STEVEHOLS54

Some forget that Kyle was released because his GSA was dropping to a dangerously low level for a replacement to be found, and in 6 matches had not showed the form or improved form after return from injury. Yes for those that forget, one of many he seems to have had over the last few seasons. It was not done out of disloyalty to Newman but because Ford could not have replaced with a half decent reserve on a reasonable av had he held on to him if his form continued going downwards. Even for Ipswich and for a while subsequently his scores were not great. From a biz perspective it was the right move at the time although hard on Kyle and for many who know his love of the club. Initially it looked like a reasonable move as Starke hit the ground running. What Poole didn't know was in the last quarter of the season Starkes form would go South and Newmans form would go North. Now it looks like maybe on reflection Poole should have been patient. BUT would they have made the playoffs if Newmans form had continued as it was into the last month or so ?? I say good luck to Newman even as a Poole Supporter. It was not his choice to leave and as the season concludes why should he not earn some hard cash as its a long Winter without income. I would like to see him back at reserve irrespective of how he performs today. If there are any misgivings it should be aimed at Swindon Management/Promotion not Newman in my opinion. If he does earn a hat full of points today even more reason why Poole should sign him for next year.

I wonder which Jason Doyle will turn up Monday. Just had a mare of a meeting with 4 points from 4 rides and seemed out of sorts. Wasn't even chosen in last nominated heats. Didn't do his team any favours as they drew at home 45-45 but went out over 2 legs with a 10 point defeat. His 7 points from 5 rides in the first leg wasn't great either. Arguably over the 2 legs his combined scores cost them a final place. Think we know where his head is currently. Now he has his 10 point league in the SGP he will be eager to insure he doesn't get injured like last year when so close it cost him the WC. Maybe psychologically he is looking after himself to insure no repeat performance with only 3 GP meetings left. Be interesting to see which Doyle turns up Monday. Having said that, would he need to be on his game anyway to beat plenty of riders not up to Polish EXL standard (probably not). We will see. He also has to travel after travelling from Germany to Poland Sat/Sun and now Poland/UK Monday. Don't get me wrong. We all want to see all riders on the top of their game but I wonder if its in the back of his mind, which have to say cant blame him after being so close to being World Champ last year.

Would make the guess the team game for 2018 so much better if all knew the limit was going to be say 45 points rather than say 42/43. Supposed we all have to await the BSPA meting in Nov even though the promoters probably already know what the draft limit proposal will be already. I hope it is 45 points with a min of 2 Brits per team. Opens up more options for all teams who can go for more strength in depth thru the 1 to 7 without having to always have a 2/3 pointer to balance the 42 points. I still believe with the Prem/Champ/National leagues we have the structure in place to bring along young riders. For me riders such as Parkinson Blackburn and Jack Smith need to graduate through the leagues. Not all can be like Dan Bewley. JPB and JS were ripping up the tracks in NL last year but both have to a degree struggled in Champ and JS have struggled even more in PL. The Poles have a good system with each rider having to track 2 Polish riders 21 or under as Juniors per team (irrespective of how good/bad their av are). The Swedes with their min 2 Swedish riders per team. Again av do not come into it. I think the min 2 Brit per team is good and up to Promoters to decide how many Brits they want per team over the 2 minimum.

Remember it well ;-) I went virtually every week and also to Hackney where I lived close to the track just across Hackney Marshes. It was good to share my loyalties over both teams and one of the rare occasions in my first 20 years of supporting a Speedway Club where I got to cheer for the League Champions. Was such a shame that in a Stadium like White City and with the already dwindling Speedway crowds it was a bit eery watching it. Wasn't so bad at Hackney as they got better crowds irrespective of the dross team Len Silver put out most seasons. But the racing was always good at Hackney with plenty of the Hackney riders becoming experts at coming from the back of the race. White City was as cloe as you could get to Polish tracks. Big. Such happy days before we had social media - mobile phones - laptops etc - etc. How the hell did the sport survive with so many foreign top riders having to rely on a thing called a phone/landline. Didn't stop them turning up each meeting. Unless of course you were the promised Anders Michanek who we used to look forward to seeing at Hackney but never materialised despite promises from Silver. What did we get instead - Finn Thomsen. What a joke and nowhere in the same class. But that was good old Len :-) Oh happy days.

