British Selection For 2007

[Subedei]

Easy to quote the Champions though, isn't it? In the same league you also have Rybnik.

 

Chris Harris

Roman Provazhny

Patryk Pawlasczyk

Roman Chromik

Wojiech Druchniak

Slawomir Pyszny

Michel Mitko.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I'm pleased someone brought up Rybnik - by the way, you've missed out your own much-loved Renat Gafurov, Roman Szombierski, Zbigniew Czerwinski, Dennis Gizatulin and Martin Smolinski from the line-up.

What, I wonder, did universally acclaimed British No 1 Scott Nicholls score against Rybnik for Tarnow this season? What's that you say? 2+1 from 5 rides? Surely not. The great Nicholls is incapable of such a lowly score. In fact, in his next Polish meeting, Nicholls failed to score in his first ride and was replaced for the rest of the meeting.

[Grachan]

What's your point? That's obviously because Scott Nicholls had a bad meeting. What are you saying? Scott Nicholls is a 2 point rider in Poland? I very much doubt it.

 

It's so easy to pick out some individual score as if it makes some claim to make that league stronger. How many did Neils Kristian Iversen score for Peterborough last week? What's that you say? 4 points? Just one from his last three rides? How many did hot Polish prospect Janusz Kolodjiez score at Belle Vue last night?

 

It's just selective scores and proves nothing. People just seem to want to look for a reason to say the EL is rubbish, when it doesn't seem any worse than the others to me.

 

As for the rest of the Rybnik side, I don't follow the Polish League so I'm getting these teams from Speedway Star match reports. That was their team against Torun (Torun being: Zabik, Miedzinski, Jagus, B Pedersen, Slabon, Stachowiak and Wisniewski - I wonder how well they would do in the EL?). Gafurov and Smolinski are doing pretty well in El. Never heard of the others. What are you saying? Does having a squad including those 5 riders suddenly make for a massively strong line up then?

Edited September 21, 2006 by Grachan

[Liverstam]

Hey Grachan, you forgot about David Ruud and Jason Crump for VMS.

Edited September 21, 2006 by Liverstam

[Grachan]

I didn't forget them as I have no idea about the actual teams. I just got them out of Speedway Star match reports and that was their team against Luxo Stars (now that team DOES look strong).

 

Crump (& Ruud) may be in the side but they weren't riding on that occasion. Where was Crump on Sept 5? He was riding for Belle Vue on Sept 6.

[Subedei]

I believe Crump has an agreement with VMS Elit that enables both club and rider to pick and choose meetings.

It doesn't appear to have done either any harm - Crump is world champion and VMS Elit are in the Elitserien final next week. And VMS Elit aren't facing that "strong" looking Luxo Stars team, but are facing last season's champions Vastervik. So, a couple of teams - at least - stronger than Luxo Stars in Sweden.

Edited September 21, 2006 by Subedei

[SCB]

I knew this would happen! In fairness, Bomber was terrible. Barely EL standard last night. Sadly In his defence, he did have a nasty crash in his 2nd heat and in his last heat he was also trying to look out for Billy Janniro.

 

BTW, play-offs don't count for averages

[Hazzman]

Everyone has a bad night

[G the Bee]

It would be unfair of anyone to comment on last nights meeting being a true reflection on Bomber's form. His second ride fall seemed to knock the stuffing out of him and I thought he looked quite lively in his first ride, passing Iversen and mounting a challenge on Sullivan. Perhaps this wasn't the case and he just had a bad one. It's hard to tell because I doubt you will hear any excuses from Chris's camp.

 

It's interesting to note, however, that Chris did not ride for Vastervik tonight in their Elite League final against VMS Elit. I sincerely hope that his fall hasn't led to an injury.

 

But if we are bringing up individual meetings....... Stead and Harris came up against each other in the Matt Read meeting last Friday and, whilst Stead beat Harris twice in the team event, in the grand final (the race that mattered), Chris flew past Stead on the back straight of lap 1 and won the heat by nearly the length of the straight. It was as convincing a victory as you will ever see.

Now I know testimonials are hardly meetings to judge current form as riders are not going to risk injury by riding too hard and taking risks (Chris himself looked lacklustre in the heats) but I'm sure Stead and Chris, as racers, were both well up for the final, with Chris's performance almost saying "that's the real Chris Harris, catch me if you can" (he couldn't)! Bomber won in easilly the fastest time of the night but, for good measure, set the second fastest time of the night too!

