Scunthorpe Saints V ...rye Cobras Sun 4th July

[waco]

Marc has broken collarbone so his dad tells me as they left hospital at dinner time. get well soon mate

This is cruel luck for Marc ..who was making rapid progress this season..I, and im sure Ben, wish Marc a speedy recovery

[Shadders]

Semion the crowd is good for the NL, for the club to go up it needs some backing, i think the reason the crowds have fallen slightly is is because of the promise last year the team was going up, my feelings are if we can go up the missing supporters will come back, at present we are getting around 500 to 600 on a friday, when the club first started we were getting around a 1000 at the meetings,i think the missing people will come back with better speedway, thats just my feelings, i could be wrong, but that is most peoples opinions that go on fridays.

Yes, but will the "missing people" stay if you don't produce a winning side?... Take the example of Newport, who's crowds dipped alarmingly after they lost a few home matches.

 

 

Marc has broken collarbone so his dad tells me as they left hospital at dinner time. get well soon mate

That's a real blow to Marc and the Cobras.. wishing him a speedy recovery... Cheers Benji

Edited July 5, 2010 by Shadders

[Shadders]

Marc has broken collarbone so his dad tells me as they left hospital at dinner time. get well soon mate

That's a real blow to Marc and the Cobras.. wishing him a speedy recovery... Cheers Benji

[IronScorpion]

That's a real blow to Marc and the Cobras.. wishing him a speedy recovery... Cheers Benji

 

What is the last bit supposed to imply It was a racing incident where Benji rode on the inside of Marc at bend 3 & continued round. Unfortunately, he clipped the kerb causing him to collect Marcs front wheel resulting in Marc breaking his collarbone hitting the floor before the air fence. His family & friends, who i had been speeaking to during the PL meet were sat/stood just infront of us. His mum and a few others ran, out of concern to the stricken Marc, whereas Benji had rode round to also check on his condition. Please edit your last implication as it is well out of order.

[Shadders]

What is the last bit supposed to imply It was a racing incident where Benji rode on the inside of Marc at bend 3 & continued round. Unfortunately, he clipped the kerb causing him to collect Marcs front wheel resulting in Marc breaking his collarbone hitting the floor before the air fence. His family & friends, who i had been speeaking to during the PL meet were sat/stood just infront of us. His mum and a few others ran, out of concern to the stricken Marc, whereas Benji had rode round to also check on his condition. Please edit your last implication as it is well out of order.

Don't be silly

[Roger MARTIN]

Yes, but will the "missing people" stay if you don't produce a winning side?... Take the example of Newport, who's crowds dipped alarmingly after they lost a few home matches.

 

 

 

That's a real blow to Marc and the Cobras.. wishing him a speedy recovery... Cheers Benji

 

Thats up to the promoter to get together a good side, its the same for any sport, but i tthink if you can win most of your home meetings, the home crowd will be happy, i know the 500 to 600 that go now will stay.

[lucifer sam]

The current situation is not good, too many teams are paying PL money to riders and I feel that the league has lost its way from its original intention. Now it is all about money and I fear that several teams will not be lining up next year mine included as we cannot sustain the financial outlay especially in the current economic climate. Costs have increased drastically from the CL days as riders demands are higher and loan and transfer fees are taken into account. The days of a development league are behind us and it is not good for British speedway. The league standard is too high for development to be its aim as a whole and cannot be sustained by several clubs. Riders demands though impact on all three leagues as if you can get £25 - £30 in the NL what do you expect in the PL and EL? I don't blame the riders for this but everyone needs to see the bigger picture and until that happens things will only get worse.

 

Jayne, that's somewhat worrying to read. I was encouraged by the introduction of the NL last year - because it seemed that it was more-or-less the CL, but with proper rules (the "rules" were always the bane of the CL). However, it seems that costs, which were already on the rise in the third-tier, have spiralled even more. It should be remembered that one of the primary reasons for the introduction of a third tier in 1994 was to provide a cheaper level of speedway, so that tracks could open that otherwise could not have. And it's also provided the entry point to the sport for Somerset, Scunthorpe, etc.

 

If Buxton can no longer sustain NL speedway (after 15 years of running in the third tier), then something has gone badly wrong.

