STEVEHOLS54

Kurtz and Holder Jr I would say yes and hopefully both will be riding Po EL next year gaining more experience. If both are considered good enough for that league (almost certain both will be in some form) they for sure they are good enough for Poole. Brady is still learning and needs pressure lifted as he is NOT Darcy Ward and at just turning 21 he doesn't need the pressure. He is coming along nicely thanks and hopefully will improve overall as he gets more experience. Lets not forget this is only his second season in top Flight. For me people need to get off Jack Holders back. Its his first season in top flight and while not getting to Bradys av ,he has one season less in UK in total remember. Plus if he can do what he did in Poland even if he was on Hancocks engine/s then please... can we not say he wont get better ???. Got to be worth persevering with. He has shown plenty at Peterborough and lets not forget he is still learning. In a good team we should be able to carry him through his ups and downs that he will have just as Brady has at times. For me its got to be Woryna/Holder Jr/Kurtz as the young future backbone of the team. Now the real debate is who next ????. Holder Sr a lot depends on when/what outcome of his appeal is (does anyone know when it is as he will probably be off to Aussie at some stage for the Winter ??). What will the teams points limits be for 2018. Magic/Milik ?? - Do people want Andersen back as a steady team man that will have his usual ups and downs but has been the man who kept going through the season. For me the points limit is a big driver of what maybe Poole can/cant achieve in 2018 as for sure Matt Ford will want a strong and more importantly consistent team that does not implode they way Poole did at one stage this season. Thankfully we wont have the likes of Kennett or Lahti back next year. Also Starke I am sure wont be there. As for the likes of Shanes/Klindt/Newman ??? - I question how many of these lower order riders we can accommodate if we want a chance of winning the league in 2018. We really don't want the nightmare that at one stage was 2017 with a lucky get out of jail card to get into the last 4 knowing it would end in tears. As it ultimately did. Let the debate begin ;-)

THJ performed in line with how he has been performing recently in UK. Rosco took a big risk in using him. He had shown no improvement during his recent dire UK scores so he should have known it was a better than 50% chance he would backfire. In fact I would have said 75% chance based on his last 5/6 performances for KL.

Of course my apologies for the slip. Same comments on his scores though as some weeks ago I went through his most recent 4/5 matches and they were bad. Partly explains why his GSA also dropped.

Maybe Rosco hoping he does a Lahti. Brilliant at reserve but dire in the main body of the team. THJ of old would be a no brainer. BUT his scores in the last 4/5 matches for RH were dire to say the least. But difficult to question Rosco. His team tactics and planning this year have been brilliant and maybe he can see TJH being a match winner a lot of us cant see based on his recent form. If he does score well then indeed it was another good move from him.

Yes Lambert probably carrying a knee injury. The point is he is riding for a Polish EXL or Nice 1 place at worse for next season. The likes of Kurtz and Holder Jr look nailed on to get teams in POL Exl but Lambert still hasn't convinced teams he is up to the level required imo. I think he was desperate to show clubs over the 2 legs of the final that he has what it takes. Shame his injury probably curtailed his scores as 9 from 6 rides in a POL 2nd Div match even if finals is hardly pulling up trees. Even so being seen and showing some ability is better than not showing and maybe being forgotten. The thing is that Speedway in UK is shown in a bad light as those of us with real interest in the Sport don't need to be treated as idiots. If Chapman was on the ball he really should be carrying out investigations, as how can he apply double standards after his Holder Jr outburst. Or was that more being angry after so close to the the Holder Sr incident and wanted revenge. Why else go so public on the BSPA site on it even though his club (who were out of the playoffs anyway) were happy at the release and were compensated. It just stinks that Chapman made such a big deal of it with the Peterboroiugh 4's (which they won anyway without him) preaches about British Speedway being let down in a Champ Comp yet in a prestigious event like the Prem Riders Championship not a peep out of him or the BSPA. No of course not. Its one of his riders so he wants it to disappear with nobody hopefully noticing it.

