World Team Cup

[Jeff.]

Wouldn't matter in this country, as many people support the swedes, Danes, Aussies and Poles as they do the Brits

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You are too young to remember the World Team Cup Finals of 1976 & 1982 at White City. No crowd and a financial disaster because England failed to make the final.

[stevehone]

You are too young to remember the World Team Cup Finals of 1976 & 1982 at White City. No crowd and a financial disaster because England failed to make the final.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

the exact reason why the easier qualifier will always be sorted in favour of 'Team' GB

[Vicar]

It's my dream to see SWC format that teams racing one team against one team, like they do in league racing.

 

Imagine that in speedway is big sponsor, who give nations unbelievable sum of money. So there wouldn't be problems with money, bikes, locations and logistics. How many teams could start in SWC? What squads?

 

Argentina:

1. Emiliano Sanches

2. Lisandro Husman

3. Lucas Allende

4. Nicolas Covatti

5. Martin Albanese

6. Rafael Gismondi

7. Gustavo Curzio

 

Australia: (only example, because we all know that there are many riders, so there wouldn't be problem with squad)

1. Jason Crump

2. Leigh Adams

3. Ryan Sullivan

4. Rory Schlein

5. Davey Watt

6. Chris Holder

7. Troy Batchelor

 

Austria:

1. Manual Hauzinger

2. Friedrich Wallner

3. Manuel Novotny

4. Heinrich Schatzer

5. Norbert Groegler

6. Christopher Fink

7. Josef Fasching

 

Belgium:(I wasn't strict, there are only 3 belgium riders, I've add Turksema , Colvin and Bergers [they have belgium licence])

1. Guido Hulsman

2. Willy Kennis

3. RR

4. Eddie Turksema

5. Shane Colvin

6. Arjan Borgers

7. Wim Kennis

 

Canada:

1. Kyle Legault

2. Aaron Hesmer

3. Jeff Orosz

4. Joe Heye

5. Gary Hesmer

6. John Kehoe

7. Fred Legault

 

Croatia:

1. Jurica Pavlic

2. Ivan Vargek

3. Nikola Martinec

4. Marko Vlah

5. Nikola Pigac

6. Dino Kovacic

7. Renato Cvetko

 

Czech Republic:(example)

1. Lukas Dryml

2. Ales Dryml

3. Adrian Rymel

4. Joesf Franc

5. Zdenek Simota

6. Filip Sitera

7. Jan Jaros

 

Danmark:(ex.)

1. Nicki Pedersen

2. Bjarne Pedersen

3. Hans Andersen

4. Niels K. Iversen

5. Kenneth Bjerre

6. Jesper B. Jensen

7. Charlie Gjedde

 

Finland:

1. Joonas Kylmaekorpi

2. Kaj Laukkanen

3. Kauko Nieminen

4. Juha Hautamaeki

5. Jari Maekinen

6. Kalle Katajisto

7. Tero Aarnio

 

France:

1. Matthieu Tresarrieu

2. Sebastien Tresarrieu

3. Christophe Dubernard

4. Stephane Tresarrieu

5. Jean Michel Bouillaud

6. Philippe Ostyn

7. Jeremy Diraison

 

Germany:

1. Martin Smolinski

2. Christian Heffenbrock

3. Thomas Stange

4. Matthias Schultz

5. Tobias Kroner

6. Tobias Busch

7. Max Dilger

 

Great Britain:(ex.)

1. Scott Nicholls

2. Chris Harris

3. Lee Richardson

4. Simon Stead

5. Edward Kennett

6. Chris Louis

7. Olliver Allen

 

Holland:

1. Jannick de Jong

2. Theo Pijper

3. Henk Bos

4. Rene van Weele

5. Kaj de Jong

6. Mark Stiekema

7. Henry van der Steen

 

Hungary:

1. Laszlo Szatmari

2. Sandor Thinayi

3. Norbert Magosi

4. Josef Tabaka

5. Roland Kovacs

6. Atilla Stefani

7. Attila Molnar

 

Italy:

