STEVEHOLS54

Don't quite know what to make of this comment from Matt in the Echo. “I don’t necessarily believe a higher average will help some of the younger riders at the bottom end of the team because I think there may be a few more experienced riders coming back to this country. He isn't even guaranteeing Shanes a spot saying he has to look at the numbers. Only young riders I can think of further down the team are Holder Jr and Shanes from last season. Not unusual for the echo to throw names around but none of us know what the POL regulations will be (assume they will now decide as BSPA AGM finished). Plus what will riders who rode in previous seasons such as 2014/15/16 be assessed at as a GSA. Also what about young poles Poles etc who may only have ridden as Juniors in their teams. Can you really have a crazy situation where Woryna gets in on 4.65 but some other high profile juniors (prefer not to name in case on Matt's shopping list) get assessed at say 6 or 7. Would be good if BSPA or SCB (whoever decides these things) put out some clarification. For me seems still a few grey areas need clarification. But then again we are only the fans who support the sport i.e the mushrooms who are kept in the dark ;-)

It doesn't take long for the usual subjects to turn a sensible forum subject like Poole 2018 into a total farce..... Come on guys - Lets keep the discussion to Poole 2018 with sensible comment - disagreement or agreement to ideas and sensible alternatives. Its a pain in the backside when us genuine speedway supporters open up our teams topic only to find its filled with nonsense and personal back biting. I am all up for friendly banter but prefer we keep it to the subject matter for the benefit of the majority and not the trolls who seem to enjoy winding certain others up :-)

Well lets hope Matt puts that one to bed sooner rather than later so we can move on to other team news not revolving around Jack. I can see from earlier comments that we have as many yes as we have no so opinion I suppose is split.

Gav Was just making the point that its always a shame to see a successful team split up due to the rules but that's the way it is. You have shown above that being creative can generate still strong teams depending upon how you go about it. Maybe Zagar and Tai wont come back to UK but the creative managers/promoters can still find plenty of good talent with heat leader potential below 8 points IF they can tempt them back to UK. Same with some of the junior Poles for example who are way ahead of many of our riders top flight or juniors. The $64,000 question though is what GSA's are both thee young riders as well as foreign riders who rode last in 2015 or earlier going to be assessed at. Will we the Joe public even be given access to what the guidelines will be. Would be nice that we are not just kept in the dark ;-)

Fully agree. Last season was his first in Prem after only 1.5 seasons in Champ with Plymouth. During that time as a first season rider he achieved a 5.82 GSA - plus he scored an av on top of 1 Bonus point per meeting plus rode well for Peterborough (nearly 9 points per meeting GSA bettering his 1.5 seasons at Plymouth). To add to that was his impressive end of season performances for bottom of the League Torun in POl EXL where he was the top of averages for non regular POL Rider. So good that Torun signed him for 2018. Now bearing in mind what he has achieved can you really say the guy doesn't deserve to be back at Poole. This season should have been without pressure had the so called top riders achieved what they should have achieved (I excl Brady who for me over achieved for someone so young). It isn't good that living in the shadow of your Brother and ex Speedway GP WC, so many expect so much too quickly just as they had done with Brady in 2016 despite it being his first season in Prem. Young riders like Jack need to be brought along at a sensible pace without all the pressure just because certain top guys didn't perform. In a successful team he would have been judged as doing quite nicely for a first season and so much potential talent lies there as we know. For me it makes so much sense to have him back with Chris who can also mentor him just as he has been partly employed to do this season with Torun. A happier and young team with experience such as Chris to hopefully keep him grounded and allow him to enjoy his riding while he finds his way. At a 5.82 GSA and with the potential talent to improve that and be one of the top riders, it would imo be crazy to let that opportunity pass me by. Especially also with the new 1 rider over 8 rule and a 42.5 team limit which make the signing even more important for me. Matt Ford has the chance to build a young and exciting team with this new rule and with the likes of Brady/Kacper W/James S/ we could be a force this season. If Matt can find another Diamond out there in Euro Speedway World on a low GSA like with Woryna then I would be well pleased. These Polish Juniors for example are way ahead of most of our young guys. Of course knowing what the authorities are setting these young riders and any riders who rode prior to 2016 as GSA would help us all. At least what the guidelines are so we can include or eliminate in team plans (or for us enthusiastic speedway supporters our calculator ideas).