Have no problem with a rider trying to prove himself for Poland 2018 as rightly said that is where his main source of income should come form over the next 10 years if he is going to make it. My gripe is the flwg: Was it not the BSPA who put out the message that he was not riding in the PLRC due to his leg injury. If that's the case then indeed how can he ride Germany Friday and then do 6 rides in Poland on Sunday. Of course the BSPA and its members/chairman will not air their views on the BSPA which can understand. However one can understand how some question the integrity of the BSPA Chairman considering his outburst about Holder Jr riding in Poland despite his club Peterborough being happy to let him ride and were compensated. Was any such compensation passed over to UK Speedway for Lambert not riding in the UK's most prestigious individual meeting for the teams top riders at the National Speedway Stadium. Is Mr Chapman even bothering to look into it or cant be ar**ed as its his teams rider and end of season so what's the point ?? Sorry mean air their views on the BSP not BSPA...

Am just intrigued that if Lambert was allowed to drop this important meeting due to injury then how can he have a miraculous recovery less than 24 hours later to ride in Poland and manage not 4 but 6 rides. If he was given permission to drop this meeting in favour of Poland then fair enough, but if he was allowed to drop the meeting due to injury only then how can he turn up less than 24 hours later over there. Just looking for someone to give me a sensible answer to an honest question which so far not been forthcoming although appreciate many posters may be at work. Not looking for anyone to be suspended just an answer on how it can be allowed.

Hi Does anyone out there know how comes Robert Lambert was allowed to pull out of the PLRC on Saturday (due to his leg injury I read) but less than 24 hours later was all the way over in Poland riding for his POL 2nd Div side and managed to put in 6 rides for 9 points. Or did the powers that be allow him to miss this insignificant event to have priority to ride in a Polish 2nd Division event even if it was their Final. Maybe Mr Chapman can comment on it as he has opinions he is prepared to air on riders missing UK events to ride in Poland (i.e Jack Holder). Appreciate he did not miss his UK teams event but as the Top KL rider at such a prestigious meeting as the PLRC should that have been given preference ??

I remember when Darcy Ward had a gating problem he spent some time I think with either Hancock or Crump and it had an affect on him as it did improve. Young riders need to use these top guys as also mentors and could learn some basic things from them. He should not be too proud or up his own backside to seek advice on an area that could cost his development dearly if he doesn't get it sorted or at least part of it. Don't get me wrong I want to see Lambert progress, as he is arguably the best young British rider we have (at the moment).

Could it be personality clashes with some of the other Promoters and Chapman ??? We all know Matts forward thinking ideas on the sport and points limits etc have not always been matched by the have nots of the Prem. I could be wrong but perhaps that has a bearing on it. Either that or Matt too busy unearthing the next big signing for Poole ;-)

I think Lambert has to start making some important decisions. I think he maybe has to drop Champ and concentrate now on UK/POL and Sweden. His talents are above Polish 2nd Div and he has had his nursery stint in that league. He needs if poss Polish EXL if he can be promoted correctly or at worse Nice league 1. He certainly also needs to meet the same top riders in Swedish Elite League. Those should be his main focus and then topped off with things such as World U21 which he still qualifies for and maybe try and get some SGP qualifying experience if possible. I have had some reservations about him as we have to remember he did get a good grounding in the sport as an under aged rider in Germany before UK. BUT yes he has talent and perhaps its a question of where he rides and the guidance he gets. Seen lots of Forum comments about his Mum being a driving force. I don't know but I think with right Professional guidance he can go a long way. Nearly all say he has got the talent but its untapping it more on to the big stage. Much as I like Poole and their promotion of the good young Aussies (incl the likes of Jason Doyle when he was developing), I do find it a shame that a young rider like Lambert with all his talent at a tender young age is not getting pushed forward as much as the likes of young Aussies such as Kurtz/Holder Jr/Fricke etc. Maybe he does need a move away into team where perhaps not so much pressure put on his like this season also with losing NKI as the established heat leader. He is still only 19 and I think yes after 4 seasons next season needs to be his breakthough year on the big stage. I hope he makes it as the top level he is one of the few Brits currently who could make it big in the sport. Fingers crossed.

I really do hope the second leg proves a decisive winner one way or the other (prefer Poole but lets just get it over with). After that we can then have this topic consigned as quickly as possible to the BSF bin and move on one way or another as the KN/BWD has for me gone past it sell by date. Ultimately Poole got 8 points back in those 2 last races that cosmetically made the result look more closer than it was in reality. Maybe that levels out a bit the contentious subject of the replacement. If Swindon had tried hard enough in those 2 races and if BWD had ridden then maybe the end result would have balanced out to where it ended anyway. The second leg will hopefully put to bed once and for all who is the better team over the 2 legs and put to bed all the conspiracy theories. If its Swindon fair play to them as they have been the better team this season and fair play to Roscoe for turning what was supposed to be a bottom of the pile team into potential Prem winners (and maybe double winners with KOC), with some shrewed signings.