Depends on what next seasons points limit is. IF and its a big IF it was 45 points then it just squeezes in (44.63) based on current GSA issued yesterday plus KW at 4.65 and Janowski at his last GSA close in 2015 of 8.97. If its 42 points then yep it wont fit. Now that would be an exciting fairly young team with CH the oldest at 30. MJ at 26 - Kurtz 21 - Holder jr 21 - Ellis 21 - Woryna just turned 21 - Newman 25. Of course only Matt Ford and other Promoters will know if 45 is on the table for 2018. (I am sure a draft proposal is already with them all). Hope it is and we don't get watered down 42 again. Also mentioned team has the 2 Brits in it. Going to be interesting to see how it develops. Also for the stat minded amongst us. Robert Lambert is only 0.31 of a point above Chris Holder. If the thinking was NOT to re-sign CH then it again JUST squeezes in. Of course that opens the debate of would you have CH over RL (if such a move was even a possibility). Plenty of food for thought and there may even be other diamonds out there that Matt has up his sleeve as he negotiates. As for the mind games about Ellis. No not mind games just a forward thinking promote who has got his backside into gear early in thinking of next season and the fact he could be an ace card drifting in and out of reserve and hopefully better. Taking the obvious 3 from 2 i.e Newman/Ellis/Woryna it keeps them pretty tight at reserve without the obvious weakness that Shames brings. That's without thinking about Klindt - someone like Jakobsen (if they could get him on a 5 GSA). Plenty to ponder on ;-)

Assets are not always in the team ;-) Would be interesting if it is someone like Robert Lambert as there have been noises floating around the forum that maybe he needs a change ?? Could be wide of the mark here but wouldn't put it past Matt Ford to tap into even more rising talent at Poole. Now that would be news to raise the pulse. True though. The points limit is critical. BUT - We all know the BSPA draft for next season is already on the table and unless there are many dissenters then chances are the promoters already know the expected points limit and what rules there may/may not be about number of Brits that have to be in each team. For sure they don't turn up (those that choose to attend) in Nov without the plans already being on the table. Chances are its between 42 & 45 but just a case of which of those figures.

Maybe Matt is window dressing the Ellis news signing. Most Poole fans on the forum know he is being signed as an asset from Lakeside and indeed switching from Swindon to Poole would be a switch to the South Coast. Wouldn't be news to get the pulse racing if it is, as it was put out on the forum by those who had already heard rumours based on talks between Cook and Ford recently. We all know Matt Ford plays the media to gain maximum exposure to possible signings and this may well be another case of the same but with news already leaked on the forum. Could be wrong and perhaps a decent signing on its way in which more head scratching on who it might be. P.S: Not saying Ellis would be a bad signing as at reserve or swinging in and out of that position during the season is no bad move ONLY if its with another decent scoring reserve possibility after Woryna hopefully comes out after first BSPA GSA amended av end May/June period.

Maybe being a little selfish here. BUT.... As a speedway fan of some 47 years - ok I was only 15 when I first starting going to Hackney ;-). I am a great believer in giving potential World class riders a chance. IF Jakobsen could be secured on a 5.00 GSA av then I would take a chance on him. Sometimes you have to take a leap of faith. Yes the easy option is to have say Ellis and or maybe Newman in reserve berth with Wornya (initially). But bottom line is Woryna will probably move out of the reserve berth (hopefully) when first GSA is issued in 2018 with changes (end May/June ??). Again IF the av allow it I would rather have an improving youngster like Jakobsen in the team even IF he stays as reserve until the Summer. If we have until 31/7 again to change riders I would persevere with the guy while he gains experience. Yes some will say the likes of M.Bech have gone backwards but ultimately how many of the star Danish riders had to be given their chance to break through over the many years I have been a Speedway supporter. Not every Danish rider came here as a HL. Also lets remember that ultimately the league is won in Oct not March. Top 4 is where to be for play offs, and if the team is strong enough then the club can exercise patience. He seems to be the best young Dane out there and ultimately someone will take that chance. I would like it to be Poole although I can understand that after what happened this season some Poole supporters want the quick/safe fix for 2018. At 7 GSA I would say sign as an asset and loan out but IF he could get 5 I would say go for it as long term I see him being way above Newman/Ellis and riding all the major leagues in Europe. Hand on heart can you see that of Ellis or Newman who are 3/6 years older (and in my opinion will always be steady English riders) being better than Jakobsen long term ??. The above is just my opinion of course. I just believe in giving talent a chance just as Matt did with youngsters like Ward/Holder Snr/Kurtz/Holder Jnr and numerous others over the years. UK may be way behind the Continent in overall quality but that doesn't stop us developing young talent wherever they originate from.

