Timbo Posted March 3, 2006 Report Share Posted March 3, 2006 (edited) I've just had a look at the "new" ? Belle Vue website History of Belle Vue Some great memories for many of us of the old Hyde Road circuit , its riders, teams and the other entertainment available such as the zoo and fairground. Edited March 3, 2006 by Timbo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youngy105 Posted March 4, 2006 Report Share Posted March 4, 2006 It's been online for almost 2 years now so it's not that new.....cracking website though, just for the Hyde Road pics....great memories Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyM Posted March 4, 2006 Report Share Posted March 4, 2006 Yes, I've looked up there from time to time to enjoy the memories of yesteryear. Absolutely right and proper that the proud Belle Vue heritage is preserved and celebrated in this way for everyone to enjoy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Posted March 4, 2006 Report Share Posted March 4, 2006 You're not wrong Andy. To see pictures of Ove Fundin, the world's greatest ever rider, wearing the colours of one of the world's greatest ever teams, is nostalgia at its best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norbold Posted March 4, 2006 Report Share Posted March 4, 2006 It could upset a lot of Norwich supporters though! Seriously, it is a great site for a great team. One that has proved to be the backbone of the sport since the very beginning. Long may it continue and long may the site continue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keepturningleft Posted March 7, 2006 Report Share Posted March 7, 2006 Fabulous web site, I didn't know it existed. I'm still astonished there is no book about Belle Vue given it's status as arguably the greatest speedway venue ever. How about it Norbold?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norbold Posted March 8, 2006 Report Share Posted March 8, 2006 Not really my area. Pre-War and wartime is covered in Trevor James and Barry Stephenson's "Speedway in Manchester 1927 - 1945" book. They might be the people to ask. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youngy105 Posted March 28, 2006 Report Share Posted March 28, 2006 Fabulous web site, I didn't know it existed.I'm still astonished there is no book about Belle Vue given it's status as arguably the greatest speedway venue ever. How about it Norbold?? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> If someone does write about the History Of Belle Vue Speedway could they please leave out The Perrin Years 1988-1992 and 1994-2004. Keep 1993 in as we won the league that year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted March 29, 2006 Report Share Posted March 29, 2006 Have to agree it's a great site. Just as an aside, as with most photos of years gone by, you cannot help but notice the size of the crowd, does anyone know how much the admission charges were and what the average wage was at the time? The crowds at most sports always seem large judging by the photos of the day, I know TV etc was not around in a lot of the years, but was it a cheap night out? Colin.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norbold Posted March 30, 2006 Report Share Posted March 30, 2006 (edited) 30 September 1933: Belle Vue v. Wembley National Trophy Final 2nd Leg: Capacity crowd of 40,000 with hundreds locked out. I don't know about Belle Vue but admission prices at Wembley were 1s 2d, 2s 4d, 5/- and 10/- The average working man's wage at that time was about £3 10s per week. Edited March 30, 2006 by norbold Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Butler Posted March 30, 2006 Report Share Posted March 30, 2006 30 September 1933: Belle Vue v. Wembley National Trophy Final 2nd Leg: Capacity crowd of 40,000 with hundreds locked out.I don't know about Belle Vue but admission prices at Wembley were 1s 2d, 2s 4d, 5/- and 10/- The average working man's wage at that time was about £3 10s per week. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Greetings Norman, Being less than one year old at the time I can't comment on the prices at Hyde Road in September 1933. However, when I first discovered the mighty all-conquering Aces in 1946 the prices were 1/- [5p] and 2/6 [15p]. The programme cost 6d [2.5p]. Halcyon days! Ron. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Posted March 30, 2006 Report Share Posted March 30, 2006 30 September 1933: Belle Vue v. Wembley National Trophy Final 2nd Leg: Capacity crowd of 40,000 with hundreds locked out.I don't know about Belle Vue but admission prices at Wembley were 1s 2d, 2s 4d, 5/- and 10/- The average working man's wage at that time was about £3 10s per week. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Taking the 2s 4d figure (that equates to 12p) then the entrance fee was about 2.8% of the average weekly wage (on Norbold's figures). If we take today's average admission price as being £12 and the average wage as being about £450 per week, then then pertcetage jumps to around 3.7%. Not a sufficient difference, in my view, to affect attendances drastically. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gresham Posted March 30, 2006 Report Share Posted March 30, 2006 Just trawled through the action shots in men & machines section of the website.Peter Craven & Peter Collins photo's awesome.Does anyone know the best way to go about obtaining prints of these?They would look smashing on my office wall.Pure nostalgia!