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INCOGNITO

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Everything posted by INCOGNITO

  1. Poor meeting with one mistake leading to a pass and one pass in heat 15. Very much follow the the leader and spread out. Heaps got points but quite a few were against opposition reserves and fallers. Wolves won comfortably but will face a stronger test against Belle Vue with a full seven back on track
  2. Connor Mountain at reserve for Swindon which with R/R won't help Swindon as the reserves take three extra rides already. Maybe this is one meeting where Heaps should get in the points and Greaves after the weekend should also score well. Wolves need to get full points from remaining home fixtures and should win here but Batchelor, Morris, Musielak and Ellis have all had good meetings at Monmore and could rescue a point.
  3. If you are talking independent it needs to be a panel and with people like Tony Steele, Jan Staechmann, Andrew Silver etc that still love the sport and have seen better days and would love to see it rise from the flames. Add to those a few more and you have a body that can run alongside them to oversee things and when need be say NO to the BSPA about certain rules bought in clearly trying to benefit the few
  4. If you look at the original post it says about wages and how it's paid on the day. i have spoken to a few riders and they would be happy with this method and offer and these are the sort of riders you would have in the league scoring points with some maybe 3-5 and some much higher. Wages would be around £8,000 a meeting for both teams so a crowd of 700 at £12 each would cover that and at those prices with the right promotional issues met through the sport you should be able to attract double that at most tracks. The extra goes towards running costs like rent and remember there would be less money needed for flights but most importantly riders get paid and it creates more varied fixtures. How do Ipswich fans miss their clash with Kings Lynn or how many would be at Sheffield v Belle Vue.
  5. Thorssell 8.5, Masters 8, Heaps 4.5 = 21 Jorgensen 6, Becker 4, NL 2.00 = 12 a reduction of the current team by 9.00 but these are just examples and using PL averages the teams shown are roughly about the same and in the case of Grajczoneck 6.5 at Berwick he and a 2.00 replace Gappmaier 5.0 and Pjipier 3.5 so not much difference than they are now
  6. As an EXAMPLE only this is the sort of standard we need to be looking at and charging no more than £12 entrance fee for adults and £25 a family ticket (2/2) BELLE VUE - Craig Cook, Steve Worrall, Dan Bewley, Paul Starke, Damian Drzodz, Kyle Bickley, NL 2.00 BERWICK - Josh Grajczoneck, Kevin Doolan, Aaron Summers, David Howe, N B Jacobsen, Jye Etheridge, NL 2.00 WOLVES - Rory Schlein, Kyle Howarth, Thomas Jorgensen, Luke Becker, Ashley Morris, Nathan Greaves, NL 2.00 With teams of this strength as an example you could run at wages that won't break the bank (see original post) and lower entrance fee to no more than £12. You still have seven riders wearing your club colours and they are not doubling up (NL only) and fans can relate to these riders much more when they are yours and not shared. You get a varied fixture list with a different team visiting each week on your chosen race night. We have a wage bill that is affordable and as original post, the home track pays the set wages for riders from both teams using the attendance money so riders are not owed money and paid on the night they have just earned. We see more places for British youngsters progressing and getting rides and we see just as entertaining races watching Worrall v Howarth or Howe v Becker as you do watching Doyle v Fricke or Thorssell v Bjerre. COST EFFECTIVE - RIDERS PAID - VARIED FIXTURES - YOUR RACE NIGHT - MORE BRITISH RIDERS - WEEKLY MEETINGS - YOUR TEAM
  7.  50 more Maciej Janowski 50 more Greg Hancock 100 more Andreas Jonsson
  8. So you have had a bet on a team you think will finish top four and one to one could win the play offs. Taking away a play off place is not the answer and yet again changing the terms of any season ticket holders. say Swindon finish top, they have lost two Rye House meetings plus a play off semi final and then get to see their team in a final who haven't ridden for two weeks or had a home meeting for possibly a month
  9. If you want the likes of Woffinden, Hancock, Sayfutdinov etc to ride here you would have to increase admission of a track that gets one thousand regulars to about £23 to include just one so adding two would be £28 and roughly four to five pound on top for each top rider. Or about an extra 250 REGULAR new fans for each top rider you employ which won't happen as many don't go now as they feel £18 isn't value for money and very few riders would want to ride here in a league of 28 (now 24) meetings as a minimum. British Speedway has to go with what it can afford and rebuild using NL riders at reserve but also make the NL a learning league as it used to be and not fill it up with Championship riders like Perks, Shanes etc
  10. Pits fine that a few tracks can pay the bigger names but how many of these are doing it through the finances of the club. Some of these are met by outside business interests and it's not about the few it's about all tracks pulling together to rebuild at one big league. Only if you used Championship averages could you do a 45 limit as there wouldn't be the riders around to fill all teams as doubling up is another disease that has eaten away at British Speedway. Using only Premiership averages upto say 35 would mean Belle Vue, Wolves, Poole etc coming down to the level of Ipswich, Sheffield, Redcar etc. If Leicesterbwant to sign Andersen on say 7.89 then fine but that takes a big chunk out of the limit and on the plus side would mean they are more likely to have two NL reserves.
