qualifiers, what good would it have done him? He would have been out injured and missed out in them too...Would that have made him more or less deserving of a place next year?

 

As for the other 2, AJ has had a shocker of a season by his own standards. The jeers of the locals in Bydgoszcz when he stepped onto the podium in the final SGP said all you needed to know...

 

Having said that, injury or not, AJ was still better than Hans this year, and I don't think Hans has a case against either AJ or Koldi.

 

Nicki, Emil and Koldi have to be picked if the SGP has any credibility....After them, AJ has probably made himself the best choice for 4th pick with his win in Bydgoszcz.

[ladyluck]

They can and they will can you imagine the 3 gp`s that`ll be in poland next year 4 poles in the line up and a wildcard !! Won`t happen i`m afraid.....

 

The tide seems to be turning. A few weeks ago, perhaps even a few days ago, I'd have agreed with you, but it seems that Kołodziej's candidature has the momentum behind it. Barring devine intervention, there will be only a sole Briton in the GPs next season and you have to wonder when that representation will increase again.

As someone else has commented, perhaps in the Tai Woffinden thread, it's awfully tough to get into the GPs via the qualifiers. It'll require either a nomination or a huge effort. For me, this season has seen Woffinden, Britain's big hope, slip down the standings of young riders. He should, to repeat, have stayed clear of the GPs this season and concentrated on the Under-21s. Apart from Woffinden (and the qualified Harris) there is no one else close to GP standard.

So, Russia will have two GPers, Poland four and Britain only one next season. furthermore, I see no reason why the Poles should be denied a local "wild card" for the Polish-staged GPs next season, unless other nations allocated nominations are similarly treated. That would mean the Danish and Swedish-staged GPs.

[ladyluck]

I have been far from being a Hans Andersen fan over the years but he would be hard done by to be kicked out of possibly the strongest lineup ever when he was sitting quite pretty before his misfortune.............

 

Hardly "sitting pretty", he was down around eighth place and he also failed to qualify last season, in a "weaker" line-up. The last time Andersen was kicked out of the GPs it was the correct decision (the only problem was that a rider who performed worse than him - Lee Richardson - was given the nod) and Andersen subsequently had his best season the following year. Since that "proving a point" season, he has reverted to drifting.

Regarding the qualifiers, how many GPers rode in the qualifiers this season? It's a serious question. Harris, Zetterstrom and Lindgren made the final, while Woffinden failed to make it that far, but what about the likes of Bjerre, Andersen and Jonsson? Others have more valid reasons for missing them. For example, the likes of Gollob, Crump, Hancock and Nicki Pedersen would be either nailed-on certainties to qualify, get a nomination or call it quits. Rune Holta was in two minds about riding the GPs this season, so he'd probably have quit if he didn't make the grade.

Edited October 16, 2010 by ladyluck

[Robbie B]

Personally I think that the nominations should be scrapped.

 

Bring back the GP Challenge, with the bottom seven riders in the GP standings racing against the top nine riders from the GP Final, with the top seven or eight (maybe even having no wild cards) making up the 2011 GP series.

 

It would help the current GP riders as they wouldn't have to go through the GP qualifying rounds, thus making space for other riders to compete.

 

And we would have the best riders in the GP, who have earned the place, this would make a proper World Championship.

 

Nominations are just pure PC gone mad, just to please TV rights in countries, which as far as I'm concerned is wrong, riders should be there on merit only.

[westhamboy66]

Personally I think that the nominations should be scrapped.

 

Bring back the GP Challenge, with the bottom seven riders in the GP standings racing against the top nine riders from the GP Final, with the top seven or eight (maybe even having no wild cards) making up the 2011 GP series.

 

It would help the current GP riders as they wouldn't have to go through the GP qualifying rounds, thus making space for other riders to compete.

 

And we would have the best riders in the GP, who have earned the place, this would make a proper World Championship.

 

Nominations are just pure PC gone mad, just to please TV rights in countries, which as far as I'm concerned is wrong, riders should be there on merit only.

Good post Robbie. Yes proper qualification would give more credability to the GP series. Although I am more of a traditionalist I love the GP's but there are simply too many picks for whoever the TV Company wants. One wildcard max. That way if there were an injury to one of the top riders as with Billy Hammill then common sense would prevail. Emil would get the pick this year and that seems fair to me.

Edited October 16, 2010 by westhamboy66

[spook]

Hardly "sitting pretty", he was down around eighth place and he also failed to qualify last season, in a "weaker" line-up. The last time Andersen was kicked out of the GPs it was the correct decision (the only problem was that a rider who performed worse than him - Lee Richardson - was given the nod) and Andersen subsequently had his best season the following year. Since that "proving a point" season, he has reverted to drifting.

 

If he didnt suffer his injury then it is right to make an assumption that there was a very good chance that he would have continued his form..... top 8 is top 8.... the point I am making is that regardless of what has happened in previous seasons or regardless of how he hasnt fulfilled the promise that others felt he had, he actually doesnt deserve to be booted out.... and anyone who has been in his relative points position to the rest has only previously suffered it through political decisions.......

 

GP history dictates that it is harder to get into the GP's from the cold than it is to remain in the series from outside of the top 8 ..... and i'd suggest more so these days with the sheer quality that is in the lineup..... like I said I think it is more likely that this will be a political decision than a comment on form...it could well come down to just how surplus to requirements Hans Andersen is as it could be argued that his chances of getting back in are less than Kolodziej's....... or it could simply come down to IMG's attitude for 2011 on how important quota is.... or maybe it will come down to £££££'s on the table

 

no matter what league or riders we obsess over it is naive to suggest that IMG have worked in any other way than the way that they have over the years and there are currently two Polish riders in the top 4 who can provide testament to it

[spook]

Personally I think that the nominations should be scrapped.

