longlivefrankie Posted July 13, 2008 Report Share Posted July 13, 2008 how about a proprer world cup now (seeing as it was virtually poland v australia last night) the "minor" nations 9(us/usa/ger/hun/slo/sco!/etc) could sort themselves out in qualifying rounds the on to a world cup finals like most other sports top six ( aus/pol/den/gb/swd/cz?)seeded to finals - finals two groups of 4 held in one country over a week/2 weeks or so discuss Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Davis Posted July 13, 2008 Report Share Posted July 13, 2008 I said to my mate last night about having it so theres only 2 teams (of 7 riders) in the final run over 15 (or 18, whatever) heats. Dunno if it would work though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Jasper Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 The minor nations already rided against each other, to qualify for round 1 and round 2, they then get the chance to go against the big boys which will help them improve, I like the format this way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyM Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 how about a proprer world cup now (seeing as it was virtually poland v australia last night) the "minor" nations 9(us/usa/ger/hun/slo/sco!/etc) could sort themselves out in qualifying rounds the on to a world cup finals like most other sports top six ( aus/pol/den/gb/swd/cz?)seeded to finals - finals two groups of 4 held in one country over a week/2 weeks or so discuss Wonderful idea requiring major league sponsors. Think it would struggle to make money unless you could attract fans to come over from other countries in big numbers, as with the GP circus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hazzman Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 It would be boring bar four or five meetings. You manage the hammering Aussie and Denmark would hand out to the likes of the minor nations. Sweden and GB would struggle for depth as well IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humphrey Appleby Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 how about a proprer world cup now (seeing as it was virtually poland v australia last night) Depends on the format you use. If you use a test match format, that would rule out all except the 8 or so countries which would be strong enough to track 7 or 8 riders, not to mention that the minor nations usually only have the budget to do one or two meetings. Furthermore, where would the US and Australia ride their home matches? top six ( aus/pol/den/gb/swd/cz?)seeded to finals - finals two groups of 4 held in one country over a week/2 weeks or so That was already tried with previous editions of the BSI-organised SWC (albeit using a 4TT) and it wasn't a financial success. That's basically why the SWC reverted to staging the Semi-Finals in the countries of two of the Semi-Finalists. For all its faults, the current format at least gives more countries a chance to enter and be semi-competitive, and allows Australia and the US to take part. In addition, the 4TT formats usually means at least a couple of teams in each round are competitive, whereas a test match format would lead to a lot of one-sided hammerings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucifer sam Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 I've been a long-term advocate for a proper World Cup. The current system is a bit disatisfying, although the race-off and final are normally fair good meetings. But it would be far better having just two teams in each meeting and having team-riding, etc. That would be far more exciting than a 4TT format. All the best Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frigbo Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 (edited) Great idea in theory, not workable though IMO. The gulf between the top 5 and the rest is massive - some 2 teams matches would be complete batterings (Denmark v Hungary anyone?). Also it has been proven that Speedway supporters do not attend matches without the home nation in, it would be a financial disaster. The current format at least allows enough competitive teams in each meeting to keep it interesting, Saturday being a classic case in point. Edited July 14, 2008 by frigbo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucifer sam Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 And it has been proven that Speedway supporters do not attend matches without the home nation in, it would be a financial disaster. Frigbo, then stage the group matches across Europe - so there is a "home" team for each match. Speedway riders are used to travelling. All the best Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulco Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 (edited) I vaguely remember a competition in the 70s that was a sort of World Cup between nations run as a series of Test Matches over 18 heats . Think GB were involved along with combined Australasia , Norway/Denmark , Sweden and Poland sides. As i said the memory is a bit vague , but i think this was only a one-season wonder . Edited July 14, 2008 by Paulco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frigbo Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 (edited) I vaguely remember a competition in the 70s that was a sort of World Cup between nations run as a series of Test Matches over 18 heats . Think GB were involved along with combined Australasia , Norway/Denmark , Sweden and Poland sides. As i said the memory is a bit vague , but i think this was only a one-season wonder . Spot on - 1973 Daily Mirror sponsored tournament around the UK tracks. England, Australia, NZ, Russia, Poland, Sweden and Norway/Denmark. One big group of 7, rode each other once over a 2-3 week period. Matches were over the 13 heat format. The final was a 39-39 draw, PC beat MIchanek in a runoff at Wembley after Anders knocked him off and was excluded. Not sure combined teams add much credibility to a World Cup tournament. Edited July 14, 2008 by frigbo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulco Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 Not sure combined teams add much credibility to a World Cup tournament. I know , but times they were a different then . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucifer sam Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 I vaguely remember a competition in the 70s that was a sort of World Cup between nations run as a series of Test Matches over 18 heats . Think GB were involved along with combined Australasia , Norway/Denmark , Sweden and Poland sides. As i said the memory is a bit vague , but i think this was only a one-season wonder . And the 1973 Daily Mirror International Tournament was a huge success, culminating in a tense Wembley final, and attracted extensive national media paper coverage. All the best Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hazzman Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 But can anyone paint a decent picture of it's 1974 version? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humphrey Appleby Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 But it would be far better having just two teams in each meeting and having team-riding, etc. It would be, but I just don't think it's practical for more than a handful of countries, and then it isn't really a true World Cup anymore. I do think that you could continue to stage the SWC in its current format, but have the 5 or 6 'test nations' ride matches (or series) against each other over a longer period (say 2 years) for a test championship. It works that way in cricket. You have the World Cup which every country in the world has a chance of playing in, but the 10 test nations also all play each other over a 5-year period to determine the ICC Test Rankings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humphrey Appleby Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 I vaguely remember a competition in the 70s that was a sort of World Cup between nations run as a series of Test Matches i think this was only a one-season wonder. I think it was ostensibly staged to celebrate the Golden Jubilee of the 'first' speedway meeting at West Maitland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laser558 Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 The thing I would prefer is a format where pairs from each team rode in a heat to encourage team riding rather then individuals and possibly change the points scoring to 4,3,2,1 just to make it interesting. No real fun seeing Leigh Adams the length of a straight ahead of a guy from say Hungary. The answer possibly could be to bring back team matches and and have home and away internationals with the top four qualifiers going into a quarter final with the final held at a neutral venue. For example Poland and Denmark in the final held in Germany or the Czech Republic (or Mildenhall ). I think change is needed and perhaps it should be held every two years rather than annually which would allow for the qualification meetings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longlivefrankie Posted July 14, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 (edited) there were three attempts at international tournaments in the sixties/seventies, firstly the patchy world league in the late sixties which i think was basically a couple of matches norminated in various test series - in those days test series were major events. secondly a internations tournament i think in 72 or 73 then the daily mirror backed international tournament in 73 or 74 culminating in a pulsating TV covered final at wembley between england & sweden which ended in a draw needed a run off beween PC & michanek ending in exclusion for anders controlversially. of course it wasnt the only amazing race between Pc & anders that year if my memory is correct there was waht has been descried as the greatest race ever at the zoo between them in a KO cup match i htink where alomst every bend they passed each other!!!! there were other mini tournaments in the eighties involving 4 nations to celebrate various anniversaries back to topic i suggested the seeds to the cup finals rounds to try and two minor nations to fight their way through rough example below-every 4 years!!!! qualifying groups - 1-scotland, hungary, norway & austria 2-germany, slovenia, italy & finland 3 USA, south africa, new zeland & malaysia 4-wales (he he!), russia, holland & france qulifying final group - winners from all groups - top 2 to finals world cup finals - group 1 - GB, Den, Czech & qualifier group 2 - Swd, Pol, Aus & qualifier finals in UK for example GB V Cze-coventry Den V Qual-peterborough Qaul V Gb-eastbourne Cze V den - sheffield & so on OK there will be hammerings but eventually as i football/cricket/rugby.... Edited July 14, 2008 by longlivefrankie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humphrey Appleby Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 possibly change the points scoring to 4,3,2,1 just to make it interesting. How would that make things interesting? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humphrey Appleby Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 malaysia How many riders does Malaysia have? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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