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Yeah, wasn't a bad crowd. Although the scoreline was very one sided (Which was always going to be the case against a 3 man Kent team) there was some very good racing on a well prepared track. The downpour yesterday and a bit of a shower this morning helped to give a track with a nice dirt line. For Stoke, everyone was solid, but Payne was on fire, clocking a 62.5 second time in heat 13. For Kent, Morely was very good, Ayres was alright when he calmed down, and Shanes was good value for money, but couldn't gate for toffee! The 3 3 pointers for Kent looked way out of their depth though, which was unfortunate for them All in all, a good meeting though.

No Chapman for Birmingham Ellis and Perry to hit maximums, Zach W to hit around 17, still needs the rest to chip in with a few. Birmingham will always be like that this season. When Zach moves into the main body of the team, they will be reliant on whoever drops down hitting some form, but their top 2 (And Zach) will ensure that they stay close in most meetings.

To give an example to the original question, years ago Stoke signed Neville Tatum on an 11 point average at the start of the season. He rode 1 meeting, got injured, didn't race for us again and we had our pick of guests for the season. Best signing we ever made

Was good to see you last night, even if I didn't really introduce myself. I promise I'll tell you my name next time I see you My decision is born of frustration, because I am fed up of being taken for granted as a fan. Last night was a good meeting, that ended in a way that feels all too familiar. Cradley had the same issue on Wednesday, but they get a pass because it is a one off, whereas Stoke have a power failure and it is almost expected, with cries of "Not again", instead of "Such a shame" To be honest, despite my young age, I have been going to Stoke for 19 years, and during that time, I have had some fantastic evenings, across both leagues that we have participated in. Unfortunately, the longer it has gone on, the more it feels like there is a disconnect between what a fan is, and what the promotion see a fan as. Yesterday, when taking into account the fuel, and the entrance fee, and a couple of soft drinks, it probably cost around £35, in a time where money is tight for a lot of people. Add in the fact that Stoke as an area tended to get hit harder by the recession, and suddenly fans are more careful about where they spend their money, and want to feel appreciated. The Stoke promotion seem to have a view that "We put on a service for you, you should be thankful that we do it" rather than seeing the fan as a customer, and wanting to give them value for money. When they moved to the NL (And in the years leading up to that) a lot of bridges were burned with fans. Stoke fans are some of the most loyal fans, and in years gone by have done all manor of things to help the club and the riders, but there is only so long that they will accept being taken for granted, and for a lot of them, that time came a long time ago. I am a dyed in the wool Stoke fan, and want nothing more than for the team to succeed, and everything I say comes from that viewpoint. It saddens me to see the decline that we have suffered, and I wish it could change, but it feels that we have a promotion who are happy to go through the motions, put a team out and know that because of the stock cars, they will make a profit. I can't help but feel that, for as long as the same people are involved in the running of the club, it will never recover, because they don't seem to want to change their ways. I want Stoke to do well, and by that, I don't mean I want a team who sweeps all before them. Yes, a 7 man trophy would be nice (Given that in our history we have never won one) but I just want to feel respected as a fan. I want to feel as though the promotion is thankful that I am there, instead of feeling that the promotion are happy to take my money and let me be. I'm sorry that this post got a bit long, but I feel like I make this kind of post every year, and every year nothing changes. It is upsetting to see how the club struggles, but by the same token, it is upsetting to see that the promotion have no desire to get better. Until the club actively tries to improve its image, why should I actively go out of my way to go? I will always support the 7 riders who pull on the Stoke race jacket, but until someone from the club realises the damage that they are doing each and every week, I will have to do it from afar. Can the club be turned around? No doubt. It would take hard work, but it can be done. Will it be turned around? I doubt it.

As far as I know, yes, but I wouldn't want to say for definite. The generator is still there, and was still very noisy as I walked past it. It's a shame really, as it had been a pretty good meeting. The track seemed good and provided a good racing line around the outside for those who wanted to use it, and while a couple of riders kept hitting the same bumps, those who attacked the track got their rewards, with Payne and Clegg both looking in a class of their own. Stoke were never going to go through on aggregate, but as a fan, I feel deprived of another meeting of Clegg and Payne, because you know that they wanted to meet up for a third time, to see who got the bragging rights! Sadly, I feel it is just another nail in the coffin.

