Sunday Amateur Dirt Track League

[speedyguy]

Duke rode post war for Norwich then Yarmouth in 1948, transferring to Leicester and retiring in April 1949 after injury.

 

Any information on Danny Lee, riding in the late 1930s?

 

Danny Lee was at West Ham in the mid-1930s, then with Birmingham in 1937 and 1938. He was also active at Eastbourne from the mid-1930s to 1939. In the latter season, Lee also rode for Southampton. Post-war he came back at Harringay, then joined Sheffield. He went on to ride for Edinburgh before retiring the early 1950s. Danny was also a keen member of the Veteran Speedway Riders Association (as it was first known) for many years. At one time he lived in Hastings.

[miro]

 

Thank you very much for the information above. Danny Lee was resident in Oxford in 1939 and was active in the clubs first season.

Edited July 12, 2009 by miro

[speedyguy]

I recall Danny Lee was at West Ham in the late 30s and I think he rode for Hammers Reserve team during this time and filled in for Max Grosskreutz's "Norwich Select" against the Hammers in one second-half match at Custom House. This was a match arranged between Max and his pal Bluey Wilkinson. The 9-heat match was on 24/9/37 and resulted West Ham 17 Norwich 37. Bert Spencer & Wal Morton 9 maximums, Dick Wise 7, Wilf Jay 5, Reggie Hay 4 and Danny Lee 3 were the Stars scorers. Jock Sweet & Bill Birtwell were non-starters and replaced by Reggie Hay & Danny Lee from my info.

 

Roy Duke suffered a serious back injury whilst with Norwich in 1947 and he was subsequently replaced in the Stars line-up by Ivor "Aussie" Powell who was signed from West Ham. Roy suffered this injury in a Challenge match v West Ham

 

Alan Smith was found & trained by Max at the Firs as a member of the Norwich Stars whilst Malcolm Craven was told by Max "you will not make a speedway rider" if reports could be believed, he went on to join Wembley & Birmingham after those early rides at the Firs. Max, for once, was to be proved wrong, but it was maybe the only time he was.

 

Charlie Challis was with Crystal Palace & Birmingham pre-war. In 1946 he was with Norwich for a while, then joined Plymouth Devils in the new Third Division with Len Read and also rode in open meetings for the then new Leicester track.

 

 

In 1954,I paid £5 for a bike once owned by Charlie Challis. It had been fitted with a 250cc JAP engine (probably for use on grass). The bike was standing in a scrap yard at the Elephant & Castle in south London. I sold it on to the French rider Claude Boston who wanted the frame, handlebars and wheels. The engine went as a job-lot in the deal.

[speedyguy]

Thank you very much for the information above. Danny Lee was resident in Oxford in 1939 and was active in the clubs first season.

 

 

Danny Lee also rode at Staines in 1939 where his main rival was former West Ham rider Jack Adams.

 

At Oxford, among Lee's opponents would probably have been Billy Newell and George Bason - possibly Peter Robinson.

Edited July 13, 2009 by speedyguy

[miro]

 

George Bason, who died not long ago I believe, was captain of the first Oxford team to race a visiting side at Cowley in 1939. Some other names of that year apart from Lee and Duke were Geoff Godwin, Buster Yeoman, Dick Reynolds, Rob Jones, Ron Clarke, Jack Adams, Jack Peck - I had a list of scorers once - any info on early Oxford welcome, and apologies for going off topic.

[frenchy]

George Bason, who died not long ago I believe, was captain of the first Oxford team to race a visiting side at Cowley in 1939. Some other names of that year apart from Lee and Duke were Geoff Godwin, Buster Yeoman, Dick Reynolds, Rob Jones, Ron Clarke, Jack Adams, Jack Peck - I had a list of scorers once - any info on early Oxford welcome, and apologies for going off topic.

 

The 'Potted History of Oxford' gives some details on 1939. Drop me a PM if you want further details from it.