Both your and Gavan's posts are sensible reading. I do feel for Swindon/BV and Wolves as the price for a successful season is that they have to shed top riders over 8 which if you support them is indeed sad. However taking all 8 sides in the league this new rule is both a bit of a leveller but also means that promoters have to be more savvie in their team selection plus it gives ALL promoters the chance to build teams with strength in depth using the new rules. I was initially disappointed that 3 days of meetings seemed to have yielded so little but as a Speedway supporter who supports Poole but lives in Chelmsford, Essex I am taking the positives from it also in the hope that now the meeting is over there will be news on at least a TV deal now nights are agreed even if no league sponsor is forthcoming. As a Poole supporter I feel we have more to gain by this rule as any switched on Promoter can choose from a whole host of talent around Europe on GSA's below 8. The big question is what will some of these guys get as GSA and will riders who were riding in 2014/15 below 8, what will they get as GSA's in 2018 (we are in the dark on that one but hopefully we will find out ??) Secondly based in Essex I see Lakeside are joining the Champ. Geat news as their track is only 30 mins drive for me and I can now get to wto see some of the future of British Speedway. Riders such as Jack P.Blackburn - Jack Smith - Dan Bewley and others as well as other young talent from places like Australia etc trying to prove themselves in the Sport. I no have the choice of driving 3 plus hours to see Prem in Poole and also 30 mins on diff race nights to see the talent of British and other nations learning their trade with experienced raiders. Life is not so bad after all in my case after this AGM :-)

Not bad at all. Means that promoters will have to use all their management skills to get the best mix of riders. I like the look of the above though :-)

Agree we need to see full content of AGM but the initial release doesn't initially inspire. If it is 8 & 11, initial thoughts are as it is for Prem and maybe Lakeside topping up existing Champ. So all the gossip re 1/2 coming up has not come to pass it seems. Interesting to see why they decided not to and maybe explains the slow progress of the meeting and lack of any positive updates. I followed your various posts re changing things for the better of UK Speedway but in all honesty I could never see the main teams in the Prem such as Poole/BV/Wolves etc agreeing to lower both the standard and implement things like a pay cap. I for one want to see both top riders and good racing. Taking the sport back to near enough basic level with little to no overseas stars is not for me the way forward. Anyway let's see the full announcement but looks like it may be more of the same and if points dropped to say 41 then chances are lower level again. Hopefully at least some fixed nights will bring some of the stars most of us want to see over. Those that choose to sign them, it is their choice and if my club can afford that luxury then fine by me.

Maybe SGB should have worded their tweet posted Friday a bit differently. Their tweet said: NEWS | Premiership and Championship clubs start their AGM in Tenerife which lasts until Sunday. We will bring you news updates as and when we can. Maybe I misunderstood thinking Prem meeting would be first i.e Fri/Sat with Champ meeting Sunday. Maybe I shouldn't have taken the wording literally as it stated they would bring us news and more importantly updates when they could. That's why I thought we might get some updates at least released pending a full statement or the main guts of what was agreed pending an official statement. Anyway we will soon know outcome. Like many I am an eager and enthusiastic speedway fan who wants to know things like team limits/league set up etc so I can get the calculator out to try and guess who my team Poole may or may not sign for 2018. The new points limit at least enables you to dismiss certain ideas. Same with if we know how overseas riders GSA's may be established for 2018 and for those who rode in UK up until a certain time i.e 2014 or 2015. Same for example will riders like NKI who rode in 2016 be assessed at that GSA for 2018 ?? All adds to the intrigue and interest while we try to work out who may or may not sign in these dark and dreary nights of the close season

Yes maybe I read the BSPA comment to literally on Friday when they said they would release news as they got it. Your last comment doesn't bode well then. Anyway all will be revealed (hopefully) in the coming day or so. Lets hope at least part of it is an indication of a way forward for the sport

But doesn't the BSPA AGM also include matters Champ as well as Prem ?? I cant see why snippets of news cant be released such as. Breaking news - Prem team limit for 2018 will be xxx or Fixed race nights agreed details to be confirmed - or XXX and YYY will be joining Prem League to make it a xx team league in 2018. I cant believe letting a little bit of news out after 2 days of meetings would do any harm. Would have thought most/if not all Prem matters took priority before they move on to Champ issues as they are probably a lot less to discuss then the Prem. Maybe there is some fall out big time internally which is why nothing to report. Anyway lets hope some news breaks soon as we have the rumour mill in full flow such as T.N.T who either has a hot line to the top or is maybe guessing ?? Its not like we want the whole meeting comment, just something to mull over while they complete proceedings.

