uk_martin

Ha ha, I remember those from my TA days, on exercise in Germany...otherwise known as a "TURDIS" ! Likewise I was at Vojens in the early 1980's just after Ole Olsen had built it, when that too was just a shale track with grass banking all around and precious little else. It's a bit different now though. Does he have to wear it for the rest of the season? Will it fit over his helmet?

It might help to highlight that point if you can explain what it is that the PZM do for the Polish youngsters, as a point of comparison to what the BSPA "don't" do.

Yes, well done to Richie...looks like I owe Wizzer a pint of beer too...

39 sounds very limited until you bear in mind that the reserves are 2 x 2.5, leaving 34 to be spread around the other 5 places. What's with the minimum 31 points limit though? Which clubs would field a 31-point aggregate average team? I would think that implimenting this is going to make Greek austerity plans sound like a walk in the park. If the Stal Gorzow budget for 2012 that I was told about is anything to go by, and if that's typical of other clubs, then this is going to be drastic with a capital D-R-A-S-T-I-C.

As a slight aside, if Wroclaw (Breslau) is close enough, maybe see you there in August? Three of us are flying into Leipzig, then staying a night in Colditz before getting the train to Wroclaw for their match against Tarnow. Be good to be able to wear red and yellow in Poland and shouting for Seb Ulamek without confusing the locals lol.

I didn't see whether at the time of the collision, Hancock had crossed the line or not. In either circumstances... 1. If he had crossed the line, the rule quoted by NeilWatson applies, and the ref got it right. 2. If Hancock hadn't crossed the line and the race was still "live" at the time of the collision, then Crump should have been excluded anyway for both wheels crossing the inside line in his drama-queen attempt at avoiding the pile-up and grass-tracking his way to the finishing line. Either way, the eventual outcome was correct, and hats off to the referee for the right call.

Thanks Pawel. Something like that for next year would be well worth looking forward to. This year, I've got the trip to Malilla (SWC) and a trip to Wroclaw v Tarnow (via Leipzig and Colditz!), with the possiblitiy of a non-speedway trip to Krakow in Sept/Oct which I'd like to convert to a speedway trip if there is a play-off match in the area (in Tarnow?) to look forward to. But next year with info like that at hand at an early stage, there may be some even more interesting trips to be planned.

Naughty Nicki!

Speedway Sar I take it? Ah well, my fault then...not being a reader of that mag. Still it would be nice to have a consolidated fixture list for next year, that include all the individual events, SGP qualifiers, etc etc that go on, so that those of us who intend to travel can plan ahead to best effect. Maybe having it as a "sticky" at the top of the forum or something? For those of us still finding our feet with the Polish speedway scene, I think it would be a great help.

Is this an annual thing? Would love to know more about events like this much further in advance. I'm happy enough to travel to Poland 2 or 3 times a year just to see a league or play-off meeting but if the trip could include something on a Saturday as well as a Sunday league match, then that would be twice as good. Any chance that a list of meetings like this could be compiled and posted at about the same time as the league fixtures next year, to help with the forward planning please?

Is there any of the Alf Busk lineage in Nikolaj Busk Jakobsen?

Don't get me wrong Phil, the heart is with them, but the head says otherwise...only my opinion like. The photos of the Italian track suggest it will suit the Poles and those who ride in the Polish leagues and other big tracks. If the English lads were at Berwick or Workington every week, my opinion may be different, but the "muck" of Newcastle isn't really the best preparation ground for a 400m semi-longtrack circuit, with what looks like a cement dust surface. I do wish the British lads all the best out there, and if they can pull it off, there'll be a pint waiting for you in the bar at the Barr the following Thursday, Phil.

Fair enough, lol. My 8+8 have been edited down to 7+7

Are you trying to make a comeback Phil?

Those in bold are my stab in the dark best guesses for progress to the final. Good luck to the English guys, but when you look at the gulf in class between MJJ (GB-EL Ekstraliga etc) Dudek, Zmarzlik, Pawlicki2 etc and the likes of Tom Perry & the Worral bros, you have to resign yourself to saying good luck and god speed, but not hold your breath lol

Sounds like a handicap race to me then. The Italian, Irish and Spanish wheelbarrows be followed by Frenchies, Germans and Belgiques with buckets, to transfer their burdens over to the Belgian, German and French wheelbarrows, as the race progresses, in case the wheels come off their financial wagons. Could also be that the Greeks will get a German to push their wheelbarrow, as they expect all their finances to come from Germany at the moment?

Stuff that lot... it's the boating, bows 'n' arrows and swordfighting that I'm most looking forward to.

According to this article - http://www.polonia.bydgoszcz.pl/blog/1_1432-josh_auty_w_polonii_bydgoszcz_.html - it seems that Josh Auty will be given the chance to impress Polonia with a view to challenging for a team place. Best of luck to the lad. Be good to see British talent given a chance in Poland. Now for Ben Barker to be given a go over there...

The TVP cameras do a good job, but three are things that they miss, things that make the trip over to Poland for league meetings so worthwhile...the insanity that is a Polish league meeting... Enjoy!

Oh so nearly for Gorzow. If zagar had decided to turn up then the result could have been different.Like Bluejam says, these two teams could be facing each other again in the play off finals. Tarnow's riders might have to be banned from riding in the UK to improve their performance if they are to stand a chance against Gorzow then lol.