Flwg my recent posts on Frederik Jakobsen (flwg Skidders comments after the World team U21 final in Poland), I see the Poles have woken up to this potential prestigious future talent. Flwg posted today on the main Polish Speedway website. https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=en&rurl=translate.google.co.uk&sl=pl&sp=nmt4&tl=en&u=https://sportowefakty.wp.pl/zuzel/709288/zaczelo-sie-polowanie-na-mlodego-dunczyka-rok-temu-nie-chcial-go-prawie-nikt&usg=ALkJrhhWAbC8CNhoKiggyOMYlOlsnNr_Cg The opening headline is: (Pls excuse the Polish that attaches itself when I copy across). The hunt for a young Dane began. A year ago almost no one wanted him Frederik Jakobsen scored 13 points in the DMŚJ final in Rybnik. He beat Max Fricke, Robert Lambert and Dominique Kubera and caught the attention of many club activists. Some have already decided they want to have it. I wonder if a UK Promoter can get clarification from the BSPA on what a riders GSA av would be for next season before deciding if they want to sign him. I know some non Poole supporters feel he should be given 7 but I do find it bemusing that K Woryna can come in with 1 years UK experience on just over 4.5 GSA and a potential top class Polish performer also riding in Polish Exl, yet a rider only in his 3rd season on a 500cc bike who is 19 - never ridden UK in ANY league - first season riding in Polish 2nd Div (2 leagues behind Pol EXL) - odd guest appearance in Sweden and his own Danish League is potentially deemed as a 7 pointer. I would love to have Matt clarify his GSA for 2018 and if low enough I certainly would have him onboard.

Skidder has kept the Poole topic interesting based on rumours he heard. Indeed he did not name riders. The news on Ellis was put out by someone else and to be honest I would never have guessed Ellis from what Skidder had put on the forum. I was still digging for clues after Ellis name had been put out on a non Poole topic. For me I say keep it up Skidder as its your kind of info and overheard conversations/rumours/comments which makes the Poole forum interesting and worth looking at.

indeed he has gone backwards as has MJ Jepsen although at east he has rediscovered some form after a difficult situation with his father having cancer and having to finance his treatment last 2 years or so. My line of thinking on Jakobsen is he is young - only 3rd season and even then mainly riding in DK with POl 2nd Div as was completing his studies. Top scored for DK in Euro team u21 final. Check our Uk rider scores for comparison :-( If he could be got in on a low/low av (and god knows how BSPA would rate him) then maybe worth a chance at reserve ?? Ok the BSPA team points limits and how many UK riders per team as well as league make up will all have a bearing but we want to see the next big possible thing. Maybe signing as an asset not a bad thing and see how things pan out in Nov BSPA meeting ??

I may have underestimated Ellis. His scores in first part of the season were dire to say the least. But like Swindon his scores have improved markedly in the second half of the season and its those first half scores which are reflected in his new 5.45 GSA up from 5. I checked Swindon meeting stats and he has indeed put in plenty of good solid scores the last 2/3 months. If the thinking is to tighten up those 2 reserve berths with solid scorers, then knowing Woryna will almost certainly be out of reserve come first GSA in 2018 it would then be wise to have 2 solid scoring guys in there. Meaning that the likes of Ellis/Newman/Klindt ???/Jakobsen if he could be given a low GSA would for sure make it interesting. Would still like to see Kurtz/Holder jr back with the top end open to discussion/conjecture.

Getting back to Poole 2018 :-) Skidder alerted us to how well Frederik Jakobsen has developed since last year and I flwd up with some comments yesterday evening on this undoubtedly talented young rider. His team Poznan were hammered in PL 2 semis yesterday in scoring only 33 points, BUT his score was Frederik Jakobsen - 12 (1,3,0,2,3,3) This on top of him top scoring for DK in World Team U21 final on Sunday. This lad is only 19 and only his 3rd year on a 500cc Bike. Has been finishing his studies in DK this year. Again I say if he could be signed on a low BSPA av (and why not with no UK league exp) or Polish EXL or Nice 1. Maybe worth a punt as possibly the next big Danish rider ?? He guested at an end of season meeting at Poole last year on an invite from Matt and also issued a come and get me to the Club in late October (article in Bournemouth Echo) I would like to see Matt sign him if he could get him at a low av as bags of potential imo. Believe his studies finish now so could be an all in rider for 2018 ?? Any thoughts or comments ??