Yes the silence from the BSPA is deafening. Would have thought that Prem biz already sorted over Fri/Sat. They could have released a bit of positive/good info for the fans to show that at least progress is being made. Maybe not gone/going as well as we all hope. i.e No league sponsor - no firm TV deal - not enough take up of clubs wanting to come up. BSPA who only announced on their twitter (I think) for the first time yesterday that the BSPA annual AGM was taking place in Tenerife this Fri/Sat/Sun, also said they would release news as they got it. Of course hope I am wrong, but just a few lines on some changes already agreed (if any) would go down well with us the supporters who pay to support these guys. Makes me laugh that despite the potential problems the POL EXL were imposing on riders for 2018 on advertising etc, they sat down with the riders prior to the end of the 2 week transfer window, listened and sorted those issues and we had an exciting close of window. Everything done and dusted in 2 weeks. Yes there is more money involved ultimately but they are light years ahead of how UK runs the sport. Not only in POL EXL but also in Nice 1 and POL league 2. The 2018 transfer windows early & mid season are also set and that's it. Anyway we await the news of any kind as to the future of our sport and team building limits/overseas rider GSA's etc/ sponsorship/TV (if any) and how many teams will make up the Prem (and other leagues) in 2018.

I agree. Too much pressure put on youngsters like Jack. Some forget what he achieved when riding for Peterborough in Champ last season which was a step up from his 1.5 seasons riding for Plymouth. Also look what he did in those end of season POL EXL meetings. Any young rider who can make it into the Torun team for next season in my book is good enough and should continue to improve. Additionally some may not realise but Jack scored 27 bonus points from 26 meetings which was the second highest bp of any rider in the Prem in 2017. BP are not incl in the GSA but in effect it added a point to his GSA in real terms. I agree he let his frustrations out at times but he is still young and wants to do well. He can do without undue pressure and in a team where other riders do the job they were employed to do (and 2017 was not a good season for that at poole with some riders), then I can only see improvement in the guy. Especially if Chris also signs.

A number of his Saturdays may well be taken up with World U21 again if he wants to give it a real go as think still qualifies as just turned 21. On top of that will no doubt try for the SGP qualifiers and various National team events both U21 and seniors. But that's the life of a class speedway rider. Look at the lines of Niki Pedersen who does leagues in POL/SWE/DK also did SGP and SEC in 2016 on top. Also factor in other World team events - Danish Champ and other tournaments. As PK says he gets 6 months off and it goes with the territory of being a professional speedway rider I suppose. Some of us don't disagree with this possible choice. We assume the 2 Brit rule will still apply which brings in Ellis and Shanes. Its the Batchelor slot which is the one that is not so obvious. if you go for a high GSA heat leader then you have to adjust lower down or go for a more strength in depth look. One debate would be are you better with say Batchelor against Andersen ?? They have similar GSA's (0.12 between them). If you drill down their 2017 scores its Andersen for me. Reason being as below. Hans home av was 8.00 or 8.55 incl bonus points Hans away av was 7.58 or 8.30 incl bonus points Troy home av was 6.79 or 7.03 incl bonus points Troy away av was 8.27 or 8.80 incl bonus points I don't think Batchelor has been so good around Poole over the years and for me I would prefer Hans. Think he would be a better team man as well as a motivator and mentor to younger riders. Also at the first sign of rain Batchelor was more about self preservation then going all out for the team. This is my opinion based on what I have seen of the guy over the last 4/5 years.