[SCB]

Actually, Bomber had the fastest time of the night. Dare I say it, in heat 3, Simon had Bomber well beat. Heat 12 was a great race betrween the two with them virtually holding hands while blasting around the boards together!! Had the Somerset fans mesmorised, but we're using to seeing Bomber do that every week

[Reviresco]

And that's the crux of my arguement regarding Nicholls, although you seem to have missed it.

Nicholls and Richardson get permanent wild cards seemingly each and every year while other riders get shunted out. They've been in a "comfort zone". Look at what having a year out has done for Andersen. Kicked out of the GPs he's come out all guns blazing and has won a couple of GPs when he's got the chance.

Handing out charity year on year is doing Nicholls no good at all.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I haven't missed it, I just fail to understand it.

 

Nicholls has been the top British rider for a number of years and, love him or hate him (and you obviously hate him), he will be seeded into the GP year on year until another Brit comes along to take his Brit No. 1 slot away from him.

 

Andersen started his 'rebirth' this year quite well but I think he's now shown how inconsistent he can be. Nicholls has been there for a few years now and, its a great shame that British speedway fans can't support their no. 1 rider.

 

We may now have got to the stage where no other Brit deserves to be in the GP.

 

Then again, maybe Rune Holta will change from Norwegian via Polish to British and there will be another 'British' GP rider in 2007.

 

IMO, I can't see how Britain can justify more than one rider in GP07. Cardiff is not full of British fans, it is full of British speedway fans who support riders from different countries. Only when you attend GP's in other countries do you get the 'nationalistic' support that it appears British fans can't achieve. If British speedway fans supported their own riders more, it may be easier for BSI to seed 2 Brits in 07.

 

Loram is the only possible choice, being a former World Champion and featuring reasonably highly in the Elite Averages.

[south coast robin]

Have you attended a Cardiff Grand Prix ?, as the noise this year from the British fans when SN won a heat was phenomenal .

I have attended England football games and cup finals and that compares to them .

[cwf]

It would be unfair of anyone to comment on last nights meeting being a true reflection on Bomber's form.  His second ride fall seemed to knock the stuffing out of him and I thought he looked quite lively in his first ride, passing Iversen and mounting a challenge on Sullivan.  Perhaps this wasn't the case and he just had a bad one.  It's hard to tell because I doubt you will hear any excuses from Chris's camp.

 

It's interesting to note, however, that Chris did not ride for Vastervik tonight in their Elite League final against VMS Elit.  I sincerely hope that his fall hasn't led to an injury.

 

 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Bomber didnt ride for Vastervik as he picked up a shoulder injury on Monday

[Subedei]

Nicholls has been the top British rider for a number of years and, love him or hate him (and you obviously hate him), he will be seeded into the GP year on year until another Brit comes along to take his Brit No. 1 slot away from him.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

That's just silly. I don't hate Nicholls. I just don't believe he should have preferential treatment based solely on his nationality. And, face facts, Nicholls only gets in year after year of failure. It should be an embarrassment that a rider of such obvious limits is No 1. And those limits are cruelly exposed time after dismal time in the GPs.

 

Andersen started his 'rebirth' this year quite well but I think he's now shown how inconsistent he can be.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Won three GPs and that's almost as many finals as Scott Nicholls has been in. I didn't argue for Andersen's inclusion this year. I believed - still believe - that under any reasonable criteria that excluded Andersen, Nicholls and Richardson also had to be excluded. And now Nicholls will have to beg for another chance to fail miserably.

 

We may now have got to the stage where no other Brit deserves to be in the GP.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

No, we've reached stage where NO British rider deserves to be in the GPs. They either can't qualify and/or, in the case of Nicholls, can't be bothered even trying to qualify via the qualifiers.

[robpeasley]

Sub,

 

To be fair, Nicholls has got a valid excuse this year, he WAS in the top eight at the time of his collarbone injury, and looking at the final standings, he would have probably booked an automatic place he had not missed a round.

 

Personally, I think all the riders down to twelfth (Bjarne Pedersen) have been competitive and good value in the GP this year.

 

Given that Hans Andersen doesn't qualifty courtesy of his overall sixth, but does qualify along with Jagus & Holta from the GP Qualifier, that makes 14 riders (13 if Gollob does retire, I hope not, after seeing him weave his magic in the "flesh" on Saturday).