The thing is, watching a silent movie, you can't make out who has said what to who, or get an explaination of what was going on etc etc...people are left to interpret for themselves with only a part of the information to hand. If ever there is a time when misunderstandings could ferment, it's when there is a lack of information, so the absence of the presenters was highly unfortunate. I was at the stadium, and the pits were below where I was sitting. I could see and not hear, a bit like people watching television. Again, my view was also partially obstructed as well, so I could only make out some of what was going on. There were the occasional phone text messages from family and friends away from the stadium which informed us about certain things, but not everything can be contained in an SMS message. I also could form an opinion on what I saw, but as I clearly didn't see everything, or hear anything, it would be wrong in my mind to be too opinionated one way or the other. As for the TV coverage, and also only in my opinion, either the presenters should have stayed, or the entire coverage should have been stopped. Only half-covering the events was the worst thing that could have happened.

I know what you are saying, however in discussions with people, the question that always came up, is "what would Lee have wanted?" Unanimous opinion was that he would have wanted the show to go on. (note it is only an opinion, feel free to disagree) Hence the "damned if you do and damned if you don't" line.

A case of "damned if you do and damned if you don't". Also case of "talk is cheap" comes to mind. Supposing that the meeting would have been cancelled after about 7 heats, Would the supporters in the stadium have been entitled to refunds? In which case would the riders that wanted to have the meeting stopped have been happy to not get paid for the day? There was only one pot of money, it could either go towards refunds or it could go to the riders' pay...it can't go both ways. Would the people who were phoning in to complain afterwards have been willing to pay for the refunded admission prices? As for the conduct of the meeting, the translation that I saw on the SG web site says that the PZN does not influence meetings from "outside". Its representitive at the meeting is the referee, (or "judge"! in the words of the translation service lol) and he negotiated the continuation of the meeting with BOTH team managers. It's easy to say that it's all Gorzow's fault, but I'm willing to bet that the last three races being 5-1, 5-1 & 5-0, influenced ZG's wanting to pull out of the meeting too. They were keen for the meeting to be rerun rather than taking Gollobs option of letting the remaining riders in the remaining heats get excluded under the 2-minute rule and have the meeting count towards the league table. No-one's hands came out of all that totally clean. As for the actions of the TVP guys, I can understand their personal feelings, and I have sympathy with that, HOWEVER, there is a PROFESSIONAL angle to this. The whole situation was confused, there were millions of people watching who needed explanations of what was happening, and it was their jobs to make some sense of it for the benefit of the viewing public. They let their personal feelings get in the way of their professional obligations. OK, there was a death, and it's very sad that it happened. But we've seen that before. When MotoGP riders, IndyCar and F1 drivers have been killed in the past, the TV presenters have stuck to their tasks and the viewing public got all the information that was available, and weren't left trying to make sense of a silent video that carried on for a long time afterwards, and I wonder how many opinions were clouded by mis-understanding the pictures that were being seen, that weren't explained by a commentator or presenter.

Kind of relevant to what is bieng said here, but no point writing it out twice...

I've just returned home after having travelled to see this meeting. As to what happened, all I can say is that the situation was confusing. The stadium PA was hard to hear where we were so we didn't catch the internal announcements, and of course we didn't have the benefit of what was seen on TV. That said, the pieces of the jigsaw that are to hand suggest that: The Referee consulted with the teams as soon as news broke. Both teams agreed to continue. The match score card was signed by both team managers to that effect. Falubaz had a change of heart as time went on and of course it was all stopped after heat 11. Some Stal riders were seemingly also not happy to contunue. Tomasz Gollob's suggestion was that the meeting sould carry on with all remaining riders in the remaining heats being excluded under the 2 minute rule so that the meeting could be "declared" and no rider need ride. Flaubaz's management were not happy with this and were negotiating for a re-run of the meeting. Confusion ruled. No-one seemed certain about what was going. I said that I had a few pieces of the jigsaw, but I don't know how many are missing. Not sure anyone really does. Stal fans were locked in the stadium for a while as stories spread about the Falubaz fans and the Riot Police locking horns with each other. Seems some Falubaz fans were arrested, and others would be persued on the evidence of the CCTV and photographic surveilance that was carried out. What seems to have missed all the reports so far, was the spontanious chanting of Lee Richardson's name by fans of both teams when the news broke. There was a minute's silence as a mark of respect, and the afterwards, there was even applause from the Stal fans when the next round of tribute chanting of Lee Richardson's name came from the Falubaz fans. It of course led to the Stal fans repeating the chants. Not long after that, but I'm not quite sure after which heat, the Falubaz fans unilaterally left the stadium. Sadly that was when they had their encounter with the Police. The meeting went on for a heat or two without them, with the atmosphere in the stadium being numbingly flat. After an period of uncertaintly, the announcement was then made that the meeting had been abandoned, with decisions about whether the result would stand following later in the week. People started moving towards the exits, but of course were penned in for a while (see point 5 above) Someone on another thread said that we can all live another day and the meeting may or may not be rerun, and there will doubtless be repercussions, before everything is sorted out, but there's one person who won't be with us to see that day. RIP Lee Richardson, and my condolences go out to his family friends and colleagues on their immeasurable loss.