  11. So who is going to pay to make the product stronger and with what riders ? The ones who keep saying we need it stronger are the ones that have top level speedway as it is now. We have just 8 teams in the top level, one not running as it can't afford to and needs to run at weekends and a few others running at a level it can't afford and running in the red as a business. However fans of Ipswich, Redcar, Glasgow etc are happy with the level they are at and that's what the current Premiership clubs need to be running at. The 35 limit suggested is using Premiership averages all over which is where Glasgow, Ipswich etc are at now and it's getting Swindon, Belle Vue, Wolves etc to get to that level too. Yes there are riders available to come in but not of the standard to run a top level as it is. Denmark have riders that would come in as do Sweden and other countries but none of these are riders that would improve a current Premiership team but would help fill the gap of doubling up riders we are currently doing. New NL riders moving up would also cover the gaps and hopefully a few NL tracks would look at riding at this level like Birmingham. Can anyone really say that the current Premiership can survive as it is now. We can't afford as a sport to pay top riders or for that matter the next level like Kildemand, Kasprzak etc but we can offer a good entertainment package of a big league where Glasgow face Belle Vue and Kings Lynn face Ipswich or Poole v Lakeside if tracks work together. Swindon fans would still follow their team if it dropped a level just as they do in football. If they tracked a team of Morris, Musielak, Ellis, Zach W and three lesser riders it would still get enough fans at £10 entrance fee to watch them ride against Lakeside or Peterborough and a different team each week, not the a,e teams over and over again and most importantly on the nights it wants to ride on. Fixed race nights are fine for a top level league but only if you can afford one and Britain can't unless it rebuilds
  12. Even the level it is now tracks can't afford it and fans are not willing to pay £18 to watch what's on offer and you are going to struggle to get any new fans unless you make it an affordable entertainment and that means getting to a £10 sport which many feel it should be now any way. There are not enough people interested I speedway to pay for a strong product and the only hope of attracting new fans is to lower entrance fees. Crowds are dropping everywhere now and the interest in getting so thin it's no good trying to make the product stronger at a cost it can't afford, it has to rebuild. Tracks need to to pull together in one league and create a varied fixture list in one league, not two as present which isn't working. It therefore has to be a level the lesser tracks can afford
  13. What people really want is to see a Swindon side of Doyle, Morris, Zengota, Kildemand, Musielak, Bellego and Ellis against Wolves with Lindgren, Woffinden, Pawlicki, Thorssell, Masters, Howarth, Greaves and a top league along those lines. However a a number of those are not interested in riding here unless it's one fixed race night and about 14 fixtures, not the 28 or so and on two race nights. Britain can't afford the top riders anymore and they don't want us as it doesn't pay to be in a league racing on numerous race nights for what's on offer. The sport here needs rebuilding at a cost that it can afford and at a price fans will be happy to pay and attractive to new fans as the sport needs to lower the average age of its supporters who are mostly middle aged people or older. To do that it needs to get back to basics and start at a level it can afford. its no good dreaming of seeing Sayfutdinov v Zmarzlik or Woffinden v Pedersen on a British track apart from Cardiff. Those days have gone and the individual honours are now too important to top riders and the high rewards there and in Poland. We have to rebuild and give more chances to young riders. The NL is becoming a third league when it was supposed to be a training league to give riders the chance to progress. Its not what many want but it's what needs to happen and all tracks to stand together to create the variety required and the financial side to benefit clubs and spectators. Britain is so far behind other leagues it can't try and keep up and while there is a call to have league racing, it's simply not attractive enough at present to carry on as it is.