1. Mattia Carpanese

2. Simone Terenzani

3. Daniele Tessari

4. Andrea Maida

5. Christian Miotello

6. Guglielmo Franchetti

7. Simone Tadiello

 

Latvia:

1. Kostia Podzuks

2. Maksim Bogdanovs

3. Leonid Paura

4. Aleksander Iwanow

5. Viatcheslaw Gieruckij

6. Jewgienij Karavackis

7. Jewgienij Pietuchow

 

Malaysia:

1. Nazrie Ramli

2. Mohammad Azlan Abdullah

3. Azmi Kaseran

4. Amli Jamat

5. Nur Azman Masdar

6. Rody Sofian Buang

7. Mohd Saufi Wang

 

Norway:

1. Rune Holta

2. Rune Sola

3. Lars Gunnestad

4. Mikke Bjerk

5. Lars Gunnestad jr

6. Carl Raugstad

7. Marius Rokeberg

 

New Zealand:

1. Andrew Bargh

2. Andrew Aldridge

3. Dale Finch

4. Jade Mudgway

5. Grant Tregoning

6. Andrew Tree

7. Kody Tocher

 

Poland:(ex.)

1. Tomasz Gollob

2. Jarosław Hampel

3. Piotr Protasiewicz

4. Krzysztof Kasprzak

5. Sebastian Ułamek

6. Grzegorz Walasek

7. Weisław Jaguś

 

Romania:

1. Alexandru Toma

2. Fanica Popa

3. Marian Gheorge

4. Mihai Deimar

5. Marian Cojocaru

6. Mircea Agrisan

7. Stefan Popa

 

Russia:

1. Roman Povazhny

2. Renat Gafurow

3. Denis Gizatullin

4. Semen Wlasow

5. Emil Saifutdinov

6. Ruslan Gatyatov

7. Danil Iwanov

 

Slovakia: (I wasn't strict for this team, because I want many teams, so there is Topinka [he's from Czech Republic, but have slovakian licence] and Jaroslav Gavenda [he rode 10 years ago], Gaspar Forgac)

1. Martin Vaculik

2. Vladimir Visvader

3. Gaspar Forgac

4. Rastislav Bandzi

5. Tomas Topinka

6. Jaroslav Gavenda

7. Jan Halabrin

 

Slovenia:

1. Matej Zagar

2. Matej Ferjan

3. Izak Santej

4. Jernej Kolenko

5. Denis Stojs

6. Maks Gregoric

7. Matija Duh

 

South Africa:

1. Byron Bekker

2. Martin Bekker

3. Brendan Coughlan

4. Deon Prinsloo

5. Ian Hutchinson

6. Bobby Devine

7. Deon Swart

 

Sweden:

1. Andreas Jonsson

2. Fredrik Lindgren

3. Jonas Davidsson

4. Peter Karlsson

5. Mikael Max

6. Magnus Zetterstroem

7. Peter Ljung

 

Ukraine:

1. Andriej Karpow

2. Andriej Kobrin

3. Yaroslav Poluchovitch

4. Wladimir Kolodiy

5. Wiktor Gaydym

6. Wladimir Trofimov

7. Stanislav Ogorodnik

 

USA:

1. Billy Hamill

2. Greg Hancock

3. Chris Kerr

4. Billy Janniro

5. Ryan Fischer

6. Ricky Wells

7. Tom Hedden

 

Without teams:

Bulgaria: only Milan Manev

Estonia: only Margus Mandre and Ken Vildas

Japan: only Hideaki Ota

Moldova: only Igor Murasko

Suitzerland: only Sirg Schutzbach

 

So there are 28 teams in championships! I think the good system would be by divisions like wrote Ken Kestrel. There wouldn't be so big differences in teams strenght. Maybe six groups with 4-5 teams, or 4 groups with seven teams. So big group will be very exciting. One team (or two) goes down, and one (or two) go up in each group. Like in league. For ex.:

 

Group 1: Poland, Sweden, Danmark, Australia, Great Britain, Russia, Czech Republic

Group 2: Germany, USA, Hungary, Slovenia, Finland, Norway, Italy

Group 3: Austria, Croatia, Latvia, Ukraine, Holland, France, Slovakia

Group 4: Argentina, Belgium, Canada, Malaysia, New Zealand, Romania, South Africa

 

What do you think: who will win in each group? If someone want can try simulate by Speedway Meeting this champs

Edited January 26, 2008 by Vicar

[topaz325]

May be one day in the distant future, 2040, but by then Speedway will be banned for being too dangerous/dirty, anyway i,m sure that Holta chap is Polish!