 

Maybe the fairest solution would be to put in the next one or two from the qualifier, that's Peter Karlsson and then also Chris Harris (if Gollob does retire).

 

That way, surely no-one has been selected on the basis of their nationality, but on their position in the GP series (top 12) or GP qualifier (top 5).

 

All the best

Rob

[Subedei]

To be fair, Nicholls has got a valid excuse this year, he WAS in the top eight at the time of his collarbone injury, and looking at the final standings, he would have probably booked an automatic place he had not missed a round.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Never short of excuses is Nicholls. He's just not good enough. One single final in the last three years. Hells bells, Andersen was defenestrated last season and he's a GP winner. No one would argue for Nicholls if he wasn't British. It's chauvinism gone mad.

 

Given that Hans Andersen doesn't qualifty courtesy of his overall sixth, but does qualify along with Jagus & Holta from the GP Qualifier, that makes 14 riders (13 if Gollob does retire, I hope not, after seeing him weave his magic in the "flesh" on Saturday).

 

Maybe the fairest solution would be to put in the next one or two from the qualifier, that's Peter Karlsson and then also Chris Harris (if Gollob does retire).

 

That way, surely no-one has been selected on the basis of their nationality, but on their position in the GP series (top 12) or GP qualifier (top 5).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I can't see Gollob being replaced by anyone other than a Pole. But it is good to see the great man considering his future after a disappointing GP season. A shame others don't follow his example. And Gollob's made THREE finals this season, which is two more than Nicholls.

I personally think Gollob will be around next season. But good to see he has some pride about him.

[SCB]

Never short of excuses is Nicholls. He's just not good enough. One single final in the last three years. Hells bells, Andersen was defenestrated last season and he's a GP winner. No one would argue for Nicholls if he wasn't British. It's chauvinism gone mad

I disagree. I want to see the Worlds best 15 riders in the series. I believe that Nicholls is one of the World best 15. He may not be in the top 5, he may only just scrape into the top 10 but he is definatly top 15.

 

I'd also argue that Peter Karlsson is one fo the top 15 rider in the World and should be in the GP's while Puk, Pepe and Richardson are most definatly not.

 

Just because a rider is not able to finish in the to 8 of the regualr GP riders does NOT make him a non-GP standard rider!! It just makes him a non-top 8 GP rider!

[Subedei]

I disagree.  I want to see the Worlds best 15 riders in the series.  I believe that Nicholls is one of the World best 15.  He may not be in the top 5, he may only just scrape into the top 10 but he is definatly top 15.

 

I'd also argue that Peter Karlsson is one fo the top 15 rider in the World and should be in the GP's while Puk, Pepe and Richardson are most definatly not.

 

Just because a rider is not able to finish in the to 8 of the regualr GP riders does NOT make him a non-GP standard rider!!  It just makes him a non-top 8 GP rider!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I disagree.

On what basis do you assume that Nicholls is one of the fifteen best riders in the world?

[The Icicle Thief]

That's just silly. I don't hate Nicholls.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You blantly do!! Or at least have an extreme grudge against him for some reason. Whether you like or not he is one of the top 15 riders in the world he has proved that over the last 4 years. If we are to exclude riders of Scotts standard we will have a grand prix series of 6-10 riders and boy wouldn't that be exciting!!

[Subedei]

You blantly do!!  Or at least have an extreme grudge against him for some reason.  Whether you like or not he is one of the top 15 riders in the world he has proved that over the last 4 years.  If we are to exclude riders of Scotts standard we will have a grand prix series of 6-10 riders and boy wouldn't that be exciting!!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Prove that he's one of the top fifteen riders in the world.

I don't think he is. And all I have a grudge against is him getting undeserved charity nominations to the GP series. Who is he? Oliver Twist, wanting more after three dismal years of failure. One GP final in three years - even Lee Richardson's done better than that.

But in the absence of a logical arguement you fall back on saying I hate Nicholls, or I have a grudge against him. Nonsense. I just want fair play for all. Nicholls has had more than his fair share of chances.

What happens when he fails next season? What excuses will be pulled from the hat to justify yet another nomination?

[SCB]

I disagree.

On what basis do you assume that Nicholls is one of the fifteen best riders in the world?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The fact he is 11th in the GP standings is a good signing IMO. Also, it's my opinion, based on his performances in the SWC, GP's and various other meetings and leagues.

 

I'd also argue Bjarne Pedersen is probably worthy of a place too.