uk_martin

Just add a Philips...or rather DON'T lol

Hi Dean If "A Ltd" supplies a product/service, and receives money for it, it has to be receipted and will appear in the books that HMRC will inspect for taxation reasons. I don't think it's legal for "B Ltd" or "C Ltd" to receive money for products / services to be supplied by "A Ltd" Nothing to stop "A Ltd" having outgoings / costs / expenses e.g. directors remuneration, accountants fees, other business expenses, etc, that rack up whilst the sales do not cover the outgoings....Just a matter of time then before someone calls time and brings in the receiver / administrators / liquidators to wind the company up. Any form of transfer of money from one company to another, is liable to taxation, e.g. Income tax from dividends, or VAT from a sale of a product, so the more you make money do the rounds, the richer George Osborne will get, and the more the value of the cash in your bank will diminish. Being specific to the Philips case, it's quite probable that his accountancy business is flourishing, and likewise his BCTG colleges could be doing really well too. They won't get dragged down the plug hole just because of the speedway. Each company that Philips owns has to stand on its own two feet. As a parallel to this, the money you put into your pension fund will go towards investing shares in a range of companies on the stock market. Some companies will do your pension fund a power of good...on the other hand, some of your money may well have gone into UniPart Ltd. Unipart ceasing trading won't affect the investments made by your pension fund in other companies.

There are accountants who are employed purely for their skills in setting up trading companies, letting them run up a debt, whilst their shareholders get paid dividents, and then winding them up again, as "administrators", or "liquidators". BBC's Watchdog has featured some of these in the past. Because directors of companies are not personally responsible for the debts of the company (unlike sole traders of non-limited companies) then they can get away with these things all the time. Accountants know all the loopholes and know exactly how to best go about "playing the system". It's what they get paid for!

LEGALLY - each Limited company is a seperate legal entity, belonging to the shareholders. There is nothing stopping one or two shareholders owning several or many limited companies. Therefore, there is nothing illegal about Alan and Charles Philips being sole shareholders of Birmingham Brummies Ltd (or whatever it was called) AND Phillips Fantasy Accounting Ltd AND Whatevertheywant Ltd etc The minimum capitalisation needed to open a new limited company is just £100. That's all the shareholding needs to be. After that what assets it accumulates, or what debts it racks up are a seperate issue. One company can be cash rich and "reward its directors" with flashy new cars, whilst at the same time another company could owe loads of money and maybe go bust. They are two seperate legal entities, and are only linked by common director with his share ownership. Each of those limited companies will have books that will monitor all cash comings and goings. You can't just do bank account transfers between two companies, however if a company is very profitable and has cash to splash, it could "buy an investment" in one of the other companies, or it could buy a cheap product at a hugely inflated price (there are no laws that govern what price cheap tat has to be sold at) or the cash rich company could pay its director a dividend, which that director could invest into the debt ridden company. All very legal, and all very objective, as there are laws which govern these things. Bear in mind too that Philips, being an accountant will be best suited to how to make his money work best for him in these circumstances. What's MORAL, HONOURABLE, and DECENT - now that's another set of questions...and one that begs subjective answers, no two of which will ever be quite the same.

One for the Birmingham fans... Can I suggest that everyone takes a step back and reassesses what has happened to the Birmiingham Brummies fan base over the past 7-8 years as a result of activities on these forums? Then maybe ask yourselves if the way that things have gone on in the past is the best way to carry on into the future? How many fans have been lost as a result of personal attacks in forums for one reason or another? How many more can the Brummies afford to lose? Is there anyone left to lose? Is the constant personal attack / counter-attack doing any good in bringing fans together to rally around a common cause to show a potential promoter that the fans are one headache that they won't have to have? So who am I to speak? Good question. I'll hold my hands up. I've been as guilty as plenty of others of giving as good as I get. Guilty of ruffling a few feathers. Guilty of giving my opinion even if it's not popular. Guilty of enjoyiing my time as a Brummies fan. Guilty of plenty of other things too. There you go. Fetch a rope and hang me. I'm beyond caring about that now. And when you've finished hanging me, you'll still be faced with those questions I'm asking. So what's the best way forward? Does anyone think that comparing ego's and penis sizes is the way to go? Or do we draw a line in the sand and say what was is in the past and from here we go forward? Do we carry on or stop the game of "I'm a bigger fan than you"? Do we get over the past and work towards a future? Is it time to bury hatchets and come together? We've seen the damage that the boardroom civil war did, we don't need to carry on a civil war on the terraces too. I'd hope that some people reading this might think that they are better than that. Sorry if it's only me to ask those questions. I was hoping that they might have come from someone more respected in order to carry more credence, but there you go, it's an imperfect world. But one things for sure, and that's that it keeps on turning.