[TwoMinuteWarning]

Harry Rogers did ride for Dagenham in their opening league match of the season against the Romford "Rommers" on May 1st (scoring 1 pt). He died, age 24, on Thur May 19 at a special charity meeting staged to encourage recruits to the Territorial Army (well, this was 1938, remember). His bike locked with that of 40yr old Dagger Jack Cooley, and both fell. Rogers was then run over by junior Alex Gray.

 

22yr old David Jackson died at a practice session on Thur Aug 11th, when he was thrown over his handlebars and landed on his head. No other rider was involved. No further meetings were held at Dagenham in 1938 after this death - I'm not sure whether those two facts are linked, though the inquest verdict on both fatalities was "accidental death".

 

Interesting to note that the Eastbourne team, which won the league, contained four members of the Birmingham National Lge Div.2 team - Tiger Hart, Bob Lovell, Danny Lee, and Stan Lemon (who rode as Stan Johns in the Sunday League)

 

The league was referred to in Speedway News as the Inter-Club League, but in Eastbourne newspapers as the Sunday Dirt-Track League.

[norbold]

22yr old David Jackson died at a practice session on Thur Aug 11th, when he was thrown over his handlebars and landed on his head. No other rider was involved. No further meetings were held at Dagenham in 1938 after this death

Dagenham re-opened on 9 October 1938. Morian Hansen took over microphone duties for the night while Stan Greatrex and Ernie Evans were pit marshalls. On 16 October Dagenham raced West Ham Hawks. The season ended on 6 November.

[TwoMinuteWarning]

Yes, quite right, norbold. I even had those details in front of me as I wrote that email.

 

I must take more water with it

[norbold]

Yes, quite right, norbold. I even had those details in front of me as I wrote that email.

 

I must take more water with it

That's ok. And thank you for correcting me over Harry Rogers riding for the Daggers as well.

[speedyguy]

I wonder if that is Alf Kaines who went on to ride for Southampton post-war.

 

 

It was - and he also rode at New Cross in 1946.

[speedyguy]

Did Gil Craven ride for Dagenham in the 1938 Sunday League?

 

And was there a similar league in 1935 including Luton and Wembley Reserves?

[cardrew]

The full results of the league (after extensive research at the Newspaper Library, Colindale) are as follows:

 

Dagenham 39 Eastbourne 44

Dagenham 39 Easbourne 43

Dagenham 44 Romford 39

Dagenham 56 Romford 26

Dagenham 26 Rye House 56

Dagenham 49 Smallford 33

Eastbourne 57 Dagenham 27

Eastbourne 44 Dagenham 39

Eastbourne 53 Romford 23

Eastbourne 56 Rye House 27

Eastbourne 46 Rye House 34

Eastbourne 55 Smallford 28

Eastbourne 51 Smallford 32

Romford 40 Dagenham 43

Romford 46 Eastbourne 33

Romford 26 Rye House 56

Romford 40 Smallford 42

Rye House 29 Eastbourne 52

Rye House 44 Smallford 39

Smallford 55 Eastbourne 27

Smallford 51 Rye House 33

 

The rest of the matches were not run and the league was never completed.

 

Dagenham's leading riders in the league were Frank Hodgson (captain), Jim Baylais, Crusty Pye and Nobby Stock. Jack Tidbury was Romford' star rider. The Smallford team was Doug Wells (captain), Archie Windmill, Ken Tidbury, Percy Brine, Dick Geary, Charlie Appleby, Steve Bullivant, Harry Bower, Bob Wells and Cyril Brine.

 

I am amazed by the Dagenham v Rye House 26-56 result (same as Romford v Rye House 26-56???)

Have not come across the Rye House v Smallford 44-39 result before

Do you have a date for either of these matches?

 

I show 4 additional dates, however can find no trace of these matches being staged

June 5 Smallford v Dagenham

July 3 Rye House v Romford

July 17 Dagenham v Smallford

Aug.14 Rye House v Dagenham

 

Looks like schedule had Dagenham and Eastbourne riding twice at home against each opponent

Romford, Rye House ans Smallford riding once at home against each team

[norbold]

I am amazed by the Dagenham v Rye House 26-56 result (same as Romford v Rye House 26-56???)

Have not come across the Rye House v Smallford 44-39 result before

Do you have a date for either of these matches?