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted March 31, 2006 Report Share Posted March 31, 2006 30 September 1933: Belle Vue v. Wembley National Trophy Final 2nd Leg: Capacity crowd of 40,000 with hundreds locked out.I don't know about Belle Vue but admission prices at Wembley were 1s 2d, 2s 4d, 5/- and 10/- The average working man's wage at that time was about £3 10s per week. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> So what was the attraction do you think, I know speedway was in it's formative years and could be seen as a new sporting occasion. We have established that the costs to the paying public are similar to today's. There was no television to speak off, but there were other attractions, theatre, cinema etc again similar to today, so why did the crowds disappear? During those days, did promoters and riders make a lot of money? It would be nice to see larger crowds. I have attended world finals at Wembley with what could be described as capacity crowds yet how many do you get at the Cardiff GP certainly no where near the size of Wembley. Similar story to most sports I feel. Sorry to quiz you all, but the demise of crowds is a mystery to me, the product (speedway) is still as thrilling to me as it ever was, unlike most motorcycle sports that have changed so much over the years. Colin.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norbold Posted March 31, 2006 Report Share Posted March 31, 2006 The biggest gates for speedway were just after the War in the late 1940s. There were probably three main reasons for the decline in gates. 1. Entertainment Tax. Although sports were partially exempt from this tax, which at one time, in the early 1950s, went up to over 60% of gate money, speedway for some strange reason wasn't exempt as it was classed as a trial of speed and not a sport. 93,000 people witnessed the 1950 World Final with £22,600 being taken at the gate. If it had been a football match the total tax bill would have been £3100, because it was speedway the tax bill was £10,200. This was, of course, being repeated at all tracks up and down the country. The tax was crippling many smaller tracks. Either the promoters had to absorb it, which most couldn't, or they had to put admission prices up, which drove people away. 2. Television! 3. Just after the War people were looking for some excitement after the long dark days of the War. Speedway fitted the bill admirably, but, as time went, on I think the sheer excitement element of it palled for many people and just left the hard core supporters. Life was returning to normal and there were other things to do... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Butler Posted March 31, 2006 Report Share Posted March 31, 2006 Norman, Let me, as a veteran of that era, congratulate on your concise and accurate portrayal of the situation. Ron. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff. Posted March 31, 2006 Report Share Posted March 31, 2006 Taking the 2s 4d figure (that equates to 12p) then the entrance fee was about 2.8% of the average weekly wage (on Norbold's figures). If we take today's average admission price as being £12 and the average wage as being about £450 per week, then then pertcetage jumps to around 3.7%. Not a sufficient difference, in my view, to affect attendances drastically. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> In 1987 when Belle Vue raced their last season at Hyde Road admission inc programme was £3.10. Less than 20 years later we now pay £17.00, an increase of 450%. That means for every £100.00 earned then you would need to be earning £550.00 today so you can see there is no parity at all cost wise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted March 31, 2006 Report Share Posted March 31, 2006 Norman, Let me, as a veteran of that era, congratulate on your concise and accurate portrayal of the situation. Ron. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Well said Ron. Thankyou Norbold for your comments they certainly make sense. Colin.. ps Sorry I have wandered off topic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted April 1, 2006 Report Share Posted April 1, 2006 In 1987 when Belle Vue raced their last season at Hyde Road admission inc programme was £3.10. Less than 20 years later we now pay £17.00, an increase of 450%. That means for every £100.00 earned then you would need to be earning £550.00 today so you can see there is no parity at all cost wise. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> From a personal point of view I seem to remember in the mid seventies that admission charges seemed more affordable to me then,(and by then I had a girlfriend/wife to pay for!) than they do now. I also respect that costs have risen enormously for the riders over the years, several bikes to maintain etc but also the level of sponsorship (once only, it seemed, for the more famous riders) has increased both at club level and personal level. These must have forced prices up a bit. It seems strange that we read that Man Utd can attract over 65,000 crowds, week in week out, Man City somewhat less and Belle Vue far less (but perhaps more than most). I suppose it is just down to success. I know it is difficult to make comparisons, but it would be nice to know where it all went wrong for Speedway and can it ever improve. Again sorry for wandering off topic. Colin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Butler Posted April 1, 2006 Report Share Posted April 1, 2006 Colin, The basic subject of the thread being nostalgia, I don't feel you've wandered off-topic. Indeed broadening the horizon can often make the discussion considerably more interesting. Ron. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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