Wow its not too dislike Football then where you have an agent to represent your interests. Bet the 1/2 days of that meeting Matts mobile must be pretty hot then with all that goes on in the meeting via his representative ;-) Yes appreciate that Skidder. Just thought that as arguably the biggest voice in Speedway Promotion in the modern era he might want to be there. But I am no expert on these things and I am sure that he has close contact with his CO - Promoter/s during those important meetings when it comes to things like vote casting etc. Thanks for clarifying.

Maybe someone can help me here. I made a comment re the BSPA annual meeting on a post a while back and mentioned Matt Ford was not in the annual group photo last Nov. A poster commented that he doesn't usually attend. IF that comment is correct then I question why arguably the most influential Promoter/owner of the modern era doesn't, as do they not require votes to get through things like points limits etc ?? If the Conference meeting discusses and ten decides to change something on the draft and he is not there then how can he influence what his feelings/thoughts are. I could be wrong and the comment made earlier was not a serious one. I know he hasn't always seen eye to eye with some of the others on team building limits etc, but would appreciate any comments from anyone in the know how Matt gets around that if he doesn't attend.

Unfortunately this is where we get into the haves and have nots. For sure clubs like Poole will be able to attract some decent names as Ford has always been good on the sponsorship side. For me (and as a Poole supporter) I would like to see some top riders in this Country and if a team can make it fit within the points limit should it not be individual choice ??. Ultimately a team has say 42 or 45 points meaning if they sign a top rider (IF they secure the backing or can afford it) then the points for that rider will mean possibly weaker elsewhere. I believe in live and let live. Hardly call some of what's been going on this season a raging success. Its all about opinion of course. I just don't think those clubs who want to bring the top riders to UK should be punished or made outcasts. Sweden perhaps an accident waiting to happen. Too many of the top riders on the back of unworkable crowds (from what I have seen on TV). Also if their sponsorship deals are not great hardly surprising the problems with no points limit and must have 2 Swedes per team. It catches up with you. But having some of the top riders in UK is surely one for the individual Promoters/owners to decide if their budgets make it work. Having 1/2 in teams is not the same as having 5 wage busters per team. Maybe if Sweden a car crash waiting to happen then perhaps Janowski and Milik for Poole 2018 not so stupid an idea ;-)

Wold not disagree. I am not convinced THJ is the rider he was. Have not seen evidence in his scores in Pol 2nd Div or Sweden to convince me he is the rider he once was. Would KL want to take another chance flwg this years problems?? If I was Chapman I would go for proven riders in Prem and whilst Kerr and MPT can be up and down (as are most riders) I think they would be more consistent and without the expense of having to fly in a rider who may be going backwards. He can always change it if riders don't perform. I agree with you Trees. Kerr on his 5.06 and MPT at his 5.20 swapping the reserve berths with Auty & Rose. I would be maybe a little worried about a long tail in the team but much depends on who their top 3 are ultimately and if its 42 or 45 points. Plenty to ponder on for sure. One for the brain cells though. Who would you prefer to have - Rose at 5.25 - Auty at 4.65 or the possible Joker in the pack TJH at reserve on his new 4.64. When viewed in that respect a TJH rediscovering any kind of form could be a decent rider in the reserve berth. If you want to keep cost down you wouldn't have TJH but he could be a decent choice with possibility of 5 plus rides per meeting if he does sort himself and his equipment.

Thought that was last night as Glasgow lost at home to Ipswich. Maybe staying on the South Coast today as a guest of Matt. You never know but that's just my mischievous mind playing games ;-) Interesting about the Swedes though as plenty of the top boys (In fact most of the SGB riders) ride there.