 

All the best

Rob

Edited July 6, 2010 by lucifer sam

[Roger MARTIN]

What is the last bit supposed to imply It was a racing incident where Benji rode on the inside of Marc at bend 3 & continued round. Unfortunately, he clipped the kerb causing him to collect Marcs front wheel resulting in Marc breaking his collarbone hitting the floor before the air fence. His family & friends, who i had been speeaking to during the PL meet were sat/stood just infront of us. His mum and a few others ran, out of concern to the stricken Marc, whereas Benji had rode round to also check on his condition. Please edit your last implication as it is well out of order.

 

Who's fault is it then, if Marc was hit by Benji, i cant see anyone else but Benji to blame for it. was Benji excluded, if he was then he is to blame.

[torpointfanatic22]

Semion the crowd is good for the NL, for the club to go up it needs some backing, i think the reason the crowds have fallen slightly is is because of the promise last year the team was going up, my feelings are if we can go up the missing supporters will come back, at present we are getting around 500 to 600 on a friday, when the club first started we were getting around a 1000 at the meetings,i think the missing people will come back with better speedway, thats just my feelings, i could be wrong, but that is most peoples opinions that go on fridays.

 

Roger for once, I have to agree with you. The crowds have steadily dropped over the past 3 seasons or so, and the promotion not following through their promises has definitely been a reason for that. Im not convinced all would come back just by moving up to the PL, although I, like you think a number would. The key will be improving the product. Exciting team to watch, good track to provide good racing, and better facilities for the fans are all needed if possible.

[Roger MARTIN]

Roger for once, I have to agree with you. The crowds have steadily dropped over the past 3 seasons or so, and the promotion not following through their promises has definitely been a reason for that. Im not convinced all would come back just by moving up to the PL, although I, like you think a number would. The key will be improving the product. Exciting team to watch, good track to provide good racing, and better facilities for the fans are all needed if possible.

 

 

We can all see what needs to happen, lets hope Mike Bowden do, its not all about the speedway, their are things that need to improve off the track, but if they get it right, who knows, one thing for sure i cant see any of this years team good enuff to go up, i did think Paul would be ok, but his form has dropped, and to be good enuff to go up he needs to be the top rider this year, if Nicky comes into the team then i can see him going up, the the rest no way.

[semion]

We can all see what needs to happen, lets hope Mike Bowden do, its not all about the speedway, their are things that need to improve off the track, but if they get it right, who knows, one thing for sure i cant see any of this years team good enuff to go up, i did think Paul would be ok, but his form has dropped, and to be good enuff to go up he needs to be the top rider this year, if Nicky comes into the team then i can see him going up, the the rest no way.

 

Are you asumming that there will be a space for Plymouth, if they decide to move up a League ? Leicester are going to be taking one place in the Premier League, and the way the Elite League is going with the have's and have not's, I wouldnt rule out a Club dropping out of that league and coming down. Plymouth might not be left with any choice come next season.

[Roger MARTIN]

Are you asumming that there will be a space for Plymouth, if they decide to move up a League ? Leicester are going to be taking one place in the Premier League, and the way the Elite League is going with the have's and have not's, I wouldnt rule out a Club dropping out of that league and coming down. Plymouth might not be left with any choice come next season.

 

Semion on not asumming anything when speedway is involved, if the NL was run the way it should be i have no problem staying in it, but the people that do run the league are a disgrace, i also have no problem having young riders in the team, i dont support having older riders in the Plymouth team, some of the best racing i have watched at the sba have involved young riders, its just promises were made that were not kept,it is because of that Plymouth will try and go up, thats just my opinion.

Edited July 6, 2010 by Roger MARTIN

[Shadders]

Who's fault is it then, if Marc was hit by Benji, i cant see anyone else but Benji to blame for it. was Benji excluded, if he was then he is to blame.

IronScorpion's go the hump

[Ben91]

Are you asumming that there will be a space for Plymouth, if they decide to move up a League ? Leicester are going to be taking one place in the Premier League, and the way the Elite League is going with the have's and have not's, I wouldnt rule out a Club dropping out of that league and coming down. Plymouth might not be left with any choice come next season.