 

Bring back the GP Challenge, with the bottom seven riders in the GP standings racing against the top nine riders from the GP Final, with the top seven or eight (maybe even having no wild cards) making up the 2011 GP series.

 

It would help the current GP riders as they wouldn't have to go through the GP qualifying rounds, thus making space for other riders to compete.

 

And we would have the best riders in the GP, who have earned the place, this would make a proper World Championship.

 

Nominations are just pure PC gone mad, just to please TV rights in countries, which as far as I'm concerned is wrong, riders should be there on merit only.

 

 

Good post Robbie. Yes proper qualification would give more credability to the GP series. Although I am more of a traditionalist I love the GP's but there are simply too many picks for whoever the TV Company wants. One wildcard max. That way if there were an injury to one of the top riders as with Billy Hammill then common sense would prevail. Emil would get the pick this year and that seems fair to me.

 

 

It would certainly simplify things ....... I never have been a fan of the amount of wildcards that IMG and BSI have dished out over the years but I do think that they need at least two tbh........ for instance with Robbie's plan Emil gets the wildcard...... but he hasnt been the only injured rider .... so if the qualification night took place at the end of the season then that would have raised question marks over the fitness of at least Hans, Bomber and Freddie....... earlier in the season a question mark over Nicki P at least

 

Maybe we have got too used to the system in place and need a bit more of the ruthlessness that we had with the world championship qualifying ......but if you think it gets political over 4 wildcards wait until the day there is just 1..... is it such an easy decision between Emil and Nicki? What would it be in other years?

[ladyluck]

I always find it disappointing when forumers start plumbing the depths to prove their point

 

 

If he didnt suffer his injury then it is right to make an assumption that there was a very good chance that he would have continued his form.....

 

Ever thought of practicing what you preach?

You can't say what would've happened if Andersen hadn't suffered injuries, just as you can't say what would've happened in the cases of Sayfutdinov and Nicki Pedersen. Would they have been top eight? Where would there top eight status leave, potentially, Bjerre and Holder? Out of the candidates the sad truth is that Andersen has the worst case, although had Jonsson not won in Bydgoszcz his case would've been worse.

[spook]

Ever thought of practicing what you preach?

You can't say what would've happened if Andersen hadn't suffered injuries, just as you can't say what would've happened in the cases of Sayfutdinov and Nicki Pedersen. Would they have been top eight? Where would there top eight status leave, potentially, Bjerre and Holder? Out of the candidates the sad truth is that Andersen has the worst case, although had Jonsson not won in Bydgoszcz his case would've been worse.

 

well thats all a bit unecessary and direct isnt it?

tbh yes I think I am practising what I preach...... the reality is that I have little respect for Andersen's riding style or attitude over the years but it doesnt stop me seeing the bigger picture.... I have my favourites and I have my preferences (and yes Janusz is in both categories) but none of that makes any difference to the outcome.... the only thing that does in the end is who IMG pick... so therefore (while being direct has apparently been given the green light) it is pointless me coming up with things like a 'tide that seems to be turning' when it is seemingly based on other forumer opinions and what could be an obvious tactic by the Polish federation.... just because we might want something to be so it doesnt mean it necessarily will be ... I would have thought that recent years were strewn with evidence of that one!

 

the best way of working out who will be included is by studying IMG/BSI's behaviour of the past and that has included things such as: nationality, quota spread, did a rider finish in touching distance of the final 8? a GP win? injury, previous chances, someone on the sidelines who deserves their place (who knows what IMG's criteria for that one is!)......someone looking at these kind of things objectively should start seeing that it should/could actually be a close call.......

 

as fans its a win win situation because we have such a strong lineup now that it probably means that we only get to have one of Hans or Janusz.... Hans who was in 2 finals and 3 semis... and Janusz who was in 2 out of 2 semis as wildcard and a top dog in the league.... for me personally it would be great if we could replace a gating, slick track liking, poacher and blocker with a blasting racer who should up the excitement....but I dont get to make the picks!

[ladyluck]

Hans who was in 2 finals and 3 semis... and Janusz who was in 2 out of 2 semis as wildcard and a top dog in the league....

 

Well, it is clear now why you think it could be a close call. You have under-stated Kołodziej's performances in the GPs. It wasn't just two semi-finals; it was two finals.

As for my "tide is changing comment", that pertained to the British representation being set at two. My comment is not just based on a couple of forum posts and the grandstanding of the PZM boss, but more on the article from Philip Rising in the Speedway Star. Rising is, supposedly, well connected when it comes to BSI.

You suggest that the best way of "working out" who'll be picked is to study BSI's past choices. In that case you should obviously discount both Andersen and Kołodziej in favour of a random Briton. Remember, Richardson was picked and Andersen dropped at the end of 2005. However, as I said, the tide seems to be turning. Don't let yourself get caught swimming against it.

[Mark]

Hardly "sitting pretty", he was down around eighth place and he also failed to qualify last season, in a "weaker" line-up. .

 

I dont care if he gets a wildcard as I'd like the best 16, forget the TV politics, race in the gp's.

 

But to correct you he was 7th before Pedersen brought him down in the 7th GP in Sweden. I spoke with his team in Italy and his injuries were nasty with broken fingers on his clutch hand and injured ribs. Even you would have to agree that to carry on riding was to his credit. No surprise he went backwards having made the Cardiff final just 1 GP prior to injury.