Yes but none of us want another abortion of a situation like the last mess. Better to not have then to have a half hearted stab at it. Still we can all dream of what we would like to see. Same with my views on Poole 2018 ;-)

THJ could be the joker in the pack as depends which TJH you get. I would be concerned which way his career is going. On the face of it a great reserve at his new 4.64 GSA for next season, but based on his returns in last month or two ??. His scores have been dire at times but is that because he was riding for a team with no prospects of playoffs and perhaps riding for an attractive av for 2018 ?? The guy is almost 29 and we saw a lot more from him as a rider when he was 25 riding for Poole in 2013 which was his last year prior to his July 17 signing for KL. He was fast and a good rider. For me he has gone backwards. He only had 7 meetings in Polish 2nd Tier so not even Pol EXL and didn't do too well. His Swedish scores have not been great either. The real THJ who was also making appearances in SGP several seasons ago would be a no brainer signing at 4.64, but the THJ of today seems to me to be a shadow of the rider he was. Crazy thought considering the guy is not 29 yet and should be at the peak of his career. May be worth a gamble though as if he does adapt to UK tracks and rediscovers some form it could be a good signing. Also not the be all and end all, as we have seen this season riders being dumped if they didn't measure up. Its not as if you are tied to them all season if they don't perform. If KL do stay in Prem (and I hope they do), then I really hope they can get it right for 2018 after the disaster of this. NKI would play a BIG part in that I think although to be honest he is not quite as good as he has been in the past. Could he be going down the Hans Andersen route of slow regression. He is 35 after all and will be 3 months short of 36 when season starts. If rumours out of Poland are that he may be emptied by Stahl Gorzow (who would have thought that after the last few seasons). He may well lose his SGP place as well. Perhaps the time is approaching for NKI to come back to UK (where believe he lives with his partner anyway) and rebuild some confidence. I for one would love to see him back in UK as even though I am not a KL supporter he is true quality and even a not top of his game NKI is still a better rider than most in UK.

I am still a big Chris Holder fan. He has had a difficult couple of years but showed that with engines working properly he can still perform as in the last GP. I think at just over 7 points GSA he is well worth being back on his ritual home track. I think its been a strange old year for a lot of the top riders. Too many of the top guys have had engine tuning problems with lots having inconsistent meetings around Europe. There was talk about Johns having tuning issues with engines he produced due to a spares issue on a particular part if I remember form earlier this season. For sure Chris has had issues finding the right set up. Look at how Zagar has suddenly turned things around the last month or so having finally got the right set up. It shows that when you have the right equipment i.e just look at Holder Jr performances on Hancock engine when riding for Torun as Hancock was crocked for the season. If Chris can get his engines sorted and tuned properly then that 7.16 av may look a bargain. Especially if it also allows Matt Ford to sign a Janowski or Milik on top. Or even as you say Hans Andersen. Again and I keep beating on about it. That points limit has a big bearing I think on Matts plans as I am sure he would want it as high as possible.

Make that 11/13 Clubs as I miscalculated ;-) Honestly and as a supporter of Speedway since 1970 in my mid teems. I would love to see Coventry back but as a viable club with sensible Promoters/owners running in a decent stadium. It was a sad loss to see them go as they did and indicative of what's been going on in the Sport for some time. I have fond memories of their visit to the likes of Hackney/White City/Ipswich and Poole over the last 47 years. More recent years the Poole v Coventry fixture was a real grudge fixture for some but in a good way. Lets really hope we see them again soon one day. Speedway needs it what I would call good traditional clubs with long histories. I have seen too many go over the years incl London Clubs I used to visit for years such as Hackney/White City/West Ham/Wimbledon. Some have got used to success over recent years. You should have tried to be a Hackney supporter in First Div - Years on no success but always good races seeing genuine WW stars of the era. Only when they dropped a div and became Hackney Kestrels did we finally see a Champ and Cup win. Unfortunately the Hawks while much loved never managed it :-(

We can but live in hope ;-)

Sometimes I think. WHY??? did I join the BSF nearly one year ago having viewed it online for a few months prior. For sure it seems to be heavily populated by idiots who seem to have nothing better to do all day/night but rip the backside out of each other to the degree it even gets nasty. Appreciate some of it is light hearted ;-) but there are too many pages of absolute drivel from people who have no real interest in what the topic is about rather than contributing positively or for that matter negatively to an opinion relative to the topic. I think I have posted some thought provoking posts on the Poole team for both this year and also next year, yet a lot seem to want to have no input or sensible opinion on what the topic is. I welcome others ideas on whether they agree/disagree but at least plenty should post something that is positive to the forum topic which at least cultivates interest in the subject. This Topic is Poole 2018 but too many of the usual suspects contribute "Jack S**t" to the topic itself wanting to participate in meaningless B.S which most of us sensible contributors really don't want to see or get involved in. All I say as a contributor is on a Poole 2018 topic, lets keep the contributions to exactly that. Agree or disagree with my ideas of a team for 2018 and I certainly welcome others ideas on who they would like or maybe even expect to see in 2018. As for the non related crap and back biting/sarcasm and pure nastiness I would ask them to shove it where the sun doesn't shine maybe on some other topic more suited to their negative contributions. Apologies to those who at least contribute posts of interest incl the likes of Gavan who at least voices opinion even as a non Poole Supporter. At least a good chunk of what he says in relation to riders etc makes sense, even if I don't always agree with all of them. There are times when I think, what's the point. I really want to keep contributing to a topic that mean something to me. That may incl some of the Southern Clubs Prem Clubssuch as Rye House/Somerset and Swindon if I have something interesting (imo) to contribute which won't be often as my main team interest is Poole. I enjoy the Poole Topics as I like Poole and want to see and contribute positive or sensible opinions and share with others likewise. As for all the other B.S. Please - Park it elsewhere ;-)