 

I feel the Management Commitee would prefer to lose a NL team to the PL over an EL side. Plymouth seem to have been planning to step up since 2007, however if it is not right for the club, having a team in the NL is better than no team at all of course. If there was to be more requests to join the PL then the Trophy would presumably be culled, then of course we are heading down the route of having one big league, whilst the National League would continue for junior and stand alone teams who do not wish to step up. The main problem at all levels of speedway is there are pockets of clubs who want different things and different levels of rider etc, these pockets are too small to create smaller divisions, so the three we have at the moment is the best option. Anyway, that's my view, seems we have veered off topic a little at least we aren't all arguing

[Roger MARTIN]

Its my opinion if the NL was run with the interest of British riders first, and run in a way that everyone can see that is the intention to run it that way then, their would be no problem, i think the main problem is the man running it, he makes up the rules has the year goes on, people contact him if their not sure about things before meetings, where he throws the rule book out of the window, and tells them yes you can use a rider when in the rule it says you can not,you can not run a speedway league that way, i have seen some great meetings at the sba in Plymouth, and i believe the NL if run the right way could be better than the PL and the EL, the main reason being you have young riders coming up wanting to do well, couple that with teams only being permitted one older rider in the team, and one Australian per team, and on a 6 point cma,i feel the idea behind the NL is very good, but the people running it must be of the same idea, their is no good running like it is, where you have riders in it like Cook who rides number 1 for a PL side one week, then rides in the NL the next, im just using Cook has an example, i feel that if a rider after riding so many meetings for a PL side, and his cma rises above 4 for his PL team in that curant season should not be permitted to ride in the PL and NL, some riders in the NL are finding it hard to get 5 or 6 points a meeting,and only have one bike, when some riders are getting double figures in the PL and the NL,in my opinion that is not how the NL should be run, if run the right way it could and should be a great league to watch, the NL should be used has a feeder league to bring young British riders on, at this present time its a feeder league to bring young Australian riders on, and promoters are helping them along the way, this has to stop now because it wont be long before their is no NL.

[June]

Roger I think a lot of us agree with most of what your saying in your post. I firmly believe that sport belongs to the paying supporter ( without them it wouldn't exist)I'm not saying that all promoters do not think likewise, but some just work the sport for their own benefits and financial gain. Call it patriotic but my thinking is that sport of any kind is competative and we the fans attend to see our teams excell and especially when it comes to World competitions, like the world cup. We must start looking to put our youngsters first or in the very near future we will have no team GB and few turning up to watch competions with only foreigners in. Speedway is difficult to get started in because of the expence involved, but it seems promoters will go to any means to get Aussies in their teams. Its the british supporters who are paying at the turnstyles!!!!! As for Plymouth in the PL. you deserve that, but don't dispair the NL league is better. ( your in the best league )thats if it was run properley, the youngsters never stop trying.

[Roger MARTIN]

Roger I think a lot of us agree with most of what your saying in your post. I firmly believe that sport belongs to the paying supporter ( without them it wouldn't exist)I'm not saying that all promoters do not think likewise, but some just work the sport for their own benefits and financial gain. Call it patriotic but my thinking is that sport of any kind is competative and we the fans attend to see our teams excell and especially when it comes to World competitions, like the world cup. We must start looking to put our youngsters first or in the very near future we will have no team GB and few turning up to watch competions with only foreigners in. Speedway is difficult to get started in because of the expence involved, but it seems promoters will go to any means to get Aussies in their teams. Its the british supporters who are paying at the turnstyles!!!!! As for Plymouth in the PL. you deserve that, but don't dispair the NL league is better. ( your in the best league )thats if it was run properley, the youngsters never stop trying.

 

 

June i watched Exeter in the PL from the mid sixtys until they finished, and if run the right way yes the NL could be better than the PL, most of the meetings at Exeter were one sided, but at this present time the NL it is not better, only because of the way the people in charge are running it, it would be much better watching young British riders racing everyweek, then watching riders from Australia who i know nothing about race, who cares if Ward North or any Aussie make it or not' is of no interest to me, they are good to watch i admit that,but so are riders like Marc Owen, by bringing these Aussies into the NL is not helping the development of any British rider by taking their place, and any promoter who helps them along the way by doing this are just putting a nail in the coffin of British Speedway, their a disgrace and they can say what they like, but thats the truth, until the rule is change next year we will get another batch of Aussies coming off the conveyer belt coming over, the third Holder Brother will be over soon, when he is old enuff, and when they come over the British lads will be the one's to make way for them, you can bet on that, unless something is done about it.