 

I show 4 additional dates, however can find no trace of these matches being staged

June 5 Smallford v Dagenham

July 3 Rye House v Romford

July 17 Dagenham v Smallford

Aug.14 Rye House v Dagenham

 

Looks like schedule had Dagenham and Eastbourne riding twice at home against each opponent

Romford, Rye House ans Smallford riding once at home against each team

I don't know where I got Dagenham v Rye House result. I think I may have made a mistake there. I'll have to check further on that one. The match was due to take place on 7 August but I don't think it was ever ridden. Thanks for pointing it out.

 

Rye House 44 Smallford 39 took place on 19 June.

 

The match on Aug 14 definitely wasn't staged. I'm not sure about the other three you mention, but I haven't found any trace of the results either. The date I have for Smallford v Dagenham is 10 July. That may have been the second meeting of course. I need to check my records on all this further. I'll get back to you later.

[TwoMinuteWarning]

I am amazed by the Dagenham v Rye House 26-56 result (same as Romford v Rye House 26-56???)

Have not come across the Rye House v Smallford 44-39 result before

Do you have a date for either of these matches?

 

I show 4 additional dates, however can find no trace of these matches being staged

June 5 Smallford v Dagenham

July 3 Rye House v Romford

July 17 Dagenham v Smallford

Aug.14 Rye House v Dagenham

 

Looks like schedule had Dagenham and Eastbourne riding twice at home against each opponent

Romford, Rye House ans Smallford riding once at home against each team

 

I have:

July 17 Dagenham 49 Smallford 34 (from Dagenham Post)

July 31 Rye House 37 Smallford 46 (from Speedway News)

 

Re June 19 Rye House 44 Smallford 39, this was advertised as the Herts Championship Cup - 2nd Leg, though it could also have been counted as a league match, of course. The 1st Leg had been due to be held at Smallford the previous Sunday, June 12 (no result available)

 

Re July 10 Smallford v Dagenham, I'm not sure if this match was ridden, as on the same day a combined Romford/Dagenham team was riding againat a "Putt Mossman Internationals" team at Dagenham

 

There was a dispute at Dagenham in August which prevented the track being used for speedway meetings. Last meeting I can find is Bank Holiday Mon 1 Aug, then nothing until the reopening on Sun 9 Oct. While this dispute continued, I don't believe that either Romford or Dagenham rode any league matches, either home or away. This effectively meant that the league was more or less abandoned, though a couple of matches were staged involving the other teams.

 

The only speedway at Dagenham during the closure period appears to have been a practice session on Thu 11 Aug - when a young rider, David Jackson, was thrown over the handlebars of his machine and died. It was the 2nd death at Dagenham in three months.

 

 

[KenB1]

I love reading all this old stuff, its excelent well done all.

[speedyguy]

Re July 10 Smallford v Dagenham, I'm not sure if this match was ridden, as on the same day a combined Romford/Dagenham team was riding againat a "Putt Mossman Internationals" team at Dagenham

 

 

Among the starters in the Putt Mossman team was Alvin 'Spike' Rhiando - better known for his exploits as a leading midget car driver. Who else - apart from Mossman and Rhiando - were in that team?

[TwoMinuteWarning]

Only other team members I know were Moff Jones (who had several meetings for West Ham Reserves in NL Div.2 that year - was he an Aussie?) and Dave Hynes (a new name to me)

[speedyguy]

Only other team members I know were Moff Jones (who had several meetings for West Ham Reserves in NL Div.2 that year - was he an Aussie?) and Dave Hynes (a new name to me)

 

 

Dave Hynes was well-known post-war as a frame builder with a good reputation.

[SHALEWAY69]

Only other team members I know were Moff Jones (who had several meetings for West Ham Reserves in NL Div.2 that year - was he an Aussie?) and Dave Hynes (a new name to me)

Moff Jones was a North Queenslander who rode from 1928-1947. gold prospector

Dave Hynes was from Melbourne, known for the Hynes frame in 1947 used by many Australian riders Dave rode at Plymouth 1947.Went to America. Later based on Queensland Gold coast.