[Saint Rob]

You can change the format as much as you like, GB still wouldn't win. Even if they were the only team in it

[MattK]

I like the current format.

[AndyM]

Wonderful idea, bringing back fond memories of the tournaments in the early 70s, though I think you've drilled down to too low a level, Vicar. Sure Australia v Canada or South Africa would be a nice even contest! You could adopt handicapping, of course...

[BigFatDave]

I would go for that idea as well, I just think that I would like to see teams of 7 riders.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I can see problems for England here......

[Bavarian]

Instead of Great Britain, You could have three separate national teams England, Scotland and Wales.

By the way, are there any Irish riders around these days? (Or at least some with Irish forefathers?)

[Humphrey Appleby]

You could have three separate national teams England, Scotland and Wales.

 

Where does it end? Why not have a separate national team for Bavaria as well?

 

(Or at least some with Irish forefathers?)

 

So national teams would end-up being contrived rather than truly representative? A bit like the NZ Maoris in the Rugby League World Cup.

Edited February 10, 2008 by Humphrey Appleby

[Bavarian]

It works for Rugby Union, and see how this sport has progressed since they invented a World Cup tournament in 1989.

Speedway would be well advised to copy much of what is done in Rugby Union.

 

Why are You against Scotland and Wales (and possibly Ireland) as stand alone national teams in the world cup ? Scotland has already contested Speedway World Team Cup Rounds in the past !

[Humphrey Appleby]

It works for Rugby Union, and see how this sport has progressed since they invented a World Cup tournament in 1989.

 

Perhaps my memory is failing, but doesn't speedway have a World Cup tournament now?

 

Why are You against Scotland and Wales (and possibly Ireland) as stand alone national teams in the world cup ?

 

Scotland and Wales could barely scrape enough riders together for a team, whereas Ireland doesn't have any speedway riders (and are you talking about an all-Ireland, Northern Ireland or Republic of Ireland team). The point though is, that the FIM stipulates one representative team per national federation, and at the moment the ACU is the national federation for Great Britain.

 

Scotland has already contested Speedway World Team Cup Rounds in the past !

 

I think you'll find that in those days the ACU represented the whole Commonwealth. Originally there was one Commonwealth team riding as Great Britain, but in the early-70s the ACU started staged a qualifying round between English, Scottish, Australian and New Zealand representative teams to determine which side would represent them in the WTC 'proper'.

 

There were separate England and Scottish teams in the World Pairs rounds, but I think liberties were often taken with national teams in that competition.

 

[Peter]

Ireland doesn't have any speedway riders

An Irish rider took part in the amateur meeting at Scunthorpe recently.

 

As for the original point of the thread... people can tinker with the format as much as they like. The fact is, there is a bit of a gap after Denmark, Poland, Sweden, Australia and Great Britain. At present, Russia, Czech Republic, USA, Germany and Finland aren't top 5 material.

[BigFatDave]

It's my dream to see SWC format that teams racing one team against one team, like they do in league racing.

 

Imagine that in speedway is big sponsor, who give nations unbelievable sum of money. So there wouldn't be problems with money, bikes, locations and logistics. How many teams could start in SWC? What squads?

 

[Great Britain:(ex.)

1. Bill Brewer

2. Jan Stewer

3. Peter Gurney

4. Peter Davey

5. Daniel Whiddon

6. Harry Hawk

7. Old Uncle Tom Cobleigh

 

Manager? Middlo of course!! That is if Tom Pearce can't make it!

 

Its got the makin's!!

Edited February 12, 2008 by BigFatDave

[barrow boy]

I like the current format.

It is possible to have a match involving 4 teams of 4 riders with each team fielding 2 pairs that ride each of the other 3 teams 2 pairs once each. It does require 24 heats though but this is the same as the current format. This would provide proper team racing but whether it would provide better entertainment is debateable.