Much as I would love to see Coventry back in Speedway, do we really want to see it back at the wasteland that is what is there now ?? Speedway is already struggling without major investment with clubs even with half decent stadiums struggling to stay afloat. Lets cherish the memories of this once great club as it was. there has been too much happen imo for it to come back unless another stadium could e provided or some major investment in this. The players involved couldn't even get that right so what chance. Coventry at some stage will be redeveloped imo. Do we really want to see some half hearted attempt to race there again with a patched up (even then needing major investment) stadium. Would love to be proved wrong but if British Speedway is already way down what chance Coventry :-( Sorry to all Coventry supporters but just a view from someone who remembers the good days from my home track of Hackney in my first meeting in 1970 when we welcomed such a good team and have fond memories of their riders. They were a team to be feared for many years. So sad they way it went downhill in recent years :-(

I have spouted a lot about Gavan and his knowledgeable and interesting comments on the sport. He supplies both entertainment and worthwhile comment to the SF. But Gavan knows full well that some of what he says is waving a red rag to a bull. Some of it is fun and there is a lot of positive input in what he has to say so I welcome him and his comments/input. Just feel that this CH/Batch thing gets out of control and should be on the Holder sacked topic. But suppose that topic has lost its appeal on Holder sacked so it gets dragged out all over again on Poole 2018. I welcome Gavans comments/opinions on rider ideas and those put up by others whether he agrees or disagrees as this is what this forum is all about. But as for the Holder/Batch thing. Come on guys not on this topic please :-)

On your last point. Yes the so called BSPA were quick off the mark to promote our young lads had arrived in Poland, but correct me if I'm wrong but no a peep out of them in news as to how well or as it tuned out how badly they had done in finishing last. Why not at least post some lines on a brave effort against better rivals rather than try to bury it as if it never existed. The bottom line is that it only highlights how far behind the others UK really is. The Poles are light years ahead of UK and get a reality check. UK will NEVER compete. There is not the investment or interest or sponsorship/promotion. We may get the odd rider who will do well like Lambert but imo even he will never scale the heights. Lets not forget this lad raced in Germany etc as under aged even before signing for KL as a youngster legally allowed to ride EL. I think he will be an above av UK rider but World class?? - Not convinced despite his U19/21 performances in Europe. Note Europe not the World. Now the young Aussies and Danes are ahead of our boys in performance and probably ability imo. Sunday was almost a wipe out for our lads and just showed how far behind we are. Lambert was ok but even he is way behind the Poles and some Aussies imo. Yes our lads need major investment but even if we had all the tools in place it will be years before we get to these guys levels. That will never happen so we will have to make do with being bottom of the pile for a lot longer.

Wouldn't it be nice to get back to what this topic is about i.e Poole 2018. Some seem to have lock stock and barrel transferred the Chris Holder Topic over to Poole 2018. It depressing reading the same thing trolled over and again now on this topic . Come on guys if any want to bang on about CH/Batch and their sackings/bans then move it over to the other topic. I for one (and no doubt others) would like to have our topic back please. It seems to be highjacked by this old news. The CH situation will no doubt conclude depending on the appeal (whenever that is) and hopefully it can be put to bed whether the sentence be reduced/extended or maintained. Until then as a Poole supporter I would like our topic back please. Bang the argument out on the CH thread if you guys want to continue knocking crap out of each other opinion wise.

I agree. Until he decides if its Speedway mainly or just as a combo of all 3 then he will develop slowly and irrespective of the all action he shows he may take too long. But as per my last post maybe his future as a Poole rider post 2017 will mainly be determined by the league and points set up for 2018. For me a Newman/Ellis or one of those and a Fredrik Jakobsen (if he can get in on a low av) would be preferable. But of course I forget. We have that secret weapon Kacper Woryna who will initially start as a reserve anyway. Although not after the first GSA meaning long term we need to have a strong reserve combo in my opinion. Plenty to think on but we have to wait anyway for the Nov BSPA meeting before any real planning can be done.

irrespective of who we think will or wont be riding next year (and its fun to guess and have ideas on it), the important factor in all of this is what the make up of the league/s will be and what points av the powers will be will be put in place for teams. Ultimately whatever guessing we do we still have to wait for Nov earliest to see what the BSPA decide/vote on. No doubt if Matt is not in the BSPA team photo post meeting again this year then we will know its hasn't gone as he wanted.