Well, that was my first meeting of the season at Stoke, and no doubt my last as well. Absolute farce.

He is very much a rider who will do well, or do nothing. I expected him to score a few, because he started relatively well with us, but he can be very frustrating. He is someone who can score points though, and he looked to be gating well. No real change from when he was at Stoke, because there was always the worry that he could score 6 or score 0.

Malcolm, as far as I know, hasn't bought in to the club. Last time I checked the records at companies house (Which was about a year ago) there were still only 2 shares sold, with the assumption being they are to Dave and Caroline. Frankly, Stoke is never going to progress. It's often mooted that there is a requirement that for Dave and Caroline to continue to use the stadium, speedway has to run. They run Speedway as cheaply as possible (To try and cover the costs) and skim the money from the Stock cars. Stock cars put money in to keep the stadium up to some form of habitable level, and the bar takings soar on those nights. 5 year plan, 10 year plan, 100 year plan, it makes no difference. The owners will never sell, Stoke will never get any better, and they will stay NL because it is cheaper. Such a shame, but something that won't ever change.

No Zach W? Means a much easier Stoke win. Ellis and Perry will hold the ship together, but that's about it. Stoke by 8, so long as it beats the weather.

So, kind of went as expected. Birmingham's top 2 were virtually untouchable, middle order for them was hit and miss, and Zach W was very good at reserve. For Stoke, Phillips impressed, Tedham scored good points, but the others seemed a little below par for what they will expect of themselves. As for the meeting, not a bad meeting. Glad to see everyone get up after the horrible looking crash in heat 12, and surprised we made it to 15 heats given the dark cloud that seemed to be hanging over Perry Barr from about heat 10! Deserved win for Birmingham, and as I said yesterday, the top 2 will get them out of a lot of sticky situations in the coming weeks. They will be weakened when Zach goes into the main body of the team, but they should still have enough to be there or there abouts at the seasons end. As for Stoke, if they can bat off the ring rust and get bikes sorted, they will turn heads with a few performances.

To be fair, I'm pretty sure at this point, people will have made their decision on whether to travel or not! It's just a link for those who can't make it for whatever reason. You can't honestly say you have decided not to travel to a meeting solely on the basis that there were updates being provided...

This could be a really interesting meeting. Birminghams top 2 have the upper hand, but I would give the edge to Stokes middle order. Reserves will have an interesting battle, and this is one that could go down to the wire. Just hope the weather holds up!

It's the British weather. I reckon we can squeeze a meeting in in November

Honestly, I think this will be an interesting test for Stoke. Our top 2 is capable of holding their own against anyone, while our middle order is relatively strong in comparison to other teams. A lot will depend on how our reserves go, but there is a good chance Stoke could hit 50+. More importantly, I just want everyone to get out of the meeting safely! It's a challenge with nothing at stake. Get the bikes sorted, blow off the cobwebs and prepare for the next 9 months!

What we expected in regards to the last signing. An interesting looking team. Considering the relative low points limit, and the concentration on youth, we have no-one making their debut in this league, which could well be a bonus. Should finish top half. Can it push for the title? Who knows.

I honestly couldn't remember. Figured it was easier to play devils advocate. Point remains, a Stoke season ticket is horrendous value.

