Kevin Meynell Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 Unfortunately you are living cloud cuckoo land if you expect an international private company to plough their profits back into something because it's "the right thing to do". I think BSI could rightly claim that they're paying just over GBP 750K per year to FIM for the rights to the SGP, and that it's the FIM who should be apportioning that money amongst its member countries. You might ask the FIM where that money is going. Sweden and Denmark have developed youngsters without BSI money. Why can't we? That's not the issue at all. The national federations should never have given away the rights (and therefore potential profits) to a commercial company with no interests in domestic speedway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Know Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 All world championship events bike or car have been run under the FIMs control and always will be. Riders will always put this first above any domestic racing as its the only way to become world champion. In the not to distant future SGP will become very much like moto gp where contracted riders only race in this event. This has already started for 05 by dropping the number of riders to increase prize money also only have the best in it. As for having promoters running SGP thats a big no as their are to many of them in it for there own good. Referance bsi putting money into young british riders wait to end of season to see what they have planned ( MORE THAN HAS BEEN SPENT OVER THE LAST 50 YEARS BY ALL THE SO CALLED WORRIED PARTYS ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 (edited) In the not to distant future SGP will become very much like moto gp where contracted riders only race in this event. This has already started for 05 by dropping the number of riders to increase prize money also only have the best in it. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> You're joking right? Not ONE rider would have made money form the GP's this year, either you buy naff bikes and come last and do a Kaj Laukannen but the cost of getting to the gP ois more than he gets for commign last. Alternatively you could win the GP but the cost of getting the bikes is outweighed by th winnings, so the riders lose there as well. No rider makes money from the GP's and by dropping 8 riders, it might help 1 or 2 rider possibly break even (though I doubt it). You're living in a fantasy world there. Here's the prize money in dollars. 1st in Heat 25 = 10,250 (£5746 WOW) 2nd in Heat 25 = 7,450 3rd in Heat 25 = 6,250 4th in Heat 25 = 5,750 3rd in Heats 23 & 24 = 5,000 4th in Heats 23 & 24 = 4,400 3rd in Heats 21 & 22 = 3,250 4th in Heats 21 & 22 = 2,850 3rd in Heats 17 & 18 = 2,650 4th in Heats 17 & 18 = 2,600 3rd in Heats 11 & 12 = 1,750 4th in Heats 11 & 12 = 1,700 3rd in Heats 5 & 6 = 1, 600 4th in Heats 5 & 6 = 1,600 (£897, a flight, somewhere to say, tyre, fuel oil and suddenly you're in debt) Thats £32,000, per GP, now assumingthe guy in 8th get average amount of money (£2000 per GP) and there 6 GP's, then he get 12,000 for a season of GP racing. Now lets assume the winner gets £8000 and a rider wins every GP, in a series of 6 GP's then he gets £48,000. Now that looks good BUT no rider will win every GP and the rider who is challenging for the World title has a pit crew, so he pays them all a wage, assuming he pays his top guy £15,000 then his earnings are alwready down to £33,000 and then he buys a bike or 3 (£8,000 so Lee Richardson said on SKy a few weeks back) thats £24,000 on bikes, so the rider now has an amazing Wage of £9,000. Take away oil fuel and tyres, someone to stay and airfares and the rider is probably getting a bit desperate and living on bread and water. Edited September 9, 2004 by SCB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whacko Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 aren't we forgetting about sponsorship there SCB? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 Why should rider have to get sponsorship to be able to ride in the GP's, shoudln't BSI pay the rider enough? After all, BSI get the prime advertising spot (front forks) so they shoudl give that money to the riders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whacko Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 (edited) How many of the top riders actually buy their own bikes though? There are CL riders out there who gets bikes, full gear, vans etc supplied to them via sponsorship, so I can hardly see the poor GP riders splashing out on this equipment! ok just re-read your posting. I think BSI should supply all riders with a bike each, 20 x £3k is hardly breaking the bank for BSI! Edited September 9, 2004 by Whacko Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Meynell Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 aren't we forgetting about sponsorship there SCB? Yes, but no-one's going to make a living out of SGP alone. Reducing the number of riders from 24 to 16 will save about USD 13,000 per meeting, so every remaining rider will potentially get a pay rise of USD 813 each. It's still not going to pay the bills. In any case, does anyone believe that the SGP riders would actually sit around doing nothing for up to 3 weeks at a time, when they could be out earning more money? I think a dose of reality is needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whacko Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 aren't we forgetting about sponsorship there SCB? Yes, but no-one's going to make a living out of SGP alone. Reducing the number of riders from 24 to 16 will save about USD 13,000 per meeting, so every remaining rider will potentially get a pay rise of USD 813 each. It's still not going to pay the bills. In any case, does anyone believe that the SGP riders would actually sit around doing nothing for up to 3 weeks at a time, when they could be out earning more money? I think a dose of reality is needed. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> well if they were paid more money they would not have to ride elsewhere! I'm sure the F1 guys dont go racing all over the place during the GP season risking unneccesary injuries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iris123 Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 Well Coulthard was racing up and down the Reeperbahn last year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whacko Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 he is a prime example of a failure though - he plays harder than he works and will never be win! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Know Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 Some people just dont have a clue do they, (SCB). Do you think sgp will standstill just for british speedway, NO. Also if you think most riders buy anything your wrong as they buy bugger all for speedway as its all free. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iris123 Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 But he also shows(like some footballers) that give sportsmen more money and they will want to spend it.So giving speedway riders more won't neccesarily make them sit at home in Britain counting the dosh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 (edited) They might not pay for there bikes but THEY have gt them bieks through sponsorship, why should they then use them for BSI's sake? I don't expect BSI to stand still for league racing (read this thread). I just know that the GP's WONT have full time riders. Lets look at it another way, the top riders earn 40k in Sweden, 40k in Poland and 40k in the UK (I don't know what) and win every GP and get another 30k. So for the GP's to be full time they have to pay the rider that extra 120k they earn in the 3 leagues, can you reallu see BSI paying the riders that extra 120k? Thats a pay rise for THE top rider (assuming he wins every GP) of over 500% and the rider lower down will need a bigger pay rise to cover there league wages loss. The riders get there sponsored free bikes whether they're in the GP or not so they will be saying, "we'll stick to league racing and earn 120k and no ride in the GP's" ahead of, "we'll ride int he GP's for 40k and somebikes". What would you chose? World Champion and 30k OR best non-GP rider and 120k? That assuming BSI are willing to give the rider a pay increae of between 500 and 600%!!!!! Edited September 9, 2004 by SCB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Meynell Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 well if they were paid more money they would not have to ride elsewhere! And where is this money supposed to come from? The SGP is nowhere near in the same league as F1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Meynell Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 So for the GP's to be full time they have to pay the rider that extra 120k they earn in the 3 leagues, can you reallu see BSI paying the riders that extra 120k? What would you chose? Quite right. I'm quite convinced that if it came down to straight choice between the SGP and the national leagues, the riders would choose the national leagues hands down. The SGP is light years away from being a full-time circus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Meynell Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 All world championship events bike or car have been run under the FIMs control and always will be. Well, speedway very nearly wasn't run by the FIM in the past, and once the speedway authorities finally wake-up, might not be in the future. ARiders will always put this first above any domestic racing as its the only way to become world champion. Professional riders fundamentally need to earn a living, and have only ever participated in the generally poorly-paying World Championship whilst they knew they could make that living elsewhere (i.e. in the national leagues). If they had to decide between the SGP and the national leagues now, they would undoubtedly have to opt for the latter option. In the not to distant future SGP will become very much like moto gp where contracted riders only race in this event. Again, where is the money going to come from to finance this? The projected expansion of the SGP has failed to materialise, and it's only a matter of time before the existing GP organisers get tired of making losses to enrich BSI. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatface Posted September 10, 2004 Report Share Posted September 10, 2004 (edited) Sweden and Denmark have developed youngsters without BSI money. Why can't we? That's not the issue at all. The national federations should never have given away the rights (and therefore potential profits) to a commercial company with no interests in domestic speedway. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Kevin, we all know you like to slice and dice. But at least keep it in context. I was replying to someone who suggested that BSIs profits go into developing youth. I'm saying that as a private company we cannot expect them to do that. And if we (Britain) want quality youngsters coming through we are going to have to get our hands dirty and do it ourselves. Nothing more nothing less. Edited September 10, 2004 by falcace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Meynell Posted September 10, 2004 Report Share Posted September 10, 2004 And if we (Britain) want quality youngsters coming through we are going to have to get our hands dirty and do it ourselves. And where will BSI get the next generation of riders for the SGP? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted September 10, 2004 Report Share Posted September 10, 2004 And where will BSI get the next generation of riders for the SGP? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Sweden Denamrk and Poland? There will always be 24 (or 16) riders who are better than the rest. If every speedway rider riding now retired tommorow and there were no speedway riders, if I and 15 other on this forum were to take up speedway we could be the GP riders. So as long as there 16 people with speedway bikes there will be speedway GP's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Meynell Posted September 10, 2004 Report Share Posted September 10, 2004 (edited) Sweden Denamrk and Poland? I think you're missing my point. Why should BSI expect to benefit from the development programmes of any country, whilst putting nothing back themselves? For that matter, why should any country bother to develop riders when they can be used by the SGP without any compensation (be that financial or otherwise)? Edited September 10, 2004 by Kevin Meynell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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