Gresham

The Engines would be off the shelf and 'sealed' basic engines with no high spec tuning. Built to last from a manufacturer like JAWA. Rolling chassis would be owned by the riders...they provide their own. Costs would be kept down, as riders wouldn't be paid the money that they spend on engine tuning or engines. The rider wouldn't have the costs...the money saved being paid to the rider, would still go towards Engines. It's just the club paying it direct, rather than the rider. When you think about it...it's the Clubs paying for the engines and tuning anyway...as they pay the riders, who then pay the tuners, engine manufacturers. It's a crazy situation as it is...you have certain riders racing for teams, who get paid to race for that team. However....that money being paid, often goes towards the maintenance and tuning of engines being used in GP's and Individual events. Why should clubs be paying wages to riders, who then use a great majority of that money to invest in machinery for GP and Individual events? Any money in theory, should be going into machinery being used to race on at Club meetings. Costs would be the same, you are just cutting out the middle man ( the rider ) Pay the rider...the same wages, less the cost of maintaining the engines. It's simple in theory. If a rider wants to be sponsored by companies for individual events, then so be it. Why not have sponsors who wish to sponsor a rider or team, have the money go towards the team engines instead, and have the sponsors name on team kevlars, team bike and handle bar covers? Costs would still be lower than now, as the engines would be sealed and 'Standard' and built to last...rather than highly tuned and on the brink of breaking. That could easily be done. It's just a mindset of how Speedway is run now, that has to be changed. We've got used to it being like it is for many years...change is hard to see, but it could be done. Riders wouldn't like it to start with...but if it was forced, then they would have to. Most other motor sports run this way...it's only Speedway as far as I can see that doesn't. In fact, in many motor sports...drivers/riders have to pay a team or manufacturer up front to race for them in many cases.

.... this for me, is the biggest change needed with Club Speedway. Looking at the way Speedway has developed since it's early days, I think the one thing that should have been introduced many years ago, was the Introduction of Club/team bikes. Off the top of my head, I can't think of another team in motorsport, where it's up to the individual in each team, to supply and service/maintain their own motors/chassis etc. Speedway riders throughout history, spend £££££'s on their engines, tuning them to within inch's of their life. Everyday...every rider is concerned about how much extra speed they can get out of their engines. It's a merry go round, that is fruitless and the only people that really benefit are the engine tuners and manufacturers. Having seen one of the Danish riders interviewed recently, where he quoted he spent over £200,000.00 to race Speedway last season. Let that sink in...200 Grand before he's made profit....absolute madness. As a fan...are we concerned about who's got the fastest bike...who's got the best tuner? Are you not frustrated when you see a talented rider failing to score to his potential, because his bike isn't as fast this week? They spend countless hours travelling, covering many miles and still have to concentrate on getting their engines highly tuned...just to compete. Surely as Speedway fans, all we are interested in, is seeing the talent of a rider on a Speedway bike...rather than who's got the best engine tuner and who owns the fastest bike? I'd love to see Club Speedway make a massive change to how it's run and introduce Club bikes. You may ask who's going to fund this? Well each rider knows how much he spends each season on engines and tuning from their accounts. That could be taken into account when structuring such a new venture. A percentage could be taken off each contracted rider, to go towards the club bikes, instead of into the riders pocket, who would only spend that money on servicing and tuning his own bikes. If Clubs could find a way of having sealed engines, with minimum tuning needed...off the shelf in other words, then I feel Speedway could save massive amounts of money. Granted...Riders would have to have their own rolling chassis, and able to make adjustments to clutch etc...but costs could be massively improved on. I'd only suggest this was done in League meetings. In Individual meetings, I'd say let the riders do whatever they want re their bikes. But simplified...find a way of Clubs providing sealed engines. Each engine being checked before a meeting, then lots chosen as to who gets what engines. Get the engines put in each riders rolling chassis before the meeting...then race...on equal terms. Yes...big adjustments would have to be made...plus a different thought process by the riders on how to approach a meeting. Yes, it's a drastic idea...but it's something I've felt strongly about for many many years. Of course there would be stumbling blocks to start, like anything that is new...but why not. Personally...I'd love to see this introduced. I'd love to see Speedway promotors able to save money and invest in the sport. Tracks have had to invest in Air fences...We also need to start investing in track covers. I don't see enough money coming into the sport to survive as it is...let alone invest for the future. It imo, would also bring a better Club feel to our sport. Can anyone else see this being possible? Find ways of doing it, rather than reasons not to?