[Humphrey Appleby]

It is possible to have a match involving 4 teams of 4 riders with each team fielding 2 pairs that ride each of the other 3 teams 2 pairs once each. It does require 24 heats though but this is the same as the current format. This would provide proper team racing but whether it would provide better entertainment is debateable.

 

That format was used for the WTC for a couple of seasons in the late-1990s I think. The problem was that teams didn't ride in every heat which allowed teams to contrive results for their mutual convenience.

 

[Hazzman]

That format was used for the WTC for a couple of seasons in the late-1990s I think. The problem was that teams didn't ride in every heat which allowed teams to contrive results for their mutual convenience.

 

Anyone remember Crump and Adams's antics at Brandon?

[T.N.T.]

While I like the idea of a 7 man team, it would need alot of work on it with qualifying rounds being done through the season with the finals being held in a week, sometime in October.

 

These teams would have to ride in qualifiers during April, May and June

 

Argentina:

1. Emiliano Sanches 2. Lisandro Husman 3. Lucas Allende 4. Nicolas Covatti 5. Martin Albanese 6. Rafael Gismondi 7. Gustavo Curzio

Canada:

1. Kyle Legault 2. Aaron Hesmer 3. Jeff Orosz 4. Joe Heye 5. Gary Hesmer 6. John Kehoe 7. Fred Legault

 

Austria:

1. Manual Hauzinger 2. Friedrich Wallner 3. Manuel Novotny 4. Heinrich Schatzer 5. Norbert Groegler 6. Christopher Fink 7. Josef Fasching

Hungary:

1. Laszlo Szatmari 2. Sandor Thinayi 3. Norbert Magosi 4. Josef Tabaka 5. Roland Kovacs 6. Atilla Stefani 7. Attila Molnar

 

France:

1. Matthieu Tresarrieu 2. Sebastien Tresarrieu 3. Christophe Dubernard 4. Stephane Tresarrieu 5. Jean Michel Bouillaud 6. Philippe Ostyn 7. Jeremy Diraison

Holland:

1. Jannick de Jong 2. Theo Pijper 3. Henk Bos 4. Rene van Weele 5. Kaj de Jong 6. Mark Stiekema 7. Henry van der Steen

 

Croatia:

1. Jurica Pavlic 2. Ivan Vargek 3. Nikola Martinec 4. Marko Vlah 5. Nikola Pigac 6. Dino Kovacic 7. Renato Cvetko

Romania:

1. Alexandru Toma 2. Fanica Popa 3. Marian Gheorge 4. Mihai Deimar 5. Marian Cojocaru 6. Mircea Agrisan 7. Stefan Popa

 

Italy:

1. Mattia Carpanese 2. Simone Terenzani 3. Daniele Tessari 4. Andrea Maida 5. Christian Miotello 6. Guglielmo Franchetti 7. Simone Tadiello

South Africa:

1. Byron Bekker 2. Martin Bekker 3. Brendan Coughlan 4. Deon Prinsloo 5. Ian Hutchinson 6. Bobby Devine 7. Deon Swart

 

Malaysia:

1. Nazrie Ramli 2. Mohammad Azlan Abdullah 3. Azmi Kaseran 4. Amli Jamat 5. Nur Azman Masdar 6. Rody Sofian Buang 7. Mohd Saufi Wang

New Zealand:

1. Andrew Bargh 2. Andrew Aldridge 3. Dale Finch 4. Jade Mudgway 5. Grant Tregoning 6. Andrew Tree 7. Kody Tocher

 

Latvia:

1. Kostia Podzuks 2. Maksim Bogdanovs 3. Leonid Paura 4. Aleksander Iwanow 5. Viatcheslaw Gieruckij 6. Jewgienij Karavackis 7. Jewgienij Pietuchow

Ukraine:

1. Andriej Karpow 2. Andriej Kobrin 3. Yaroslav Poluchovitch 4. Wladimir Kolodiy 5. Wiktor Gaydym 6. Wladimir Trofimov 7. Stanislav Ogorodnik

