Rotskiracing Posted November 19, 2003 Report Share Posted November 19, 2003 This is totally ridiculous. Speedway meetings without T/S will not be the same. It's been a part of speedway for me for over 20 years and they've scrapped it for a pile of rubbish Why wont they for once listen to what the supporters want as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GM Posted November 19, 2003 Report Share Posted November 19, 2003 To me the way it must have came about was they had all read it the speedway starr the same as all of us that they were going to move heat eight up to heat five to stop the reserve and number two faceing a tac sub ride. But then some bright spark stood up and said "I know" we will just through out the tac sub rule then they all by now with servere heat stroke and dieing to get to the bar agreed what a great idea they all shouted. Wait until they wake up tomorrow with there hang overs and hopfully realise what they have done They have turned our sport on its head and its about time there was an independent comittie that ruled on the sport with no conections to any club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTL Posted November 19, 2003 Report Share Posted November 19, 2003 We all loved the Golden Joker in the KO Cup last year didn't we! (NOT!) Obviously Len has had another senior moment in suggesting this and it would appear that all of the other promoters should be booking thier spots in their local eventide homes for the confused after this potty decision. BRING BACK TACCY SUBS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayEmm Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 This maybe a positive change or not depending on how it is implemented and what the rule actually means. I am going to reserve my judgement until I know what the new rules actually are rather than responding on the basis of headlines. The devil will be in the detail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
born_2b_mad Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 For crying out loud, what is it with those dithering fools. I give up.......a complete waste of space the lot of them. Why the hell don't they listen to the paying public for once, they all know how much it was hated during the KOC trial, and yet they still make idiots of themselves by bringing it in full-time. Once again the BSPA are an embarasment to the Sport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryce Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 I thought the that one of the major aims of the conference would be to try and make speedway less confusing for the casual armchair fan who might be tempted along to see the sport live. Then they come up with this ridiculous pile of tosh. I really cannot think of another sport that shoots itself in the foot so consistently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DW Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 I would think the rule will be the same as used in the KOC last season.i.e you can use it whenever you're 8 down.I bet you're not allowed to move your heat leaders out of 1,3 and 5, meaning it will be harder to win races away, to get 6 points and possibly leading to run-away home wins? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Star Fever Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 At last the horribly unfair TS rule has gone! Why the heck should a team who may have contrived to be 6pts down be able to whack in their heat-leaders at opportune moments? How may times have we seen poor teams with 3 good heat-leaders win a match when they shouldn't have done? OK it may still happen, but at least this way they have to do it the hard way with 2 out of the 3 GTs from programmed rides. Lynn lost out v. Sheffield in the KOC with these rules (was this the only time the new rules enabled a win?) but it was one of the best matches at Lynn this season because of them. The moves are much more 'tactical' than 'substitute' and have far more credibility than the old rule imo. Great idea, I reckon - but if others don't like it then thats fair enough, we're all entitled to our opinions. But lets see a full season of it first eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racer X Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 At last the horribly unfair TS rule has gone! Why the heck should a team who may have contrived to be 6pts down be able to whack in their heat-leaders at opportune moments? How may times have we seen poor teams with 3 good heat-leaders win a match when they shouldn't have done? OK it may still happen, but at least this way they have to do it the hard way with 2 out of the 3 GTs from programmed rides. Lynn lost out v. Sheffield in the KOC with these rules (was this the only time the new rules enabled a win?) but it was one of the best matches at Lynn this season because of them. The moves are much more 'tactical' than 'substitute' and have far more credibility than the old rule imo. Great idea, I reckon - but if others don't like it then thats fair enough, we're all entitled to our opinions. But lets see a full season of it first eh? Star Fever - were you awake when the KO Cup was being ridden? And as for a poor team doing well with tacticals - good grief it served King's Lynn pretty well didn't it?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulboy Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 To my mind the great problem with this Golden Double/Joker etc is that it can positively encourage race fixing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racer X Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 I understand that the decisions at the Conference have yet to be ratified and in the fans and sponsors can kick up a big enough stink over this, I reckon we can get this suicidal rule change kicked into touch. First we have to note whether Nigel Pearson is really worth his salt and whether he will report the finding of the poll going on with this web site. Some sort of letter writing, emailing of faxing campaign would be useful. I would recommend if you were going to do any of the above to keep your communications civil DO NOT SWEAR and communicate your disgust and dislike of this rule either to your own Promoter or the BSPA or prefererably both. If enough of us get of our bums I reckon we can make a real difference to our sport. I feel that the BSPA have grossly underestimated the hatred of this rule and it is up to us to try and swing them round to the sensible option of ditching the the Golden Double. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest chicken george Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 The golden double is one of the best things to happen to speedway for a long time we need to keep it to keep speedway alive . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabbit Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 At last the horribly unfair TS rule has gone! Why the heck should a team who may have contrived to be 6pts down be able to whack in their heat-leaders at opportune moments? How may times have we seen poor teams with 3 good heat-leaders win a match when they shouldn't have done? OK it may still happen, but at least this way they have to do it the hard way with 2 out of the 3 GTs from programmed rides. So if the riders are nominated at the start of the meeting, do the rides have to be their programmed rides? We're not talking replacing riders in heat 14 with a top gun or something? I'm just trying to get exactly how this will work before making my mind up - if it is programmed rides then why not? You still have to be 8 points down and the rider still has to go out and win their programmed race to make the maximum benefit. Can't see what the fuss is about...think it will just make team managers work harder and we'll see more tactics. TS's are fine but have always benefitted top heavy teams, I'll willing to give anything a shot if it will make for more exciting meetings - being able to bring out a top heat leader over a lesser rider in heat 14 when a teams worked hard to get a decent lead always seemed unfair anyway, especially when a good top 2 will be out in the next race. Just my opinion before I'm branded a heretic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racer X Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 The golden double is one of the best things to happen to speedway for a long time we need to keep it to keep speedway alive . OK I am interested in the reasons why people support this. Why is it one of the best things to happen - considering the universal oppostion to the rule from almost all quarters? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frigbo Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 How do i explain to new visitors (and hope to retain a modicum of credibility) that someone gets 6 in one particular race and only 3 for all their other heat wins?? This rule created false results in the KOC last year (apparently, as i boycotted it because of stupid rules!), this is going to radically affect the Bonus Point situation and in my opinion takes a huge amount of skill out of Team Managing. The only consolation is that it will save me a shed load of money during the summer because i shalln't be frequenting Blunsdon to watch It's a Knockout every Thursday!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest chicken george Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 How do i explain to new visitors (and hope to retain a modicum of credibility) that someone gets 6 in one particular race and only 3 for all their other heat wins?? This rule created false results in the KOC last year (apparently, as i boycotted it because of stupid rules!), this is going to radically affect the Bonus Point situation and in my opinion takes a huge amount of skill out of Team Managing. The only consolation is that it will save me a shed load of money during the summer because i shalln't be frequenting Blunsdon to watch It's a Knockout every Thursday!! shut up you stay in to watch eastenders Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frigbo Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 (edited) How do i explain to new visitors (and hope to retain a modicum of credibility) that someone gets 6 in one particular race and only 3 for all their other heat wins?? This rule created false results in the KOC last year (apparently, as i boycotted it because of stupid rules!), this is going to radically affect the Bonus Point situation and in my opinion takes a huge amount of skill out of Team Managing. The only consolation is that it will save me a shed load of money during the summer because i shalln't be frequenting Blunsdon to watch It's a Knockout every Thursday!! shut up you stay in to watch eastenders Could always come round your house for tea!! Edited November 20, 2003 by frigbo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace_of_clubs Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 Does the fact that 7 votes have been made in favour of this stupid rule suggest that we have 7 BSPA lurkers on the forum? If so I hope they're taking notice of the 92%+ of supporters. There are just so many reasons why this rule is insane it would take all day to list them. And clearly it is going to encourage 'race fixing' it makes sense to drop a point if you are going to be gifted 3 points back for nothing from your No.1 in the next heat. This rule is just so bizarre and off the wall even by BSPA standards, I cant really believe its true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted November 20, 2003 Author Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 Apology from Neil Machin in the Sheffield programme May 23 2003, 08:18 AM First of all an apology. It follows widespread criticism of the new KO Cup rules relating to the golden double facilities, which were designed to bring scores closer without actually diminishing the spectacle in any way. We will obviously accommodate the rules this year for the remaining cup fixtures, but your voices have been heard and the item will be revisited at the next AGM. http://www.speedway-forum.co.uk/forums/ind...c=1737&hl=joker Many of the fans complained about this rule this year but now they bring it into the main league! 91.67% of the votes so far say we don't want it. Will the speedway star have the guts to offer a national vote in their magazine on this issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabbit Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 (edited) And clearly it is going to encourage 'race fixing' it makes sense to drop a point if you are going to be gifted 3 points back for nothing from your No.1 in the next heat. AoC's point just proves that we need more information on this - he's viewing it a completely different way to how I am. Are the nominated riders only allowed to go for double in their programmed rides or can they come in to replace another rider in the style of the old tactical and go for double points? I'm seen plenty of people spouting off on this rule but no-one seems to have the answer to this pretty important factor or is everyone so blindly against it they don't care what the finer points are??? If they'll be used in the same way as a tactical now (for example a heat leader coming in in ht 14 to replace a 2nd string etc) then I agree it seems ludicrous if they can get double points. But, if that same heat leader is nominated to ride in heat 13 as per his programmed ride and his team is 8 points behind, he still has to go out and win that heat over his other 3 heat leader opponents to get the maximum advantage. If this applies, I've no real problem with it replacing the old style t/s. Edited November 20, 2003 by rabbit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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