....lovely bit of social footage showing how things are so different today... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSOumilHl0U

Maybe....i don't know peoples 'history'....however he is still entitled to his opinion. The sad thing is...nearly every thread is turned on its head by the same people...telling others what they should think. People have opinions...we don't all agree...but its the same old people, same old crap nearly every thread. If people stuck to the subject and ignored forum members, this place would be a whole more pleasant experience.

For sure...I agree with much of that, and did imply what you said in a previous post. However...when you look at the pro's and con's of letting former riders in for free, who have a history with the club...what negatives are their...apart from losing £20 gate entrance? If they are not there...you're still £20 down. They bring an added attraction to the sport surely? How nice for an announcer to say...'we have former riders such and such here tonight, I'm sure they would be pleased to have a chat and a beer afterwards'. And maybe bring them onto the centre green for an impromptu chat now and again.? At the moment...all I see, is some rider dragged out, talking about the meeting before, with the likes of 'Oh yeah...fair dinkum mate...boys gave it their all, ripped a few good starts...could do better...throw another prawn on the Barbie mate'...whilst being drowned out by the mascot burning a few laps or two tractors doing their best to take all the dirt off the race line ;-) I've now had to amuse myself, at betting on which of the fat family can win the race to the Burger bar at the interval....whilst giggling at the announcer as he's muffling his word down the mic, whilst fumbling around in his satchel to find sweets to throw to the winner in the crowd, who got the answer right to this weeks teasing question, as to which rider did what in which year....enthrawling stuff I tell thee... Rather than...

Weird how some folk think it's not right to talk about Speedway because they don't go anymore, and don't find it entertaining anymore...yet pop down to the general chat part of the forum, and you'll find hundreds of posts by people giving 'strong opinion' about politics, who obviously haven't got a Scooby about it, yet no one goes calling them out...all very odd.

I wouldn't know where to start tbh. The startling fact is, if you took the elite and prem leagues...and fill every team with British riders...you'd only have 147. Nuts when you think about it. When you take into account, doubling up in the two 'Professional' leagues...how many riders are actually riding professionally over here?

Haha...you learn something new every day...It hadn't crossed my mind that times were still being done with a stop watch manually...what a waste of time ( excuse the pun )

Bit strange, asking people to pay, to go back to their old work place, isn't it? ;-) Surely as a 'Promotor', you would realise the added attraction ex riders bring to your business? In other sports, promotors have to pay for 'appearance' money to ex professionals...yet ours turn up, mix with the paying public, and some are asked to pay for the privilege...beggars belief when you think about it. I used to love listening to Malcolm Holloway at Swindon...he often added so much to what we were watching...and sometimes tell people to 'stop being daft' and explain to them why certain situations have happened on track. Hearing opinions from an ex riders perspective is so much more enjoyable...especially when the put certain fans in their place who don't have a clue ;-)

Out of interest...how many British riders are there, that ride Speedway in this country?

I'm totally with you fella...I think the majority of riders should be let in for free. If it was rammed and tickets were a premium I'd understand. But it's not...so let them in I say. Let them talk to fans. Fill up the wide open spaces as well. I'd also go as far as letting in all under 16's for free with a paying adult, and all under 18's in education.

Do they rarely attend because they can't afford it, like many, or because they feel slightly unwanted? It must be hard for any rider, especially from back in the day...when they were 'heros' to many, yet when they retire are 'desired' as much any longer. I also know from other sports, that new club owners and promotors, often don't like old sportsman coming back, as they would talk of the old days and how things were done differently.