  14. With the example pay rates of £50 a start and £50 a point you will get the riders you can afford. Number ones will most likely be riders like Steve Worrall, Jason Garrity etc and they would be around £250 start and £600 points money which won't be too far off what they are getting now. They will have 36-40 league matches, plus cup matches so going on 40 meetings would be around £34,000 a year. Yes there is expenses which is why riders try and gain sponsors and being a number one they stand a better chance of improving current deals. Let's not forget that the riders at reserve will mainly be NL riders who will be picking up £400 if they score four from four which is more than they do in the NL. Its also a lot more than most people pick up each week in 40 hours work and they could get that in one night and getting just third places. These are the riders that the sport can afford and will also make it more affordable for fans new and old. Also I think that the issue of the home track paying all wages would be of benefit these days. They have had the income and riders can be paid straight away. At present a club like Berwick could have four away meetings in a row. What money are they going to use to pay their riders which has been a problem for a few tracks in recent times. Its all all about talking and addressing issues and hopefully the BSPA will adopt this even if it's for guidance or ideas but certainly they need to listen to the fans that are left and to each other and work together.
  15. Pits at Championship level hence the 35 limit which isn't far off what most Championship clubs are at now
  16. 35 is an estimated limit and I have put down teams to see if they can be fitted in with riders with new riders coming in from abroad and plenty of NL drafts. It may seem to week for some but you have to realise we have been running at a level the sport can't afford for too long already. we are now at a stage that we can't afford overall the riders we have at number one in some teams. It needs to be all clubs working together so Redcar or Workington can compete at a level with Belle Vue or Poole. Aces he's for example could have a team along the lines of Cook 8.2, Worrall 6.6, Bewley 6.3, Drzodz 5.5, Etheridge 4.3, Smith 2.00 and a 2.00 draft. That is a team that could compete against the current Redcar team which would be at the same level, just maybe a bit more balanced We all want to see bigger names here but we need variety and need weekly action at a level that is affordable while also giving British riders a better chance of progressing.
  17. British Speedway needs to be employing riders it can afford and that means at a level we don't really want but it's a level needed to rebuild and be affordable. With current levels and prices for fans, tracks can't afford to pay riders three grand a night and with just 18 tracks remaining in the top two leagues it needs everyone fighting together to save the sport here. Bring in Sayfutdinov, Bring in Zmarzlik etc but the level we all want to see would mean charging £30 a meeting and crowds of 5,000 and we are struggling to get people to pay £18 now and tracks getting a fifth of that. If you can't afford a Ferrari, get a Ford Focus and run financially viable and less behind curtain deals
  18. With the current state of British Speedway being at breaking point, now is the time that promoters and owners really need to listen to their customers or face the consequences that won't be reversed once the final straw has broken the donkeys back. For or this the sport needs to arrange at a big venue like the NEC a weekend of urgent and important talks required between all parties. One hall should be a Speedway Show with stands all around a small entertainment pitch while another open for an open forum with fans and sponsors able to voice concerns and views. At the good food show they have a theatre at the end of the hall good for a decent crowd so this would be suitable for use of both sides. The trade stands pay to be there, fans pay £5 to enter the show and a further £5 to enter the theatre. This would go some way to meeting costs but most importantly it's an event that needs doing and tracks listen to the fans and sponsors. The AGM could have a pre meeting before this and then the AGM concluded either on the Sunday at the show or finished at a nearby Conference Suite with just BSPA working together to get the sport back on line and look to the future for all. PROPOSED CHANGES / IDEAS ONE LEAGUE combining current Premiership and Championship tracks to compete at Championship level but using Premiership averages and teams built to a 35 limit including at least one NL draft at 7 for each team. RACE NIGHTS to suit each track. If Belle Vue want Friday's and Swindon Thursday etc then fine. If riders can't commit to British Speedway as priority (not including their home nation) then don't bother and stay abroad . FIXED PAY RATES / FEES There appears to be be money owed to riders in each league this year which shows the sport is running at costs far too expensive for the income. They are losing die hard fans and not