Indeed. Considering the guy is still only 19 and has been finishing school/college in DK this year he could be one of if not the next big DK rider ?? Has performed well in DK and been coming along in Polish 2nd League. Recent guest appearance as well for Piratena/Swe. if someone asked me who wld I rather have say an Ellis who at 22 in March and been riding for some time or an up and coming 19 year old who is going places having only had 2 seasons prior to this on 500CC speedway bikes, then I know who I would prefer. The guy also issued a come and get me plea to the Pirates in Oct (see Bournemouth Echo article in late Oct 16) when he was guesting in end of season meeting. Assuming he is finished his studies end of this year could be a surprise signing for any forward thinking club if he can get in on a low average. Should be as he is so young - never ridden GB leagues and has been riding in Polish 2nd (not POL Exl or Nice 1) and DK. Nothing to warrant giving a high av in UK. Certainly not above KW who is more experienced. LC has suggested it must be Ellis. Much as I want to see British riders flourish I also want to see potential young WW talent irrespective of which Country they come from. A young DK rider is probably more likely to go all out in UK League if he already hinted where he wanted to ride ;-) For me Ellis will always be a 5/6.5 point man.He has ridden UK long enough and when riding on Continent has never really done anything in ind competitions for junior Championships etc. FJ has ben improving at a pretty rapid rate considering not even 3 seasons on a 500 CC bike. Anyway will be interesting to see who he ends up with as I am sure forward thinking promoter......./s already has his card marked ;-) ;-)

Its been fairly quiet on this topic flwg the excitement of the last 48/72 hours. Now the initial euphoria has died down with Poole having made the play offs (which in itself is an achievement after all the problems recently), would like to revisit this. Is anyone out there in the know using the forum able to give some sensible hints as to who this second rider might be that has allegedly been signed/agreed to ride for Poole in 2017. If certain forum contributors seem to know then surely some clues (of a sensible nature) can be put into the forum domain so us forum users and contributors can at least work it out without actually naming who the rider is. See nothing wrong in that.

Keep it going Skidder. This is far more interesting than a lot of the personal sniping and back biting that seems to frequent any topic that has Poole as a subject on this forum. Any more clues or hints are always welcome of course, but if not happy to at least have the brain matter trying to work out who it may be. Plus if those who may know already seem happy with the possible signing then I will await with eager anticipation ;-)

Certainly doing my brain cells in ;-) The trouble with taking early retirement (by choice) is that you over think like hell who it might be when its the club you support. In football you get too many names put in the public domain but with you Skidder its like trying to squeeze the lemon drip by drip to get some hints/clues. Impatient ?? - Of course - but that's what the forum is all about. Speedway fanatics/fans scouring for info on who may be riding for their club next season even if we are still at the front end of this. Liverpool FC named Keita as signed for next year. Why cant we at least get a rumoured name or reasonable clues to point us in the right direction. Even if they don't come off it stops the over active brain cells scouring the SGB website and GSA's for clues as to who it might be ;-)

Hope its not TJH as for me a backward step based on his scores this season and to me has gone backwards wherever he is riding both UK and Cont. I notice his UK av for Kings Lynn is dropping even further below the current GSA 5.69 based on woefully low scores last 1/2 weeks. Only mention it as never know if you are dropping a hint Skidder. He meets certain of PPF criteria as he rides UK - has ridden UK. Is he not a Poole asset as if so surely doesn't need KL approval to discuss next season as he is already as asset. Also interesting how his scores are dropping with his av as the season draws to a close. In 16 rides since last GSA came out he has got a massive.... 12 points i.e 3.00 per 4 rides. Not bad if you are trying to drop your av (not saying he is but IF.....) Just checked KL site and up to last night his av had dropped to 5.00. Indeed maybe becomes interesting if he gets some engines instead of peddle power for next season :-) Maybe I am way off the mark but keeps it interesting ;-)

Personally would like to see a certain KN back with his low GSA as he could go in as both a Brit - Loyal Poole man who tries his hardest for Poole - If he keeps fit (finally after last 2 seasons of bad luck) would be a great as second reserve on his 4.22 current GSA which with luck and only 2 meetings left he could maybe maintain ;-) To have say both Newman and Woryna as the reserves would really be good. Again league set up for 2018 - points limits - what make up of team has to be if 2 Brits minimum all go into the melting pot. Would like to think Kyles release earlier this season is behind both parties. For sure from a Biz point of view and with his av dropping and Pooles bad form, decisions had to be made which were not pleasant. His injury for sure affected his form but had he not been released, then from a GSA perspective Ford would have been up a creek. Fortunately Kyle got fixed up but certainly as a rider who gives 100% having him float in and out of reserve would be good. Where that puts James Shanes ??? - Still not sure what is the right and wrong move as he will still be weak at reserve although hopefully a little better. Will Matt Ford take any risks next year though after this year. Somehow I don't think he will. Interesting thoughts to ponder.