 

Belgium ?:

 

? ?:

 

 

The eight winners would then go through to face

 

Russia:

1. Roman Povazhny 2. Renat Gafurow 3. Denis Gizatullin 4. Semen Wlasow 5. Emil Saifutdinov 6. Ruslan Gatyatov 7. Danil Iwanov

 

Slovenia:

1. Matej Zagar 2. Matej Ferjan 3. Izak Santej 4. Jernej Kolenko 5. Denis Stojs 6. Maks Gregoric 7. Matija Duh

 

Finland:

1. Joonas Kylmaekorpi 2. Kaj Laukkanen 3. Kauko Nieminen 4. Juha Hautamaeki 5. Jari Maekinen 6. Kalle Katajisto 7. Tero Aarnio

 

Germany:

1. Martin Smolinski 2. Christian Heffenbrock 3. Thomas Stange 4. Matthias Schultz 5. Tobias Kroner 6. Tobias Busch 7. Max Dilger

 

Norway:

1. ? ? 2. Rune Sola 3. Lars Gunnestad 4. Mikke Bjerk 5. Lars Gunnestad jr 6. Carl Raugstad 7. Marius Rokeberg

 

Czech Republic:

1. Lukas Dryml 2. Ales Dryml 3. Adrian Rymel 4. Joesf Franc 5. Zdenek Simota 6. Filip Sitera 7. Tomas Topinka

 

This would then give you another round with the 7 winners going into the Quarter Finals where they meet up

 

USA:

1. Billy Hamill 2. Greg Hancock 3. Chris Kerr 4. Billy Janniro 5. Ryan Fischer 6. Ricky Wells 7. Tom Hedden

 

These 8 would then ride to find the 4 teams going forward to meet up with the top four (not including defending champions) to ride off for a place in the Grand Final

 

The top four in this ride off would be seeded to avoid each other.

 

Australia:

1. Jason Crump 2. Leigh Adams 3. Ryan Sullivan 4. Rory Schlein 5. Davey Watt 6. Chris Holder 7. Troy Batchelor

Danmark:

1. Nicki Pedersen 2. Bjarne Pedersen 3. Hans Andersen 4. Niels K. Iversen 5. Kenneth Bjerre 6. Jesper B. Jensen 7. Charlie Gjedde

Great Britain:

1. Scott Nicholls 2. Chris Harris 3. Lee Richardson 4. Simon Stead 5. Edward Kennett 6. David Howe 7. Olliver Allen

Poland:

1. Tomasz Gollob 2. Jarosław Hampel 3. Piotr Protasiewicz 4. Krzysztof Kasprzak 5. Rune Holta 6. Grzegorz Walasek

7. Weisław Jaguś

Sweden:

1. Andreas Jonsson 2. Fredrik Lindgren 3. Jonas Davidsson 4. Peter Karlsson 5. Mikael Max 6. Simon Gustafsson 7. Ludvig Lindgren

 

 

This would then give you five teams in the finals which is where SKY would film.

 

Example - Australia, GB, Denmark, Sweden and Poland (which it always is anyway)

 

Day 1 = Australia V GB --- Sweden V Poland

Day 2 = Australia V Denmark --- GB V Sweden

Day 3 = Poland V Denmark --- Australia V Sweden

Day 4 = GB V Poland --- Denmark V Sweden

Day 5 = Australia V Poland --- GB V Denmark

 

This would then determine who finishes 3rd, 4th and 5th while the GRAND FINAL will be on Day 7 featuring the top two from the 5 days.

 

GRAND FINAL - Day 7 --- ???? V ????

[Chris]

Anyone remember Crump and Adams's antics at Brandon?

 

Yep and it was probably the reason why the format was changed fairly soon after. It was laughable. Crump and Adams were riding with their left feet down for the majority of the race to keep them behind Gustaffson and Karlsson.

 

Nothing wrong with the format now. The SWC has provided the best racing in the sport in the last few years.

 

[BigFatDave]

Nothing wrong with the format now. The SWC has provided the best racing in the sport in the last few years.

Hear Hear! (with the possible exception of the Oz Solos! )