Top advice.

Bluejam alluded to a more fundamental problem in his post a few pages back. He and a few others of us used to follow the Brummies home and away for years. In the days when I did the Twitter Updates I went to 100% of the meetings for more than 2 years and only missed a meeting if I was on holiday. Almost all of us who were such devotees have since pretty much given the entire sport in the UK a wide berth now. There's more to it than just how the Brummies were run. Speedway itself has become a "toxic brand". It seems that the closer you get to the sport the more repulsed you feel at the behind-the-scenes politics, ineptitude and dirty tricks that go on at all levels of the sport to the point when you just become so fed up with it all that you pack the sport up not just your team. So as well as it applies to those more directly at fault, thank you to the British Speedway establishment for your part in fans no longer going through the turnstiles at Birmingham.

Nice to see the generosity being shown to the Brummies fans by the other teams up and down the country. I doubt if any attempts to convert them into supporters of other teams will succeed though. Personally, I think that where there's life there's hope and that the main focus of most Brummies fans will be on supporting the sterling efforts being made to bring the sport back to the city in 2015. It won't be long before what's going on in Wolverhampton, Cradley or Coventry will just be a distraction. Birmingham is where the heart is, not Brandon or Monmore Green/Wood.

The article explains the principle. The principle applies in the UK too, if you want to dig deeper into it... http://uk.practicallaw.com/1-107-6319

Check out the concept of"lein" - http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/_/dict.aspx?rd=1&word=Lein It would allow the GRA to effectively hold property to ransom til their debts are cleared.

Listened to the show on the radio. Philips was making out that he was the victim of a BSPA conspiracy. What he said gave rise to a number of questions that needed the BSPA to answer. What a shame that they weren't there. Seems that the BSPA are hiding in their nuclear bunker waiting for the fall out to settle before, as Semion said, letting one of their own have it all on the cheap. Is it right that the "bond" that is lodged with the BSPA is only in the £8,000-£10-000 bracket (Philips said that Birmingham's bond was £8,500), and that having debts in excess of that are enough of a serious breach of regulations that the SCB can close a team down? But for the grace of god then... Philips stated, and no-one from the BSPA was there to answer the point, that he recognised that he had a short term cash flow issue and that it would be solved by an advance of the Sky money that the BSPA have in their bank (he says) to overcome the difficulties. Philips said that he applied to the BSPA for an advance and the BSPA refused to assist, and that alerting them to the cash flow shortage was what triggered the process of throwing the rule book at him. I wonder what the reply to that from the BSPA would have been? Birmingham's management were never liked in BSPA circles, as they were on the other side of the boardroom civil war to BSPA "Old Boy" Graham Drury. They liked to do things their way, and that did tend to rub establishment figures up the wrong way, so it comes as no surprise now that no-one in the BSPA wants to see Philips or anything/anyone connected with Philips survive, whether he has the cash to bail out the debts now or not. We got one side of the story on the radio. Who knows what was true and what wasn't. Tony Mole pointed out that he was only an honourary president of the BSPA and didn't have an executive role, so wasn't aware of all the information, so coudn't answer back for the BSPA. One thing is for sure, time is running out, and there's a game of "hardball" going on over the future of Birmingham Speedway. Philips isn't blinking, Mole doesn't know what to blink about (he says) and the BSPA weren't blinking there. So so sad that it's all come to this.