Edited July 7, 2010 by Roger MARTIN

[SimonB]

I always seem to hold a different opinion to most on the topic of the National League, still never worried me yet

 

All speedway teams are run as a business and obviously need to generate sufficient revenue to cover its costs. As the owners of these businesses are taking the financial risk and often subsidise the business out of their own pocket I beleive they should be as free as possible to put together a team that provides its paying customers (the life blood of any business) with an exciting entertaining spectacle that helps attract / retain the supporters. As an example last season Mildenhall bought in two Aussies during the final part of the season, Dakota North & Taylor Poole. Those riders added great excitment to what otherwise could have been a very dull end to the season and helped maintain the crowd levels with the quality of their racing.

 

The development of british riders is another topic in my opinion.

 

We need to find a way of getting riders into the sport much earlier and a way of making it cheaper for young riders to take part in the sport. This is done in Denmark with junior racing on smaller bikes on junior tracks. That way by the time they are old enough to move onto the 500cc machines they have already had several years experience of competitive racing. That is the way forward in my opinion to producing more and better quality british riders. Then when they are old enough for the NL (15??) they will be good enough to take their place no matter how many Aussies are available. How you find the investment needed to do this is well beyond my ability to answer.

 

I appreciate we have a mix of reasoning behind the teams in the NL, stand alone teams obviously want to be competitive to attract the crowds. Other doubling up teams are perhaps more interested in developing riders for their PL / EL teams to save them future transfer / loan fees. So there has to be some compromise between the two to maintain a viable league.

 

Anyway this argument has been running for a number of years and the NL still seems to be producing a decent product and attracting crowd levels that at least make the sport sustainable. Hopefully answers can be found to ensure not only sustainability but also growth in the future.

[June]

Roger....I agree with you 100%....I live in hope that next year we have rules to suit stand alone and feeder clubs. and a level playing field for all riders, Like you I dont mind the Aussies, but have no interest in them at the expence of our british youngsters. The league is british, therefor our kids should have first chance of a team place.

[chopper]

I always seem to hold a different opinion to most on the topic of the National League, still never worried me yet

 

All speedway teams are run as a business and obviously need to generate sufficient revenue to cover its costs. As the owners of these businesses are taking the financial risk and often subsidise the business out of their own pocket I beleive they should be as free as possible to put together a team that provides its paying customers (the life blood of any business) with an exciting entertaining spectacle that helps attract / retain the supporters. As an example last season Mildenhall bought in two Aussies during the final part of the season, Dakota North & Taylor Poole. Those riders added great excitment to what otherwise could have been a very dull end to the season and helped maintain the crowd levels with the quality of their racing.

 

The development of british riders is another topic in my opinion.

 

We need to find a way of getting riders into the sport much earlier and a way of making it cheaper for young riders to take part in the sport. This is done in Denmark with junior racing on smaller bikes on junior tracks. That way by the time they are old enough to move onto the 500cc machines they have already had several years experience of competitive racing. That is the way forward in my opinion to producing more and better quality british riders. Then when they are old enough for the NL (15??) they will be good enough to take their place no matter how many Aussies are available. How you find the investment needed to do this is well beyond my ability to answer.

 

I appreciate we have a mix of reasoning behind the teams in the NL, stand alone teams obviously want to be competitive to attract the crowds. Other doubling up teams are perhaps more interested in developing riders for their PL / EL teams to save them future transfer / loan fees. So there has to be some compromise between the two to maintain a viable league.

 

Anyway this argument has been running for a number of years and the NL still seems to be producing a decent product and attracting crowd levels that at least make the sport sustainable. Hopefully answers can be found to ensure not only sustainability but also growth in the future.

 

Finally a sensible post on this subject.I dont believe that something like 4 aus riders with patriality riding national league is the problem, it stems from a lack of a junior structure.Take a look at what other countries are doing and start from there.

 

Cheers Chopper

Edited July 7, 2010 by chopper