So some (or a few) think no Holders will be back next season. I would hope Jack is given at least another season (if he agrees to ride in UK), as I think would be crazy not to have such a potential talent in the team. So playing the 42 points limit, how about the flwg (in no particular order. Also taking new GSA came out today. B Kurtz 8.08 Ellis 5.56 Woryna 4.65 Shanes 2.95 Holder 5.82 Total 27.06 Leaves 14.94 points. Now depending on what the Poles do for 2018, and if they relax rules a little, and we got to fixed nights in Uk plus maybe have a 10/12 team league. You could get Milik at 5.67 - Janowski (who probably wont be World Champ this year) 8.97 = 14.64 combined. Or Holder Snr 7.16. Hans Andersen on 7.75 is a fair av but other than say with Milik would leave limited option on a true number 1. Of course still have Kyle Newman (now 4.86) who if you replaced Shanes with would drop the balance to 13.03. Of course this is just opinion and playing the 42 point limit game. Now if its 45 it opens up much better options on H/L. We shall see. Of course a lot will also depend on IF any of the top guys want to come to UK next season.

Nice response from one of his sponsors. Perhaps some forget that the close season is a long time without a regular if any income. A whole 6 months. For riders like Kyle its not like say Hans Anderson who has the luxury of income form 4 leagues around Europe (UK/SWE/DK/Pol) to keep him reasonably warm during those long months. Kyle has 2 and in one of those Leicester were out of any income stream from beginning September. Thankfully for him he still has Ipswich in the playoffs and has some money coming in during October. Speedway is not a rich mans sport for the bread and butter riders and bearing in mind that Kyle was dropped also in June, can one blame the guy for trying to earn some much needed cash in the playoffs whether that be just for the Poole home meeting or even if it is both of the semis. I would still have the guy back at Poole in a reserve berth at that low 4.45 GSA as we all know his true worth is more than that in a half decent side. Lets not forget that his real potential is in both his points and bonus points situ. Especially when you look sat the league winning sides of 2014 & 2015. For example 2016 7.03 - 2015 8.54 (yes 8.54) - 2014 8.13. All incl BP. Admittedly he did well under the EDR scheme but lets not forget he also did well when moved up in team place so plenty of good scores against more experienced rivals. As a reserve on 4.45 GSA I still think he is a bargain and we all know a trier. Monday a prime example. Forget that last race as match was won and interesting that both last 2 heats were 5-1 to Poole which maybe partly down to Rosco wanting to keep it tight for the second leg crowd. Who knows but even Doyle was at the back in one race. Meaning in 4 real rides he scored 8. How many Poole supporters would like that return from 4 rides from their reserve week in and out. I hope he is back for next year but what will the points bank be for 2018 - 45 or 42/43 (Hope its 45). Additionally how would it fit into Matt Fords master plan if he intends to have also Ellis/Woryna/Kurtz/Holder Jr. Personally I would like to see Newman and Woryna start at reserve with possibly Ellis or Holder floating in and out of those positions maybe as we get to first GSA. Again with depending on how points pan out. Having Newman floating back in again to reserve as our reserves hopefully rack up the points. We have seen what strong reserves can bring you with potential of 5 rides plus. For me its then 2 decent heat leader types with Kurtz continuing to build, but without having the Speedway nation on his back as this young guy has had too much pressure put on him. He has done a hell of a job in only his second season in top flight (just about to turn 21) but will still have some bad ones occasionally. He should be allowed that luxury now and then if we have some decent heat leader strength plus improvement in the younger ones.