Hancock for me only interested in who pays biggest pay check. Signed for a guy who has purchased a 2nd Div team and wiped all their debts. Think he is going to get paid plenty and will have at least 2 seasons riding against inferior opposition even if they get 2 successive promotions before getting to POL EXL. I didn't think he would sign for the 2nd Div team but obviously some big bucks thrown his way to keep him in Poland. Maybe also his chums at Monster also expressed a desire he kept the Monster flag flying in Poland as it would have been farcical having a SGP rider not riding in the biggest speedway Country in the World. One less rider for UK to look at.

Its maybe easy for many to be judgemental when looking from a distance. But consider the following. Chris almost lost his best friend - soul mate and kind of young protégé in Darcy Ward. They were like 2 kids at times but the bond was close. Following on from that and not far behind was his split from partner Sealy and the mother of his son Max. To add further salt to the wounds was that his engines were not firing in 2017 and there were tuning problems with Alan John's engines and well documented by John's himself. I am sure all factors may have also hit his confidence because how can a guy who was so comfortably in the top 8 SGP riders for so long plus was third in GSA only to Doyle and NKI in 2016 fall so far so quickly. Have said countless times now that he deserves this year at SGP level as well as with Torun and whichever UK Club he signs for. If he screws it up this year then he only has himself to blame as he can't use the previous years issues to haunt him forever. If he messes it up in 2018 then he may well lose his SGP place - His UK team place and also most importantly for his Bank Balance, his long term place for so long in Poland - Torun.

I was critical of Buster when things all kicked off following the Holder situation and then it seemed a crusade against all things Holder after the Peterborough saga. With the hindsight of a calm close season we need to look forward. Many were happy to see Buster take the roll of BSPA Chairman and saw it as a way forward. This is not a sport where we are blessed with multi million mega sponsorship and the sport has been going through a difficult time in the UK. Maybe we all need to get behind Buster. Mending British Speedway is no quick fix. He has no doubt spent a lot of time and effort to try and get it pointing in the right direction. Yes there have probably been some mistakes and controversy, but such a role comes with not making easy or always popular decisions with some. If we are going to move forward then let's appreciate that overall he is doing his best to get the sport going forward. Its no easy task and unless some entity with millions to spend on the sport is going to come forth, then lets all get behind the guy for the efforts he is trying to put in for the benefit of British Speedway. I am sure even for him its a learning curve being the man at the forefront who will always have the gun pointed at him when things are not going too great. Hopefully the bigger picture will show his appointment long term as a positive one.

Love the banter between the main 2 Southern clubs. Let's just keep the racing good for both teams and hopefully we can keep the league in the South. Prefer South Coast Poole but if not let it be Swindon and not those Northern Clubs :-)

Welcome back Swindon Forum fans. Been a bit quiet with you guys recently but suppose not too much going on ;-) Its never easy when you win the league and you are rewarded by having to drop part of the squad to meet the points limit for flwg season. For me Doyle and Morris have to be the start point. Losing 4.74 points is a fair chunk so Rosco will have to be at his best in the team building. Could be worse though as Wolves who won nothing have to shed 5.44 assuming its 42 points next season. Keep hearing rumours that Ellis was purchased as an asset by Poole but nothing has come forward and that was some months ago. Having said that even if he didn't stay that's only 5.56 points so not a great saving in points once he is(if) replaced. For sure it has to be Bellego or Musilak and the Pole was arguably better at the end of the season so do you try and stay with the form man ?? Lots to ponder for you Swindon fans as the AGM draws nearer and the Poles/Swedes also close their transfer windows. Good luck with the juggling of points.

Yeah but most of that revolved around the slow and painful death of the stadium sadly. Believe me they are sadly missed by all Speedway fans I hope, and leaves a hole in he sport. Have lots of memories of Coventry from way back in 1970 onwards when I first turned up as a 16 year old at Hackney my home club in those days. Coventry Bee's were a great club and enjoyed watching many of the greats of the day riding for them until they also sadly closed in 1997 during which time they changed from Hawks to Kestrels. Believe me nothing saddens me more to see the sport die club after club. So important we support and promote those cubs that do survive and whilst I adopted Poole as my team of choice in modern times, I will never lose sight of those great clubs no longer with us who gave me so much joy and excitement for so many years. Long may the sport continue.