Is it? Last season, if memory serves, it was £12 + £1 for a programme, so £13 per meeting. If we assume the same is true this season, you have £13 a meeting again for what you are getting for a season ticket. There are 10 confirmed teams for the NL,meaning 9 home meetings. Stoke haven't declared in the National Trophy. Stoke have no shared events. On that basis, £13 a meeting would cost you £117 for the league meetings. Let's assume that all 10 teams are in the KoC, you would need a Prelim round, then a round of 8, 4 and 2 (The final) so at the absolute most, 4 additional meetings. Let's also assume that Stoke make it to the Gold Cup at the end of the season. A further 2 meetings, maximum. And finally, let's assume that the Pride of the Potteries makes a miraculous comeback. We will also throw in 2 challenge meetings. At the very best, that works out as 18 meetings, or £234. A solid saving of £64. However, let's work on the worst case scenario. Challenge meetings get rained off due to the early season weather. There is no POTP, and Stoke crash out in the first round of the KoC, and don't make the Gold Cup. You've paid for 10 meetings (9 league, 1 KoC) so you would have paid £130, but instead you paid £170 for a season ticket. The ONLY way that this works out as good value, is that Stoke have to run 14 meetings this season at home. 9 will be in the league, so there has to be a further 5 meetings before you save money. That is not good value in the slightest. Infact, that is horrible value. The season ticket should be at or below £130, because £130 is the theoretical minimum that it will cost to see every meeting that matters this season.

The crowds don't necessarily need to improve. If they stay at the same level, chances are you will make a profit. The NL is a hell of a lot cheaper than the EL, as evidenced by Stoke surviving on a crowd of around 150/200. It is, with all respect to the other leagues, the only one where speedway is sustainable on lower crowds, and far from being a pure training league, is becoming more and more a league where teams can go to bring young riders through, but also put themselves on a better financial footing.

Interesting signing. Adam has always had potential, but the question has always been whether he is willing to make the sacrifices and put the effort in away from the track to give him the best possible chance of succeeding. He had virtually a full season with Stoke last year, and he didn't improve. For me, this Birmingham team is nothing special. Ellis and Perry are strong, but most teams with 2 heat leaders will find them being 9 point riders at the end of the year. Birmingham will need a tail that all improve for them to stand a chance, and I just don't see them improving as much as some of the other teams.

The heatleaders will add to their averages. I fully expect Ellis and Perry, for example, to be 10 point riders, and Armstrong and Payne at Stoke to hit 9. I have no issues with a minimum points limit to stop what happened last year, but cherry picking the best riders isn't about picking the riders with the biggest average. Had Cradely wanted to cherry pick, they could have done (And I believe they have to an extent)

Personally (And I apologize for hijacking the Birmingham thread) I think that such a low points limit is misguided. There was already a significant gap between PL and NL, and this is only going to widen. This year, teams are going to put around 7 points on their average without even challenging for honours (As an example, Stoke finished last season on a team average of 43.6, and weren't challenging for anything in the league) While this year may see a competitive league, based solely on the number of 3 pointers, next year there will be a lot of riders on inflated averages, who simply won't be able to fit in. The averages at the end of the year always average out to around to between 42.5 and 44 per team. On that basis, with a 10 team league, 60+ points need to be dropped at the end of the year to accommodate the inflated averages that come from such a low points limit. No longer is a 3 pointer who averages 3 a good signing, because the entire team needs to add 6-7 points to its averages in order to just be an "average" team. Personally, I think this will cause a lot of issues in 2016, because there will be a lot of riders who have averages around 5, who simply wouldn't have averaged that in a previous incarnation of the league, and who will find themselves without a team place.

Hmm, no offence to Shaun but I find myself slightly underwhelmed by this news. He is incredibly enthusiastic, and is fantastic with the fans, but I don't know. Still, I wish him all the luck he in the world, and will cheer him on, same with anyone who wears the race jacket!

Shaun Tedham makes it 6 for Stoke

Just to come back on track Stoke sign Lee Payne and Ryan McDonald.

Interesting pair of signings. Lee showed flashes last season of being untouchable around Stoke, and the knowledge he gained riding for Belle Vue will no doubt help him, but it was obvious that troubles (Both mechanically and physically) were holding him back. If he can get a good season together, there is no reason that he can't be a 9 point man in this league. As for Ryan, again showed glimpses of a talented rider, and having experience around him will no doubt help him this season. Shame that James McBain appears to have retired, as they could have shared some of the travelling! If my sums are correct, leaves us with 8.30 for the final 2 places. I would imagine Widman will return on 4.81, leaving 3.99 for our final rider. Reece Downes would fit quite nicely...