I don't understand how people voice an opinion about how THEY feel about the sport...and get told by others, that they actually don't feel that way, and should feel differently, because it doesn't match their views. The mind boggles... Everyone is different...everyone has different ideas about how it could be improved, why they don't go anymore, or why they still enjoy it. People don't need to tell others how they should feel...it is their personal opinion. I've 'Returned' to watching live Speedway again after a little lay off, and have brought new people along. I'm thoroughly hooked again...but unfortunately, the more you read and try to understand the rules, regs, recent history, thoughts from managers and topics about recent events, it does tend to leave you feeling frustrated. When team managers and ref's are struggling to understand the rules, god help the rest of us. I simply shrug my shoulders now, laugh, and just enjoy the racing...too much information spoils it for me.

Thanks for confirming :-) Hopefully what has been proposed will make a turning point for a brighter and healthier future.

Haha...classic :-)

SCB licence is £60 if you classify yourself an amateur ;-)

I'd agree to a certain extent. Nothing better than chatting to ex riders and hearing old stories, plus getting their perspective of the riding action on the night. You learn a lot and it gives an added dimension to the meeting. Same with other sports as well...watch it with someone who's been there and done it at the highest level, and you get a whole different understanding. It's not like the terraces are bursting at the seams is it.... I'd also take it further and invite all school children in free with paying adult...and all under 18's in for free that are in education. You might as well have these people in for free, spending on refreshments etc...than not. You get them hooked and then that generation pay ( hopefully ) in the future. Plus...if people watching on the TV see a full house, especially of a younger generation, then they might be inclined to come as well. Just thinking outside the box a little.

Behind closed doors, all promotors, team managers, referees and officials were invited and to offer feedback. 6 rider teams only...over 15 heats. double points scraped...return to TS whenever team fell behind. No RR...etc.

Worth applying and paying for a licence...cheaper than a season ticket ;-)

Is this format anything to do with what was scheduled to be tested at Kings Lynn between Newcastle and Scunthorpe? Did this 'Test' actually take place?

If it's to be understood correctly, this has happened at Belle Vue? I know it also happens at certain football grounds. It's a catch 22...where do you draw the line? I understand there is a 'Belle Vue Legends' wall at the new stadium? I'd feel uncomfortable if I was the owner of the Club, promoting it, using images and names of former riders, to enhance their own business today, yet not willing to wave £20 to those riders he's using for his own business interests. Would a certain rider turn round and say...'No longer use my name or images, in programmes or further Belle Vue promotions, to gain financial reward for your own business now.'? Could we ever see a case of image rights being used by Speedway riders? Or has that already happened? Good will sometimes benefits a club or promotion now... If fans felt strongly enough that say for example 'PC' had to pay to get in, then talk with your feet...they'd soon take notice.

I agree...like I said...it all depends what each individual riders contract has written in it and where they reside. Each is an individual case. You don't ignore any contracts...as some maybe legally binding and effect money coming in or going out. That is a basic of any business balance sheet...as you should/would already know.

And people wonder why lads give up racing.... Such a tough sport to get into...expensive and time consuming. Interesting on the fans forum at BV last night, they were talking about getting youngsters through, talking of training tracks, academies, cherry picking from BMX riders of all things...but you get to a point where you think it's all talk, for all the reasons you have pointed out.

So you think a Bank manager would ignore any contracts you have with rider, and your legal obligations written into that contract? Contracts are all individual and can be complex, especially if the rider is a non resident. But if you think a bank manager/ financial advisor, would not take into consideration any riders contract, or any other physical assets, that could lead to either a profit or a loss, then I think said bank manager should find another job. Plus it seems you are looking at an 'asset' as purely leading to profit. Most eventually lead to a loss through depreciation. Doubting one thing and actually knowing is a big difference.

All depends on any contract agreed and the duration.