But Gav Remember this is a Forum. Something us Speedway supporters use to give us some fun in those dark and dreary days of the close season. it allows us to rumour/ try and guess and maybe even dream of what we would like to see for next season. This is why we have 104 pages of forum and rising on the subject of Poole 2018 compared to near enough what all the other Prem league clubs have posted put together regarding 2018. So we will continue to latch on to any piece of news regarding quality riders because one would hope ultimately one or more of them may come our way. In the meantime we will continue to dream on and keep the forum on Poole alive. Thanks for your contributions though as many of them if nothing else are entertaining ;-)

How many multinationals would want to see their names plastered around run down and ageing stadia that in the main have not had major investment for years. Excl the new BV Stadium that is. If you look at places like Lakeside (who were in Elite/Prem until this season). It was like taking a walk back in time. I remember taking my son there 30 years ago and when I went in 2016 it was like nothing had been touched. Supporter facilities poor - Toilets that stank to high heaven with overflows and seemingly not touched in decades. Little to no seating/stands. Can you imagine if Coventry had stayed in Prem in 2017. The stadium was poor. I would cringe if I was a large company seeing my banners plastered around such a dump. Maybe that's good enough for the spit and sawdust Stocks & Bangers but do major nationals or companies really want their brands advertised in such conditions. The World is a different place to the sixties & seventies but where most organisations have moved on, unfortunately most stadiums are still caught in this old time warp. An unfortunate fact of life we are all stuck with.

Not fickle just sound business sense. He wasn't signed as his high GSA under new calc for 2017 would have meant problems further down the team. Probably right decision considering Holders poor form for so long due to engine tuning issues well documented also by Alan Johns on the main Polish website in last week. However with a 7.16 GSA for 2018 one would be barmy not to try and sign the guy bearing in mind he was third in the real GSA's to only Doyle & NKI in 2016. Considering NKI would come back with 9.04 and Holder with 7.16 for 2018 then surely common sense dictates Holder is worth a gamble in trying to get back to near or on to his 2016 GSA. Of course much will depend on IF he can get the gremlins out of his tuning problems of 2016 as with the Darcy loss of 20165 as also his personal breakup with his partner and Max's mum soon after should now be behind him so no excuses on the emotional front for me for 2018. Hopefully if he also has young bro Jack alongside he can also take on the mantle of mentor just as he will be doing so for Torun and also recognised by Torun in recent press releases after following their signings. Have said earlier he deserves next season to HOPEFULLY prove the doubters wrong. I do not defend his actions at that meeting at KL in 2017 so don't get me wrong, but he was suspended/sacked and then banned and fined so the situation is over in that respect come the start of 2018.

Gonna take a long time for Chris to get that monkey of his back huh ? ;-) As for Jack I think he has a decent future. Interesting looking at the POL EXL rider stats for 2017. There are 55 rider stats listed for those regular riders in 2017 (no idea why 55 when 8 x 7 - 56 riders. Anyway. If Jack were to finish in the top 35 he would only need around 5.4 av excl bonus points per 4 rides. Such an av puts you ahead of Kildermand/Walasek/Thorssell.Musielak/Andreas Jonsson. Of the 24 unclassified riders who rode in a few meetings, Jack was top and Brady second. Jack form 4 meetings and Brady from 2. Perhaps one can see why the top league in the World wants to sign such potential prestigious talent for 2018. I still think Matt would be crazy not to sign Jack alongside Chris. I think Chris will be mentor to Jack in UK and POL and both can tap into the prestigious Monster Sponsorship deals as well. Having Chris/Jack and Brady all signed by POL EXL cant be bad. Especially when you consider riders such as Cook can only get a POL Nice 1 place despite having qualified for the SGP. Its what we build around these guys which is important in my book.

Yes Rybnik were very clever when they drew up Fricke's contract. They made sure if they got relegated they would not lose out. If he stays good chance they will bounce back with riders they have. If anyone thinks he is worth it then they have to pay up. Believe at least one POL EXL team still thinking about signing him before window closes in 5 days. But obvious that some of the Poles still not convinced he is top flight material with consistency at that kind of money. I think he can hold his own as he did last year. He was 27 out of 55 main players (excl riders who did a few meetings such as Jack Holder). Not bad for his first season in POL EXL.