attracting new customers and at £17-18 an adult for 15 one minute races they are not going to attract the numbers required to increase income and most importantly atmosphere to make it a better nights entertainment. There is is a weird way speedway clubs pay riders with the home team paying the visiting team a percentage of their wages according to the points they get. The visitors then make up the rest but if they haven't had a home meeting for weeks, they can only do this via private money. So a fixed pay rate, paid on the night should erase these issues and again, if it's not enough for a certain rider, then go find a track abroad where you can get 40 plus meetings and paid on the night. £50 a start - £50 a point means there is £500 on offer each race (£550 inc BP) gives you a wage bill of £7,500 a meeting (plus BP). £10 Adult - £6 Concession - £1 Age 11-16 means you would need a crowd of 750 Adults to ensure the wage bill is met for that night (800 inc BP). If a track can't get a crowd of 750 for a meeting on their chosen race night at these prices then they are obviously in no fit state to ride at any level. Any extra income a track gets with a larger crowd can be used how they see fit, either meeting costs incurred or towards rent and expenses etc. However sponsorship money should be gained to meet running costs and stadiums that are rented also take the income off bars and food outlets. You our are not going to attract people at current rates. A young married couple come to the speedway after watching the GP the previous week. £36 for two adults, two kids at 12 and 9 costs just £1 and a programme a further £3. Then the kids want an ice cream, some chips and they all have a couple of drinks. You are now looking at roughly £70 paid out to stand on a grass bank or on old concrete terraces and watch fifteen one minutes races often with a large gap in between due to track grading or so many restarts due to movement at the tapes. AVERAGES - Foreign riders come in on an assessed average and should keep that average until he reaches that level. If he has come in on a 6.00 average but is achieving 3.74 then any meeting he misses, his club can only use a guest or RR based on his real average of 3.74. If that track wants to bring him back next year then it will be on 6.00 but will they want a rider than scores three or four WHAT THIS GIVES YOU VARIETY - Not the same teams over and over again WEEKLY - With 18-20 tracks, plus Cup matches you are looking at 22 meetings on average giving weekly meetings and not one every three weeks and then two in a week to catch up. TEAM - The seven riders you have are YOUR riders not also riding elsewhere YOUNG RIDERS - Using Premiership averages and seven riders to a limit of 35 most will need a 2.00 rider at number seven. These are draft riders and as teams are at a Championship level then Redcar, Workington etc won't be looking at having to get in better riders but teams like Belle Vue, Wolves and Swindon going to their levels. This will create more spaces for riders to move up into as most if not all reserves will be British riders. ATMOSPHERE increases with the more people there. Attracting new fans at these rates should be much easier and hopefully local pubs, clubs or associations will get involved and make it a more regular night out. Colleges, large companies, military bases etc can be approached to hopefully double the current levels OVERALL it's making British Speedway more affordable on both sides and building from a solid new foundation. It gives tracks their required race night and more opportunities for British riders. MAKE THE AGM PUBLIC AND LISTEN TO THE FANS .... May even make a few bob holding the Speedway weekend and without major changes it will be last out please turn off the lights
  19. Lindgren 12 -14 50 LESS Woffinden 12 - 14 Doyle 11 - 13 Zmarzlik 9 - 11 Janowski 9 - 11 Pedersen 8 - 10 Dudek 8 - 10 Sayfutdinov 8 - 10 MJJ 7 - 9 30 MORE Laguta 7 - 9  Zagar 7 - 9 Hancock 7 - 9 50 MORE Holder 6 - 8 20 MORE Vaculik 5 - 7 30 MORE Pawlicki 4 - 6 Cook 2 - 4 
  20. Forget the injuries to Howarth and Newman, the biggest name missing here is Doc Bridgett who week after week, year after year has provided a great racing surface at Monmore Green and this was a gate and go track. Hardly any passing, one race line mostly and turn one was bare and dusty but exit on turn two was fine despite being in sunlight more. They have added more clay to the material which should help but it's nothing like the track it was. As for Leicester, why didn't they take Sarjeant out of heat nine and put Bjerre in ? That could have cost them a point and certainly took away the chance of winning by still using a rider that in three heats covered less ground than Usain Bolt. Another home win like most of the league and any points that teams can take on away tracks will be vital to reach the play offs. As Peter Adams says it's the form at the end of the season that counts but Wolves with Morris at 2 and Heaps looking like a bloated Ed Sheeran lookalike they are going to find it hard to improve unless they take a gamble on a new rider soon.