The BBC presenter read out a statement from the BSPA stating that they would not be taking part in the show due to concerns over Alan Philips's health. What the hell is that all about? Shame really as some points were raised that an official BSPA response would have been useful to hear.

I hope you don't do jury service if that's all it takes. Still, you'll believe what you want to believe, so carry on. I've not been losing too much sleep over BSF for a while now, and don't intend to start now. Suffice to say, and to repeat what I said on Facebook, fingers crossed that something can be sorted out for the Brummies and that they'll weather the storm, somehow.

I'm quite aware that a since-departed former promoter put about the story linking me with this Pedler, and those who wanted to believe it have done so, but if I've got something to say, I'll say it myself thank you.

Oops. Sorry for the duplication

Because it's not an "international" fixture. Same goes for any rider riding in a foreign league match in their own country.

Went to see Bartosz Zmarzlik's debut hopeful of a good meeting but came away feeling robbed, for two reasons. Firstly because of Rosco's prevarocations which took up the time that another couple of races could have been held in, which would have given us a result. Do I blame Rosco for it? Yes and no...Yes because the fans were cheated, and no, because he was doing what he gets paid to do, which is to look after himself and his team...ONLY. And secondly, robbed of justice with that awful refereeing decision. Do I blame the referee for that - without a doubt. Glad that Bartosz showed his potential. I just hope he can do a good job for the rest of his meetings for us. I think he will enjoy his time at Kings Lynn on Thursday. Just a shame that there will only be 4 or 5 more races that we will see him for at Perry Barr before his contract expires (weather permitting).

Or..."Bartek" to his friends. (say it as you see it)

I for one might well do so. Maybe others will too. A far more inspirational signing than Edward Kennet ever was, so maybe those others who were depressed by that caliber of rider might well feel better about this one. Might just reinforce confidence in fans about the future too. Who knows? A full time rider and a club asset next year? (Well, let's get there first, but why not have the glass half full for now, for a change?)

Good job they didn't sign Pawel Przedpełski then isn't it. Welcome to Birmingham, Bartek.

My first meeting of the year, as much to say hello to some people as anything else, and was quite impressed with some of the races. Well done to all the Brummies riders. Hope that Jonas Kylmakoprpi gets better soon after getting that injury that caused him to withdraw,

Got our tickets. Can't wait for next week! It's going to be a great trip I think. Weather forecast looks reasonable (without being totally tropical), so it should be good. Be interesting to see who we bump into out there, and it would be nice to say hello to anyone off here who's going to be there too.

Having been to the St Helen's v Wigan Rugby League match, just for a change, I was listening to the fans there shouting "kill him", "rip his head off", "nobble him", "break his neck" etc.. I sincerely doubt however that these shouts from the terraces were anything more than "bravado" and in the cold light of day I doubt that anyone on the terraces would for one minute wish ill on any of the players, of either team. So unless the Poole fan in question is some kind of psychopath (which I would doubt) I don't think there would have been any true malice in what was being said. Speedway is fueled in part by methanol and in part by adrenaline, so you have to make allowances for the fact that people will say things when they are "pumped up" that they may not really mean and that goes for fans, riders and officials alike. If the odd fan shouting off in what may at best be an "uneducated" manner is so upsetting, the for pity's sake, don't ever consider going to Poland to watch this sport.

Is there a "Miss Polish Brolly Dolly 2014" competition running anywhere? I'd nominate the 4 ladies from Torun as leading candidates right now. What do you mean "sexist tosh"? lol If you can lust after Daria, why not those lovely start line ladies?

I went to the SWC in Gorzow a few years ago, and met some of the locals over some beers etc. It's a very welcoming town that is SO big into speedway, Still in touch with a lot of the people who I've gotten to know over there, and visit regulartly. I just took to the place. Yes other towns are more picturesque and Torun's stadium may be a little nicer, but at the end of the day, it's as much a "people thing" who you latch on to. Have been back every year since, and wouldn't miss the home meeting against Falubaz for anything! Needless to say, I'm more than a little pleased with today's result!