  21. With a few weeks off already I don't think they wanted to leave it nearly a month til the next home meeting and being a foregone conclusion that Aces were going through it was best to run it this night. The Karlsson Corridor is a very misleading term used at Monmore. It has nothing to do with Peter Karlsson who usually exited turn two out wide but it came from his brother, Mikael Max who was previously Karlsson. Mikael was the first to master hitting the kerb out of turn two where there is a soft patch and spring forward down the straight. David Howe then managed to use it regular as did Freddie Lindgren but never PK so in reality it should be the Max Move, the Howe Hot Spot or the Lindgren Leap but Mr Tatum and Pearson used it once and it's stuck ever since. As they say ..... Speedway out of the top draw
  22. Is it just me that thinks the three best riders to go through to next years GP series are Piotr Pawlicki, Vaclav Milik and Robert Lambert who all happen to be nominated wild cards. Which gets me thinking why do they bother with qualifiers to get here and do initial qualifiers during the season upto the semi final stage (2 meetings) where the qualifiers meet up with ten nominated riders like Pawlicki, Hampel etc and then the top six from each go to the final to meet up with one wild card and the riders finishing 9-11 in the GP series. Seems a a bit crazy sending riders like Kai Huckenbeck, Ricky Wells to places like Latvia to face the likes of Hampel, Zagar etc so let them go there with a chance of getting to the semi finals which opens it up a lot more for qualifying
  23. Matej Zagar, Antonio Lindbäck, Janusz Kolodziej, Krzysztof Kasprzak, Jack Holder, Niels Kristian Iversen, Kenneth Bjerre, David Bellego, Kevin Wolbert, Craig Cook, Max Fricke, Hans Andersen German Wild Card - Smolinski or Huckenbeck Three Wild Cards Jaroslaw Hampel and Leon Madsen must be up for a slot and both good enough to be GP riders and would like to see Robert Lambert given a place but GB get very little usually so would expect Vaclav Milik to have more chance of getting a nomination.
  24. If they want to do it over 42 heats why not do it on the same day. Start one at 12 and the second at 7pm and during the break get the track done and ready for the evening as the base holds up well and the main work would be getting the starting gates level. Poland is really the only place now to hold big finals and Belle Vue is fine for a qualifier but unless Germany can provide better than Tetrow and grass banks it should be given to countries that can provide the stadiums like Sweden or Vojens, Denmark. Points should be be carried forward to the race offs with bigger points on offer in the final, maybe 5-3-2-0 giving a team chance to gain six points with a 8-2 while the leading country can just go for the race win as GB did to secure their advantage. In this scenario, Russia would have needed a 7-3 to win the title. Also take away the age restriction for reserves in a pairs event. In the SWC it's fine to have a under 21 but too much pressure or importance is put on reserves in this format and really only Poland, Britain and Russia had creditable reserves of the standard to be in a World Final.
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